*Revolutionary War Watch* USA

It doesn't give us rights, it enumerates our God-given rights. Life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness.

I don't believe in god, so should I be forced to believe that each man was endowed with those rights from god? Further more, if an elected official doesn't believe in god should he have to abide by those rights.

Our attention has always been diverted to an outer enemy so we don't focus on the enemy within.

We are then further divided bickering about unsolvable social issues to keep us from uniting as
Americans to rid our country of corruption and mismanagement of resources.

We fail ourselves with complacency and apathy while those who understand this weakness
in our human nature walk away with the spoils.

A true revolution would have to begin with massive unilateral outrage towards our leadership.

However, without the strength of truly worthy leadership within the existing government, we would
fall into chaos and civil war.

Katrina has shown us that we do have the power to force our leadership to change.

We just have to remain focused and united and forget our petty differences.

Starting off my post, I'm getting two points out of the way:

1) 0.002% = 5,940 people, out of 297,000,000. I think we can all agree, that at least a few more than 6,000 Americans presently feel that a revolution is a good idea. There are likely more than 6,000 Americans signed up at this very message board, let alone part of fanatical revolutionary groups, or who just happen to feel that way.

2) The election year is 2008, not 2006. The dollar won't collapse until 2009 if it is going after an election year.

Now, continuing, I'd like to stress that despite the apparent lack of Revolutionarily apt people, who really support it, there is a very great number, I'd estimate it to be well over 40% of the population, who are generally unhappy with the government as it stands. These are the people who can be pushed, the people who need to be taken from the point of thinking "This isn't quite right." to the point of "I need to make this right."

Thus, as has been mentioned earlier in the thread, we need a trigger.

What major events are forseeable in the future? As in, we know that they'll happen?

The Election in 2008

Now that's an intentionally short list. Of course there's also Additional Terror Attacks, or Pandemic Disease Outbreaks, or any number of horrible bad things, but the only one we're really promised, that by all means should be happening, is that Good Ol' Election.

Of course, if there's a singe very important event other than that in the next 5 years, it should be discussed, if you know one, bring it up later, we'll talk.

Here is my simplified outline for the election year and build-up.

2006: Early, Early campaigning for Party Leadership begins.
2007: Party Candidates chosen. Hilary vs Schwarzenneger? I don't know.
Early 2008: Campaigning goes. Candidates have their fun.
Mid- 2008: Democratic Party Leads - Hilary Trumps? Maybe.
Sept-Early Oct 2008, All's well, drawing to elections
Mid-Late Oct: Terrorist Attack hits a large city.
Late Oct: Second Terrorist Attack hits another large city in aftermath.
November 1st: Third Terrorist Attack in a third city.
November 1st: President Bush announces a need to suspend the elections. Congress Agrees. National State of Emergency Declared.
November 2nd: Nothing. No elections.
December: New date set for elections: June.
January-March: Candidate takes sick in outbreak of disease.
April: New campaigning for New party leader begins.
May: Debate on keeping president Bush for whole third term, in light of emergency, lack of candidate.
June: No elections.
September: Revolution begins.

Or, something to that effect. Many people say that a President cannot hold office for 3 terms. FDR Did. FDR Did it because of the War. President Bush definitely could.

At this point, there's two paths America can take. Well, three, but I doubt the third can happen.

1) Social, Political, Ethical decline. Standard of living decreases, Government becomes draconian beyond any previously known point. Military power skyrockets, internal conflicts occur, a coup, and a descent into the depths of History for the now defunct American Empire.
2) A Revolution occurs, a new order is formed, a new government, corporations are knocked down, wealth is redistributed. New, more powerful America rises, American Empire is reborn.
3) Massive Social/Political Reform are undertaken, government cleans itself out, breaks ties to Middle East and Corporations. People take reliance off of oil, new tech, smarter lifestyle is adopted. 6% Growth is not standardly expected, stability is. American Empire continues as itself, but with a new outlook.

We passed a point of No Return when America went into Iraq. It shrugged the world off and dared everyone to stop it. It went against the collective will of everyone else, and the price it will pay is that the Empire is now in decline. Will the empire fall? Will the people save it? Will the government? I see only three choices, and, feeling that the government will not save itself and the people, I'd say that the onus is on the people to save it, before a point is passed where they can not.

