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Iran Now Says Satellite Can Spy on Israel

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posted on Nov, 18 2005 @ 02:24 AM
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Originally posted by Sep
So you are saying that Iran cannot buy the satellite pictures from open market?


Tell you what, when you find a military comander who will go to nuclear war with his strategic intel based off of sat pics from "the open market" you let me know.




And if Iran is indeed suicidal and wants to kill everyone then it doesn’t need to know exactly where to shoot.


Wrong again. They are not simply looking to get themselves killed. They have motive. They want to destroy the nation of Isreal. In order to do this they need accurate and time sensitive intel.


As you said Israel is a small country, a few nukes can flatten it, so what good is a satellite?


Yet another false assumption. A few nukes can not flatten Isreal, much less take out steel reinforced concrete missle silos burried in rock that would be used to fire back at Iran. These things can survive a near miss by large nuclear weapons. You need a "hit" to take them out.



Different leadership? The current supreme leader is 65 years old and will be leader until he dies. So he will be there for some time. And I am not sure who the successor would be, can you tell me if you do?


It will take Iran about half a decade (plus or minus) from the time they get a nuclear reactor online to build nuclear weapons. I'd say there is a very reasonable chance that he will expire in the near future, say, within 10 years. I do not know who the successor will be, nor can I predict the political climateof Iran 10 years from now with great accuracy. Frankly, if I could there would be less reason for worry.

Any way you cut it, Iran deployed a strategic recon sat, and lied about it. Iran is not a friend of the US, they are at best a nation with hostile leadership and at worst a nation we will have nuclear war with. There is logical reason for concern.




posted on Nov, 18 2005 @ 02:26 AM
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i think they wanna hand over mapped out charts of our country so they can nuke us instead. iran is thought to have had many terrorists. just a thought..



posted on Nov, 18 2005 @ 03:14 AM
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All roads lead to Tehran.

They have got to be stopped, if they make and use even one Nuke the world wide chain reaction will be catastrophic.
Probably hundreds of Millions dead / Injured or displaced, a complete collapse of the monetary system.
I wonder how Israel would react? i mean if they detect an incoming Nuke will they Launch back at only the attacker or take out all her enemys as it would be the last stand?



posted on Nov, 18 2005 @ 03:49 AM
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The Iran myth is being hyped up more than Iraq was, this is insane. Your all talking yourselves into killing thousands of people out of logic your pulling from thin air.

Just start a rumor that Isreal is under threat (even thou they out weigh any nation other than the US & Russia in Nukes by about 300 to 1) and people will believe anything.

Iran has every right to have:
1. Nuclear Power
2. A Nuclear Bomb (read up on the MAD doctrine to understand why)
3. A military that can defend itself
4. Satellite imagery

The whole 'they support, fund, grow Terrorists' logic is just an excuse. Every nation that is powered by capitalism and run by the corporations that fuel it in some way supports and funds terrorism. Even the people your fighting today were created, funded and trained by the CIA and the Whitehouse, even Saddam was your team member, so was Osama, so are the Saudi Royal family and the oil barrons which run that place. That excuse is nothing but hypocritical.

You can't pick your fights only on countries that are technologically infearior in everyway and then demonise and spread crap about any country that uses their right to be an equal player. For every issue against Iran, which there are many, you can find equal or worse issues with America or it's allies, this whole religious tone that gets put on this debate is nothing but a whitewash for the fact there's business and great power to be had in the next few years and Iran is the unfortunate lot to be sitting on the goldmine. Your a sucka if you think otherwise.

Iran is sitting on the oil, it's holding OPEC up, we are heading into a global energy crisis. It has more reason to need these things for defensive purposes than any insane war mongering logic that says they are a offensive threat.

If a war on Iran happens, which it most likely will soon, don't believe any of the hype and lies that will be sold other than the fact that their energy sources are detrimental to US survival, them have the bomb will take away Isreals uncontested power and not having Uranium imports while controlling oil and gas exports, will interfer with Russia and China's growth and eventual threat.

If your going to support the war, atleast undestand the truth, don't simplify it with an insulting religious tone that whitewashes all the business involved because that shifts the blame out of the hands of those ultimately responsable.

Saddam was business. Don't let it happen again.




[edit on 18-11-2005 by TheShroudOfMemphis]



posted on Nov, 18 2005 @ 04:47 AM
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It seems both these countries always make the news or have somany topics going on about them. I say wipe them both from this earth and end the drama.



posted on Nov, 18 2005 @ 05:40 AM
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Originally posted by TheShroudOfMemphis
The Iran myth is being hyped up more than Iraq was, this is insane. Your all talking yourselves into killing thousands of people out of logic your pulling from thin air.


