Masonic Government involved with Child Abuse and Pedophilia?

Originally posted by suzy ryan
Come on now, part of the truth is a lie. Tell the good folk at ATS who she vilified and how....come on now make our point for us.

Actually all at ATS should be affaid of the how and why this was done to an Australian of the year. Google 'gaiaguys' and 'Victorian Police Corruption'.

Are all survivers their parents and friends mad or bad and all secret societies sane and benevolent? No sorry, it's only masons who would never lie or hurt anyone because they can and want to...yeah right...got a bridge to sell me too?

You know, I have tried and tried to follow your posts, suzy, and it's just sooooo jumbled up that I can't really make it out. If you could present your case a little more coherently, it might help. I know others have said this in the past regarding your contributions, being hazy and not making much sense, so I don't feel it is just me being biased. I can't even understand your point, if you are just repeating hearsay about some story you heard or read about in Australia, or if you were in some trial as the victim or witness or if you are a survivor or what.



[edit on 12-8-2005 by Stegosaur]

Originally posted by suzy ryan
Are all survivers their parents and friends mad or bad and all secret societies sane and benevolent? No sorry, it's only masons who would never lie or hurt anyone because they can and want to...yeah right...got a bridge to sell me too?

I don't think anyone is saying Masons would never lie. Or even hurt someone.

Masons are human, after all.

But you're still talking about something of which you have absolutely no proof. None at all. Just hyperbole and accusations.

Thankfully, accusations do not necessarily imply guilt. You should really, really spend some time looking into this entire subject; at the very least, you'll be able to critically pull apart some of the more famous (and since debunked) allegations of ritual abuse.

Originally posted by suzy ryan
Come on now, part of the truth is a lie. Tell the good folk at ATS who she vilified and how....come on now make our point for us.

How? she supported the bozos who claim as part of my religious practice I kill and rape children.

Actually all at ATS should be affaid of the how and why this was done to an Australian of the year. Google 'gaiaguys' and 'Victorian Police Corruption'.

Maybe you should google the site. from the site (I'm not going to link to this trash)

The Australian legal system has judged the two unpaid volunteer authors of this website guilty of defaming the Ordo Templi Orientis (in our language, the Order of the Eastern Templars) Freemasons who also call themselves the Illuminati in their higher degrees. We must pay this legal corporation/legal religion more than A$30,000 compensation (approx 2x our total annual income) for articles that still remain intact on this gigantic private whistleblowers' website.

GOOD NEWS!

Thou asked hence shall it be!

*LOL* I suck at writing in divine English!

So if EYE witness reports and SWORN testimonies don’t work for you what do you want, pictures? I HOPE NOT! Case files etc, when we are telling you that the “ausie” police does nothing to investigate, hence there are none!

I can bring you numerous witness reports but I won’t! Because you say they aren’t valid *LOL*, and I don’t want you to waste your precious time! Or ATS’s precious bandwidth!

Here are some authors and activists!

The Age newspaper (5th April, 6th April, 19th April),

" It is claimed that police inadequately investigated pedophile activity in which police were allegedly implicated, and that a video implicating police, in the possession of a detective, was lost."

By Gary Hughes, Melbourne Age

April 5, 2004

Victoria's Ombudsman is investigating the alleged mishandling of police inquiries into child sexual abuse, including claims of corrupt police behaviour.

One of seven specific allegations under investigation relates to a 1992-1993 police inquiry.

It is claimed that police inadequately investigated pedophile activity in which police were allegedly implicated, and that a video implicating police, in the possession of a detective, was lost.

But the Ombudsman's internal investigation, which has been running for two years, has itself been plagued by problems.

These include delays and the need to remove one police Ethical Standards Department investigator after he failed to pass on crucial information from two witnesses who alleged possible police involvement in an organised pedophile and child pornography ring.

The claims against police were referred to the Ombudsman by Chief Commissioner Christine Nixon in early 2002. A formal investigation started in June that year.

Victorian police are conducting a parallel criminal investigation into connected allegations of organised pedophilia and child pornography and links to the entertainment industry.

The Ombudsman is looking at three previous police investigations of alleged child sexual abuse, one at a Mornington child care centre in 1992, a second involving students at a school in a central Victorian town in 1999, and a third into Gregory John Stevens, a former scriptwriter for the TV series Neighbours, who pleaded guilty in the County Court in 1997 to sexual acts with a 14-year-old boy.

Police did not lay charges in the Mornington or country school cases.

One involved allegations that two men in the country town were sexually abusing schoolchildren. In the Mornington case, a Department of Human Services inquiry concluded that the child care centre owners, who denied any wrongdoing, had allowed and possibly participated in the sexual abuse of children in their care.

By Gary Hughes, Melbourne Age

April 6, 2004

The Department of Human Services refused to mount its own investigation into allegations of sexual abuse of schoolchildren in a Victorian country town after details were provided through the mandatory reporting system.

The decision was made following advice from police, whose alleged mishandling of the investigation is now part of a Victorian Ombudsman's inquiry.

The former student welfare co-ordinator at the school, which cannot be identified for legal reasons, told The Age that the police investigation was "incompetent" and the children had been treated by police in an "appalling" manner.

A detective claimed a jury would not be convinced a boy had been abused because "similar behaviour of males attempting to touch other men's penises happens in football rooms after the game", said the co-ordinator, who took detailed notes. The Age revealed yesterday that the case is part of an Ombudsman's investigation into alleged police mishandling of a number of child sex abuse cases and possible corrupt police behaviour.

In developments yesterday:

The Law Institute of Victoria renewed its call for an independent review of Victoria's police complaints system and, if necessary, the creation of a powerful anti-corruption commission similar to bodies in NSW and Queensland.

By Gary Hughes

The Age, April 19, 2004

Police files on a suspect who claimed sexual abuse by men dressed as police are said to have "disappeared".

A deputy principal who reported a student's claim of the abuse says detectives later told him that Victoria Police computer files on one of the alleged pedophiles were tampered with.

He was also told his initial report to the Department of Human Services under the mandatory reporting system disappeared.

The 13-year-old boy told staff at the school he had been repeatedly sexually abused by a number of men on the Mornington Peninsula. He said some of the men wore police uniforms and warned him that they would know if he reported the abuse because they were policemen. The boy had also been used to produce child pornography later published overseas.

I am sorry that I have to post all this but I went through their homepage and couldnt find any old articles! So I don’t think they have that option turned on! Anyways articles taken from:

theage.com.au...

www.theage.com.au...

www.theage.com.au...

www.theage.com.au...

www.theage.com.au...

theage.com.au...

theage.com.au...


