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NEWS: Venezuela And Spain Sign Controversial Arms Deal

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posted on Nov, 28 2005 @ 01:34 PM
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Spain has signed a controversial arms deal to supply Venezuela with $2,000,000,000 worth of military equipment. Spain will supply Venezuela with 8 navy patrol boats and 12 military transport planes in a deal that the US has tried to block the signing of. Both Venezuela and Spain insisted the equipment was for peaceful purposes. Mr Chavez said it would be used to combat the drug-trafficking in the Venezuelan-Colombian border.
 



news.bbc.co.uk
During the ceremony, which was broadcast on Venezuelan state TV, President Chavez said attempts by Washington to sabotage the deal were an example of the US trying to impose its will over the world.

US ambassador Eduardo Aguirre had asked the Spanish authorities not to go ahead with the sale.

He said Washington was considering whether to allow Spain to sell aircraft made with US technology, which would require a US export licence.

President Chavez said at the time that the boats would be used to step up Venezuela's coastal patrols against the drugs trade, while the transport planes would be used mainly for humanitarian missions inside and outside the country.




Please visit the link provided for the complete story.


The US will obviously be a little uneasy about this deal, but what are they expecting Venezuela to do...Launch an attack on the US...


I think the US can sleep easy knowing that Chavez could never attack the US...not if he wanted to reach his next birthday anyway...


[edit on 28/11/2005 by MickeyDee]




posted on Nov, 28 2005 @ 02:09 PM
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The US is just paranoid...

There is no chance Venezuela would ever launch any sort of attack on the US...although i do think Chavez is partially doing this to annoy Bush!



posted on Nov, 28 2005 @ 02:22 PM
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I don't know if Chavez is doing it to annoy Bush, but he probably sees that as a nice fringe benefit.


Would Venezuela attack the USA? I highly doubt it! But this deal will probably make Chavez feel a little safer knowing that the USA will be less likely to attack them.



posted on Nov, 28 2005 @ 02:35 PM
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The US is unconcerned about an attack by Venezuela on the US. We are concerned about Chavez's influence on his region. Does anyone ever read the source material or give an moment's thought to the subject at hand. How much threat to the US is a few patrol boats and transport planes? Chavez is psychotic.



posted on Nov, 28 2005 @ 02:50 PM
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Shoot, we're just messin' around Grady. I think we all know that the US doesn't fear an attack from Venezuela.

And as regards Chavez's state of mind, well, I've never seen an inkling of anything that convinces me that he isn't perfectly sane. That's a lot more than I can say for many leaders around the globe.


He wants to fight drugs.
What bad influence does that have on the region?



posted on Nov, 28 2005 @ 03:11 PM
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Maybe Chavez is stocking up because he still feels that the USA is targeting him and wants to be prepared. Or he could just be interested in taking over some of his smaller neighbors.

In the 70's, Venezuela had an active plan to take over part of Guyana, that ended, but since the country is rich in oil and gold, maybe he's decided to try???

Guyana-Venezuela Dispute



posted on Nov, 28 2005 @ 05:30 PM
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fight drugs? riight....no i bet he'll aid farc with drugs, why would he impair fellow communists? he would love farc taking over colombia and extending his influence there.

heck i bet he wants to reunite gran colombia and rule it all.

[edit on 28-11-2005 by namehere]



posted on Nov, 28 2005 @ 05:51 PM
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remember the US isn't his only emeny. People in his own country don't like him. It was basically a powergrab. He needs to defend himself and his oil not just from us but anyone.



posted on Nov, 28 2005 @ 06:37 PM
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it seems to me, especially with the united states currrent administration, they're not so much against an attack against the us, but one against drug trafficking.



posted on Nov, 28 2005 @ 06:48 PM
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Originally posted by jacquescas
remember the US isn't his only emeny. People in his own country don't like him. It was basically a powergrab. He needs to defend himself and his oil not just from us but anyone.


Really? How did you come to this conclusion? The Venezuelans I've been talking too paint a far different picture of public sentiment down there(which is also why they are up here as they are Businessmen and Capitolists aren't that popular in S. America atm), Chavez is almost as popular as Che Guevera in large segments of the Rural population.

[edit on 28-11-2005 by sardion2000]



posted on Nov, 28 2005 @ 06:55 PM
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Originally posted by jacquescas
remember the US isn't his only emeny. People in his own country don't like him. It was basically a powergrab. He needs to defend himself and his oil not just from us but anyone.