Who said anything about war, other then Iran starting one? At most the US or Isreal will just take out their nuclear powerplants.


Just start a rumor that Isreal is under threat and people will believe anything.


Start a rumor? For heavens sake, they have OPENLY called for Isreals destruction. Can you imagine if the President of the US called for Irans complete destruction? You would probably have a heart attack trying to type how evil Bush is. Yet when Iran's leader does it, it's no big deal.


Hypocrisy at it's finest.


(even thou they out weigh any nation other than the US in Nukes by about 300 to 1)


Congratulations on making THE single most ignorant statement in the HISTORY of ATS.


Isreal has 300 nukes it's self at the absolute most. Most estimates put them closer to the 100-150 range. So, even if Isreal had all 300 of them, you are saying that Russia, China, India, Pakistan, North Korea, the UK, and France all have 1 nuclear weapon each.


Never mind the fact that Russia has around ten thousand warheads by it's self... I guess that means Isreal has around 3,000,000 nukes?



Iran has every right to have:
1. Nuclear Power


Agreed, so long as nuclear weapons technology can not be developed from it.


2. A Nuclear Bomb (read up on the MAD doctrine to understand why)


Wrong and wrong. No one has any inate right to nuclear weapons. If you can make them, then you get them. But if you try to make them, then you run the risk of having action taken against you by those that deem you a threat. Second, MAD doesn't work when leaders are guided by psycho twisted hate filled religious doctrine which calls for the complete destruction of it's neighbor.


3. A military that can defend itself


Again, if you attempt to build up your military, another nation may take preventative action if they view the nation as a threat to themselves. I do agree though, every nation should have a conventional military that can protect it's citizens.


4. Satellite imagery


Sure. But again, if some nation views it as a threat, well, it might get taken out.


The whole 'they support, fund, grow Terrorists' logic is just an excuse.


Sorry, no. They do do this, and that is why every western country in the world is fearfull of Iran.


Every nation that is powered by capitalism and run by the corporations that fuel it in some way supports and funds terrorism.


So now capitalism is the enemy?



Even the people your fighting today were created, funded and trained by the CIA and the Whitehouse, even Saddam was your team member, so was Osama, so are the Saudi Royal family and the oil barrons which run that place. That excuse is nothing but hypocritical.


Obviously you have no concept of historical prospective.


You can't pick your fights only on countries that are technologically infearior in everyway and then demonise and spread crap about any country that uses their right to be an equal player.


Yes, you can if it is a legit threat. And guess what - Iran is. No one is spreading "crap". They admit to sponsering terrorism. They publically call for whole nations to be wiped from the map. It is a proven fact that they have had nuclear weapons programs. It's all there for anyone to see.


For every issue against Iran, which there are many, you can find equal or worse issues with America or it's allies, this whole religious tone that gets put on this debate is nothing but a whitewash for the fact there's business and great power to be had in the next few years and Iran is the unfortunate lot to be sitting on the goldmine. Your a sucka if you think otherwise.


No, you are a "sucka" for being so convinced that the western world is so evil.

If Iran just wants to mind their own buisness, and not stir the pot, why not agree to have their uranium enriched elsewhere? The US would pay for it to insure that Iran was not developing weapons. Why don't they STOP FUNDING TERRORISTS?

The fact is, the US, ISreal, and the EU don't want to have to deal with Iran, but Iran is just simply to dangerous to be allowed the chance to develope nukes. You are a fool if you think otherwise.


Iran is sitting on the oil, it's holding OPEC up, we are heading into a global energy crisis. It has more reason to need these things for defensive purposes than any insane war mongering logic that says they are a offensive threat.


Why doesn't Iran simply get a nuclear power to be it's muscle? Get Russia/China/France/India as an ally? That way no one messes with them, but the western world doesn't have a problem? There are so many solutions, but they are unwilling to compramise. Why? They want a bunch of nukes for their nut ball radical islamic agenda.


If a war on Iran happens, which it most likely will soon, don't believe any of the hype and lies that will be sold other than the fact that their energy sources are detrimental to US survival, them have the bomb will take away Isreals uncontested power and not having Uranium imports while controlling oil and gas exports, will interfer with Russia and China's growth and eventual threat.


While I agree that they would be a nuclear power that could contest Isreal, there will be no war. There is no need for one whent the US can simply sit back, fire some missles, and take out their nuclear power plant(s).


