92 Year Old Woman Goes Out Shooting When Cops Kick Down the Door(Update)

Originally posted by Quicksilver

It would be a tragedy and people would complain why the hell did they send in uniformed cops and give em a heads up. Come on and think about it and stop trying to demonize the police.

You are not hinting that the old ladies life is less valuable than the police are you?

I hope not, because the whole story is making these police officers that are after all experts in thir field look like rookies.

They had plenty of time during surveillance to make sure that they got the right house, you know.

Knowing that it was an elderly lady living in that house makes them more guilty of shooting her to death.

I guess her safety was not an issue.

You know I hope this do not happen to my grandmother one day.

Originally posted by xmotex
Ahh, the bootlickers have arrived

People have the legitimate right to open fire when armed thugs break down their door.

Had the cops simply sent uniformed officers to investigate whatever complaint instigated this fiasco, one 92yo lady would be alive, and three cops wouldn't have bullet wounds.

Instead, they behaved like goons, and unsurprisingly it ended in pointless bloodshed.

I totaly agree with you.
Why couldnt they have sent a uniformed cop or two to knock on the door and ask her to come outside?
Has no one here seen those cop shows where they rip the front of peoples houses off before going in?
Nothing about the way police work is "by the book" or nice.To be honest,there isnt much difference between the police and the criminals.
Except the cops are alot better armed and alot better funded.

Originally posted by xmotex
Ahh, the bootlickers have arrived

People have the legitimate right to open fire when armed thugs break down their door.

Had the cops simply sent uniformed officers to investigate whatever complaint instigated this fiasco, one 92yo lady would be alive, and three cops wouldn't have bullet wounds.

Instead, they behaved like goons, and unsurprisingly it ended in pointless bloodshed.

Thats just idiotic, why should the officers tip their hand and let the criminals let the know there coming. The police officers followed SOP and this was just an accident, accidents happen deal with it.

Originally posted by denythestatusquo
Uh what happened to tear gas folks? Is there not supposed to be police dogs too?

Is this the wild west now?

Cops should resort to the least violent method to do their job instead of freaking out and losing it.

Many cops are chickens and too afraid to get hurt so they freak when they think that they may come into harm in a situation. I don't like those kinds of police.

just out of curiosity because you seem to have all the answers on how things should be done, what would a good non violent response be for the police when faced with a violent situation like being shot at??? if i had someone shooting at me, you better believe i'd have some fear of getting hurt. i don't think it is a chicken move to shoot back when someone is putting your life in danger. what do you think the cops could have done otherwise?? do you honestly think that if the officers had brought dogs along, it would prevent people from shooting?? no. they'd shoot the dogs too. check out a galls catalog sometime. they make bulletproof vests for dogs. its a lot easier for people to armchair quarterback situations like this and go off about how things "should have been done", but until you actually have someone shooting at you, you cannot honestly say for sure how you would react.

Originally posted by Samhain

Originally posted by xmotex
Ahh, the bootlickers have arrived

People have the legitimate right to open fire when armed thugs break down their door.

Had the cops simply sent uniformed officers to investigate whatever complaint instigated this fiasco, one 92yo lady would be alive, and three cops wouldn't have bullet wounds.

Instead, they behaved like goons, and unsurprisingly it ended in pointless bloodshed.

I totaly agree with you.
Why couldnt they have sent a uniformed cop or two to knock on the door and ask her to come outside?
Has no one here seen those cop shows where they rip the front of peoples houses off before going in?
Nothing about the way police work is "by the book" or nice.To be honest,there isnt much difference between the police and the criminals.
Except the cops are alot better armed and alot better funded.

Ignorance at its finest, cops are usually no where near as well armed as a drug dealer they are attempting to arrest. If you dont go "by the book" then you get fired and chargees are brought against you by IA. You dont ask a drug dealer to come out nicely that give them time to flush the drug or get a weapon.