The paper not the homepage! Oh and BTW found the articles online!

Also look up the Leader written by Dr. Reina Michaelson, in Mornington Peninsula!

Greed
Edited by James Chessell
January 15 2003
Former dot-commers still like to watch ...
You can take the boy out of the dot-com but you can't take the dot-com out of the boy.
The last time your diarist ran into Peter Crafter and Cary Stynes was late last year at a highly amusing Software Communications Group gathering.
Having both been former Sofcom grand pooh-bahs, the dynamic duo seemed to be enjoying the show - Perth lawyer and dot-bomb raider Farooq Khan, of Bigshop.com fame, trading verbal blows with fellow opportunist, Vaz Hovanessian - but stayed on the sidelines. They were, after all, out of the Internet game.
In July 2001, Stynes left Jeffcom, as it was then known, and later replaced Barry Moignard at the helm of CBD Online. CBD has since become CBD Energy, a business based on a machine that measures carbon-dioxide levels in buildings such as car parks.

Crafter lasted about a year before he, along with fellow board members Kennett and Kevin Dutton, left Sofcom.
(Followers of Stynes' career will remember he was formerly the head of Media Entertainment Group, which went on to report an $11 million loss after he left.)

www.theage.com.au...

Also read this article from July 8, 2004!

review of the handling of child sexual abuse has raised questions about the ability of some officers assigned to these crimes

Stroke hits Ombudsman

STATE Ombudsman Dr Barry Perry lay undiscovered in a paddock for several hours after suffering a stroke on Anzac Day.

He is being treated in the Alfred Hospital, where he was yesterday described as being seriously ill. Dr Perry, who is also Deputy Ombudsman (Police Complaints), was walking alone on a friend's property near Daylesford when he collapsed on Friday afternoon. A neighbour was contacted and asked to look for Dr Perry after he failed to return to his Melbourne home as planned that night.

Then funny enough the Ombudsman involved gets a stroke! *lol* so would I! If I had to do he’s job!

And some more links!

www.gaiaguys.net...

www.csapp.net...

www.theage.com.au...

www.bandt.com.au...

www.abc.net.au...

By Gary Hughes
July 8, 2004
Victoria Police will reopen four child sex abuse investigations and overhaul its sexual crimes squad after a damning Victorian Ombudsman inquiry identified serious shortcomings in the way cases had been handled.
Two senior members of the squad, who are among the force's most experienced sexual crimes investigators, face disciplinary action over failing to adequately investigate a number of cases and will be asked to explain why they should not be transferred.
The inquiry also found the pair may have lied under oath to Ombudsman investigators and accused one of unprofessional and rude conduct.
The confidential 37-page report, seen by The Age, also found:
*snip*

Claims police mishandled child sex abuse cases
Broadcast: 09/07/2004
Reporter: Josephine Cafagna

The Stateline!

THE PAEDOPHILE AND SATANIC NETWORK IN AUSTRALIA INVOLVING GOVERNMENT OFFICIALS, LEADING POLITICIANS, TELEVISION EXECUTIVES, TOP TV PRESENTERS, AND THE POLICE.

A MUST READ BECAUSE THIS IS HOW IT WORKS ALL OVER THE WORLD



By Reina Michaelson

The following is a summary of events that detail the infiltration of a high-profile, powerful group of child sex offenders into my child abuse prevention organisation. What was uncovered as a result of this infiltration was the existence of an Illuminati-based child pornography and pedophile ring that is operating in Australia, under the protection of senior-ranking members of Victoria Police. The members of the network include senior management and executives from a major television network, media celebrities, high-ranking politicians, police officers in charge of pedophile and child pornography investigations, senior management representatives from the Department of Education, directors of "child-focused" service clubs, wealthy businessmen, and others. I have tried to keep the account as brief as possible while trying to include all relevant information. The description covers events from 1995 until present. The names of individuals have been changed.


Department of Education Protects Pedophile Teacher

In 1995 I started running Australia's first child sexual abuse prevention program in schools, the Child Sexual Abuse Prevention Program (CSAPP). This school-based program teaches children how to protect themselves from sexual abuse and what to do if someone tries to sexually abuse them. The program also teaches adults how they can best protect children under their care from sexual abuse. My assistant and I were at a particular high school in the northern region working with Year 9 boys. We received a note written anonymously by one of the boys asking "What do you do if you get raped by a teacher and no-one will believe you? What happens if you get raped and you enjoy it?". Later during that day we were asked exactly the same question by a boy who was flushed red with embarrassment. I replied "Talk to the Student Welfare Coordinator", to which he replied "What if he is the one who won't believe you?". I emphasizied that it is important to keep telling until someone believes you.

During the day my assistant and I noticed the strange behaviour of a particular teacher, called “Dick Newman”. Later that afternoon I learnt that the car I had been driving had been rammed in the school's car-park. Witnesses reported that the car had been rammed deliberately by a man who then drove off very quickly.

The local police were called and ran a licence check on the car and discovered that the number-plate was fake. They then took photos of the crime scene using the school's camera. Later, when it was revealed that a teacher was under suspicion of sexually abusing the children at the school and then organising the ramming of my car to intimidate me, the photos went "missing", and no further action was taken.

”Dick Newman” was the only person at the school who knew my car, as he had taken it upon himself to show me to my car to give me directions to the shops during a break in classes.

It was organised that the boys in Year 9 would be interviewed in order to find the victims and give them appropriate support. Three people (including myself, my assistant and a counsellor from a sexual assault centre) were responsible for conducting the interviews. At the completion of the interviews, there were concerns for approximately 12 of the boys. These concerns related specifically to sexual assault by a teacher at the school. However, by this stage (over a week had passed since the initial program) it was clear that the boys had been threatened. For example, when I interviewed the boy who had asked the questions about sexual abuse by a teacher and not being believed, he huddled into a foetal position, started crying, and said he could not tell me what happened. When I asked him why he couldn't tell me, he replied that he had been threatened with his life. His best friend told me he would never tell what had happened.

Some time after this, we organised a theatre company performance for the students (on the topic of sexual abuse). While the children were seated and waiting for the play to begin, “Dick Newman” made an unscheduled visit to the hall. He proceeded to stand in front of each of the boys we had identified as potential victims and stare them down. The boys, who had been happy and laughing in the excitement of waiting for the play to begin, went grey with fear. Finally, I stood in front of “Dick Newman” so that he could not intimidate the boys any further.

