See what using microwaved water can do

Originally posted by Yarcofin
I'm not buying this.

Nor I.

I think the container issue is a very valid point.... I also think the experiment needs to be repeated SEVERAL times.

I'll be interested to see what everyone learns as they do this....

It's a little girls grade school science project *pokes*

let's just say that again, shall we?

It's A Little Girls Grade School Science Project *super mega poke*

alla you people picking holes in a Grade School Science Project like it was some JPL/MIT science project are:

a) missing the Grade School part, and

b) being kinda mean to the kid (even though she's not here)

This kid did a GREAT JOB! She thought of a GREAT EXPERIMENT! She was LOGICAL about it, she tried to do the SCIENTIFIC METHOD, she Labled the pots, she Took Pictures over Time to help Document her Results.

Shame on all of you who are picking at the results.

Major Thumbs Up to Arielle Reynolds for conducting such a cool experiment and sparking us brain dead old farts into actually Thinking about things again.

end rant.

twj

Originally posted by Beer_Guy
I'd like to get in on this one. We have a plant store and there are all kinds of seedlings I need to start. I have a pack of Leonotis Leonurus right here in front of me, they normally grow pretty fast. Fast growers should show results faster. Geraniums would be a great choice, but we don't grow them.
U2U me if you want me in, I'd love to help!

I 'm in as well. I think there might some else at work here, but I do know that there is something to using pure water.

For Christmas a coworker and I each received a flower kit. Not really into the whole flower thing but to be nice I planted it and placed it on my desk. My coworker did the same. Despite her office having better mid-day direct light, my plant had only sunrise, Mine grew like a weed. I had to turn the darn thing every day or it grew angled toward the window 4 feet away. It grew so fast that, once in bloom, I had to use twine and chopsticks to keep it from tipping over.

Difference:
Her plant = Tap water
My Plant = Room temp bottled water (Cheap crap to boot)

May be that the whole reaction to plastic is the key...don't know, but I want to find out! LOL

DG Another great thread, You always have very interesting topics to share with us, thank you for that!

I've always had a gut feeling about microwaving my tea etc., which I do about 10 times a day! Tonight I took the time to do it the old fashion way, and used my Spring Bottled Water to top it off, Since the tap taste like chlorine yuk, I noticed a huge difference immediately in the taste by boiling it!

Im going to also take the time heating my food like I did before the Microwave came into being! I bet I notice a big difference in my energy levels & how I feel! I passed on your info, and Dad too is joining me! Now hopefully the rest of the clan in my house will listen, sometimes it is hard to teach old dogs new tricks! Maybe if I give them a cookie they will lol
Thanks Again Angel

The container that the water was microwaved in would play an integral role in the toxicity levels ... I have heard (though continue to do so) that microwaving foodstuffs in styrofoam containers isn't very good for you - additionally the soft plastic of most containers (like those cheapo-typperware types) will partially 'melt' if the contents are heated (being a college student, I have learned this the hard way after destroying many a delicious mom's-home-cooked meals).

That said, when exercising one is told to *never* drink distilled water ... that it essentially does nothing to hydrate one's body, since the distillation process eliminates the electrolytes (I think this is the rationale?) ...So it may have something to do with that.

I can't image the typical chemicals (like flouride, chlorine, etc) are too great for plants, either ... so I don't know how much I buy this science fair experiment.

Originally posted by OctopusDr
It looks like she may have overwatered with the microwave water. Its pots soil looked much more damp.

I have to agree with you there.

It looks like a fungus attack to me.

First, who cares? Because, whoever waters their plants with microwaved water has issues in the first place.

Secondly, what does this mean? So far, my first post speaks for itself.

It is possible to run the experiment under various and numerous variables, such as maintaing certain temperatures, intake level of certain water especially(as I assume the researcher only used microwave water on one plant and filtered water on the other). Then, of course, I assume that most of the discussion going on is tended to the level of 'what effect does this have on humans'. Sorry to say, but I think this is well known or already known to a great degree. Microwave ovens have been around for years. I am sure if you search, you will find the information you are looking for. Unless you are taking part in your high school's science fair, so I really do not see the need to run the experiment.