Originally posted by marg6043

Originally posted by Quicksilver

It would be a tragedy and people would complain why the hell did they send in uniformed cops and give em a heads up. Come on and think about it and stop trying to demonize the police.

You are not hinting that the old ladies life is less valuable than the police are you?

I hope not, because the whole story is making these police officers that are after all experts in thir field look like rookies.

Im sorry but i don’t have much compassion for people who try to shoot police. Also I was not saying I hold her life less valuable I was just merely pointing out that you cant send uniformed police to do drug bust in drug ridden neighborhoods.

They followed procedure she shot at them in the house and maybe tried to shoot them while in the yard. Also who has cleared this lady of any charges? Who know if she was actually trafficking drugs?

Did they not know going into this that the only person who would be there would be a 92 year old lady, who I'm sure probably didn't live in the safest neighborhood (wasn't this a drug bust). Probably had her house broken into before and therefore purchased a firearm to protect herself. I hear plenty of Morons on here defending the police, but don't you think they should find out the occupants, their age, maybe take some of that into consideration? I dare any of you to place your great grandparent in that situation and continue to defend those officers! How about a little background research before breaking down someones door. I don't care who it is, someone breaks down my door without identifying themselves, there getting blasted! And of course they have to identify themselves, show me where the Supreme Court overruled that!! MAYBE she didn't hear them, that I can believe but to say that they don't have to identify themselves because they have a warrant is the dumbest thing I have heard all day. LMAO. Stop defending police incompetence!!!!! Or you may be next!!!

and maybe tried to shoot them while in the yard. Also who has cleared this lady of any charges? Who know if she was actually trafficking drugs?


yeah and maybe she was an Alien and maybe she was planning to take over the earth. MAYBE!!! Are you serious?? Please tell me your kidding?

[edit on 22-11-2006 by kleverone]

[edit on 22-11-2006 by kleverone]

Originally posted by JamesMcMahn


Ignorance at its finest, cops are usually no where near as well armed as a drug dealer they are attempting to arrest. If you dont go "by the book" then you get fired and chargees are brought against you by IA. You dont ask a drug dealer to come out nicely that give them time to flush the drug or get a weapon.

Where i live each cop car has a 12 Gauge and an AR-15 in the trunk,not to mention the .45 on the hip and back up just a shout away.
Seems to me the only time cops get fired or there are charges filed is when someone Catches them on film shooting or beating someone.
Then its an "isolated" incident.I think that police brutality has become the norm rather than the exception.
The thing that realy bugs me about this story is that grandma didnt take any of them with her.

Originally posted by kleverone
Did they not know going into this that the only person who would be there would be a 92 year old lady, who I'm sure probably didn't live in the safest neighborhood (wasn't this a drug bust). Probably had her house broken into before and therefore purchased a firearm to protect herself. I hear plenty of Morons on here defending the police, but don't you think they should find out the occupants, their age, maybe take some of that into consideration? I dare any of you to place your great grandparent in that situation and continue to defend those officers! How about a little background research before breaking down someones door. I don't care who it is, someone breaks down my door without identifying themselves, there getting blasted! And of course they have to identify themselves, show me where the Supreme Court overruled that!! MAYBE she didn't hear them, that I can believe but to say that they don't have to identify themselves because they have a warrant is the dumbest thing I have heard all day. LMAO. Stop defending police incompetence!!!!! Or you may be next!!!

You do not have to identify yourself while going to serve a warrant if (A) the situation is dangerous (B) you think evidence could possibly be destroyed or (C) the suspects may escape, it is just a good idea to. If it was any of my family I would be greatly angry but I would understand.

Originally posted by kleverone

and maybe tried to shoot them while in the yard. Also who has cleared this lady of any charges? Who know if she was actually trafficking drugs?


yeah and maybe she was an Alien and maybe she was planning to take over the earth. MAYBE!!! Are you serious?? Please tell me your kidding?