I was then told no further action would be taken as the boys had not named the offender.

Program Infiltrated by Pedophile Board of Management

In 1996/97 I was named 'Young Victorian of the Year' for Community Service, and later 'Young Australian of the Year' for Community Service. One of the judges was a well-connected government official Don Hyde, and another was Robert Osmotherly, the General Manager of one of the major Australian television networks, Network Ten.

After winning this award, Robert Osmotherly approached me and said that he had never heard of this terrible crime (child sexual abuse) before meeting me. He said wanted to help me get my program into every school in Victoria within five years and said he had the money and the connections to do this. He said he would raise half a million dollars in six-weeks and have it matched within 6-months. He said that he and Don Hyde would set my program up as an independent organisation and that they would establish a Board of Management consisting of all of their powerful and influential friends. Don Hyde would become President of the organisation and Robert Osmotherly, Vice-President.

I agreed to Robert Osmotherly's proposal as it sounded as if he would enable the program to receive substantial funding and therefore be able to reach many more children within Victoria, and across Australia. I did not consider for a second that Robert Osmotherly and Don Hyde could have been deceiving me in order to get control of, and ultimately, to destroy the child sexual abuse prevention program that I had developed.

The Board members and supporters that they brought to the organisation were very powerful and from the highest echelons of society. These included the Editor-in Chief of a major Australian newspaper, the former head of a child-focussed service club, the head of the largest agricultural society in Victoria, the partner from a well-known law firm, an extremely wealthy businessman and former Network Ten board member, the head of a well-known accounting firm, the head of a successful advertising company, and others.

Despite having such wealth and powerful connections, in the two-year period that they served on the Board they organised only one donation of $25,000. The board members subsequently despised the donor and ostracised him from their community (which at the time I thought was incredibly ungrateful!). This is compared with over $200,000 my family and I raised doing the fundraising ourselves in the same time period!

Furthermore, my efforts to secure funding were being actively sabotaged. For example, after an interview on the Channel 9 'Today' show, I was contacted by a well-known multi-national company, who said that they would like to fund my program. This well-known company was located in Sydney, and as Robert Osmotherly frequently went to Sydney, I asked if he would have a meeting with them on behalf of our organisation. He agreed. However, when he returned from the meeting, he said for me not to have much hope and not to contact them for six months while they sorted out a new tax issue. I found this very odd, as they had been so keen to fund the organisation when I had spoken to them. I phoned the woman whom I had spoken to, and she confirmed my suspicions. She had been at the meeting and Robert Osmotherly had told the company not to bother funding us, as "the organisation won't be around in six months". Needless to say, we did not receive the funding.

During this time period, I was without any income for four months. Many other people would have quit and sought other employment, however, I believed passionately in my cause and did not give up, much to the chagrin of Robert Osmotherly. On one occasion he said to me "You have given so much to this cause in your life, why don't you just give up? You have achieved more good in your short life than many do in a long life-time. Why don't you retire down in the country (I was 28 years old). Go on, just give up". When I replied that I would never give up, he stormed away! I was confused by this behaviour, but as I trusted him I did not think too much more about it at the time.

The Board members achieved one other "in-kind" donation. It was the use of a Honda CRV vehicle. I appreciated the use of the vehicle while I had it (approximately 18 months). However, I later discovered that the head of the company that donated it, a close friend of Don Hyde, had just been convicted of child sex offences. These offences included the production of child pornography.

Meeting with VERY POWERFUL Pedophile Politician

After winning the award, I had a meeting with a very powerful state politician, Jeff Kennett. At that time, Jeff Kennett was the most powerful person in the state. As well as being politically powerful he also had key business interests, including in the media. When I was first introduced to him, he was staring at me quite sleazily. After he asked what work I do, and my response "child abuse prevention", he would not make eye contact at all and sought to exclude me from the meeting in a very bullying manner. It was well-known that Jeff Kennett was a serious domestic violence offender, and that his wife was frequently being admitted to shelters in secret. However, given the power and status of Mr. Kennett, the issue was never raised in the mainstream media.
I was later to be informed by a very reliable and trusted source from the child welfare field that there is a file containing serious child sex offences (against boys) by Jeff Kennett, but because of his enormous power in Victoria, the police would not act on it. I also discovered from a former sex worker that Jeff Kennett frequently paid St. Kilda boy sex workers for sex, and that one of these boys "talked too much to the wrong people and ended up dead with an 'accidental' heroin overdose". It was also alleged that Jeff Kennett intentionally abused the boys in unusual situations (for example, in a helicopter) so that if it ever got out, the boys' testimonies would seem unbelievable. This of-course, is exactly the same strategy used by offenders in the U.S child-care centre cases. Interestingly, Jeff Kennett has recently commissioned a statue of himself - as a gargoyle.

Later I met with another politician (from the same political party) who told me that "Jeff Kennett is REALLY into that (child sex abuse)". This same politician told me that in the late 1980's and early 1990's, the police were "getting too close to the truth, too close to people in high positions of power who are also pedophiles" and so the unit that had been established to investigate organised pedophilia was shut down. (Soon after a pedophile police officer was put in charge of investigating these offences to ensure that the truth never got out and that this high-ranking network of offenders would never get caught).

Network Ten Produces Pornography

One day I was working on a computer at Network Ten. As I was working, Robert Osmotherly approached my computer and put a floppy disk in the machine. He said "Look at this" and proceeded to bring up images of pornography involving humans and Sesame Street characters. I was very embarrassed and did not know how to react. I asked "Where did you get that?" and he replied "Oh, someone put it together here", indicating that Network Ten was producing pornography. I was later to discover that Network Ten is also producing child pornography and is, in fact, an Illuminati-owned and run television station. I was also later to discover that Robert Osmotherly is a passionate member of the Illuminati "religion".

Robert Osmotherly introduces me to Mr. Television.

After winning the Young Australian of the Year, I was invited to go on one of the morning television shows on Network Ten. (This was before my association with Robert Osmotherly. Ironically, after my association with Robert Osmotherly, Network Ten did not do any promotion of my work at all!). It is hosted by one of the most famous and longest serving television personalities in Australia, Bert Newton. I was asked to prepare a number of questions that Bert would ask me. I prepared very straight-forward questions that focussed on the work, so I was quite shocked when he glared at me and said "Are you doing this because it happened to YOU?". I was also stunned when he refused to allow the phone number of my organisation to be presented on the air for donations.

