Americans divided on the issue of security and privacy.

Heres a hint for security: Stop medling in other peoples affairs, how would you like it if China invaded the US because they didnt like your leader and created trumphed up charges against the nation?
Stop funding brutal leaders in foreign nations and let them be.

"Every man is in control of his own destiy"
Lord Rayden (Mortal Kombat)
This holds true to women as well, and yes the quote DOES hold truth for people as a whole. So lets just stop bothering other people and go about working to rebuild the nation not someone elses, if they want to rebuild let them do it themselves. This nation started out as a bunch of shanties on the east coast and grew into a superpower.
Stop telling other people what to do, leave them alone, back off, and get on with your life because they will to. Bombing peope wont solve "terrorism" only create more of it. Shooting little jimmies mom, dad, sister, brother, grandmother, grandfather, and 80% of the family line will only make jimmy want to see you dead when he grows up.

SECURITY = CONTROL. They tell you its security, but thats just to fool you. One way to make this world better is to get rid of these illuminati bastards, and take back the wealth. Then we can distribute it evenly, and their would be no problem. Most problems stem from money. We have to get the power back into the hands of the people....and outta the hands of a few corporate chieftans.

Originally posted by devilwasp
Then I take it your in the opinion that the government should not exist, there should be no standard army, police force or other services, since afterall they are only invading YOUR privacy.

I was looking for other words, but the ones that first came to my mind are fitting.

That was stupid, and ignorant.

Between Anarchy, and a Police State there are countless options.

I would prefer to live in a nation where the peoples rights, including the right to privacy, are honored by the STATE.

If you want to give up your rights PLEASE go move to another nation.

Don't destroy what America was just because you bought into all the Chicken Little stories the government is feeding you.

Originally posted by ArchAngel
I was looking for other words, but the ones that first came to my mind are fitting.

That was stupid, and ignorant.

Only warning archangel, this type of posting will stop now. Discuss the topic, not the members.

I hope this sinks in.

Edit: To add, by your logging off I'm assuming that you got the point.

[edit on 11-1-2006 by intrepid]

Getting rid of these illuminati people is not as easy as it sounds, they dominate a good chuck of the worlds wealth and economy. To stop them you LITTERLY have to wipe out all the corporations and put it back to the old mom & pop type stores and family factories where they pass them down generation to generation. What we need is the ability to go home at night not wondering if your phones going to be tapped by the DHS (Department of Homeland Security) and your son shows up to tell you he had a talk with the teacher and the "men in black" from the NSA and CIA and they want to talk with you because he said "I dont like bush" at school.
"Those who sacrifice freedom for security deserve neither"
-Thomas Jefferson-
These people (the ones who own it all and control it all) are willing to wipe out every last living person in a state or part of a nation to keep control, not only do they dominate this nation but also others such as Canada (economically), Britain (same), China (same), Taiwan (same), North Korea (militarily), Japan, and so on. Try and shout them down they have 4-10 other nations in line to fall back on. They will not go peacefully into the night nor should we.
Security in the nation can be determined by actions of the few on a grand scale. Its a matter of how do we make it safe again considering this is no longer our nation persay. So first we have to retake it but how? Diplomacy has failed because they care nothing for it, they are very patient so they can afford to make you think you've won when you have only signed your own death warrant.

Despite the personal attacks, AA has some very valid points. THere are lots of options between anarchy and a police state. I dont know if the whole revolution thing is going to go so well yet folks. Now is not the time to preach an overthrow. I still have faith in America. I think we can get through this. If everyone spent time fighting for the same individual rights that are being trampled, rather than letting these things build up, we probably wouldnt be in this situation.
This whole thing has spun out of control, and there is not nearly enough people "freed from the matrix" to start a revolution. (Gosh I hate using that movie as a reference, but its a good one none the less.)
We need to start organizing protests, boycotts, etc...
Be more vocal about the way we feel. The more people realize that it isnt quite so mainstream to be sheep, the more will speak out with you. 51% voted for this administration, Majority republican control in the senate, and now they are trying for the supreme court; Maybe we need to tip the scales back towards reason.
A lot of people feel the way we do, just look at the worlds reactions to our actions of late. Most Americans are just blinded by patriotism. I think when we show that a majority of the population will NOT stand for our rights being trampled on, and will NOT stand for crumbs economically, things will change. There is a long history of resistence in this country that has changed our world drastically for the better. Malcolm X, Chief Joseph, Cesar Chavez, George Orwell, Huey P Newton, Susan B Anthony, Mumia Abu Jamal, etc... These are the American heros. We are taught to admire the slave owning forefathers, and our crooked politicians, but they havent done nearly as much for the population as American freedom fighters have.
Remember the things that have changed, whether workers rights, civil rights, womans rights, etc, and then keep in mind that these issues were corrected without revolution.
We need to UNITE against the common enemy, and let them all know that we will not forget that this is a nation for the people, by the people, and when it seems like this principal is lost completely...then we take it back and make it so.

Originally posted by ArchAngel

Originally posted by devilwasp
Then I take it your in the opinion that the government should not exist, there should be no standard army, police force or other services, since afterall they are only invading YOUR privacy.

