Someone Else's Fault

Originally posted by magicmushroom

In the US you have the I'll sue you culture, that when something goes wrong there has to be some body to blame and claim from. Do you not think that society as a whole has bred this culture, that in reality thats what the money men want, people who are inacapable of standing on their own 2 feet and being strong and independant.

Yes society has bred this culture, and I think that is what Semper is talking about. Society has bred this false sense of security and pass the buck mentality, if a society in general coddles people that choose to be lazy and weak, then how will they ever strive for their highest human potentials?

Now there are those people in society that do need help, like physically handicapped, etc..., but when someone or group that is capable of handling their own issues, but decides to try to pass the buck, now I have a problem with them.

Magicmushroom,

Did anyone ever tell you your a real fungi? Sorry I couldn't help it.



[edit on 29-4-2007 by Realtruth]

Obviously my somewhat esteemed compatriot has either failed to read my postings, or more likely as is the norm, refused to acknowledge any posts that substantially disparage his vitriol...

On numerous occasions I have elaborated on the necessity for the reporting of incidents and the absolute requisite for public control of all government entities...

This is just another established pattern of refusal to accept responsibility and the deflection that is so very apparent and obvious here.. Much like the use of the word "Simp" gives the poster some feeling of power in an apparently powerless position. He will gain some measure of satisfaction in altering my name to fit the form of deflection he is currently utilizing. All the while I am sure justifying this because of some past misspelling of his name or the actions of some other poster on another thread.

Documented cases of this kind of deflection and use of psychological impactive analogy is well recorded usually among the very young in competitive reactionary environments....

However,

The main point here is again, the excellent example of the deflection of responsibility and refusal to accept that responsibility being portrayed here.

Of course the "Lumping" of this poster into a category exemplifying the negatives of any group he may or may not belong to would easily offend. Yet his complete refusal to accept any responsibility for his actions enables him to do this very action to me.

There really is no need to defend my position as it is being supported and substantiated as this progress..

This truly is fascinating and perhaps worthy of a Masters Thesis...

Semper

Originally posted by truthseeka
If one cop is killing all these unarmed people NATIONWIDE, we clearly have a problem.

I get it. I hear you. You'd rather take the easy way out and blame them all. You'd rather make a joke of my point than address the real issue. It's clear.

I didn't blame simp for other officers shooting unarmed people;

No, you blame him for being a cop. You blame him for being in the same group that these others are. For not policing the whole group. For being part of a group that has corrupt and criminal members. Just ask yourself if you'd welcome the same judgments that the worst of your 'fellow group members' deserve. Are you willing or able to "police" your group? Do you take responsibility for the corrupt and criminal in your group? You're doing the very thing you preach against. You're just not willing to admit it.

Of COURSE he's not going to say, "yeah, my brothers in blue who kill unarmed people are responsible for their murders."

And, I have never seen you write ""yeah, my brothers who kill unarmed people are responsible for their murders." or that your "brothers" are in any way responsible for their actions. In fact, I have seen you deflect the blame from them many times and put it on the cops or white people or the government or the rich or ANYONE but them.

Look in the mirror.

Before I get too deep into this, I'm going to respectfully bow out. I don't have any desire to go further into this personal issue with you. It's clear to me where you're trying to go and that's your choice. But I know you're not going to see my point, so I won't force it. I've already been accused of being in a "bad mood" because of my writings in this thread.

Take care.

Originally posted by Realtruth

Yes society has bred this culture, and I think that is what Semper is talking about. Society has bred this false sense of security and pass the buck mentality, if a society in general coddles people that choose to be lazy and weak, then how will they ever strive for their highest human potentials?

Now there are those people in society that do need help, like physically handicapped, etc..., but when someone or group that is capable of handling their own issues, but decides to try to pass the buck, now I have a problem with them.


[edit on 29-4-2007 by Realtruth]

Exactly RT,

Society as a whole is finding it more and more "politically correct" to place the blame of any individuals actions at the "feet" of the group and completely disregarding the independent actions of the individual...