When I later became closely associated with Network Ten Robert Osmotherly would often say to me "You know, Bert Newton REALLY likes you. He REALLY likes you!", This surprised me because my experience of Bert Newton had been the exact opposite of that. (Interestingly, Robert Osmotherly also frequently said to me "Jeff Kennett really likes me since I started helping you. He has me sit next to him at all of the formal functions we attend now". This was indeed true, Jeff Kennett, Robert Osmotherly and Don Hyde were all the best of friends.)

After my experience with Network Ten, I subsequently discovered that in the late 1980's Bert Newton was frozen out of the television industry due to allegations of his involvement in the production of child pornography. Although his alleged involvement in this activity was well-publicised at the time, he was never charged and about a year later he joined Network Ten. Since then he has continued to play a significant role in the production of child pornography in Australia. One contact who works on the set of the morning program hosted by Bert Newton finds the work to be very distressing as other on-air talent are very open about their pedophilia. This contact is disgusted, as his sister is a victim of child sex offences, however he does not want to publicly disclose the information as he will lose his job.

In addition to the above, I am now in contact with a boy who was paid $2000 a night to have sex with Bert Newton, from the ages of 15 - 18 years.

Introduction to the Pedophile Police

There is a specialised police unit in Victoria that, since the early 1990's, is responsible for investigating all child sex offences involving multiple-victims, offences committed by teachers, as well as child pornography offences. I had a meeting with the head of this unit, Detective Senior Sergeant Nick Flanagan, and was very surprised when the first thing he said to me was "Does Jeff Kennett know about your program? Jeff Kennett should know about your program". I found this a very odd thing for him to say as an opening statement, and especially so, given the information known about Jeff Kennett's alleged sexual abuse of boys. I thought it impossible for this police officer not to know of these things, given his specialist role.

Relationship between Nick Flanagan and Robert Osmotherly

I subsequently became aware of the "unusual" relationship between Nick Flanagan (police) and Robert Osmotherly (Network Ten). I invited Nick Flanagan to do a presentation for the board members. Don Hyde was "so impressed" by Nick Flanagan that he wanted to invite him onto the Board of Management (along with all the other pedophile members). I later discovered that Nick Flanagan and Robert Osmotherly, although pretending not to know each other at the Board meeting, have a very cosy relationship indeed.

Specifically, a couple of years ago, a senior staff member at Network Ten was charged with procuring children for prostitution. At the time, the wife of a detective working in Nick Flanagan's unit (Jan Pummell) received a very sudden and significant promotion to become Robert Osmotherly's Personal Assistant. It was a clear conflict of interest and deeply comprising to the investigation. Jan Pummell's husband should not have been involved in investigating Network Ten staff for their involvement in procuring children for prostitution or any other child sex offences connected to Network Ten. However, with the appointment of the detective's wife to Personal Assistant of the General Manager of Network Ten, it was guaranteed that no other information pertaining to Network Ten's illegal activities involving sex offences against children would be pursued by Nick Flanagan or his unit. And Jan Pummell enjoyed her unexpected and incredibly well-paid, new position at Network Ten.

Pedophile Police Called in to Investigate Pedophile Teacher and Other Offences

In 1999 fresh allegations were made against Pedophile Teacher, Dick Newman. This time, teenage girls reported that Dick Newman approaches students and asks them to meet him after school to meet 'Winston the Baseball Bat'. They indicated that 'Winston' was Dick Newman's penis. They reported that other students were very affected by this behaviour, and some had taken to writing warnings to each-other on the desks, such as "If Newman asks you to meet Winston, don't do it - its his dick!!".

At last, Newman had been named and the victims were prepared to come forward. Newman admitted to these offences and received 5 sessions of counselling. I then discovered that Newman had conveniently taken up a temporary position in a country school (like a priest being moved from parish to parish when things get too hot). The principal at the original school had not told the new school the circumstances surrounding his transfer and had instead said "Poor Dick, he's had a difficult time lately". I later discovered that this Principal was an expert liar and had gone over and above the call of duty in protecting this pedophile teacher.

At this new country school it was not long before further allegations of child abuse by Newman came out. Incidents of verbal abuse, such as calling students "#ing stupid" were revealed, as well as physical assaults, such as dragging students out of the classroom and throwing them on the floor. In another physical assault, Newman grabbed the 12-year-old boy by the neck and held him by his neck against a wall. Newman admitted to the latter assault, wrote a letter of apology and provided financial compensation for the loss of the necklace.

With Newman being named and various offences being admitted to, I reported his behaviour for criminal investigation to Nick Flanagan's unit. It also provided the opportunity for the 1995 offences to be re-investigated. However, Nick Flanagan interviewed only 2 of the 12 boys on the list from 1995, and reported to me that as the first two boys did not disclose anything, the others would not be interviewed. In relation to the offences against the teenage girls, Flanagan said that, at 15 years of age, the girls were "too young", and he did not want to distress the girls' families by bringing up the topic of child sexual abuse. Therefore, these offences by Newman would not be investigated either. I could not believe what I was hearing! Child sex offences are offences because they happen against children! And at 15, the victims were hardly at the young end of the age-spectrum! It was a completely nonsensical reason for not investigating Dick Newman.

As for the physical assaults, Flanagan said that he was not responsible for such investigations, so those cases would not be pursued either.. (Interestingly, Robert Osmotherly also frequently said to me "Jeff Kennett (very powerful politician) really likes me since I started helping you. He has me sit next to him at all of the formal functions we attend now".) He said "You do understand, don't you!" (it was not a question) and I replied that I did not. However, Nick Flanagan was not prepared to discuss the situation amicably and Dick Newman evaded investigation, by both the police in the unit established to investigate such offences, and by the Department of Education.

Further Dealings with the Pedophile Police
Whilst at the country school (Goldtown) disclosures of child sexual abuse by other offenders were made by many children. The disclosures centred on two offenders in the town. The specialised unit arrived to "investigate". However, the main victim of the sexual abuse, Sammy, a 12-year-old girl, did not attend school that day. She arrived after school on her bike and her face was visibly disfigured. I was told by her best friend that she had been bashed but her friend would not tell me who did this to Sammy. Her smashed-in face was warning enough for all of the children. The police later went to her house, where she fainted upon seeing them. She did not disclose any abuse at all. Despite the fact that her face was visibly disfigured and swollen from a recent assault, the police did not pursue the matter further.

