America's Agony

In your post by your very content you illustrate the point that we are not all the same. Yet you try to rationalize the very opposite position. This doesnt seem to make good nonsense.

By the very history of men...and the struggle of men ...we are not all the same. The history of this world is replete with this evidence.

Remember something about World War 1...the leaders of many of these countrys were Cousins..Related by Queen Victoria. Yet they fought against each others nations with a vengeance to the deaths of millions.

Yet so many here obviously. religiously, and devoutly adhere to the dogma that "We are all the same."

I used to believe this ...not anymore.

People are people..they are not all the same..even in one country with the same cultural upbringing people are not all the same.

"We are all the same" is good PR and a nice attempt to play through on a default setting thinking no one would challange this...it just isnt so. History clearly indicates something else is working here. Something people are not naturally wont to define. To identify in lieu of our "Feelings."

Think it through carefully...if we were all the same..why do we have this parasite you are trying to describe and for which so many ridicule you and your thinking process.


Thanks,
Orangetom

Yes ..I understood that you perceive it the way you choose...No problem I understood that.

Divisions in people means that we are not all the same.

Your rationalization technique comes across like a politician's speech...hence my reference to Public Education. Which shell is the pea under...Wow!!!..it is under none of them. It doesnt exist!!

As I stated to Magicmushroom..read some history. Feelings and emotions can deceive many of us.

Thanks,
Orangetom

I agree...parental influence is very important in development. This means...God Forbid....we are not all the same.

I can see why someone wants to substantially reduce parental influence. That way we are all the same ..lowest common denominator.

Public Education=television education

In lieu of parental influence or a good anchor.

Well said....again..

Thanks,
Orangetom

Orange, thats just the point i'm making they did not fight in the wars did/or do they, they sit in their lofty palaces and send us to war dont they. The 1st world was initiated because of the discovery of oil in Persia, The industrial complex knew it would need this new fuel to progress, we knew the Germans were trying to get in on the act hence the 1st WW. The first British unit entered Iraq in 1914. Thing is our history books forgot to mention that, it was all about the Western front. After ww1 when we had kicked the turks out and we carved up the ME we made dam sure we had all the known oilfeilds in the territory we occupied, and we have never been away from the place.

As I said before all these events are connected, they are not a ramdom series of events. The Common market was first discussed before ww2, do you think after that war we would have wanted to join in a European Union after fighing the Nazis and co, no, its the old stepping stones aproach, the ones who control have plenty of patience, we get a little of the bad medicine a bit at a time even if it takes decades to bring their plans to fruition.

Think of the damage 1 cruise missile can do, in the later stages of ww2 the Nazis launched 10k at the Uk a third of which hit their targets, who would have fought that in less than 25 years after this event we would be entering into financial partnership with our previous enemies, by design or what.
It would be like having Muslim terrorist over for tea in New York in about 16 years or so, can you see that happening.

Pain??????

MM,

Have you considered the possibility that much of what you see as intentional manipulation, is actually incompetence?

We come up against incompetance every day in our lives, particularly when dealing with big organisations. One reason put forward for this is something called the Peter Principle

This states that in a heirarchial organisation, any given individual will, over time, be promoted up the ladder until they reach a position that is a little bit beyond them. Once they are in this role, since they are not fully competent, they will not be promoted further. They will stray doing the job they are incompetent.

In time, each role in the heirarchy is filled by someone who is not quite up to the job. The effective "work" in the organisation is done by those who have yet to reach their "incompetence level".

Look around your workplace, particularly if it's a public institution. We see it all the time. The great teacher, who gets promoted to head of year and flounders under the stress and paperwork. The talented foreman, who, once promoted, hates having to deal with management and finds it impossible to drag himself away from nitty gritty issues on the shop floor..

This applies to all levels in the organisation, and explains why politicians never seem to be able to deliver on their promises, and public services never seem to work as efficiently as they should.

Nowthen, Of course there is incompetence, there are a myriad of facets to this but dont look at the individual event look at the bigger picture. Just think of all the projects from construction to the military they all go over budget, well there maybe incompetent mistakes once or twice but evey time and over long periods of time. If you or I were as incompetent as these people in our jobs we would be sacked in no time, yet year in year out these projects go over budget.

Are they genuine mistakes or is it a system of conditioning so we expect money to be creamed off but they just call it overbudget. Nobody bats an eyelid anymore its just accepted, so where is all that money going and what is it being used for.
If you were having a house built and the builder quoted 500k and you agreed but halfway through the build he says its now 1mil you owe do you reach for your wallet.

There's all manner of scams going on right infront of our noses thats how brazen they are. Look at Silverstein he buys the WTC complex pays a massive insurance premium specifically for terrorist cover and lo and behold the rest is history and he gets paid out twice. Has he been investigated for this, no why not. If you were to do the same on your property you would be investigated by the police and your insurers. I suppose it was just a coincidence that he makes his purchase, his property is destroyed and he doubles his money all within a few months, that should be in the Guiness book of records.

Here are some facts on the IMF's fiscal policies. Economics are indifferent to culture, (human's are all one race.)

The Giant Tape Worm. It's not just America's misery, it's a war on the poor.

These are 10 conditions countries must meet to obtain an IMF loan.

