It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Why do I have to believe in God to be a Mason?

page: 1
0
<<   2 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Feb, 1 2007 @ 05:38 PM
link   
I have been very interested in Freemasonry lately but found out I have to believe in a supreme being to be a member. Well I don't know that there is and don't know if there isn't. I wouldnt call myself an antheist but the Judaism , Islam and Christianity doctrine makes no sense to me. Could I still be a Mason? Why do I have to believe in a God at all to be a member.




posted on Feb, 1 2007 @ 05:58 PM
link   
It doesn't matter what you "believe"; because AElohim, Adi-Buddha, Allah, Christ, RA, Ausar, Kether, AIN SOPH, Ahura Mazda, AMEN, Tara, Jehovah, Brahma, The TAO, Auset/Isis, etc., etc., etc....

...are all of the same Ancient Universal Gnosis of which the "G" in the Square and Compass, according to Albert Pike and a few others, means "Gnosis"; as well as "God", "Geometry", "Grand Architect", etc.

So long as you "believe", you can join.


But an atheist is just an intellectual-imbecile; because, that there is a formless Divine Intelligence that directs the functioning and interdependent-workings of the entire Cosmos, is self-evident.


But Gnosis is not about belief; it is about Seeing One's Inner Divine Nature(Neter) directly.


An agnostic is one who does not know: A(not)-Gnostic(one who knows).



So us 'little brothers' who are beginning to study Gnosis, might be considered as "A-Gnostic" in a way; because we start by believing in Gnosis, until we regenerate our atrophied internal-senses through Yogic and Tantric practice(these practices are veiled in the Christian Gospels and Masonic Rituals as well).

Then we Know directly about the Superior Dimensions, beyond 'Euclid's Third Dimension', through which the Divinity works.



Anyway, even though Masonry is not a Religion per-se; it is Religious.


Also, Gnosis is not the same as contemporary Masonry; but the latter is however based on the former.





[edit on 1-2-2007 by Tamahu]



posted on Feb, 1 2007 @ 06:10 PM
link   
So I certainly do not claim to be a Gnostic:





The Three Mountains


..."A little while before leaving such a meritorious institution, the alluded teacher uttered the following: "Let not one of those who are present here dare to self-qualify himself as a Rosicrucian, because we are nothing but simple aspirants of Rosicrucianism."

Then he added with great solemnity, "Rosicrucians are Buddha, Jesus, Moria, K.H., etc., etc., etc." - Samael Aun Weor




So also, to be an actual Master Builder, would require much more than just going through a few external rituals.

The Lodge rituals are meant to symbolize the internal work that one must perform, in order to be a Conscious Citizen of the Cosmos.



posted on Feb, 2 2007 @ 07:45 AM
link   

Originally posted by KingDiamond33
I have been very interested in Freemasonry lately but found out I have to believe in a supreme being to be a member. Well I don't know that there is and don't know if there isn't. I wouldnt call myself an antheist but the Judaism , Islam and Christianity doctrine makes no sense to me. Could I still be a Mason? Why do I have to believe in a God at all to be a member.


Short answer? Yes. You must believe in a Supreme Being to join Masonry. End of story.

[edit on 2-2-2007 by Fitzgibbon]



posted on Feb, 2 2007 @ 07:52 AM
link   

Originally posted by Fitzgibbon
Short answer? Yes. You mustmust believe in a Supreme Being to join Masonry. End of story.


We know you must...but the question if valid...why?
What does this do exactly...or what benefit is there for there being this requirement?


peace

dAlen



posted on Feb, 2 2007 @ 07:59 AM
link   

Originally posted by KingDiamond33
I have been very interested in Freemasonry lately but found out I have to believe in a supreme being to be a member. Well I don't know that there is and don't know if there isn't. I wouldnt call myself an antheist but the Judaism , Islam and Christianity doctrine makes no sense to me. Could I still be a Mason? Why do I have to believe in a God at all to be a member.


I am a Mason and the Judaism , Islam and Christianity doctrines do not fit with my beliefs either. I believe there is some truth in each of them but the whole of each is muddied by human interpretation and embellishment. I don't believe that God reveals himself through any book or act of arguable miracle. I believe God reveals himself through the complexity of his creation and the everyday miracles that are seen by all. If there were a label that fit, it would be Deist . Here's a description: www.religioustolerance.org...

I most identify with this and Buddhism, but not so much as to be called a Buddhist.



posted on Feb, 2 2007 @ 08:05 AM
link   
As to why you must believe in a supreme being, I suspect there will be several
answers. For my part, I believe there are a few reasons.

It is a thread that provides common ground for all in the lodge, it is also
tradition. I believe the most important reasons are that without a belief in a
supreme being much of the ritual will make little sense and the symbolism even
less.



posted on Feb, 2 2007 @ 08:08 AM
link   

Originally posted by dAlen

Originally posted by Fitzgibbon
Short answer? Yes. You must believe in a Supreme Being to join Masonry. End of story.


