ATS: Mind Reading Brain Cells

Originally posted by marg6043
I remember that the mind reading cells back were know as learning and copying social behavior. ...The best subjects for studies were children because they were refer to a sponges and readily suggestible to learning behavioral patterns from their enviroment.

We have to understand that not everybody that look at bloody movies or play violent games will turn into criminals.

Sorry marg - saw your post after I posted and had to log off.

You always go straight to heart of any matter.

...The whole understanding of learning/development/being is polarized. On one side we have the behavioral/cognitive Skinner types; they believe that every thing and everybody is a product of their environment, period, nothing more to the story. This is where Produkt seems to be coming from.

On the other hand, the Jungian types say things like "the ultimately mysterious realm of psychic landscapes" when referring to people and the things that they do. Jungians believe that man is MUCH more than the sum of his parts, and more than just a product of his experiences. Jungian psychology allows for "psychic powers" and 'mysterious' phenomenon. This is what you seem to be saying too.

Source: C.G. Jung Society

I am more a Jungian too - but as Jung and his teachers would have agreed, I also see that the behavior/learning connection can be mechanical - and it can be hijacked.

But that is actually cells that their job is reading others people minds is perhaps interesting but also troublesome because of the repercussions of such a theory to be true.

These cells do exist - they have been observed, and are located in the Broca part of the brain.

It kind of make me wonder if the government has done experiments on mind manipulation and mind reading on unsuspected subjects.

I have read that the US government has been accused of that before.

Unfortunately, I have no doubt about it... I think the evidence exists, and many references are here on ATS.




[edit on 14-1-2006 by soficrow]

A fascinating and compelling article Soficrow. The inate ability of people, all people, to discern the motivations and intentions of others through the use of "mirror neurons" would certainly seem psychic to others if their conclusions were accurate. The conclusions would, of course, not be the result of any psychic ability in the generally accepted meaning of that term, but they could certainly seem psychic.

Let us hope a means can be found to develop, refine and train everyone's "mirror neurons" to the point where misunderstandings become uncommon and human compassion becomes widespread.

I have learn about neurones because I took psycology long ago,

But my daughter just finished her last semester on cell biology and she did an extensive study on the brain and the jobs of neurones.

For what I gather neurones are the most important cells in the brain without them we are nothing.

Until 1998 it was believe that brain cells will not regenerate but studies done abroad shows that they do in adult humans with cancer.

Until then the discovery that only lesser mammals had brain cell regenaration was a fact but never in humans because it wasn't until the subject die that it was posible to do the test.

I imagine that the "electrical impuses" of brain cells also made "magnetic fields" that has been called in the science world as "magnetoencephalography" (Magnetoencephalography (MEG) is the measurement of the magnetic fields produced by electrical activity in the brain, usually conducted externally, using extremely sensitive devices such as SQUIDs.) can attrack other magentic fields outside the brain and hook with other brains to read mind is actually very posible and real.

This a part of science that is just starting to take an important role between neurologist.

Sad that the findings are mostly done outside of the US.

Is a thread on ATS on EMP that talks about the electrical impuses,
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Marg, electroencephalography has been used in this country since the 1930's--mostly by psychologists and neurologists attempting to discern the workings of mentally ill patients. However, the U.S. Air Force has never lost interest in the technology involved and has, over the years, made a surprising number of discoveries related to mental functioning within a normal, healthy human brain. Elsewhere, attempts have been made recently to reverse the process involved and feed patterns into the brains of volunteer subjects. There have been some successes, but mostly the process is to gross to be of real use; however, you can bet attempts will continue because of the possibility of being able to control a human brain remotely.

Yes the Magnetoencephalography is been around for a while but the discovery of the brain regenerating cells is new.

Also I have read of the government trying to use mind control experiments but is just accusations.

They probably are.

Now my point is that if cells produces electrical impulses that make magnetic fields then I can imagine the connection between brains to read minds.

Now are we aware of it in a conscious level or we don't even realized we are connecting.

I wonder.

Just a theory.

[edit on 14-1-2006 by marg6043]

Originally posted by marg6043

Now my point is that if cells produces electrical impulses that make magnetic fields then I can imagine the connection between brains to read minds.

Now are we aware of it in a conscious level or we don't even realized we are connecting.

I wonder.

Just a theory.

...A good one, I think.

Supposedly people can become conscious of these connections with training, and kids and animals have it natrurally if it's not disrupted.

I wonder too. I tend to think so.

[quote "The human brain has multiple mirror neuron systems that specialize in carrying out and understanding not just the actions of others but their intentions, the social meaning of their behavior and their emotions. ...

"Mirror neurons allow us to grasp the minds of others not through conceptual reasoning but through direct simulation. By feeling, not by thinking."


I read the NYTimes article the day it was published. While I'm a big believer in higher planes of consciousness, I don't think this research or article addresses that issue.

"Mind Reading" is referred to as in "Book Reading" or as in "Reading " an opponent's moves.

The research helps to define some of the traits we define as "mind" - the nature of how our brain interprets in a non-chemical way; but this study of mirror neurons does not imply ESP, only on e of the the intangible ways we learn.

Originally posted by ptownrob
While I'm a big believer in higher planes of consciousness, I don't think this research or article addresses that issue.

"Mind Reading" is referred to as in "Book Reading" or as in "Reading " an opponent's moves.

The research helps to define some of the traits we define as "mind" - the nature of how our brain interprets in a non-chemical way; but this study of mirror neurons does not imply ESP, only on e of the the intangible ways we learn.

You may not, but many researchers and thinkers see mirror neuron systems research as a key that may lead to a better understanding of more broadly defined "psychic" processes. Ie, See links posted above.

...Again - the split in interpretation occurs mainly between the behavioral/cognitive camps and the more Jungian or theologically oriented.

