TR3-B: My theory

Okay, I've been meaning to post this as it's own thread for quite some time, but just havn't had the time really. I'm not going to go super-indepth but I'll try and cover all the bases very briefly so people will know where I'm coming from.

The TR3-B has been a favorite topic of discussion of UFO buffs and Black Project enthusiasts. The main focus of discussion that I've been privy to is basically how it's propelled. The conspiracy theorists angle no matter on which side claim that the TR3-B is propelled by either Aliens using anti-gravity technology, or it's reverse engineered from Alien technology. I've never been a subscriber to these hypotheses.

I believe that the TR3-B or a very similiar aircraft, does in fact exist, but it doesn't use any of the usually propulsion techniques that the Theorists take for granted. My way is IMO technologically feasible without making many assumptions (like Aliens are in the UFO's or that the TR3-B is reverse engineered from Alien craft(it may be reverse engineered off the ruskies or nazi's though, I'm open to that)).

The way I see there is only one type of vehicle that conforms to the performance witnesses have observed, acoustic properties, and size. Some witnesses have said that some of these Triangle shaped UFO's were enormous, some even saying up to a football field in length. The only technology that I'm aware of that will allow for such a huge aircraft is quite simply Aerostat technology.

Aerostat technology is simply a neutrally boyant or LTA aircraft. Now I know some of you are thinking "Ya right, those things are a completely different shape then this UFO!" and with conventional Helium aerostat technology you'd be right.

There is a new form of neutrally boyant airframes that are inching closer to the market.

Vacuum filled hard composite lifting cells. With this technology you could theoretically make an aircraft nearly any size and shape. Basically all the benefits of blimps without the aerodynamical drawbacks. Ok that answers one part of this thread, the "How it achieves lift?" was a quite simple one to answer.

The next one delves into more speculation on my part so please take with a grain of salt.

"How does it propell itself from A to B?"

This isn't as simple as it seems, at least for a military airframe. You need it to be silent running for either Spec/Ops insertion, Surveilance, or Psy-Ops which is what this platform would do beutifully. My theory is that should this craft exist, it's propelled by an advanced "solid state" version of Lifter technology. I cannot delve into that much more as I don't really see how such a system could be built, but if it's possible then I'm sure that someone out there has at least tried to do it by now.



Just enlarge this craft to the size of a triangular football field, add on some searchlights on the bottom and paint it completely black(or some sort of camo skin that changes color depending on the conditions) and voila. TR3-B. Maybe.

[edit on 4-4-2006 by sardion2000]

Who far back does the TR- story go because even the TR-1 designation is very recent.

Originally posted by planeman
Who far back does the TR- story go because even the TR-1 designation is very recent.

It goes a ways back. Alot people point to the TR-3 as being a spotter for the the F-117. Im wondering if it does exist, if it was a development of either the failed Northrop entry for Project Harvey, or even Lockheeds failed Advanced bomber comp that led to the B-2. Or it may have been the actuall Lockheed entry that was spotted flying around. Why?

The Lockheed entry was smaller than the B-2 and had the same triangular wing shape. The intial specs were for a high altitude flight profile, however, after Northrop won the comp, a low altitude profile was built in at AF request. This resulted in several changed on the trailing edge of the bomber to accomodate revised controll surfaces etc.

The rumored TR-3 could simply be that aircraft. There have been very few RECENT sightings of it. It may be sitting mothballed in some remote hanger at Groom Lake.

Is there any credible evidence of any "TR-3"'s existance?

Interesting theory and plausible IMO

When I first came across that picture of the Liftercraft project I thought how much it reminded me of classic triangle shaped UFO. Not only in shape but the lifter tech itself mimics many aspects of UFO sightings aswell. The silent operation the thrust without expelling mass for example.

Nothing magical or alien about this tech it could all work in theory IMO and could explain alot of UFO sightings. Another example could be the Infamous Phoenix UFO reported more of a large (V) shaped craft very large (bigger then a football field) completly silent and slow moving.

Originally posted by planeman
Is there any credible evidence of any "TR-3"'s existance?

Mostly photos and eyewitness reports is what I've based my theory on. I don't really know if this actually TR3B craft exists, but I have no doubt that the USAF is experimenting with this technology. It's just too good to pass up.

How high could you go with this technology is the question. The Stratosphere is a safe bet, but how high could it possibly achieve? For all we know this could just be an ultra black spy satellite launching platform. It would be a lot easier and stealthier to launch spacecraft from 150km up, rather than the usually ground level launches, or B-52 at 50 k.ft.

I will dig up the thread I placed a link in for you. What the link shows is 5 photos through an amature astronomers telescope of a very strange triangular metallic object as described by people who claim to have seen the TR-3B Senior Locust / Senior Sister craft. I'll hunt the links for you so you can see for your selves, as I for one love the piccies!

Metallic? Might be a different craft or different version of the same craft.