If your going to support the war, atleast undestand the truth, don't simplify it with an insulting religious tone that whitewashes all the business involved because that shifts the blame out of the hands of those ultimately responsable.


I'm not one to ignore the strategic implications of any war, but the fact remains that the US doesn't want to go into Iran. This isn't something it desires to do. Frankly, it doesn't make sense from a strategic view. The US has Iran basically surrounded, and has an on going expensive obligation in Iraq, and Afghanistan. From the US point of view, it's better to just lean on Iran rather then throwing a punch.


Saddam was business. Don't let it happen again.
Yup, national security is an important business.



posted on Nov, 18 2005 @ 12:01 PM
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Originally posted by American Mad Man
Who said anything about war, other then Iran starting one?


- Er, you, just below.


At most the US or Israel will just take out their nuclear powerplants.


- See? An act of war, trying to start a war.


Start a rumor? For heavens sake, they have OPENLY called for Isreals destruction.


- I asked you before AMM, who is this "they"?

You mean a President absolutely not in the US model shooting his mouth off and being criticised for it by members of the Iranian gov with actual and real power there, don't you?
Or the revolutionaries during the last 26yrs (and doing nothing other than make the noises)?

The real power in "Iran" did not call for Israel's destruction.


Can you imagine if the President of the US called for Irans complete destruction?


- Why do you insist on equating Iran's style of Presidency with the USA's?
They are not the same and have nothing like the same 'powers'.


MAD doesn't work when leaders are guided by psycho twisted hate filled religious doctrine which calls for the complete destruction of it's neighbor.


- It does when that supposed "leader" hasn't the kind of powers you seem to imagine he has and when the track record to date is that Iran has never used her existing missiles & WMDs against anyone except in retaliation (Iraq).


I do agree though, every nation should have a conventional military that can protect it's citizens.


- It's just unfortunate that if you are called Iran it'll be taken as a threat no matter what, huh?


if some nation views it as a threat, well, it might get taken out.


- Well of course, back to trying to justify the acts of war again?

No matter that the nation that is determined to consider itself under threat is the one with umteen satellites and nuclear weapons already, eh?


that is why every western country in the world is fearfull of Iran.


- That is simply a lie.
Europe is not afraid of Iran.
Europe is afraid of the way in which this issue appears to be being manipulated to justify another ME war.


So now capitalism is the enemy?


- You'd have to be pretty naive or appallingly informed to imagine certain capitalists and capitalist countries never act this way, ever.


Obviously you have no concept of historical prospective.


- Neat if obvious dodge AMM.
The point however still stands.


Yes, you can if it is a legit threat. And guess what - Iran is.


- What "threat"?

They - unlike certain others - haven't attacked anyone in God knows how many years/decades/centuries.


They admit to sponsering terrorism.


- Sadly everybody just about has "sponsored terrorism" at some point or another.....but you excuse this with "historical perspective", remember?


They publically call for whole nations to be wiped from the map.


- No "they" haven't.
A ceremonial President did, hardly the Iranian government.


It is a proven fact that they have had nuclear weapons programs. It's all there for anyone to see.


-

There's that shell game with the similar sounding 'Iraq'.

OK, prove away AMM.
What nuclear weapons program and what proof?


No, you are a "sucka" for being so convinced that the western world is so evil.


- Why are you using silly loaded terms like "evil" now?

'The west' has done plenty in it's own selfish interests.


If Iran just wants to mind their own business, and not stir the pot, why not agree to have their uranium enriched elsewhere?


- That maybe the end result of the current negotiations between Iran, the EU 3 and the Russians.

However, I'd love to see the day when the US decided to leave here nuclear fuel provisions in the hands of a foreign power and feel happy about it.
As if.


Why don't they STOP FUNDING TERRORISTS?


- Again you have been informed several times that the bulk of this so-called funding is to give something to the relatives of those left behind if killed attacking Israel.
Not quite the same thing.

For the rest I suggest you reconsider your "historical perspective".


The fact is, the US, ISreal, and the EU don't want to have to deal with Iran, but Iran is just simply to dangerous to be allowed the chance to develope nukes. You are a fool if you think otherwise.


- Naaaa, sorry AMM but the fool is someone who really think the Europeans see this in the same way as the US and Israel want everyone to, we don't.


There are so many solutions, but they are unwilling to compramise. Why? They want a bunch of nukes for their nut ball radical islamic agenda.