Big words, big thoughts, not necessarily new, but important.

As much as everyone would like this just to be Cold War 2 somehow, or just a repeat of earlier internalised conflicts, they have to realise that the world is generally worse off now than it was before. In the new Century, in the new Millenium, the world is a vastly different place, as prophecy would have us believe. 9/11 signalled the start of this change, and it is both exciting, and terrifying, waiting for the end.

(As a tag-on nutjob thing for me to say, if Benedict-XVI dies in early December this year, then the Apocalypse has undoubtedly begun and crap will hit the fan. Last good Pope dies in 2005+7 Years of Tribulations = December 21st, 2012, when the world as we've ever known it ends. Only if Benedict dies though. Don't hate me for this.)

Originally posted by LDragonFire

quote-A stun gun is the most effective non-lethal weapon. Have you been attacked by criminals on the road or threatened by a vicious dog? Don’t panic. You only need to touch an attacker with one of our stun guns for three to five seconds. The high voltage shock will immobilize them for five to ten minutes.

tazer.com


This is the first time i have heard the phrase less than leathal....

129 deaths due to tazers, I agree tazers should be used when its a 1 on 1 situation...all others should be procecuted for excessive force.

Sorry but none of your links are working. Also WWW.Tazer.com is a paintball site.

''Non-Lethal'' would mean these weapons could not kill. Which is just not true of Rubber bullets,bean bag rounds, Tazers etc.. have all been proven to kill and the people that make them know this. Thats why the correct term is ''Less-lethal''. They are ''Less-lethal'' then a cops next option in many case his firearm.

If you never heard the term ''Less-lethal'' weapon im not shocked since you can't even spell it right . Its also a safe bet to say you dont work in a field that requires you to have a less-lethal weapon.

I dont care how many sites you find using the term "non-lethal" to describe weapons like this its not going to make it correct


[edit on 18-9-2005 by ShadowXIX]

Or, something to that effect. Many people say that a President cannot hold office for 3 terms. FDR Did. FDR Did it because of the War. President Bush definitely could.

Wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong.

When FDR did it it was because it was allowed back then. Since then the constitution has been amended to only allow for two terms.

Skibum is right the 22nd Amendment (limiting a president to two terms) wasnt ratified until 1951.

FDR died 1945

www.taser.com... "Tazer International" if link doesn't work

ShadowXIX Excuse me for not spelling right, I did notice you had to edit your post, So we have established that not only am I not perfect, You AIN'T either... But Hey thanks for pointing out my spelling mistake, if thats what it takes to make you feel good.

I goggled "tazer less than lethal" the first site up was a paintball site.

I goggled "tazer non lethal weapon" no paintball sites, well the first 3 pages there was no paint-ball sites.

You call it what you want, Ill call it what I want. If you would like to post more about Tazer's and the ways to describe them, start your own thread about it. Please stay on topic.

You are correct I don't work in a field that requires me to have Non-Lethal weapons. All of my weapons are quite lethal.


Viendin:
Exacellent, and well put. This is a very believible senario, or something like it happening, thanks for the posts. Really, would it surprize Anyone if terrorists strike before the next or near the next elections?


peace

Look at this about Cindy Sheehan's latest rally being halted.

By all means, read the article...but also read the comments after it. Look at what some people are saying:

"Protesters should have reponded violently and attacked the police. Protesters should have kicked the living *censored* out of the police."

That's pretty clear.

" I deeply respect the honest liberals and libertarians out there who are fighting for these rights, but we don'thave them anymore than when Redcoats prowled the city, or slave-catchers. "

This one is a little more subtle...but "Red Coats?" That definately a "Revolutionary" reference.

"People of the USA, it's time we wake up and smell the Revolution!"

Yep. They're talking about Revolution, and some of them are calling it by name.

So I have a couple questions I'd like to ask. Not that I expect answers...but I'd like to ask the questions:

1) If there were a Revolution, would it play into the hands of some dark, sinister, schemeing forces somewhere?

2) Would people even be talking about revolution if it weren't for the John Titor material?