[edit on 22-11-2006 by kleverone]

[edit on 22-11-2006 by kleverone]

Their were reports of her shooting out into the yard and again no one has come out to say she wasnt the one trafficking drugs.

Even if they did go in and knew it was a 92yr. women what should they have done. Gone in with hopes and dreams and try to arrest her? It is clear this lady was try to hurt someoen with her firearm.

by the way dont appreciate you calling me or other people morons. Watch it.

[edit on 11*22*2006 by Quicksilver]

Originally posted by kleverone
Did they not know going into this that the only person who would be there would be a 92 year old lady, who I'm sure probably didn't live in the safest neighborhood (wasn't this a drug bust). Probably had her house broken into before and therefore purchased a firearm to protect herself. I hear plenty of Morons on here defending the police, but don't you think they should find out the occupants, their age, maybe take some of that into consideration? I dare any of you to place your great grandparent in that situation and continue to defend those officers! How about a little background research before breaking down someones door. I don't care who it is, someone breaks down my door without identifying themselves, there getting blasted! And of course they have to identify themselves, show me where the Supreme Court overruled that!! MAYBE she didn't hear them, that I can believe but to say that they don't have to identify themselves because they have a warrant is the dumbest thing I have heard all day. LMAO. Stop defending police incompetence!!!!! Or you may be next!!!

check this out. www.law.com...
the supreme court is backing off from the 'knock and announce rule'. got anything else you want me to look up for you?

Originally posted by JamesMcMahn

You do not have to identify yourself while going to serve a warrant if (A) the situation is dangerous (B) you think evidence could possibly be destroyed or (C) the suspects may escape, it is just a good idea to. If it was any of my family I would be greatly angry but I would understand.

(A)The situation was not inherently dangerous.90 Year old women are not normaly considered dangerous.
(B)Well,Evidence can always be destroyed.but i wouldnt think that grandma's gonna eat the joint just because a cop showed up.
(C)Once again,90 year old women arent usually "runners".
I'd say she was scared,and if the "police" had used a little patience,taken their time and shown a little compassion,she'd still be alive.

Originally posted by JamesMcMahn
Thats just idiotic, why should the officers tip their hand and let the criminals let the know there coming. The police officers followed SOP and this was just an accident, accidents happen deal with it.

Then the SOP is stupid, and needs to be changed.

There's no evidence that this woman was a criminal. She was apparently nothing more than a frightened old lady in a crime-ridden neighborhood, attempting to defend herself.

Perhaps one good reason the cops should let people know who's coming is because the people inside might not be criminals at all. Duh.

Im sorry but i don’t have much compassion for people who try to shoot police.

It's pretty apparent that this woman did not know they were police.

She wasn't "trying to shoot police", she was trying to shoot armed intruders that just broke down her door.

Two scenarios: I'm a normal citizen, my address is fingered as a drug dealer's residence by a criminal looking for a way out of jail.

Scenario one: uniformed officers appear at my door, presenting a search warrant. Being a largely law-abiding citizen, I cooperate.

Scenario two: three guys with guns who I don't know from Adam shout something unintelligable and break down my door. Not wanting to get killed myself by criminals, I open fire.

Which scenario is less likely to end up with dead cops and a dead innocent citizen (me)?

[edit on 11/22/06 by xmotex]

Originally posted by Samhain

Originally posted by JamesMcMahn


Ignorance at its finest, cops are usually no where near as well armed as a drug dealer they are attempting to arrest. If you dont go "by the book" then you get fired and chargees are brought against you by IA. You dont ask a drug dealer to come out nicely that give them time to flush the drug or get a weapon.

Where i live each cop car has a 12 Gauge and an AR-15 in the trunk,not to mention the .45 on the hip and back up just a shout away.
Seems to me the only time cops get fired or there are charges filed is when someone Catches them on film shooting or beating someone.
Then its an "isolated" incident.I think that police brutality has become the norm rather than the exception.
The thing that realy bugs me about this story is that grandma didnt take any of them with her.