More and more as this occurs, it also becomes easier for the individual to deflect the blame onto this group that society has already established as the "fault" mechanism for whatever negative actions may have developed.

This establishes the group dynamics of refusal to accept responsibility and supplies the subject with some measure of satisfaction even after having perpetrated the negative action...

Semper

Originally posted by semperfortis
I apologize if you have given yourself the importance of assuming any of my posts were directly indicated toward you ceeksa...

Now...

You see what kind of role model you are? I was unaware that altering someone's tag is a means of empowerment. Was it good for you? Thanks for that info.

But, thanks for getting back into Professor Simp mode. But slow down; I'm still trying to copy notes...

You had to know I would show up eventually and plead for tolerance. Except I'm not going to this time, because y'all (I love that word) never pay much attention. This time, I'm going with blunt.

Jesus H. Christ on a crutch people! Why do y'all have to drag around this baggage from thread to thread? It's childish, it reflects poorly on you and I'm pretty sure it discourages other members from actually discussing the subject. Do you ever wonder why you only see yourselves posting over and over in these threads?

Do you even see the irony???? This thread is called Someone Else's Fault, where we all point the finger and blame someone for not taking personal responsibility for their actions.

Number one - why do you feel the need to blame anyone? People are a product of their environment for the most part, and a decision they make today is affected by numerous factors in their past. When you ask someone why they did something and they give you the details of their history which led them to the place they are today, they aren't just making excuses. They are telling you how past events in their lives affect the decisions they make.

Number two - when you point a finger, there are four fingers pointing right back at you. See examples below:

Originally posted by semperfortis
I apologize if you have given yourself the importance of assuming any of my posts were directly indicated toward you ceeksa...

I, on a more professional level, have thoroughly reviewed the entire thread and can not find where I mentioned your name even once. Your inference is as usual, yours and not implied by others.

From the OP.....

Originally posted by semperfortis
Just read some of the recent threads and you get a wonderful psychological look into the complete lack of personal responsibility that infects our world. Blame blame blame, always blame someone else and jump on whatever band wagon is waving the highest flag at the time.

Stupid Cops arresting those innocent people. So what if they had dope, so what if they fought the police, so what if they just killed their spouse,the police are suppose to be kind and gentile, no matter the person was trying to kick his head in. Can't be there fault, has to be someone else's.

Don't even try to play innocent. This thread is in retaliation to Pork Soda: Tales From the Cop Bowl and anyone who’s been reading this forum for a while knows it.

And this:

Originally posted by semperfortis
This is just another established pattern of refusal to accept responsibility and the deflection that is so very apparent and obvious here.. Much like the use of the word "Simp" gives the poster some feeling of power in an apparently powerless position. He will gain some measure of satisfaction in altering my name to fit the form of deflection he is currently utilizing. All the while I am sure justifying this because of some past misspelling of his name or the actions of some other poster on another thread.

Truthseeka only referred to you as 'simp' after you posted this:

Originally posted by semperfortis
I apologize if you have given yourself the importance of assuming any of my posts were directly indicated toward you ceeksa...

Which we also all also know is your sneaky way of calling Truthseeka 'Ceci’ and taking a shot at him. That name goes back to when a bunch of members tried to sneakily insinuate that he was ghost-posting for Ceci during her post banning (which is a very serious accusation because that offense is grounds for banning) without having the balls to come right out and say it. Also, bringing up banned members is in poor taste.

Please, don't even bother to tell me that I am reading things into these posts and projecting my own bias into them. Don't insult my intelligence.


edited for spelling

[edit on 29-4-2007 by Duzey]

Well as you being a Moderator..

And

Me being the "fault" here..

Have at it my good man..

Fault apparently being a singular adjective in this instance, yet again, you did admit to being blunt, and of course there is that Moderator thing..

I work under the establishment and not against it, so, the floor is all yours, I will bow my way from the stage with appropriate tail between my legs...

Thank you for the time and attention..