Well, President Bush wishes he had ole Hugo's approval numbers, I'll tell you that...

Chavez's Approval Rating at 70.5 %



According to a survey conducted by the Venezuelan polling firm Datanálisis, 70.5% of Venezuelans support President Hugo Chávez. Published yesterday, the survey found that Chávez's approval rating had increased by over 10% from when the Venezuelan President won the recall referendum on the 15th of August, 2004 with 59% of the vote.


I think this is just more anti-Venezuelan propaganda perpetrated by the Bush crowd. Nobody can prove that he's done anything wrong, but they call him a terrorist and a communist (so what?) and he's probably gay, too!



posted on Nov, 28 2005 @ 08:07 PM
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A socialist country coming to the aid of an up-and-coming communist country. Isn't that just wonderful.

The "surveys" there are just as flawed as are polls in the U.S.

Benevolent Heretic: a communist; So what? Yeah..... what the heck. Communism has only killed 100 million people in the last century; Lets give it another go. How compassionate of you.

PS: Grady.. Chavez might be a bit whacked, but we're not concerned a bit that he'd try to attack America.

Sardia: Che Guevera and Chavez have high popularity because most of the people don't have to work, and they get money, all of which the government owns. Thare's lots of people like that in America, too, and they get "free" money from democratic/Marxist progarms, which is why they vote Democratic.



posted on Nov, 28 2005 @ 08:11 PM
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Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

Originally posted by jacquescas
remember the US isn't his only emeny. People in his own country don't like him. It was basically a powergrab. He needs to defend himself and his oil not just from us but anyone.


Well, President Bush wishes he had ole Hugo's approval numbers, I'll tell you that...

Chavez's Approval Rating at 70.5 %



According to a survey conducted by the Venezuelan polling firm Datanálisis, 70.5% of Venezuelans support President Hugo Chávez. Published yesterday, the survey found that Chávez's approval rating had increased by over 10% from when the Venezuelan President won the recall referendum on the 15th of August, 2004 with 59% of the vote.


I think this is just more anti-Venezuelan propaganda perpetrated by the Bush crowd. Nobody can prove that he's done anything wrong, but they call him a terrorist and a communist (so what?) and he's probably gay, too!


Propaganda?.... probably not; more likely the feelings of the 41% (probably more) that didn't vote for him.

[edit on 1-12-2005 by Thomas Crowne]



posted on Nov, 28 2005 @ 08:42 PM
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Originally posted by zappafan1
Benevolent Heretic: a communist; So what? Yeah..... what the heck. Communism has only killed 100 million people in the last century; Lets give it another go. How compassionate of you.


Firstly, you have no clue how compassionate I am.

Secondly, people aren't killed by a form of government. Don't confuse Communism (which is a form of government based on common ownership) with some communist parties, which abuse of human rights.


Originally posted by zappafan1
Propaganda?.... Actually, he does kind of look like he's had a peni* in his mouth...


Yeah... I said propaganda.



posted on Nov, 29 2005 @ 04:24 AM
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bh, no, EVERY communist government is repressive, the "but its not true communism" excuse is just that, an excuse, history proves it is indeed repressive.



posted on Nov, 29 2005 @ 05:26 AM
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Originally posted by namehere
bh, no, EVERY communist government is repressive, the "but its not true communism" excuse is just that, an excuse, history proves it is indeed repressive.


Venuzuela isn't communist. Chazez was elected with 59% of the vote. They have free markets etc. I suggest those crying communist ought to get themselves out of the black and white world of US politics.



posted by zappafan1
Propaganda?.... probably not; more likely the feelings of the 41% (probably more) that didn't vote for him. Actually, he does kind of look like he's had a peni* in his mouth... or was it a cigar?


So in venuzuela, where someone wins 59% of the vote, it's ok to say he isn't democratic as 41% opposed him?

then, I ask, what about any other "Democratic" country? Blair got just over 35%(of those that bothered to vote), Bush got just slightly over 50% (of those that voted)....How does that compare?

I find it funny that some US citizens here (and elsewhere) seem to get some sort of perverse pleasure from screaming COMMUNIST!!!! from the rooftops and interfering in other countries affairs.