Also, microwaving your food is no different than microwaving water. In each case the OH bond is heated.


[edit on 15-4-2006 by Frosty]

Originally posted by WyrdeOne

That's a good question you raise, about the container used to hold the water during the microwave bath. I'm thinking ceramic or glass would be best, to avoid the possibility of contamination.

When plastic heats, it releases volatile chemicals. New car smell is killer.

Man finally, in all my time at ATS, I'm educationally qualified to answer a question.

I worked for PolyOne for 9 years. I started my engineering education about 3 years into my career at Polyone. When I started learning chemistry and effects of certain chemicals on the body, I began to question.. and I ultimately queried my corporation to the point I was removed.

By gones, but plastic is some really serious crap. Most people don't have a clue of how many carcinogens (cancer causing agents) go into making plastic. Not to mention the huge amounts of lead and cadmium. Got any red color bowls or glasses? Massive amounts of cadmium for you! Yellow, or white? Have some lead with that soup.

Plastics such as ABS, nylon, fluorocarbons and polycarbonates, and some other thermoplastics, such as polystyrene, polypropylene and high density polyethylene (HDPE), are processed at temperatures ranging up to 400°C.

Their dispersion, non-migration and non-bleeding properties make Cd pigments useful in plastic applications where uniform colouring is important. These superior characteristics together with many others make cadmium pigments useful in all plastic's applications.

Samples containing higher concentrations of chemicals called phthalates were associated with symptoms of asthma, hay fever, and eczema.

PVC flooring in the children's bedrooms was also associated with symptoms.

When molecules of plastic—or more properly, molecules of the chemicals that get added to plastics during manufacturing—get into picture of plastic storage containers our bodies, it's not a good thing. They can cause unwanted effects in the human body; for instance, some of the chemicals mimic estrogen. Estrogen, of course, is a normal, essential human hormone; but having too much of it (or the molecules that mimic estrogen) has been associated with breast cancer and other health problems. In general, chemicals that fool the body into thinking they are estrogen or other hormones are called endocrine disruptors.

* The more liquid a food is, the more it touches the plastic, so the more opportunity it has to pick up plastic molecules.
* Acid foods, such as tomato sauce, appear to be particularly interactive with plastic.
* If you heat a food item in a plastic container—even if the container is microwave safe—the transference of plastic from the container to the food is even more likely.

Wanna know what was poured into that plant if she heated the water in plastic containers?

Various amounts of formaldehyde, arsenic, polyvinyl chloride, cadmuim, lead, Phthalates (BBzP, DEHP, and di-n-butyl phthalate), Bisphenol-A, Placticizers (DEHA), estrogen mimicking chemicals, lists goes on and on.. hell, plastic even gives off aerosil (fumed silica), a chemical used to deliver military chemical weapons. You breathe this crap in, and you breathe in every bit of chemical in the plastic.

These are just the top of the barrel.. there are 7 main types of plastics.. and hundreds of types of resins, each one has its very own formula of chemicals.

I'm willing to bet, that water heated in a plastic bowl in the microwave caused the plant to die.. not the microwaved water.

Anyone willing to do these tests? .. I don't have any plants :x






A MUST READ: www.findarticles.com...
www.pnas.org...
www.ejnet.org...
www.cadmium.org...
www.grinningplanet.com...
www.webmd.com...
www.plasticstechnology.com...
www.kaliba.com.my...




World Wildlife Fund Magazine, "Chemicals That Compromise Life: A Call to Action," Wash., DC, 1998.'

Consumer Reports Magazine, "Your Health," June, 1998.





[edit on 4/15/2006 by QuietSoul]

OK, QuietSoul, I just read most of your links and now I'm TOTALLY freaked out!

[edit on 15-4-2006 by loam]

"Big Chemical" is hiding this. Polyone is currently buying up a very large portion of the Polymer manufacturing division (Geon, McHannon, parts of BASF, and parts of Dupont).