1.) Eliminate and reduce government controls over imports. Justification: Transfer decisions on the use of foreign exchange to the free market. Result: Market is flooded with imports, same phenomena that led to the Boston Tea Party.

2.) Devalue the currency. Justification: Devaluation brings down the price of exports and this allegedly increases exports allowing the debtor to earn the money to pay the debt. Result: Population can't afford imports and everything made in country is exported.

3.) Restrict availability of credit and raise interest rates. Justification: Control inflation. Result: Causes inflation.

4.) Limit or reduce government spending and deficits. (social spending) Justification: Tight money policy. Result: Leads to reduction in services, health care, etc.

5.) Raise Taxes. Justification: Curb purchasing power to fight inflation. Result: Less money circulating within market.

6.) Increase prices of public services. Justification: Increse revenue and reduce public spending. Result: Demoralize the people.

7.) Abolish government subsidies for food and transportation. Justification: Limit government spending. Result: Outlaws trade unions creates starvation.

8.) Control wages. Justification: Control inflation. Result: Suppresses purchasing power.

9.) Eliminate price controls. Justification: Free market policy. Result: Leads to price gouging.

10.) Open country to foreign investment. Justification: Free market economy. Result: Economy is controlled by outside investor's. Loss of National identity and government has no access to own resources.



This is a memo sent from the council on foreign relations to Clinton upon his taking office.

"The task is much more complicated and difficult than Clinton makes it out. First the president has not prepared the nation for the sacrifices that lie ahead if America's trajectory is to turn upward.
Second, he has yet to explain the complex obstacles to restarting the American economy when there is a recession in Japan and Europe.
Third, he has yet to confront the delicate problem of pleasing powerful financial markets which are all too ready to unleash their fury at the administration's first fiscal misstep.
Now that the election is over the new president will have to move quickly to deliver the tough message and make agonizing decisions. **In the CNN age, when indelible impressions are instantaneously formed around the world and when wall street and it's foreign counterparts can bring policy makers to their knees overnight**, Clinton's first hundred days are not just an opportunity to unfold a new agenda, rather they just as equally present a mine field that could blow up and damage his administration for the next four years.
Clinton's immediate priorities should be both offensive and defensive and defined in terms that are crystal clear and that reduce the cancerous budget deficit." (social spending)


Quigley's is a friend and advisor to Clinton, these are his precedents for the decline of civilization:

The most important reasons for decline are the breakdown of internal investment, ie. manufacturing and technology.

Decline in the rate of growth and expansion. An increase in class conflict, Increasingly frequent and violent imperial wars.

No abundance of resources. No strong economy - all towards military spending.

Growing irrationality, otherworldliness, superstition and the absence of good; growing skepticism in anything good.




[edit on 9-11-2006 by clearwater]

Originally posted by orangetom1999


As I stated to Magicmushroom..read some history. Feelings and emotions can deceive many of us.

Orangetom

History can deceive more then you would think.


Im no politician i was simply saying that deviding our selves with in our own selves is a concept and it does not have to be invented... all concepts are inventions. That doesn't mean that all inventions should have been invented.

My message is very simple, we are all the same there is no need for war or violence. it's all caused by illusionary concepts and if you can see this, it doesn't exist for you therefor you do not hate anyone in this reality for any reasons...

All for peace.

Don't we all come from the same source. When we die, we all go to the same place, no matter what our religions or what our beliefs.
Life and death are but just endless cycles of learning.
To say we are all different is to deny this very truth.
The powers that manipulate and control know this, so they divide people and beliefs to blind people from the truth to aid their control. But even the powers that control are just people the same as everyone else, they are also on a learning path, they are just consumed by their own greed and need to learn to escape it.
It is always the people you would not want to help the most that need it the most!

I admit, I have very little knowledge of the economics of the world, and to be honest, it doesn't really interest me. I don't really give a toss for money, I need it, I agree, to live in this present world you do. But to let it control you is the mistake to make.
But the only way to truly free yourself from this at this time is to deny its control and become a tramp?!?!

Were you refering in your previous post to

Caroll Quigley....Tragedy and Hope.

I have heard the name before . I know of this book Tragedy and Hope. It is on my to do reading list.


Orangetom

The power of Satan (or what ever you want to call it) and his/its influence over the world has long been documented by many religions as the destroyer of man and his/her journey to higher planes of existence.

Satan comes as an angel of light and hope, promising us all the things we want, and then delivers. We follow blindly through our own greed and want for posessions until we are ready for 'judgement'.

We, of course, bring the judgement upon ourselves. We and our leaders feel superior to our humble bretheren who understand what it truly means to be human, and also the satanic condition.

Once an attack against satan and its regime (US) is launched, we lash back with all the heartless power we can muster and call it Gods' work.

Only then, once we do the devils' work in the name of god, do we become a sinking ship in a world we created in our image.

We might as well let our kids drown in the backyard pool, because that is what the most 'powerful' nation on the planet is doing.

We see it time and time again through history. A nation grows within a veil of it's of arrogance and is destroyed, forever becoming the laughing stock of the future and a dire warning to an as-yet unborn progeny of humans.

I can not wait for the day this satanic grip is forcefully released and all that are to blame are held accountable.

I pray for it.

Suck on that Bush.

[edit on 19-11-2006 by Unrealised]