We know you must...but the question if valid...why?
What does this do exactly...or what benefit is there for there being this requirement?


peace

dAlen


Yeah, that was kind of a dense on my part. Too little coffee too early in the AM. I'm sure Appak or Masonic Light could probably put it better but I'd say the reason is to ensure that a spirit of humility exists in the Candidate, a recognition that the human ego is not all-knowing and that there exists a desire to become a better man, both in the view of the Almighty as well as society.

HTH



posted on Feb, 2 2007 @ 08:19 AM
link   

Originally posted by Fitzgibbon
...but I'd say the reason is to ensure that a spirit of humility exists in the Candidate, a recognition that the human ego is not all-knowing and that there exists a desire to become a better man, both in the view of the Almighty as well as society.

HTH


thanks, sounds like reason enough...
Again, that is something I actually pondered...and, as mentioned, it makes sense...because there needs to be a degree of humility in order to be a vessel open to obtain knowledge.

Peace

dAlen



posted on Feb, 2 2007 @ 09:58 AM
link   
The reason is that without a belief in a supreme being no oath is considered binding.



posted on Feb, 2 2007 @ 10:04 AM
link   
We have a winner.

The answer is clearly explained early in the First Section of the Entered Apprentice Initiation.



posted on Feb, 2 2007 @ 10:08 AM
link   
Also, the whole system is based on the idea that men have immortal souls, that morality stems from god, and that we strive to be better through god (as far as I understand it). So it would make about as much sense to be an atheist and a member of a regular Lodge as it would to be an Atheist and be a member of a Church.



posted on Feb, 2 2007 @ 11:09 AM
link   

Originally posted by Masonic Student
The reason is that without a belief in a supreme being no oath is considered binding.


Damn MS you beat me to it. The candidate takes an oath on whatever book of faith he chooses and therefore as a man of true moral and character we take his word on it.



posted on Feb, 2 2007 @ 11:53 AM
link   
To Join you have to believe in a Supreme Being over all. Just like any group it has laws.



posted on Feb, 2 2007 @ 12:14 PM
link   

Originally posted by corsig


Damn MS you beat me to it. The candidate takes an oath on whatever book of faith he chooses and therefore as a man of true moral and character we take his word on it.


I know this is featured in the Webb/Cross lectures, but I still have to disagree with it, and again, agree with Pike and Mackey.

Atheists must also take an oath before being allowed to testify in court. I personally fail to see how an atheist's oath would not be binding. As Pike pointed out concerning this, there are many theoretical atheists who are practical Christians, and many theoretical Christians who are practical atheists. There's really no evidence that an average atheist would consider his oath less binding than a Christian, nor that Christians are more prone to keep their vows than atheists are.

I tend to believe that the belief in a Supreme Being is required because the very nature of the fraternity is theistic. We as Masons are not ipso facto morally superior to atheists, we just have different beliefs and outlooks on life.



posted on Feb, 2 2007 @ 01:50 PM
link   
If you are a mason and you successfully go through several levels of initiation, you WILL reach a point where you WILL KNOW there is a Supreme Being.

You will probably not understand this Supreme Being the way modern Christians do. You will develope a much different concept of what the Supreme Being is.

When I talk about initiation, I don't mean just the ceremony. I mean the actual shift of your energy pattern that the ceremony is attempting to effect.

It will not be a question of weather or not you believe. It will be a consequence of experience.



posted on Feb, 2 2007 @ 02:36 PM
link   

Originally posted by hlesterjerome
If you are a mason and you successfully go through several levels of initiation, you WILL reach a point where you WILL KNOW there is a Supreme Being.


That's not true. I'm a Mason, and I do not know that there is a Supreme Being. I believe there is... but that's not the same thing.



You will probably not understand this Supreme Being the way modern Christians do. You will develope a much different concept of what the Supreme Being is.


I have no concept of the Supreme Being... I would not presume to say the creator is something particular, without actually knowing it to be true. And I didn't get that view from the fraternity, or my brothers. I'm sure a number of them have very different beliefs.



When I talk about initiation, I don't mean just the ceremony. I mean the actual shift of your energy pattern that the ceremony is attempting to effect.


Horsehockey. Entrance/membership into Masonry, all of its ceremonies... none of that changes you physically, nor is it intended to.



posted on Feb, 2 2007 @ 03:39 PM
link   
You may not be aware of it, but there are inner layers of Masons who do actually practice Mysticism.



posted on Feb, 2 2007 @ 06:23 PM
link   
hlesterjerome


While it is true that there are masons who pracitce mysticism, there are no "inner layers" in free masonry. Mysticim is used occasionly to help teach a phyliosophical point, it is not activly practiced within the lodge.



posted on Feb, 2 2007 @ 09:34 PM
link   

Originally posted by hlesterjerome
You may not be aware of it, but there are inner layers of Masons who do actually practice Mysticism.


And you know about these "inner layers" how?

I'd love to hear some actual FACTS (for a change) Please indulge me.



new topics

top topics



 
0
<<   2 >>

log in

join