3) How many people talking about it on discussion boards elsewhere are the same people? if I see five different message boards with a dozen people talking about revolting, is that one dozen, or five dozen real people?

Mod Edit: Removed profanity.

[edit on 20-9-2005 by sanctum]

I believe the poster that referred to an economic colllapse that faces the majority of Americans will be the event that could spark major protests against our government.....................if nothing is done then a revolution could start only when most Americans see no future or hope in their current situation...............

If that collapse of our economy through oil resources or monetary depletion made it impossible for most Americans to work, travel, pay bills.......find food or groceries........then the crap would hit the fan at some time during this process...........

BTW...........Iraq is the start of decline.................why?.............we are formost in there because Saddam was moving off the dollar to the Euro as the trading standard for oil........that would have caused a huge sell off in dollar supply among nations that would have devestated our national economy worse than any depression in the past..........it was intent to move to the Euro which saw our fannies make up lies and get into that country fast............a second reason would be an attempt to stablize and secure oil reserves in a fast developing and competing World for such a key resource to our economy.........

........9/11 gave us a perfect pearl harbor for our gathering forces and attacking terrorism.......but we really stretched out the truth to use Iraq as a key target................

Now Iran wants to trade oil on the Euro as well..............does that mean more attacking on the horizon??

We should have never left the gold standard in devaluing our money......damn multinational corporations and their free trade agenda pushed us to that point in the Nixon years and its been getting worse for the country ever since..............

When I was a young fellow right out of college starting work full time in the middle 70's I used to ride a bus home from the office and befriended a rider who was a corporate executive in his 60's and studied economics all his life...............he told me that going off the gold standard would be the biggest economic mistake America would ever make as a nation and becaue of it we have seen our best days as a nation gone bye....

.........he told me that increasing the money supply outside of a gold standard to back the dollar was inviting free trade over fair trade............outsourcing and illegal immigration............and corporate takeover of our government and constitutional values..........

.........and he told me this in 1976...

.....I'll never forget it because I thought he was just blowing smoke..........but it stayed with me and in the last 10 years I am frightened by his predictions being so accurate...........I'm sure he's long gone by now but I'd sure like to meet up with him if he was still alive........

Originally posted by LDragonFire
There have been many threads on ATS as of late regarding a Civil War in America. I believe this is misleading as a Civil War indicates a War between the citizens vs. citizens of this country.

I believe if something where to happen like this it would be a Revolution, Citizen Vs. Federal Government.

John Titor posts are welcome here, but remember this is about a Revolutionary War right here in the USA not about whether Titor is a fraud or not. If you believe he is a fraud or not is irrelovent.

I believe things are devoloping in our country, that a spark such as another Governmental failure to protect and to respond to a crisis like hurricane Katrina & 9/11. Could cause a situation like this to begin. With 9/11 the failure of the government to protect us from such a act, then not fireing anyone who failed to stop this. Then the slow responce to Katrina, possiblly because most areas affected where poor black folk...ect...ect

The increasing Rights given to authoritys to combat the war on Terror.[terroism in a ideology, not a country] so its war against thought or a point of view

The increasing Rights to the government to take away private property for corperations

The growing number of deaths to citizens by the police using "Non-leathal weapon"

The USA has the largest prison population on Earth.

ok this is just a few thoughts, let me know what you think

peace

my thought is that we have a mechanism to remove W and his cronies peacefully, if it comes to that. Its called impeachment.

If you prefer to fantasize about violence, I'll ask you this. In your revolutionary war of citizens vs military, how do the citizens organize, and how do they fight the most powerful military on earth ?

hmmm, Have you read what I have posted.....I started this thread, But I have stated that I want a peacefull solution to Americas problems. I don't think were going to be that lucky. And Many Agree with me

I have never visited a third world country unless you count Arkansas/Mississippi J/K. syrinx high priest I answered your question know you answer mine...What have you Debunked? anything ever in your life? please provide proof of your debunking, facts links...anything will do.

Sept 24 & 26 should be a interesting News days

www.unitedforpeace.org...

www.washingtonpost.com...

This is another interesting read:

www.lewrockwell.com...

Ask the Vietcong how they fought the most modern military in the world...Ask the Iraqis how they are fighting against it....