- No.
They want their own sovereignty maintained and not placed in the hands of foreigners.
Same as anyone else.

Obviously you have no clue as to how Iran sees 'western interference' (esp after the previous period when it was a US ally).


While I agree that they would be a nuclear power that could contest Isreal, there will be no war. There is no need for one whent the US can simply sit back, fire some missles, and take out their nuclear power plant(s).


- Unprovoked acts of war to 'help' again is it?
I don't think so and I doubt it would be anything like as easy as you imagine.


I'm not one to ignore the strategic implications of any war, but the fact remains that the US doesn't want to go into Iran.


- I find that highly questionable at the moment.


Yup, national security is an important business.


- That's more like it AMM, cut the hypocrisy and be honest.
It's about domination (of the ME by the USA's proxy, Israel), oil, money (they will have a hard time resisting war if Iran prices in Euros) and continuing control of the oil market.

[edit on 18-11-2005 by sminkeypinkey]


Sep

posted on Nov, 18 2005 @ 08:11 PM
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Originally posted by American Mad Man
Tell you what, when you find a military comander who will go to nuclear war with his strategic intel based off of sat pics from "the open market" you let me know.


Iraqis used WMDs against Iranians using commercial American satellite pictures. And going to an all out nuclear war, which WILL result in the population of both sides dying doesnt, need that much "strategic intel". All that is needed for Iran, if they wanted to destroy Israel using nuclear bombs, is drop a few anywhere in Israel resulting in massive destruction. So what is a satellite going to do? Its not like Israel's geographical position is a state secret, and Iran already has missiles with a CEP of less than 100m.



Wrong again. They are not simply looking to get themselves killed. They have motive. They want to destroy the nation of Isreal. In order to do this they need accurate and time sensitive intel.


I think you are under-estimating the power of a nuclear weapon. If your motive is to destroy an entire population, using nukes, you only need to know where the population is, for which you can refer to an atlas. Hence I see no use for a satellite when a nuclear war is about to begin.


Yet another false assumption. A few nukes can not flatten Isreal, much less take out steel reinforced concrete missle silos burried in rock that would be used to fire back at Iran. These things can survive a near miss by large nuclear weapons. You need a "hit" to take them out.


But if Iran decides to simply attack Israel on a first strike, then the destruction of Iran is inevitable. Even if Iran somehow decides to destroy all of Israel’s nuclear missiles, good old Uncle Sam isn’t going to just sit back. So if Iran is trying to attack Israel and survive they have to destroy the ability of retaliation of not only Israel but all of her allies as well, which is not possible.

So if Iran is attacking Israel with nuclear missiles, she is asking for the death of the population, not to destroy the retaliation or military power of Israel, because destroying this military power is of no use. So the notion sending a satellite to space to spy on Israel to nuke the population somehow doesn’t add up.



It will take Iran about half a decade (plus or minus) from the time they get a nuclear reactor online to build nuclear weapons. I'd say there is a very reasonable chance that he will expire in the near future, say, within 10 years. I do not know who the successor will be, nor can I predict the political climateof Iran 10 years from now with great accuracy. Frankly, if I could there would be less reason for worry.


So you are saying that Iran would send a satellite up now, so that when in ten years they build a nuclear bomb, they can know exactly which part of Tel Aviv to nuke? If they are, then they have to work on their maths because the satellite which is up now has a life span of three years and according to you, if the Bushehr plant somehow miraculously starts working today, Iran would not have a nuke before the satellite dies out. But hey, maybe Iran would defy all laws of Physics and have a nuke soon, and your and the western media's theories would come true.


Any way you cut it, Iran deployed a strategic recon sat, and lied about it.


Did they? When? They said at the beginning that it would be used "to take pictures of Iran and to monitor natural disasters in the earthquake-prone nation". Now if there is any proof that it hasn’t done exactly that and somehow the military wing of the government has took the responsibility of the satellite, instead of the communication ministry, please show us it. If not, it seems that you just accused Iran of lying, which they didn’t, making you a liar.


Iran is not a friend of the US, they are at best a nation with hostile leadership and at worst a nation we will have nuclear war with. There is logical reason for concern.


Iran has not directly attacked the US in any form save the hostage situation during which no one got injured or died (except for the tragedy of operation eagle claw, which Iran had nothing to do with). The US on the other hand has directly attacked Iran, Iranian interests and Iranian civilians killing over 300 of them including 80 children. So if anyone should be concerned it is Iran who is now surrounded by a country, which has attacked it previously and is armed with nuclear weapons.