The specialised police unit totally destroyed any chance of the truth being revealed and the victims receiving the justice they deserved. For example, they left children waiting all day to be interviewed and did not end up interviewing them, including witnesses to attempted child-rapes. They interviewed one 12-year-old victim (Lucy) and totally intimidated her. When the girl indicated that the police didn't believe her the first time she told them what had happened to her, one officer lent right over the top of her, pointed his finger directly in her face and hissed "Don't say that! You don't know that!". I was shaking, and I was an adult sitting next to the girl! As she walked out of the interview room, the officer said in voice loud enough for the girl to hear "We have serious concerns about the truth of what this girl is saying". It had the desired effect, Lucy burst into tears and said "The police don't believe me. I don't want to keep going". The Welfare Co-ordinator, who was also in the room during the interview, and who is also an experienced sexual assault counsellor and child protection officer, said to me "That wasn't an interview. That was designed to stop a child from talking".

The police did not pursue the case any further on the following grounds: No-one would believe Sammy if she disclosed the abuse in the future, as she hadn't disclosed the first time. (The fact that she had been bashed would not be seen as relevant to her hesitancy to disclose?!) Lucy had led all the children on (to make up "stories" of sexual abuse for fun, even though the children were visibly traumatised). In relation to the sexual abuse of a boy, "men try to touch other men's penises after football matches all the time" (!) so it was not worthy of pursuing. And finally, that there was not enough evidence - this is despite the fact that there were WITNESSES to the attempted rapes of the children, and the testimonies of many victims provided significant corroboration. Also, many adults reported having been sexually abused by the same offenders when they were children, but the police refused to interview these adults.

The Case is Stonewalled by the Pedophile Police

The police recommended that the Welfare Co-ordinator make reports to the Child Protection department as they stated it was a "protective issue, not a criminal one". The Welfare Co-ordinator did this, but weeks passed and the children were not interviewed, and she inquired as to why. She was informed that the Child Protection Department would not be taking any further action "on the advice of the police". So, after telling the Welfare Co-ordinator to take the case to Child Protection for investigation, the Police effectively stone-walled the investigation by advising Child Protection NOT to investigate.

Relationship between Robert Osmotherly and Nick Flanagan

During the two-year association I had with Robert Osmotherly, Don Hyde and the Board of Management that they had established, I trusted them implicitly. Although incidents occurred that often left me confused, and often baffled, and of-course, frequently without funding, I continued to trust them. Don Hyde always said to me "I'm here to help". It was his favourite saying. I therefore reported all of the events that had occurred at the northern secondary school and the Goldtown school, to Robert Osmotherly. Robert Osmotherly then told me that he knows Detective Senior Sergeant Nick Flanagan (in contrast to his earlier pretence of not knowing him at all!). He stated that Nick Flanagan is a "really good bloke". However, when I spelt out the stonewalling of the Goldtown case, Robert Osmotherly's face twitched and he became visibly uncomfortable. I had never seen Robert Osmotherly react in this way.

It was soon after this that very strange events began to occur.

On one occasion Robert Osmotherly was on the phone to his "boss" (of Network Ten). When his boss realized that I was present he began to speak aggressively, not knowing that I could hear him. He was saying "put her on the phone to me, I'll sort her out!". Of course, I found this all to be very strange as I had never even met this man before. However, when Robert Osmotherly apologised on behalf of his boss, I accepted it and put it out of my mind - again, because at that time I trusted him.

I had recently purchased a very cheap country property that I planned to use as a retreat for abused children. I invited the board members to view the site. None attended, however Robert Osmotherly said that he wanted to go - alone with me. He said he had set aside the whole day for it and was putting me under enormous pressure to go with him. I felt very uncomfortable about it as he had insisted on a number of details. First, it had to be a complete secret. I wasn't even allowed to tell my parents that I was going, let alone where I was going. Second, he had to drive. I wasn't even allowed to drive my car to the station and for us to drive together from there (my car had to stay at my unit car-park). And third, Robert Osmotherly insisted on picking me up from my unit before day-break. This was unnecessary as the trip only takes two-hours. Of course, all of these bizarre "conditions" and the huge pressure that Robert Osmotherly was putting me under made me feel extremely wary. With my parents' help I made up an excuse at the very last minute and did not go.

However, if I had done as Robert Osmotherly had wanted and if anything had happened to me that day, I would have gone missing without a trace.

Sammy's relationship to Network Ten

Sammy, the 12-year-old-girl from Goldtown, was the main victim of the sexual abuse being perpetrated against children in the town. She referred to the offender (a man in his 60's) as her "boyfriend", and her close friends knew of the sexual activities between her and the man. The offender also happened to be the best friend of her father. I was asked to provide support to Sammy, and in one session it became apparent that Sammy's personality had been totally fragmented. In her words, she was like "a house with mirrors everywhere, smashed into broken bits". It was later that I learned about the Illuminati use of trauma-based mind control, sexual abuse and satanic ritual to force children to create "alter personalities". Other information from Sammy has led me to believe that she has been subjected to all these forms of abuse.

Sammy also told me that her relative takes her to Queensland (Australia) "whenever I want" and that she can get "whatever I want, too". It was only later that I learned of the immense significance of what Sammy was telling me. Sammy's relative is a Board member of Network Ten, who is based in Queensland. It is my belief that Sammy was being used in Network Ten's production of child pornography, both in Victoria and Queensland.

Here is another example of the police's failure to investigate a case with ominous connections to Network Ten. In particular, the police unit that has been established specifically and exclusively to investigate such cases well and truly ensured that this case would go NOWHERE.

After two sessions with Sammy I was told that the school had "received complaints" that I had "brainwashed the children" and the support sessions were terminated.

More Connections to the Illuminati - the Satanic Cult in Goldtown

I was to learn later that there is a Satanic cult operating in Goldtown. I learned this from two independent sources. One was from a Christian woman who was raised in the town and who since had moved elsewhere. The other was from an adult survivor of the cult, Mick.

The Satanic cult is very powerful within the town, and was headed up by the most powerful and influential families of the town. One of the members owned and operated the photographic studio in the town. Furthermore, Jeff Kennett, the powerful politician mentioned previously, has significant "business operations" extremely close to Goldtown, and he was driven (by his driver) to this location every week.

Mick's Experiences

Mick was introduced to the satanic cult as a very young child by an extended relative. Mick informed me of many experiences he was subjected to as a child in this cult. From everything that I have been told by Mick, the cult appears to be the Order Templis Orientus (Illuminati), operating in Australia. Mick now suffers from MPD/DID but has survived his experiences remarkably well considering the traumas he has been through.