The guy is doing good within Venuzuela (I haven't heard of anything bad, unless you count redistribution of oil wealth to the poor as bad) and was democratically elected, which was verified by many international organisations, inlcuding the Carter Centre, as a free and fair election.

I ask this. USA, what is your problem? And crying about "socialism" isn't going to cut it.

[edit on 29/11/05 by stumason]



posted on Nov, 29 2005 @ 07:32 AM
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im from the usa and find no problem with this

btw , chavez isnt communist
hes a capitalist LOL

free markets, arent communist , now are they?? LOL

anyways; anyone who thinks that a few pitiful patrol boats and some harmless transport planes are of any threat; they are totally confused

for the most part communism and democracy havent really ever existed

everyone u call communist; is a fascist; heres why
one person leads the nation and sets all the policy
thats fascism plain and simple 100%
not communism

stalin was a fascist! so was castro
just think about it for one minute

and democracys dont exist either; they are republics , plain and simple
elected represenatives in congress/parliment
thats Republicanism!

so please; dont come down on "People in the USA" cuz thats plain ignorance

you judge my whole nation by the actions of a few; ur just as ignorant and foolish as those whom you are judging
thats a fact

u know everyones different; so please; stop acting like im just like those who spread hate and fearmongering
IM NOTHING LIKE THEM!
and Im From Texas!
just because i live in america/texas doesnt mean im a crazy pro-bush war lover; because im not
i want ME to be president and i dont think war is nessasary
i figure if we, the world; works togeather; everything will advance much faster and we could all get richer; its really simple

so Apoligize for being wrong
because im Not Like them at all!
what you just said was 100% prejudice and sterotypical
Apoligize



posted on Nov, 29 2005 @ 10:32 AM
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No apology from me fella. I qualified my statement by saying some US citizens, ie, the usual crowd on here beratting Chavez for being commie/castro's friend/dictator/evil all round bad guy/Pro-Womble conspirator.

I know people are different all over, hence why i did not apply a blanket statement to all US citizens. Alot, if not all, of criticism for Venezuela comes from the US though, wether it be the general consensus or just a small minority.

[edit on 29/11/05 by stumason]



posted on Nov, 29 2005 @ 05:55 PM
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btw , chavez isnt communist
hes a capitalist LOL

free markets, arent communist , now are they?? LOL


Thats not strictly right. Just because a country has free market economics doesnt mean its not politically Communist. Look at China for example.

Countries that were traditionally Communist in terms of their politics have been forced to adopt Capitalist economics in order to survive in the world economy. Any Communist country that clings to Communist economics starves to death. Look at North Korea.

Strictly speaking Communism is where the means of production are owned by the state so your right when you say Chavez isnt Communist but to say he is Capitalist just because his country has free markets isnt really right either since his political policies are amongst the most socialist anywhere in the world. The health and education programs for the poor in his country are testament to this. Chavez is a socialist.





everyone u call communist; is a fascist; heres why
one person leads the nation and sets all the policy
thats fascism plain and simple 100%
not communism

stalin was a fascist! so was castro
just think about it for one minute



Sorry to be picky but thats not Fascism. Roger Griffen defined Fascism as;

'a genus of political ideology, whose mythic core, in its various permeatations, is a palingenetic form of populist ultra-nationalism'

ie. Fascists actually have the support of the majority of their populations (populist) because they have managed to convince their people that they are racially superior to the outside world (palingenetic ultra-nationalism).

Hitler and Mussolini had this support from their populace. Stalin did not. Rightly or wrongly, Hitler WAS actually elected in Germany against other parties whereas Stalins party was 'THE' party. In Stalins Russia the state owned the means of production and distributed food (badly!). He was, therefore, as Communist as they come.






and democracys dont exist either; they are republics , plain and simple
elected represenatives in congress/parliment
thats Republicanism!



Democracies dont exist? Not sure what you mean here. A Republic IS a democracy - one where there is no King or Queen. USA is a Republic, the UK isnt, but they are both still democracies.


Sorry to be pedantic but it seems that people throw these terms around without really knowing what they mean.



posted on Dec, 1 2005 @ 07:44 AM
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So, the Spainish elect a socialist government which pulls them out of iraq and the war on terror, but then that same government gives 2 billion dollars worth of military equipment to another nation that 'just happens' to also be socialist? They don't want to get involved in war and military affairs of other nations overseas eh?



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