What do you think of my hypothesis of what this craft might actually be(if it exists).

here is an artist's rendering of the tr3-b, which most are familiar with:







...and here are some actual photos taken through a microscope...
















draw your own conclusions, but i find this very interesting....

The photos if real could also have been of the A-12 Avenger II navy aircraft. It was reported to have never made it past the mockup stage, but who knows.

www.ufoevidence.org...

woah there cid, that makes my two piccies seem stupid...rofl nice post.

Yes I believe 100 % that it is a man made craft, and that it is used for both ultra high/ long endurance recon missions, and also as a refueler for other 'black'crafts. Remember when it was seen over belgium in the early 1990's? Just after Regans massive trillion dollars black budget for star wars and other 'stuff'?? I for one believe this was the result, and is powered by a mix of both electro propulsive means, and also a as yet undisclosed magnetic propulsive system, hence the low frequency humming sounds heard at low low altitude.

As for its construction, im going to go with your lighter than air craft ideas, and also a system of ultra light materials but extremely strong for the crew compartment. BUT, if it is truely able to lower its gravatational mass, well whos to say its not a real heavy craft till the engines are turned on??

Oh and on the subject of triangular craft....can any one tell me if they have ever seen this picture before, and tell me if they have any ideas of just what the hell it is??
www.ufoevidence.org...


[edit on 4/4/06 by MadGreebo]

Originally posted by el cid
here is an artist's rendering of the tr3-b, which most are familiar with:

Thanks for finding that, I was looking all over for it.

In my version what is considered to be the crew compartments are actually the first "backup" layer of Helium should the vacuum cells breach. The vectored thrust rockets are replaced with lifting cells reminicent to this...



Yet in a more solid state form to reduce maintanance.

The Murcury Plasma replaced by a simple Hybrid engine design pumping either Pulsed DC or non-pulsed DC directly into the lifting cells, with various other things like high efficiency insulation to insulate the pilots cabin to reduce as much as possible the cost of life support(my version will also only be flown by 2-3 people, who rotate in shifts).

The engine design will be a Hybrid as I said using ultracapacitors to store and discharge great amounts of energy with the excess heat maybe even being channeled into other systems for climate control and the rest vented out the top of the vehicle, with the main power source being a high watt output helicoptor-class engine or better depending on the expected power expenditure of the lifting cells and other key systems.

Landing pads would be completely removed to save weight and because in a Neutrally boyant airframe, becomes completely redundant. You could "land" these things on the tops of skyscrapers if you so choose. Tethered down would be a more accurate description ttytt.

The crew compartment will be located just above the engine room which is in the center of the craft, with a hatchway leading to that area if repairs are needed.

Various other forms of power potentially available to this craft are: wind, solar, and space tether(if it can acheive at least Sub-orbit that is)

As for the locations of the vacuum cells, well just about everywhere there is no equipment and empty space there will literally be empty space.

That's all for now, Maybe I'll dream up some more stuff later. It's been fun.

draw your own conclusions, but i find this very interesting....

What are your conclusions about the hypothetical TR3-B, while taking into consideration my own hypothesis of what it actually is?

Also can anyone tell me if my theory is Unique? Just wonderin.....

and also a as yet undisclosed magnetic propulsive system, hence the low frequency humming sounds heard at low low altitude.

Lifters have been shown to produce high pitch, low pitch and no pitch humming sounds when turned on. It's the first thing that tipped me off about this and I then started to homebrew this theory up.

[edit on 4-4-2006 by sardion2000]

The photos if real could also have been of the A-12 Avenger II navy aircraft. It was reported to have never made it past the mockup stage, but who knows.

Well, if the A-12 flew then it could be responsible for some of the eyewitness accounts of UFO like crafts. However the A-12 cannot duplicate the acoustic and performance characterizes of the TR3-B.





In my opinion the proposed explanation given here could be entirely plausible, it could explain most, not all of the characterizes people associate with these crafts.

[edit on 4-4-2006 by WestPoint23]

lol my apologies madgreebo...for some strange reason, i never read your post although i thought i had been through everyone of them before i posted! we obviously have a mutual appreciation for these photos. before seeing these, i thought fouche was full of crap...but they have made me rethink my position.

as to the pics possibly being the A-12...i guess it could be possible, but i thought that the corners of the avenger were sharp -- these are distinctly rounded. of course, i'm not intimately familiar with obscure aircraft, so i could be WAY off here.

Originally posted by sardion2000

draw your own conclusions, but i find this very interesting....