As a child Mick was forced to attend blood-rituals, where animals and small children were sacrificed and their blood and organs consumed. Mick was required to clean up the blood after these rituals. The children and babies were street children or were taken from orphanages, so that they could not be traced and no-one would know, or care, if they went missing. The rituals were spoken in Latin and were clearly satanic. The rituals took place at various locations, including Goldtown. Mick and other children would be driven to the rituals in the boots of cars.

The members of the cult were extremely powerful members of society. There were numerous politicians (mainly from the conservative party). These people would often speak of important events before they would actually occur. Mick was also sexually abused by Gerald Oanasis, the famous television personality and professional partner of Bert Newton.

Mick was one of the many children who were used to "host" parties of the cult members. At these parties the children acted as waiters and were naked. Many of the adults, but not all, would wear masks at these parties. After the food was served the adults would have sex with the children. Children who tried to escape were killed, often in front of the other children in order to control the children through fear. Once Mick and another child had tried to escape but were caught. The other child was murdered by having her head smashed open with a rock. Her body was then dumped in a nearby mineshaft. Mick was spared the same fate, as he was told that he was the "chosen one", selected to carry on the traditions of the group.

Mick was forced to participate in the production of child pornography, including movies as well as still photographs. This involved sexual activity with other children as well as adults. He would get paid a small amount for his sexual "services", while the relative who brought him to the events would get paid a large amount of money. As he got older, Mick was no longer used for sexual purposes by the group but was required to recruit new younger children. When he was old enough (in his 20's), Mick was able to escape the group but they continue to contact him with threats.

Robert Osmotherly's "Religion"

During my association with Robert Osmotherly I got to know him (in some ways!) quite well. One day he informed me of his "religious" beliefs. These were the opposite of mine (as I am a Christian). I was also informed by one of his colleagues in the media industry that Bob's "religion" is "weird #". At the time I had not heard of the Illuminati and it is only now that I realise that Robert Osmotherly is an active and dedicated member of the Australian Illuminati. The symbolism used in Network Ten promotional material is totally consistent with that of the Illuminati (Order Templis Orientus), such as the key colours - blue and gold, and key imagery involving flames.

Telephone Interference and Intimidation Begins

It was after reporting the events at Goldtown to Robert Osmotherly that unusual events began to occur. My phone line began clicking, and the voice-mail service recorded the sounds of a tape clicking over (note, voice-mail does not use tapes for recording so the tape was from another source). Two of my organisations' staff members had their cars broken into on the same night. In one car, the book "The Clocks" by Agatha Christie was on the front seat. The book is the story of a series of murders where the only evidence left at each murder scene is a clock. On the front seat of the other staff member's car was a broken clock. Nothing was stolen from either car. On one occasion I purposely said over the phone that I kept all of my files in the backyard shed (this was not true, I just wanted to test the security of the telephone line). Soon after, the back shed was broken into.

Board Members Propose a Name-Change
At one board meeting, Harry Napkin, the head of the Agricultural Society, proposed to launch the organisation, despite the fact that it had been operating for nearly two years. He had three ideas. The first was that a rodeo would be organised, and whenever a rider fell from their horse or bull, money would be donated. Thus, it would be "money for every bruised butt". The second proposal was to organise a "beauty pageant" for 12-year-old girls. There would be an award given for "the prettiest girl on the shiniest pony". A photo of her on her horse would be used as a centre-page-spread in the leading newspaper (courtesy of the Editor-In-Chief contact). The third proposal was to have a photo of sexually abused children in an "animal birthing centre". This photo would also be published in the leading newspaper.

Harry Napkin also proposed a name-change. He proposed to change the name of the organisation to 'Shine'. I did not want to do this, and the members of the Board put me under incredible pressure to adopt this name-change.

It was only later that I learnt about the Illuminati connections and the significance of their symbolism and language. 'Shine' is a very significant Illuminati term.

Realisation Dawns

It was at this point that I realised that something was dreadfully wrong. I rejected all of the proposed ideas (very politely, but firmly). I also called for all outstanding Criminal Records Checks to be undertaken immediately. The Criminal Records Check had been designed only to identify whether a person had committed any sexual assaults against children or had any involvement in related offences, such as child pornography. Therefore, if a person had smoked marijuana in their university days, this would not be revealed in the Criminal Record Check.

This was a policy that I had insisted on right from the start (nearly two years ago), however Robert Osmotherly had given numerous excuses every time I had requested his. He even went so far as to suggest that he would organise it "on the sly" using his "contacts in the force". I did not pursue that option and instead gave the Board members two weeks to complete their forms and submit them.

Robert Osmotherly, while initially embracing the policy at the start, ultimately refused to submit a Criminal Records Check.

The Significance of Shine

I discovered that there is an Australian Internet-based group called 'Shine'. The site includes a membership section where members are able to exchange photos etc, including "S&M" and "hard-core Bert Newton style". It is a child pornography club that operates similar to the notorious Wonderland club.

I noted the code-names used by the operators of the Shine site, one of which was Natas (Satan backwards). I went to the Network Ten site and entered a secret section on the site (which members of the public would never know about). It asked for the password, so I typed in Natas, which took me to another level. It then asked for the next level password, which I didn't have. The computer then went beserk and was almost impossible to turn off. I managed to do so only by pulling out all of the connections. Soon after this, the Internet site for Network Ten was shut down and remained shut down for a number of months, which is rather unusual given that Network Ten is such a large company.

Later that year, the Department of Education put on a concert involving thousands of children. They chose to call it 'Shine'. This was an interesting choice of title, given my experience and other people's experiences of the Department of Education protecting pedophile teachers.

A further interesting connection was that Robert Osmotherly and Don Hyde organised a meeting between us and the senior managers of the Department of Education. When we all met, the men acted as if they did not know each other and were meeting for the first time (exchanging business cards, etc). However, when the men thought I was gone (I was in fact standing just out of their sight), it was very clear that they not only knew each other, but that they knew each other extremely well. They were saying things such as "Great to see you again, mate!" and slapping each other on the back!


Escape from Robert Osmotherly and the Pedophile Board

After I discovered what was going on (at least, I started to discover what was going on) I knew I had to break away from Robert Osmotherly, Don Hyde and the people they had put on the Board of Management. The AGM was coming up and I organised for my family to attend. We did this secretly, as we knew that the phone lines were being monitored. On the night of the AGM, the board members were visibly shocked when they saw that members of my family were attending. It transpired that, rather than undertake a Criminal Records Check, the members of the Board had planned to resign on the spot. This served two purposes. One, they avoided having to undergo the Criminal Records Check. Two, the organisation would effectively fold as there would be no-one to take up the Board member positions. This is exactly what Robert Osmotherly had wanted from the beginning, but especially since I had begun to uncover the corrupt pedophile police activities and the crimes in Goldtown.