NR

posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 01:15 AM
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Sep chera zeyartad az eincha namiyah? bro you say more better information than me why dont you participate more? i'm stuck with all the people from west start sending more persians in this forum


[edit on 19-11-2005 by NR]

[edit on 19-11-2005 by NR]



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 08:05 AM
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Originally posted by Sep



Iran has not directly attacked the US in any form save the hostage situation during which no one got injured or died (except for the tragedy of operation eagle claw, which Iran had nothing to do with). The US on the other hand has directly attacked Iran, Iranian interests and Iranian civilians killing over 300 of them including 80 children. So if anyone should be concerned it is Iran who is now surrounded by a country, which has attacked it previously and is armed with nuclear weapons.




West is not seeing the facts and not reading the history either.

They are sensitive about Israel's security only; never mind what happens to rest of the world.

This attitude of the EU+US has given birth to terrorism in the mid-east and their undermining of the soverign Muslim states is an incentive for the muslim youth to join hands with the terrorists.

Their rulers are not capable of retaliation, the youg Muslims think, they are.
If EU+US+Israel place puppet regimes, they rrise against it.

The connivance of the EU+US can topple the regimes, can change the rulers but can not wipe out the angry youth of the Islam, remember there are more than more than 1 billion of them.

The only way to get out of this chain-reaction is justice at international level. All nations, including Israel, be dealt with even handedly.



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 08:29 AM
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We dont negotiate with Terrorists.



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 08:45 AM
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Originally posted by thermopolis
"TEHRAN, Iran - Iran said the satellite would be purely scientific. But a month after its launch — and only weeks after the president said Israel should be wiped off the map — the head of Tehran's space program now says the Sina-1 is capable of spying on the Jewish state. "

news.yahoo.com...

Interesting that they "lied" again isn't it.

Step one............ use spy sat to find targets.

Step two ..........launch second and third sat so you have GPS capability over Israel.

Step three Launch nukes..........................

Step 2-1/2..............US and Israel turn Tehran into glass............





Are you really going to whine about THEM lying?!?? I think there hasnt been a month go past since 9.11 when lies have come out the white house.

At least iran doesnt kill innocent journalists on top of lying to the world on a weekly basis.



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 09:05 AM
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Originally posted by NumberCruncher
We dont negotiate with Terrorists.


thats a relief, I'm sure Ken Bigley felt the same way



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 09:06 AM
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Originally posted by NumberCruncher
We dont negotiate with Terrorists.


WE don't negotiatewith terrorists,
WE
do produce terrorists,
do kill innocent people,
do destroy thousands year old civilizations,
do destabilise the whole world.
************************************

Terrorists dont negotaite with U.S.

Terrorists
do kill innocent people,
do invite U.S. to destroy thousands year old civilizations,
do destabilise the whole world.
************************************

Do U.S. & Terorists promote eachother, befool the world.

Did any one read the article which goes on as:


But as it orbits the Earth some 14 times a day from an altitude around 600 miles, with controllers able to point its cameras as they wish, Sina-1 gives Iran a limited space reconnaissance capability over the entire Middle East, including Israel.

"Sina-1 is a research satellite. It's not possible to use it for military purposes," said Deputy Telecom Minister Ahmad Talebzadeh, who heads the space program.

But he agreed it could spy on Israel.

"Technically speaking, yes. It can monitor Israel," he told The Associated Press. "But we don't need to do it. You can buy satellite photos of Israeli streets from the market."


If one in 21st century does not like satellites to orbit the globe, get that banned for ever from UN (USA in disguise).









[edit on 19/11/2005 by chaudri]



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 01:23 PM
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Originally posted by American Mad Man
It will take Iran about half a decade (plus or minus) from the time they get a nuclear reactor online to build nuclear weapons.


- Anyone else care to just make up a groundless claim based on nothing more than whatever notion just happens to pop into their heads?

The best experts in the US reckon on Iran being at least 10yrs away from a nuclear weapons if they are actually trying to get them.



posted on Nov, 21 2005 @ 06:22 AM
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Originally posted by sminkeypinkey

Originally posted by American Mad Man
It will take Iran about half a decade (plus or minus) from the time they get a nuclear reactor online to build nuclear weapons.


- Anyone else care to just make up a groundless claim based on nothing more than whatever notion just happens to pop into their heads?

The best experts in the US reckon on Iran being at least 10yrs away from a nuclear weapons if they are actually trying to get them.



Please refer to an old source for better information. ATS itself as seen from around the world.

www.barabari.ch...



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