When I started questioning them, they told me to back off and mind my business. As I started to make friends where I worked, I had a lab technician from PolyOne R&D (located in Avon Lake, OH) perform some tests. When I supplied the results of the tests to corporate attention, they demanded to know who performed the test.. and so in return of saving my collegues job, I was removed for not fessing up.

I've been meaning to make a thread about this.. but I never had the time or motivation to put it all together. I think this post gives some good research routes.. so it's good enough for me.

I agree with one of the earlier posters who said the girl did a good job with her experiment. While it is not scientifically convincing it does jolt the thinking process for those who are capable of creating a scientifically convincing study. Too often are we mislead by our assumptions. For example, it was recently discovered that the current amount of fluoride we put in our drinking water is dangerous and plants are releasing greenhouse gases too. It would not be entirely surprising if microwaved water could have adverse effects on the health of biological systems that went unnoticed because of our assumptions. The fresh perspective children have of the world is the reason I support childhood science experiments even if they are not scientifically convincing. So I still give two thumbs up to the kid who conducted the experiment by following to the best of her knowledge the scientific method. The motto of this community is "deny ignorance" which is practically the same as "deny assumptions." In light of this, I certainly do think it would be worth the effort to conduct a more rigorous experiment. Before such an experiment could take place, however, a good set of guidelines for each participant to follow must be created. If everyone is performing the tests differently then the results are worthless. I am, by no means, a good scientist or good gardener but these are a few of the variables I would like to see eliminated, if possible, should such an experiment be conducted:

1. Twenty (less? more?) specimens of the same specie should be used for each test group. A different leaf structure alone could alter the results dramatically due to the albedo. Some of the light that hits the top leaves may block light from hitting the bottom leaves. Some of the light that hits the bottom leaves may be reflected and bounce back up toward the upper leaves and the light may again be reflected toward the bottom leaves. This is a lot of variability so the more speciments of each specie the better the results will be.
   
   
2. The speciments should be kept in a greenhouse that is distant from buildings so that light bulbs in the buildings cannot possibly affect the health of the specimens.
   
   
3. Wind is important to the development of a plant because it determines whether they develop a strong stalk and stand upright or they have weak stalks and just bend over lazily like a human couch potato would. As such, the specimens should all be placed in a single row (- - - - -) and two fans should be placed relatively far away on each broad side. Only one fan should be on at a time and their power state should alternate every 24 hours. The change in wind direction would facilitate healthy growth while still being controlled, fairly unvarying, and documentable.
   
   
4. Fertilizer companies should be asked how consistent the ingredient mixture in each bag of the same product is. Any inconsistency should be documented so the variable is accounted for in the results. If there is a consistency it may be possible to contact them again asking for samples that would be as consistent as possible. Do remember to explain the purpose of your question so they do not think you are trying to advocate against using their product or anything.
   
   
5. Any heating of the water should be done in glass containers. As mentioned earlier, plastics and various other materials are known to put off toxins when they are heated. Using glass containers should eliminate toxicity variability.
   
   
6. The water that would be preferred is from a reputable water bottling company. Even if the several participants used water from the same source--such as their sinks--it could be inconsistent. Furthermore, just like the procedure with the fertilizer, the water bottling company should be contacted and asked whether their is any inconsistency in the quality of the water from bottle to bottle. If there is an inconsistency then try to contact them to get ahold of more consistent samples to be used. Remember to explain the reason you are asking these questions so they do not think you will be advocating against their product or anything like that.
   
   
7. The amount of water used for each specimen should be consistent. The distribution of the water on each speciment should also be consistent. 1/4 of the designated amount of water for each plant should be dropped next to each of the four sides of the plant.
   
   
8. The power/temperature of the microwaves used should be consistent with one another. The microwaves should be consistent with the temperature of the stoves being used. The stoves should be preheated before the water is boiled so that over-heating of the water molecules is possible. The worst conditions that can be expected from the stove should be used so there is no particular bias in the results.
   