However, as my family had attended the meeting, they were able to take up the positions on the Board, and the organisation did not fold. On the surface, the meeting was very amicable and civilized, Robert Osmotherly tried to remain calm, but he ended up storming out of the meeting half-an-hour early.

Mother Receives Death Threat from Robert Osmotherly

My family and I all waited for half-an-hour after the meeting had closed (to recover!) before leaving. We had all come in different cars, and my mother had parked her car in a nearby car park. She walked to her car by herself. We had not learnt to be security-conscious at that stage. As she approached her car she was surprised to see Robert Osmotherly there (he had left the meeting half an hour early). He then approached her and said "You had better watch yourself. If you don't, someone might just run over you". He then drove off very suddenly and another board member followed in a different car.

My mother and father told me about this incident, which had left my mother very shaken. Soon after I received a message from Robert Osmotherly saying "I only want to help". I was infuriated at the evil of this man, so I phoned his office and left a message with his Personal Assistant, Jan Pummell (I didn't know the significance of her husband's relationship with Robert Osmotherly and Network Ten at this time) saying "Bob has said he just wants to help me. Could you please tell him that it would be helpful if he could undertake the Criminal Records Check that he has avoided for so long. After all, it is designed to only reveal if the person has committed sex offences against children or related offences, like the production of child pornography. Oh, could you also tell him it would be very helpful if he did not threaten members of my family. Death threats against my family really aren't helpful. If you could pass this message on, that would be great. Thanks".

Soon after leaving this message, my mother received a letter from Robert Osmotherly. In the letter he stated that he was only joking when he told her to watch out or she'd end up being run over. Yeah, real funny joke.

Report to Department of Education - Complaints and Investigation Unit

After these experiences I made a complaint to the Complaints and Investigations Unit of the Department of Education. My complaint related to the conduct of teacher Dick Newman, which amounted to repeated acts of misconduct against students, and the police investigation at Goldtown.

Leaked Document

After numerous meetings concerning the complaint (which I was told would be kept strictly confidential, particularly from Nick Flanagan and his unit), a document was leaked to me form within the Department of Education. This document revealed that the Department planned to absolve Dick Newman from all complaints. The investigation had been totally and completely corrupted in order to absolve Newman.

The grounds for this were that "no complaints of a sexual nature have been made against Dick Newman since 1995". This was unbelievable! So Newman's invitations for students to meet his penis after school were not considered to be sexual! Also, it was stated that as the schools had taken action in relation to each case, there was nothing more to be done. So, it was therefore acceptable for a teacher to commit repeated acts of serious misconduct, against multiple students, at different schools.

It was very clear that this teacher was being actively protected.

Theft of Department of Education Files

I left a message with the Minister for Education to inform her that I had received information to indicate that the investigation had been seriously corrupted. Soon after, the unit that I lived in was broken into and files containing information about the Department of Education's protection of pedophile teachers were stolen. This included a letter from a mother pleading for help as her son had been sexually assaulted by a teacher and was now suicidal. She wanted my help as the Department of Education was covering up for this pedophile teacher. Nothing else was stolen from the unit.

Visit to the New President of the Board

A new President was appointed to the Board, along with other new members. One day, the new President of the Board received a visit from one of the workers in the child protection field. This woman, Enid Ireland, approached the new President and told him that Detective Senior Sergeant Nick Flanagan knew about the complaint I had made to the Department of Education (indicating a significant breach of confidentiality). She told the new President to cease any association with me and my organisation "for the sake of your professional reputation". The incident spooked the new President enough for him to telephone me in an effort to get me to drop my complaint against Flanagan and his unit, which I refused to do. Thankfully, the new President had the integrity and courage to stick with our organisation despite the pressure he was being put under.

Anonymous reports to Crime Stoppers

Approximately 12 months had passed when I decided I would make an anonymous call to Crime Stoppers, a phone-in service where people can give anonymous tips to police about crimes. I telephoned Crime Stoppers from a public phone and informed the woman, Katie, of the pedophile network that was operating in Melbourne. She asked me to call back again with further information and I did so.
*snip*

Can’t find any links to this! Oh and above statement is only a quarter of what is written! but i guess you are all ready bored to death!

This is what I have read so far! More will come, sorry for the un edited way its presented, but I really didn’t have the time to do it!

How? she supported the bozos who claim as part of my religious practice I kill and rape children

Well Cug! Someone DID rape those children! Perhaps not who they say did it, but some one with ties to it!
I see this all the time! It is the children suffering and then some one tries to divert it! And HIT some othe groups in the process! BUT LOOK AT THE EVIDENCE! Please!



[edit on 12-8-2005 by NeonHelmet]

[edit on 12-8-2005 by NeonHelmet]

Originally posted by sebatwerk
Freemasonry does not involve itself with government

The only thing absurd is that statement.


psysheek.club.fr...


“... His [Osiris] power was symbolized by an Eye over a Sceptre. The Sun was termed by the Greeks the Eye of Jupiter, and the Eye of the World; and his is the All-Seeing Eye in our Lodges.”

- Albert Pike, Morals and Dogma of the Ancient and Accepted Scottish Rite of Freemasonry, pp. 15-16; 472


Am I the only one who sees a connection?!

You have got to be the most gullible person I have ever come across. Use your head for once, damn.

Sigh

[edit on 12-8-2005 by eudaimonia]

I belive the time has come to ignore eudamia, and suzy. They are just diggn up the same old #. Child molestation, NWO, Secret ritual sacrifice. And by replying you only contribute to their ATS points. I am ignoring them from now on.

These two women are dilusional, and will claim that freemasonry is satanic untill their death. Let them live in their little world. I am sure their cats will keep them company.

Originally posted by NeonHelmet

I can bring you numerous witness reports but I won’t! Because you say they aren’t valid *LOL*, and I don’t want you to waste your precious time! Or ATS’s precious bandwidth!

There's no need for the facetiousness. Do you understand why such reports are not necessarily proof of anything? Have you even bothered to look into the phenomenon of "false memories"?

Let's take those quotes.

Gary Hughes - no mention of Masons or ritual abuse in any of the quotes you provided. None at all.

Let me reiterate this part: nobody has denied that child abuse exists!.

Reina Michaelson is not a credible witness, by any estimation.