I was looking for other words, but the ones that first came to my mind are fitting.

That was stupid, and ignorant.

Between Anarchy, and a Police State there are countless options.

I would prefer to live in a nation where the peoples rights, including the right to privacy, are honored by the STATE.

If you want to give up your rights PLEASE go move to another nation.

Don't destroy what America was just because you bought into all the Chicken Little stories the government is feeding you.

I agree with you 100% AA. We are now at a point where many feel that the world is all black and white. That there is no middleground. That either you're with us or with the terrorist. That either you have a complete police state or you have anarchy.
I think there is a middle ground between the police state and anarchy. The government should be accountable to the people they serve. Me, you and even devilwasp and the other neo-con fraction here so willing to give up the rights and freedoms my ancestors have died for.


I really want to wake up from this nightmare!!

Originally posted by ArchAngel
I was looking for other words, but the ones that first came to my mind are fitting.

That was stupid, and ignorant.

Thanks, care to insult my family next?

Between Anarchy, and a Police State there are countless options.

I would prefer to live in a nation where the peoples rights, including the right to privacy, are honored by the STATE.

But your rights to privacy are being invaded, hell the police should not investigate you because afterall thats invasion of privacy.
The fire fighters should not enter your home to save you after all thats tresspassing and invasion of privacy.
The paramedics should not enter your home because afterall they are invading your privacy, personal space and "abuseing" you, and tresspassnig.

If you want to give up your rights PLEASE go move to another nation.

Why? This is my nation as well.

Don't destroy what America was just because you bought into all the Chicken Little stories the government is feeding you.

Dont destroy america because your afraid of power.

Not to stir the pot, but what is the point of that DevilWasp? You just pull quotes and refute opinions? None of the points you make are valid, since a housefire and terrorism are in no way even close to the same thing. This is as much a waste of threadspace as my reply to your nonsense. I have yet to see an educated, or constructive opinion on any thread from you.

I think I speak for most when I say offer a constructive opinion, or some facts, or something useful to anything but your ego, or go start a bar fight.

Discuss the issue at hand, not each other.

Thanks.

Originally posted by devilwasp
Then I take it your in the opinion that the government should not exist, there should be no standard army, police force or other services, since afterall they are only invading YOUR privacy.

Can you add to the thread about perhaps why you don't mind giving up your freedoms for security instead of making assumptions?

I, for one, am interested in hearing the other side of this issue, devilwasp. Care to contribute?

Edited to remove member confrontation.


[edit on 12-1-2006 by Benevolent Heretic]

Is not about killing the government as an entity but just controlling the powers that a particular government will give itself against the population.

How can you control a president that feels that he is above the law and the constitution, if congress can not control such a person then who will.

It seems the like the makings of a totalitarian government to me, alias democracy without killing capitalism.

The JFK conspiracy was the beginning of the totalitarian gov't marge. Sad, enit?

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
Can you add to the thread about perhaps why you don't mind giving up your freedoms for security instead of making assumptions?

I, for one, am interested in hearing the other side of this issue, devilwasp. Care to contribute?

Edited to remove member confrontation.

[edit on 12-1-2006 by Benevolent Heretic]

Well IMO, it depends what you mean by freedoms doesnt it?

I might not mind having the police investigate my phone records because I dont do anything that would really cause them something to be concerned about.

If the police or army wanted these powers of survielance frankly whats the problem if the peopel are allowed to watch the watchers to?

Yeah, lemme fire up my spy satellite to see what THE MAN is saying. I guess its ok if they read my emails and listen to my phone calls, cause I can do the same.

You finished yet Wasp?

Originally posted by DaFunk13
Yeah, lemme fire up my spy satellite to see what THE MAN is saying. I guess its ok if they read my emails and listen to my phone calls, cause I can do the same.

You finished yet Wasp?

One last time:

"2.) You will not behave in an abusive and/or hateful manner, and will not harass, threaten, nor attack anyone."


www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by DaFunk13
The JFK conspiracy was the beginning of the totalitarian gov't marge. Sad, enit?

I have not gotten much into the JFK conspiracy but I guess I will have to take sometime to go over it.

Sorry, Sorry, Sorry...
I didnt mean to harass anyone, but we all see my point right? To say that we have the same, or even close to the same abilities to spy on Uncle Sam is kind of a silly thing to say...thats all. It might be that way in the books, which were written quite a while ago, but it is not that way any more.

Sorry for breaking rules, I am still kinda noob.

Back and to the left, back and to the left, back and to the left....

Sorry for the one liner mods, but you gotta admit this is the # 1 way to refute the bs we have been fed...wait, its not a one-liner anymore...

Originally posted by DaFunk13
Sorry, Sorry, Sorry...
I didnt mean to harass anyone, but we all see my point right? To say that we have the same, or even close to the same abilities to spy on Uncle Sam is kind of a silly thing to say...thats all. It might be that way in the books, which were written quite a while ago, but it is not that way any more.

Sorry for breaking rules, I am still kinda noob.

With respect I never said that, I simply said whats wrong with the police having powers if the people can use them too to watch the watchers....I never once suggested what you said I did.