All included that withered under my apparent erroneous actions, I make full apology too..
I sincerely hope you can all accept this.

Semper

Moderators Are People Too. (and they have opinions)

The status of any member should never deter us from discussing a subject. Staff members are members first, and if they find themselves in a discussion, it is our rule of thumb to never take action.

Anyways, back to the topic at hand.

Oh, Duzey is a dudette.



[edit on 29-4-2007 by chissler]

Semper, I think the way you need to look at the situation is that maybe 20 or thirty years ago American Policemen would not have gunned someone down unless really provoked or threatend where today the rational is to protect yourself and your buddy.

Ask yourself how has this situation come about, was it planned or is it society that has developed in that way, that in a sense will are all victims of circumstance. Yes there are those who seek to use euxcuses etc. but that is a human trait, to err is to be human.

I'm sure that the generation of policemen before you many of them would never have used their firearms in anger, today is different. If you shot someone by mistake, would you stand up and say I am guilty, would you take full responcibility for your actions, would your peers even allow you to.

We live in a different world today with different value's and yes we all make mistakes and most of the time we try and wriggle out of them. If we seek to put right what is wrong then all must be put right and not just the bits we dont like.

Originally posted by semperfortis
Well as you being a Moderator..

*snip*

C'mon semper. That was uncalled for. Duzey is one of the most calm-headed people here. The fact that she is tired of the crap that goes on in this forum is testament to the amount of ignorance and tripe available in Social Issues.

BTW, you aren't the only one swimming in this. Do you have a point? Sure but this dead horse has been beaten to a pulp. It now seems less about making a point and more an infight with certain other members. Maybe everyone posting for a reaction should take a break from this.

Hey, People. Just do what the Special Green Dragon Lady Moderator says! OKay? Chill out and let's take a long hard look at ourselves.

I've got my member hat on in this thread. A member who loves the topics that get discussed in this forum, but can't stand the way it gets discussed. What could be great threads full of insights and intelligent posts that we all can learn from far too often turn into a horrible mess of insults and attacks.

As far as fault being singular, I don't think that way. I'm a shades of grey kind of gal. In the vein of personal responsibilty, we all need to take responsibility for what we post. I'm as equally sick of seing jsobecky called becky and you called simp as I am of seeing Truthseeka called names that are based around the Ceci thing. Every single one of you is as equally personally responsible for typing those letters into a keyboard and pressing post reply as the others.


@ fritz




[edit on 29-4-2007 by chissler]

[edit on 29-4-2007 by Duzey]

And Intrepid, I fully apologized...

The comments were directed at me, and me alone, so it was my natural assumption that it was I that crossed some line where she was concerned and not anyone else that may or may not have been swimming with me...

I took her comments as directed solely at me and made an apology...

I can do no more than apologize for crossing that line where she was concerned and attempt to not make the same mistake in the future..

No Harm, No Foul

MM,
I have made some almost career ending mistakes in my 21 years, bound to happen if you do any work at all.
EVERY single time I stood up and admitted my mistake. Peers or no peers, I was raised that way and it has stood me in good stead, as it will on here now at this time..

Semper

ps...

Just for clarification and fatual basis, I never once thought of, or intended reference to Ceci or any other member, banned or not..

I was just playing with the names as was my opponent in this debate.
It was however, my posting style that was singled out, and as stated before, I stand admonished...
By a Member then, if that makes it easier..

Semper

[edit on 4/29/2007 by semperfortis]

Ah Ha!

Don't you just love that?

Thread stater you would not be saying that if you were innocent of not ever commiting a crime and having your life destroyed by mad people in power, while you hear about all the scum that walks the streets and commit endless amounts of crimes, and they can have there lifes in peace and quiet.

what would you say, if you were monitored 24-7 all your life since you left school, like a person i know, who has never commited a crime.

he cannot live his life in peace, cannot goto work, cannot do anything in peace, while the people who wrecked his life making up rubbish, can have the times of there lifes, commiting any crimes, and never being in trouble.

do not say that technology to monitor people does not exist, this person i am talking about, is known by his family as being monitored all the time. he walked away from school, because rightly he was right that his life was being violated.

so do not say things like why do people blame others, alot of the time the blame is right, and what can these people do to get there lifes back, nothing thats what.