How does that compare to an AK-47 or a MAC10 and besides how often do you see a normal police officer raid a house with an AR15 or a 12 guage when they receive their CQB training usually they are just taught to use a sidearm. Only 9% of precints use .45 cal.

Originally posted by xmotex

Originally posted by JamesMcMahn
Thats just idiotic, why should the officers tip their hand and let the criminals let the know there coming. The police officers followed SOP and this was just an accident, accidents happen deal with it.

Then the SOP is stupid, and needs to be changed.

There's no evidence that this woman was a criminal. She was apparently nothing more than a frightened old lady in a crime-ridden neighborhood, attempting to defend herself.

Perhaps one good reason the cops should let people know who's coming is because the people inside might not be criminals at all. Duh.

Im sorry but i don’t have much compassion for people who try to shoot police.

It's pretty apparent that this woman did not know they were police.

She wasn't "trying to shoot police", she was trying to shoot armed intruders that just broke down her door.

Two scenarios: I'm a normal citizen, my address is fingered as a drug dealer's residence by a criminal looking for a way out of jail.

Scenario one: uniformed officers appear at my door, presenting a search warrant. Being a largely law-abiding citizen, I cooperate.

Scenario two: three guys with guns who I don't know from Adam shout something unintelligable and break down my door. Not wanting to get killed myself by criminals, I open fire.

Which scenario is less likely to end up with dead cops and a dead innocent citizen (me)?

[edit on 11/22/06 by xmotex]

You may think the SOP is stupid but it works most of the time. I am not going to argue with you anymore it appears that you all just wish to hate all police officers and not look at it from their point of view. I leave you this morning with one bit of wisdom........Accidents happen get over it.

Originally posted by Samhain

Originally posted by JamesMcMahn

You do not have to identify yourself while going to serve a warrant if (A) the situation is dangerous (B) you think evidence could possibly be destroyed or (C) the suspects may escape, it is just a good idea to. If it was any of my family I would be greatly angry but I would understand.

(A)The situation was not inherently dangerous.90 Year old women are not normaly considered dangerous.
(B)Well,Evidence can always be destroyed.but i wouldnt think that grandma's gonna eat the joint just because a cop showed up.
(C)Once again,90 year old women arent usually "runners".
I'd say she was scared,and if the "police" had used a little patience,taken their time and shown a little compassion,she'd still be alive.

The fact is you never know what the situation inside is going to be like. If it is in a bad neighborhood you Intel could tell you 1 person lives there when there are really five. You put yourself in their shoes and tell me what you would have done based on a small bit of information.

[edit on 22-11-2006 by JamesMcMahn]

The responses in this thread are astonishing, I cant believe how many people are willing to bend over backwards, state false information and make ridicules assumptions just so that in some way and somehow the Police always come out at fault. Tragic. :shk: As far as I'm concerned they are not at fault, at all, they had the right house and narcotics were recovered. They announced who they were and what their intentions were. As such, the only one at fault here is there person who started shooting first, they got themselves killed.

Originally posted by JamesMcMahn
You may think the SOP is stupid but it works most of the time. I am not going to argue with you anymore it appears that you all just wish to hate all police officers and not look at it from their point of view. I leave you this morning with one bit of wisdom........Accidents happen get over it.

Actually I do not hate the police, actually by far most police I've dealt with have been extremely courteous and professional. My neighbor across the street is a state trooper, he's a good guy and I certainly have no desire to see him come to harm.

But these kinds of tactics do not "work most of the time" - they've been an unmitigated disaster. This particular incident is one of hundreds of similar ones, several of which have ended up with dead cops and dead innocent citizens.

These cops screwed up, get over it.
And for their mistake, and the mistakes of those who trained them, they have gunshot wounds to recover from, and an innocent old woman's death on their consciences.

Repost

[edit on 22-11-2006 by Samhain]