I am interested in both interpretations: IMO the behavioral/cognitive approach shows how the systems can be both hijacked and healed; and the Jungian theological approach takes us much further into the concepts of consciousness and conscious evolution than purely mechanistic viewpoints.


Off the top of my head.

Some of the commentor's are grossly misusing the term's psychic and esp regarding mirror neuron's. No where in any of the article's I've read does it imply the usage of what's being describes here by some.

It's purely psychological, not psychic esp power's, nor does it describe any of the theories proposed here. The closest these article's are getting to any "psychic power" is the misleading title's of "mind reading". It would do one a world of wonder to understand what they are reading and to quit taking thing's out of context to peddle their own opinion's.

Originally posted by Produkt
Some of the commentor's are grossly misusing the term's psychic and esp regarding mirror neuron's. No where in any of the article's I've read does it imply the usage of what's being describes here by some.

Perhaps along with new legislation outlawing "anti-social behavior" we should consider constraints on independent original thinking. Would that suit you?

It's purely psychological, not psychic esp power's, nor does it describe any of the theories proposed here. The closest these article's are getting to any "psychic power" is the misleading title's of "mind reading". It would do one a world of wonder to understand what they are reading and to quit taking thing's out of context to peddle their own opinion's.

Ahhh. The problems of definition and controversy. Again, you might turn to the legal system to remove these pesky irritations.



FYI, marg identified the polarization between the purely behavioral/mechanistic and broader definitions of "psychic" quite well. You simply are pushing for a focus on one side of the debate. And not coincidentally I suspect, claiming that the other side is totally without merit or legitimacy. A common ploy, but unproductive.

Originally posted by ptownrob

"Mirror neurons allow us to grasp the minds of others not through conceptual reasoning but through direct simulation. By feeling, not by thinking."

I will bring this quote because it makes a point on something that I am familiar with that perhaps explain the abilities of some people, let say psychic to get connected with others and be able to know personal things.

Channeling is a way to read minds, but the people that perform the channeling call it "feelings"

It works in a way that these people can feel and get mental images of the person they are trying to connect too.

I remember very well that the government did experiments in this subject and some of the people involve are now teaching others to learn how to do it.

It was call Stargate project

It was discussed in ATS a while back.

Yes some people are very sensitive to other peoples, so I imagine that they may be reading others minds thinking that they are channeling.




[edit on 15-1-2006 by marg6043]

Thanks marg. Did a search here - which led to this site and info:

This effort was initiated in response to CIA concerns about reported Soviets investigations of psychic phenomena. Between 1969 and 1971, US intelligence sources concluded that the Soviet Union was engaged in "psychotronic" research. By 1970, it was suggested that the Soviets were spending approximately 60 million rubles per year on it, and over 300 million by 1975. The money and personnel devoted to Soviet psychotronics suggested that they had achieved breakthroughs, even though the matter was considered speculative, controversial and "fringy."

...When Army funding ended in late 1985, the unit was redesignated SUN STREAK and transferred to DIA's Scientific and Technical Intelligence Directorate, with the office code DT-S. ...Under the auspices of the DIA, the program transitioned to Science Applications International Corporation [SAIC] in 1991 and was renamed STAR GATE. The project, changed from a SAP (Special Access Program) to a LIMDIS (limited dissemination) program, continued with the participation of Edwin May, who presided over 70% of the total contractor budget and 85% of the program's data collection.

Over a period of more than two decades some $20 million were spent on STAR GATE and related activities, with $11 million budgeted from the mid-1980's to the early 1990s. Over forty personnel served in the program at various times, including about 23 remote viewers. At its peak during the mid-1980s the program included as many as seven full-time viewers and as many analytical and support personnel. Three psychics were reportedly worked at FT Meade for the CIA from 1990 through July 1995. The psychics were made available to other government agencies which requested their services.

STAR GATE: Controlled Remote Viewing

...Do we have a full thread here that analyzed this info? Couldn't find one - probably need better search terms.

Yes I found the thread, very interesting one, it seems that the government was indeed interested on this type of experimentations as to have a budget just for it.

It was featured in the Science channel.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

The thread didn't got much attention.




[edit on 15-1-2006 by marg6043]

Thanks marg. You're right, there wasn't much action there. At some point I might search "remote viewing" and see what come up. In the meantime -

I'm thinking that these little mirror neuron systems might be part of a larger system kinda like a computer network. The idea that everything and everyone are connected in a way that can be explained intrigues me...

Have you looked at it that way at all? It is a huge leap I know - but it does really interest me.

Actually it does brings out some experiences that we all may have experienced but has disregard them as just nothing.

I truly believe that we may be able to connect our minds to perform things.

People pray for cures or for health and some swear by that it works.

So who is to said that it doesn't.

Amuk is has experience in remote viewing I believe he will be able to bring more information on the subject.

Also now that you open the door to this mind reading possibility, perhaps a thread on the star gate will be appropriate.

At least to show that the government does believe in this type of things.

Originally posted by marg6043
Actually it does brings out some experiences that we all may have experienced but has disregard them as just nothing.

I truly believe that we may be able to connect our minds to perform things.

People pray for cures or for health and some swear by that it works.

So who is to said that it doesn't.

I agree most of us have experiences like this - but then ignore them as coincidence or something. ...I happen to think everything you say is possible - I've seen too much not to, but couldn't "prove" it.

Amuk is has experience in remote viewing I believe he will be able to bring more information on the subject.

HEY! Amuk?

Also now that you open the door to this mind reading possibility, perhaps a thread on the star gate will be appropriate.

At least to show that the government does believe in this type of things.

The link I found names names, has project titles and budget numbers - someone might be interested in checking them...?

Thanks marg.