That is all I can currently think of. I hope other members will contribute to the list and perhaps make the list more specific: temperature to boil the water, how long the water should be boiled on each appliance, how much water should be used for each plant, what species of plant to use, and so forth. The more specific the testing conditions the more likely the results will be accurate.

I do hope other members conduct this experiment. I am certainly interesting in the results.

~ .02 ~

tip of my hat to torbjon, megamanXplosion..

the granddaughters science project, while not perfectly set up,
has encouraged others to build on that humble 1st attempt...

i'm glad she didn't do yet another ~volcano & lava~ project!!

It would be a shame if the young girl
has used up her "15 minutes of fame"
with this microwave water V boiled water project
...call it an experiment if you like...

I have MANY plants sprouting indoors right now for my veggie garden.

Included, for the flax seed, is flax flowers.

I have 3 groups.

1) to water with regular water

2) to water with microwaved water in a plastic cup

3) to water with microwaved water in a coffee cup

See ya in a week. Already been doing for 2 days.

Plastic is definitely going to be a problem. It's well-known that you shouldn't heat ANYTHING in plastic in a microwave. Well-known to me, anyway.

If anyone does this experiment, the water should be heated in identical containers. Pyrex would be my choice. And since you can't use pyrex on top of the stove, I would heat it in the oven, just to boiling. Also in the microwave, JUST TO BOILING.

And of course, the amount should be equal for all plants. All other factors should be equal. And I agree there should be 20 plants. Including some 'control' plants that are watered with non-boiled water.

hey - i will sign on to the experiment --- i have got a pot of bedding plants as an " easter present " from a sebile aunt who thinks i want crap like that --- so killing them in the name of science sounds too good to miss

i will post my methedology when i figure it out

ape out


off to recklessly experiment - lol

A search for HANS HERTEL Switzerland who researched the subject may help.
Of course he was silenced by the powers that be, but there is still information out there.

Would love to help out with your experiment but i don't have a mic, never liked the things, thank God.

[edit on 15-4-2006 by The Links]

Why cant we have kids like this be in control of the planet and all of its affairs?

Just a small point.

Microwave ovens were banned in Russia in 1976; the ban was lifted after Perestroika.

I wonder what that was all about.


[edit on 15-4-2006 by The Links]

There's not enough information to give this experiment credit. Like someone else pointed, what the hell was the water heated int?

If it was in a clean glass container, and it was pure water, there's really nothing the microwaves can do to the water to change it chemically other than the temperature itself.

Water is water, H20, heating it up in the microwave is not going to create any new kind of chemical compound that wll harm the plant.

And the breakdown of nutrients in food heated in a microwave, guess what, it happens on the stove an in the oven as well. When you boil your vegetables, you're destroying a lot of the vitamins it contains. When you heat meat/eggs/etc on the stove or in the oven, you're altering/destroying a lot of the proteins in the food.

Sorry, I just don't buy it. There are dangers to microwaves though, as someone posted, superheating.

I've actually had it happen to me once, and it's kind of scary. I placed a glass of water in the microwave, and it was under the right conditions to get hotter than the 100 degrees necessary for it to boil. When i took it out, i placed a teaspoon of coffee in it. As soon as the first granual hit the water, the entire glass spontaneously boiled, erupting about 3/4 of the glass of 100+ degree water into the air, partially on me, and all over the counter top!!! This is VERY dangerous, and although rare, people should be advised about it. The best solution is to place something in the glass with the water, like a little chopstick or something....something to disturb the waters balance. Also, if you have a microwave that roates on the inside, it'll probably stop this from happening.

Just be careful

Oh, and just a quicky.. "heat" is just the average speed of the molecules moving around and bouncing off each other. So don't think of microwaved food being hot due to radiation or some other sort of freakish nature. It's no differant than if it were on the stove.

peace

The clippings in the photos look like impatiens. Although it appears the science girl was rooting her's in water first, here's a nice photo album demonstrating the 'Pinch and Poke' technique:

photobucket.com...


Works for Coleus also.