What are your conclusions about the hypothetical TR3-B, while taking into consideration my own hypothesis of what it actually is?
[edit on 4-4-2006 by sardion2000]

my "jury is out" as to what is powering the tr3-b...your hypothesis DOES jive with what i think of the "phoenix lights" case though...it exhibited movement and behavior similar to what you're describing.

the tr3-b cases that i can recall off the top of my head (belgium in '89 for example) described the craft changing altitude by thousands of feet in seconds, and covering miles in seconds. this type of behavior, i believe, goes far beyond any type of lifter technology, and would involve somesort of gravity manipulation or cancelation in order to control the G forces any human pilots would have to endure.

then again, i don't know the first thing about "lifter" technology, so i could be WAY off once again LOL

TR3-B not to be confused with the TR3-A Black Manta which was believed to be the spotter for the F-117. The designations are completely messed up, don't know who came up with the designations and said "This is the designation for this aircraft".

I believe in the existence in the TR3-B for reasons I do not want to share, but from a skeptical standpoint of view, there really is no solid proof for the existence of this craft, it's another Aurora in essence.

Shattered OUT...

el Cid you just jogged my memory there with your post!

Theres a theory running around that some how they use cavitation to 'push aside' the air, creating a channel or vacuum for the craft to literaly be 'thrown' down due the the pressure exerted by the air behind the craft. Ill dig for it, but it has some thing to do with high powered ultrasound and electrical currents around the frame of the craft - hence its ability to 'leap' large spaces at tremendous speeds....i'll dig till i find it!

Originally posted by el cid
my "jury is out" as to what is powering the tr3-b...your hypothesis DOES jive with what i think of the "phoenix lights" case though...it exhibited movement and behavior similar to what you're describing.

Same here. I was trying to come up with a feasible scenario that even the skeptics would agree is viable(I am a skeptic if you havn't noticed yet), even plausible.

the tr3-b cases that i can recall off the top of my head (belgium in '89 for example) described the craft changing altitude by thousands of feet in seconds, and covering miles in seconds.

Two things to consider about eyewitnesses, most of those eyewitnesses are not exactly trained to judge distance from a resonably far distance(we loose depth perception after

Originally posted by sardion2000
Metallic? Might be a different craft or different version of the same craft.

What do you think of my hypothesis of what this craft might actually be(if it exists).

The math is a bit beyond me, however, if you could calculate the strength required to resist the crushing forces of the dense lower atmosphere, under acceleration and other G-forces (any aerodynamists on board?) you'd be making a good start toward development.

Might consider utilizing Two-dimensional Metallic crystalline materials as a hull/shell.

www.scienceagogo.com...

Only problem is that such thin materials, I've heard, have a serious fracturing tendency. Merely a "technical" problem I'm sure.

Our intintial work on extreme high-altitude LAV's for the USAF was (under-)funded through a gov't contractor which, I'm told, handled a number of "black" projects; so who knows!

Dang it, can't get the link to work!

[edit on 4-4-2006 by Bhadhidar]

The math is a bit beyond me, however, if you could calculate the strength required to resist the crushing forces of the dense lower atmosphere, under acceleration and other G-forces
/snip
you'd be making a good start toward development.

I'd just be interested in the strength versus crushing forces on its own just to give me a hint to a material that could accomplish such a task. Again I assume that if it exists, that it's highly classified.

(any aerodynamists on board?)

No aerodynamists on the board I'm afraid(That may be incorrect as members come and go quite a bit, so I may be unaware of any lurking or "vacationing" members who would know of this subject, I'll ask around in RL and see if I can get them to look at this thread, should I locate any(in RL that is)).

Might consider utilizing Two-dimensional Metallic crystalline materials as a hull/shell.

www.scienceagogo.com...

So CNT's are out? How about artificial diamond? A russian company sold the technology to a US firm a few years back that is capable of producing artificial diamonds in many shapes and forms. If they could find a way to deposite it onto a lifting cell via a vapor disposition process, it could greatly help out in the pressure resistance. Not so sure about the other things though. My math ain't that good yet.

Only problem is that such thin materials, I've heard, have a serious fracturing tendency. Merely a "technical" problem I'm sure.

What process do you think would be used to reinforce say 3 m cu vacuum lifting cell?(Or larger, though I do want this to be as redundant as possible), made on a schafold of say graphene or graphite?(or some other strong light material).


Food for thought to those that don't know that much about Lifter technology. The first design dates to the 1960 apparently according to the great wiki, looking for confirmation now. (I'd actually thought it was much earlier like the 20s or something )
en.wikipedia.org...

Originally posted by MadGreebo
el Cid you just jogged my memory there with your post!

Theres a theory running around that some how they use cavitation to 'push aside' the air, creating a channel or vacuum for the craft to literaly be 'thrown' down due the the pressure exerted by the air behind the craft. Ill dig for it, but it has some thing to do with high powered ultrasound and electrical currents around the frame of the craft - hence its ability to 'leap' large spaces at tremendous speeds....i'll dig till i find it!

Sounds like supercavitation. I expect that such a system would be extremely complex, and unmanned. Not to mention the structural requirements, yeouch. I would want it to be able to withstand double max str just to make sure it doesn't tear itself apart while manuevering.

[edit on 4-4-2006 by sardion2000]

[edit on 4-4-2006 by sardion2000]