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If Jesus survived, would Christianity?

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posted on Oct, 27 2005 @ 03:14 PM
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Originally posted by LoneGunMan
It is your fruits, it is what you learn from life, not the belief in a certain diety that gets you to heaven.


So how many good works do you have to do to get into heaven? 7? 31? What happens if you do a bad work, do you have to counter it with another good work? What makes you acceptable in the eyes of God? 76 more good works than bad works, maybe?




posted on Oct, 27 2005 @ 03:33 PM
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When you have experienced all there is on the physical plane, then you ascend, to the next plane of existance. It is not the number of good works versus the number of bad. There is only Ying and Yang. Positive and negative. If you do not learn a lesson in a particular lifetime, then you do not move foreward in your quest on this plane.

This is where christians make the mistake. You think its like some reward system you give a dog. It is not. It is life. Look at nature, I mean really look at it. If you look close enough you will find the answer.

[edit on 27-10-2005 by LoneGunMan]



posted on Oct, 27 2005 @ 03:39 PM
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Jesus is/was God. There's nothing that says He isn't.

Remember that while fully God, Jesus at one point was fully MAN.

Christians are to do the will of God--not fulfill their own human agendas.

Jesus humbled Himself and became a man so He could offer the perfect sacrifice, once and for all. As a man He was tempted in all points, but He never sinned.

One God, three Persons. It's summed up as the Trinity (I John 5:7).



posted on Oct, 27 2005 @ 03:45 PM
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Ahh, so the real religion is Taoism, and Christians make a huge mistake by not believing that. Well, as does every other religion. I disagree, obviously. I think the one real religion is Christianity, no matter how much I look at nature.



posted on Oct, 27 2005 @ 03:51 PM
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The trinity? You have no idea what you are talking about my friend. The trinity had been taken from the Pagans. It means the maiden, the mother and the crone. It is all about reserection, not the father son and the holy ghost.

I beleive the bible has some great stories to help mankind in our quest. My beliefs are older and much more ancient. My beliefs were hijacked, twisted and used by your religion.

You do understand that thanksgiving, Christmas and easter were taken from Pagans dont you? You have to wonder how much more you have been lied too.



posted on Oct, 27 2005 @ 03:52 PM
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Originally posted by junglejake
Ahh, so the real religion is Taoism, and Christians make a huge mistake by not believing that. Well, as does every other religion. I disagree, obviously. I think the one real religion is Christianity, no matter how much I look at nature.


No my religion is Witchcraft.



posted on Oct, 27 2005 @ 03:58 PM
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Originally posted by LoneGunMan
No my religion is Witchcraft.


Ooo, I'm sorry. I went down that road for several years...Started out really cool...Didn't end that way.



posted on Oct, 27 2005 @ 03:58 PM
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My beliefs are actually wide open. I believe all religion can teach me something. My spiritual practice, though is in ancient Magick, and I get my power from God and nature.

Being a Witch, I bet you think I am evil...



posted on Oct, 27 2005 @ 04:00 PM
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Originally posted by LoneGunMan
Being a Witch, I bet you think I am evil...


Nope. I think the powers are, but they start out being so helpful. At least if you're into white magic as I was (and fortunes). In my experience and in talking to other practitioners as it started to go south, the more and more you rely on it, the darker and darker it gets. That's not a road I would want to travel down again, and it is not one I would wish on anyone else.



posted on Oct, 27 2005 @ 04:03 PM
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Well I do not practice because I think its cool. I practice to be in touch with all that is natural. To get away from ego. I have changed quite a bit since I have started. I used to have uite a few bad habits and thoughts that I have succsefully abolished from my life.

I have heard many Chistians going to Witchcraft, but not many Witches going to Christianity. What gives?



posted on Oct, 27 2005 @ 04:07 PM
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Sounds like an article I read. Seems this book goes around and around the Christian circle.




Bill Schnoebelen, author of Wicca: Satan's Little White Lie, can be very persuasive, even though he is not a very good speaker. What makes Schnoebelen's stories seem more credible to his audiences is the fact that he dabbled in Wicca in the past, making it possible for him to add little bits of the truth in with the falsehoods that he preaches. Over the years he and his wife Alexandria have tried many different spiritual paths, seeking one which would satisfy his obviously intense desire to have power over others. It is hardly surprising then to learn that he has finally become a fundamentalist Christian who lectures against anything other than fundamentalist Christianity. ~sniped~


Can be found here in its complet form.

[edit on 27-10-2005 by LoneGunMan]



posted on Oct, 27 2005 @ 04:15 PM
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Originally posted by LoneGunMan
I have heard many Chistians going to Witchcraft, but not many Witches going to Christianity. What gives?


What can I say, I'm not normal. Besides, it was about 2 or 3 years between the last time I touched any kind of magic or anything before finding Christ. Ironically, I didn't believe in any God at the time, only in the spiritual world.



posted on Oct, 27 2005 @ 08:30 PM
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I have been gone the last 3 and a half hours, sorry for leaving in the middle this JJ. Its not really possible, in my opinion to believe in the spiritual and not believe in a God of some sort! How can you be into magick and not believe in a God.



posted on Oct, 28 2005 @ 12:48 PM
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How can you be into magick and not believe in a God.