Originally posted by Duzey
I've got my member hat on in this thread. A member who loves the topics that get discussed in this forum, but can't stand the way it gets discussed. What could be great threads full of insights and intelligent posts that we all can learn from far too often turn into a horrible mess of insults and attacks.

As far as fault being singular, I don't think that way. I'm a shades of grey kind of gal. In the vein of personal responsibilty, we all need to take responsibility for what we post. I'm as equally sick of seing jsobecky called becky and you called simp as I am of seeing Truthseeka called names that are based around the Ceci thing. Every single one of you is as equally personally responsible for typing those letters into a keyboard and pressing post reply as the others.

And as moderators you have the power and the responsibility to stop these baiting tactics whenever they occur. But that never happens. That is why posts with potential turn into insults and personal attacks.

That's what they are: baiting tactics. They should not be allowed or encouraged. It seems like they should be against the T&C. I don't know if they are, but I do know that a formal complaint about baiting tactics will earn you the admonishment to "suck it up" and to "post in another thread if he bothers you". Iow, too bad for you. Just accept it and move on.

It makes it difficult to follow the rules when the standard is unclear.

For the sake of clarification, everything I said until I said this, was not directed at you in particular.

Originally posted by Duzey
See examples below:

I did not mention you until then. There are many posters who the first part of my post applies to. It is up to each member to examine their actions and if they feel it applies to them in some way, I hope they can take ownership of their actions and applaud them for being open-minded enough to see it.

Also, I would have posted the exact same thing if I had never become a mod. I am so tired of wading through all this back and forth crap that constantly happens to get to the posts that discuss the topic in a civil, non-personal manner. I know all of you are capable of writing good posts and it drives me nuts that I don't get to read them because people are to busy attacking each other.

Originally posted by jsobecky

And as moderators you have the power and the responsibility to stop these baiting tactics whenever they occur. But that never happens. That is why posts with potential turn into insults and personal attacks.

And as members you have the ability to not BITE.

That's what they are: baiting tactics. They should not be allowed or encouraged. It seems like they should be against the T&C. I don't know if they are,

No, they aren't against the T&C as I see it. BUT as BAIT it is only effective if the person in question TAKES the bait. If you don't, it's words and ignorance that are on the board. Ineffective and impotent. THAT is up to the member. Are you going to give power to those words? Or let them fall on the ground, ineffective. THAT is something out of the hands of the staff.

but I do know that a formal complaint about baiting tactics will earn you the admonishment to "suck it up" and to "post in another thread if he bothers you". Iow, too bad for you. Just accept it and move on.

Sorry J but calling the BS card on this one.

It makes it difficult to follow the rules when the standard is unclear.

The standards are VERY clear, the T&C is easily read, they're posted all over the board. It's up to the MEMBER to decide if they want to stoop to the level of those that are skirting the edge of the T&C. Basically, the choice is YOURS! Do you want to give that member(s) the satisfaction of getting into your house? Your choice.

You know what jsobecky, I agree with this:

Originally posted by jsobecky
And as moderators you have the power and the responsibility to stop these baiting tactics whenever they occur.

Unfortunately, in this thread I have chosen to participate as a member and as such, I can't take any action on any posts in it.

I wouldn't want to be the next member who uses one of those cute little nicknames, however. I have a feeling it might not be looked upon so lightly anymore.


Oops, sorry chissler...


[edit on 29-4-2007 by Duzey]

Who's Fault is it? ...

Someone Else's Fault

The whole he said/she said game is one we are all too familiar with. If someone is breaking the Terms & Conditions Of Use, and you feel the staff have missed it, submit a Complaint.

If you don't submit a complaint, you have no room to complain.

Let's get back to the subject.

Someone Else's Fault