[edit on 20-9-2005 by LDragonFire]

There will be civil war before there is revolution. And even I dont see US civil war happening in my life time. As for the member comment that most Americans are happy with their country. I would rather translate that to mean they are all warm and cozy in the consumer facade that is the thinnest veil of all. The fragile societal construct that they (and other nations) participate in is a house of cards. it only takes one card for the whole thing (pretty much) to come tumbling down.

There are many books that are popular among survivalists that try to paint a picture of what such a scenario might be like. I and most survivalists think they fall very short of the mark but provide an "as close as we can get" yarn to talk over amongst those who are aware of the fragility of the western world we live in.

Katrina was/is a thorough STHTF scenario played out in real-real time. Rita will be much of the same, and will be all the more interesting because we will see what exactly a government (and one with the most resources to throw) will try to "alleviate". The confiscation of arms from law-abiding citizens was a very interesting turn of events after Katrina, and not a shot fired in protest. That was very very interesting. Particularly given the 2nd ammendment and the constant rabid bleating we all hear about it. "From my cold dead fingers"...just doesn't really sound that appealing to people these days. Might miss the next season of Desperate Housewives or the Half-Life 2 expansion pack if you start asking for a squad of special operations police to come storming through tear gas into your lounge room.




[edit on 21-9-2005 by cargo]

I think it is brewing in the minds of many and it is growing. Their are many ways a Revolutionary War could start.... take a look at Rita if gun confiscations were issued in Texas you can bet there would be a lot of gun fire. What started the Revolutionary War that made our nation was gun confiscations and I can see that as the reason if a Revolutionary War were to start.

the only ones that want civil war are white supremacists, and anti govt militias. nothing else. and they dont have much support from the rest of the American people. end of story. wen McVeigh attacked the federal building back in 95, guess he thought it may start a civil war or revolutionary war.

en.wikipedia.org...

At McVeigh's trial, the United States Government asserted that the motivation for the attack was to avenge the deaths of Branch Davidians near Waco, Texas, who he believed had been murdered by agents of the federal government. McVeigh called the casualties in the bombing "collateral damage" and compared the bombing to actions he had taken during the Gulf War. The attack was staged on the second anniversary of the Waco incident. McVeigh is thought to have modeled the bombing on a similar event described in The Turner Diaries, a white supremacist novel that was found with McVeigh when he was arrested. Some have suggested that the date was purposely chosen in these instances as it coincides with the beginning of the American Revolutionary War and hence represents a date for bold action.

Impending doom... DOOM! once again raises it's ugly head on ATS. So much to go wrong, so little does... at least that you can notice.
Katrina was supposed to kill 40,000 from sources as far left as NPR and right as Drudge repeated, seems they were wrong by a 39,000.
Everybody hates the USA.
World ending prophisized events are taking place.
I'm going out to the patio with Mrs. Realist, have a CC/Stock Manhatten, and enjoy watching the big storm roll in. See ya.

The only revolution taking place in the US is the conservative revolution. You will start to see more and more young people take up conservative (I stress, NOT republican) ideals. I think eventually you will see Libertarian beliefs dominate American politics.

There will be no revolution where American fights American. Just won't happen, at least in the mid-term.

one thing is certain: things could be run better.

anyone here a member of the sons of the revolutionary war?

ive got the heredity requirements to join, but its somewhat frivilous for a 19 year old to be spending his money on

the concept of it is pretty good, but i think it could do more.

www.sar.org

The government in place now does not seem to working in the best interest of the American people.
And yes according to the Declaration of Independance we have the right to change the situation.
I don't think an all out gun battle will do anyone any good. I purpose that this 4th of July intead of going to a park and watch fireworks we move to abolish both the Republican and Democratic partys.

Originally posted by Stevo_Devo
I purpose that this 4th of July intead of going to a park and watch fireworks we move to abolish both the Republican and Democratic partys.

And do what instead?

How would you propose this?

What's your alternative?

Curious minds want to know

And do what instead?

get rid of the "Old Boys Network"

How would you propose this?

same way we have been, signed petitions and voting that sort of thing.

What's your alternative?

a government that works for we the people instead of just a small group, you know like the way it was supposed to be.


Curious minds want to know