Quite easily but then it depends on your definition of God/gods. Religions are very much self interpreted, someone might give their view which is totally different to yours but both are right as there is really no way to prove the interpretation.
Back to the thread. Would Christianity exist if Jesus didn't die on the cross?
Are we talking Christianity or Churchianity, also the fact that Jesus might never have existed never mind dying on a cross or otherwise could come into it. However I reckon Yes christianity would still exist (Its still here)



G



posted on Oct, 28 2005 @ 12:54 PM
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Christianity would not exist had Christ not been crucified. Had Christ not been crucified, and He hadn't said any of His comments supporting Himself as God, then He would have just been another rabbi who would probably have been forgotten by now. He may have influenced Judaism, but the Jews are a small people, and the Talmud probably wouldn't be studied or even known to the majority of people. Jesus would not be the Christ, His lessons would exist on a few pages within a massive tome and He may have slightly changed Jewish interpretations of the Torah. Nothing more.



posted on Oct, 28 2005 @ 01:33 PM
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Originally posted by junglejake

Originally posted by LoneGunMan
It is your fruits, it is what you learn from life, not the belief in a certain diety that gets you to heaven.


So how many good works do you have to do to get into heaven? 7? 31? What happens if you do a bad work, do you have to counter it with another good work? What makes you acceptable in the eyes of God? 76 more good works than bad works, maybe?


It's not about how much you do it's about where your heart is at. If you only doing good works just to get into "heaven" then the laws of the universe will not go in your favor because you are doing it out of selfishness. It about doing thing just because you feel and know it is right. This is how the laws of karma and the universe work.


Originally posted by junglejake
Ahh, so the real religion is Taoism, and Christians make a huge mistake by not believing that. Well, as does every other religion. I disagree, obviously. I think the one real religion is Christianity, no matter how much I look at nature.


The real religion is having no religion at all. When it comes down to it eventually we all are going the same way. Some will just take a little longer than others.


Originally posted by Amethyst
Jesus is/was God. There's nothing that says He isn't.

Remember that while fully God, Jesus at one point was fully MAN.

Christians are to do the will of God--not fulfill their own human agendas.

Jesus humbled Himself and became a man so He could offer the perfect sacrifice, once and for all. As a man He was tempted in all points, but He never sinned.

One God, three Persons. It's summed up as the Trinity (I John 5:7).


You have a right to believe what you want but like I said quoting verse shows that you have not argument at all.

Ok i am leaving this thread alone now


[edit on 28-10-2005 by DaTruth]



posted on Oct, 28 2005 @ 01:41 PM
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Yeah, Amethyst, by quoting your beliefs, you're showing you have no case at all, whereas DaTruth and others have supported their view of reincarnation, no condemnation, no mistakes with a lot of evidence and support. Sheesh, Amethyst, can't you play on their level


(that was sarcasm, by the way
)



posted on Oct, 28 2005 @ 02:23 PM
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Originally posted by junglejake
Yeah, Amethyst, by quoting your beliefs, you're showing you have no case at all, whereas DaTruth and others have supported their view of reincarnation, no condemnation, no mistakes with a lot of evidence and support. Sheesh, Amethyst, can't you play on their level


(that was sarcasm, by the way
)


I was showing that by quoting i proved what he said as false. Their are many passages that show that Jesus was not God. Look back on page one. I see you didn't comment on them. The only thing you did get right about my beliefs is reincarnation. Don't know where you got the other two from. I don't try to prove to others because i am comfortable with my beliefs to where I don't have to argue about them. It is people who have complex’s are the ones that argue to try and prove their beliefs. Ok i'm done now for real



posted on Oct, 29 2005 @ 12:00 AM
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Originally posted by junglejake
Yeah, Amethyst, by quoting your beliefs, you're showing you have no case at all, whereas DaTruth and others have supported their view of reincarnation, no condemnation, no mistakes with a lot of evidence and support. Sheesh, Amethyst, can't you play on their level


(that was sarcasm, by the way
)


Again Amethyst is quoting his beliefs but he is quoting the bible claiming the Trinity. The Trinty is more ancient than the bible. It is not the father the son and the holy ghost. It is the Maiden, the Mother, and the Crone. Otherwise know as the triple Goddess. Also when you celebrate CHRISTmas and easter, just remember those were also stolen from Pagans, and are both older than Christ. So when someone says to you while you are christmas shopping, remember the spirit of christmas, or remember the real reason we are celebrating christmas, you tell them it is because of Yule tide and it is a witches sabbat that christians hijacked!! Sorry I couldnt resist the rant!



posted on Oct, 30 2005 @ 09:32 AM
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here we go with the argument that Christians ursurped pagen religions and have nothing original about them. While Pagens and neopagens (that is wiccans) are the true original source.

FYI Wicca didn't existed until shortly after 1940, and revitalised the pagen movment once Britan repealed the ban on witchcraft. Thus is why it is called neopagen.

THe idea of the holy trinity has been around since the dawn of history. And it is more likely that other religions copied Judeo-chrisitan practices to fit in and be more accptable to other cultures.

Christmas was created in place of a pagen sun-God festival, yet really has no connection to the festival except for the date. Same with easter which is thought of to have pagen origins only when you look at the symbols used, or mistranslate words and link them to pagen Gods.

Regardless the "My religion came first" argument can be easily mis-interpeted, and muddled that it really has no meaning or relevance and only severse to divide people further.

Christianity relies on Faith, on beliving what cannot be proven. Thus we refer to Doubting Thomas

John 20:29 Then Jesus told him, "Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed."


A newborn loves his parents, but you can't PROVE it. Yet if you ask any new parent they know thier child loves them. Thus Chrisitans even without proof love thier God, and know God loves them



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