Well Cug! Someone DID rape those children! Perhaps not who they say did it, but some one with ties to it!
I see this all the time! It is the children suffering and then some one tries to divert it! And HIT some othe groups in the process! BUT LOOK AT THE EVIDENCE! Please!

Someone probably has abused those children.

But outside of the ramblings of a women who is clearly serving her own agenda, exactly where is this evidence that the Masons are taking part in Satanic abuse?!

Do you understand the difference between allegation and proof? Can you see that a woman with such an obvious agenda just cannot be relied upon to provide an objective account?

If I seem frustrated, then please accept my apologies in advance - and please, try to understand where I'm coming from.

What you've supplied so far is NOT proof of any ritual abuse. You've supplied a good amount of reports on child abuse - and once more, nobody is disputing that child abuse is happening, and it's a huge problem - but none of those reports offers anything in the way of evidence or proof.

Originally posted by NeonHelmet

Mick's Experiences

Mick was introduced to the satanic cult as a very young child by an extended relative. Mick informed me of many experiences he was subjected to as a child in this cult. From everything that I have been told by Mick, the cult appears to be the Order Templis Orientus (Illuminati), operating in Australia. Mick now suffers from MPD/DID but has survived his experiences remarkably well considering the traumas he has been through.

As a child Mick was forced to attend blood-rituals, where animals and small children were sacrificed and their blood and organs consumed. Mick was required to clean up the blood after these rituals. The children and babies were street children or were taken from orphanages, so that they could not be traced and no-one would know, or care, if they went missing. The rituals were spoken in Latin and were clearly satanic. The rituals took place at various locations, including Goldtown. Mick and other children would be driven to the rituals in the boots of cars.

How? she supported the bozos who claim as part of my religious practice I kill and rape children

Well Cug! Someone DID rape those children! Perhaps not who they say did it, but some one with ties to it!

I see this all the time! It is the children suffering and then some one tries to divert it! And HIT some othe groups in the process! BUT LOOK AT THE EVIDENCE! Please!

Look I'm not a member of the O.T.O. solely because of location. But I am a devout believer of Thelema! (The religion of the O.T.O.) and I do the exact same rituals they do. Tell me I kill little kids! Go ahead! tell me!

PLEASE LOOK AT THE EVIDENCE YOURSELF! Look at our rituals, ask us what they mean. Don't let wackos tell you what they think it means!

Yea I'm a bit hot under the collar, but this crap pisses me off!

This is nothing more that the satanic ritual abuse craze sweeping down under

THANK YOU EUDAIMONIA AND NEONHELMET!!!!!
To the others, it isn't only masons who do this to children and get away with it. Or am I deluded about that to...sorry you are ignoring me now....good, now if you could ignor everyone else who is brave enough to admit living through this hell maybe they would share and corroborate each others experiences....damn! sorry, I forgot that was your job, to shut down dialog on this subject.

yea yea mybad!
i will just say that the child abuse is organized nothing more! i cant prove who is behind just that it runs far up the heirachy!!!!

Originally posted by wiggy
I belive the time has come to ignore eudamia, and suzy. They are just diggn up the same old #. Child molestation, NWO, Secret ritual sacrifice. And by replying you only contribute to their ATS points. I am ignoring them from now on.

Oh no!

Go ahead and ignore, clearly you don't want to face the facts.

These two women are dilusional, and will claim that freemasonry is satanic untill their death. Let them live in their little world. I am sure their cats will keep them company.

That was pretty cold-hearted.

The facts are this:

Children are abused.

That. Is. All.

That's all that's been established here.

You want to deny ignorance?

Looking at just the parts you want to see is not denying ignorance, and neither is jumping to conclusions which are simply not supported by anything other than rumour and allegation.

Originally posted by suzy ryan
To the others, it isn't only masons who do this to children and get away with it. Or am I deluded about that to...sorry you are ignoring me now....good, now if you could ignor everyone else who is brave enough to admit living through this hell maybe they would share and corroborate each others experiences....damn! sorry, I forgot that was your job, to shut down dialog on this subject.

Suzy, all that's being asked of you is that you consider the facts.

You're not doing that. You're ignoring the chance to explore this situation further, and you're stepping further into a state of ignorance that will only get deeper.

Once again: Nobody is denying or disputing the simple fact that children are tragically abused, every year, in every nation.

What is being disputed is that this is ritual abuse and is being carried out by Occult/Satanic and/or Masonic groups.

You know why this is being disputed?

Because there's absolutely no evidence to support the allegations.

It's that simple.

What is being disputed is that this is ritual abuse and is being carried out by Occult/Satanic and/or Masonic groups.

You know why this is being disputed?

Because there's absolutely no evidence to support the allegations.

That is entirely false. Evidence has been surpressed. There are other threads on this at ATS.

I don't agree with Mason-baiting, but I think it's funny how they seem so sure of how their whole organization operates. To me, they're just funny. I have no malice toward them. Group thinking is for the mentally weak, so I cannot understand why anyone would join. The only masons I know are younger, super-smart ones and they view the society as a graft-club for old codgers. They could use the masonic connections if they want or need too, but they aren't really into it.

Is the Masonic world really so transparent that you are utterly certain of every Mason's behavior and every alliance made by every Mason in every coatroom? As has been mentioned, even a Catholic will admit that priests can get up to some pretty sick behavior. Why can't Masons admit this also?

THE consiracy is that no matter how much evidence we provide (filling legal and government offices) there will always be someone like you to bury it.

Originally posted by Tinkleflower
The facts are this:

Children are abused.

That. Is. All.

That's all that's been established here.

You want to deny ignorance?

Looking at just the parts you want to see is not denying ignorance, and neither is jumping to conclusions which are simply not supported by anything other than rumour and allegation.

Sorry, but just the fact that there's been DISCUSSION (NOISE) about all this should have others PAUSE and STEP BACK and reconsider if they really want to join something that has been tainted by these horrible stories.

And who are you to say with absolute certainty and authority that these are just rumours?

Originally posted by eudaimonia
And who are you to say with absolute certainty and authority that these are just rumours?

I'm not the one making claims....

You're making the claims. You've provided no evidence - just rumour and allegation. It's not up to me, or anyone else, to disprove it at this point, as nothing has been provided to begin with! Even when people have offered alternate sources to back up their points, you haven't acknowledged these. Thus, without any evidence to support them, these allegations are nothing but that. With a disturbingly unhealthy amount of rumour spread liberally over them, it seems.

Originally posted by smallpeeps
That is entirely false. Evidence has been surpressed. There are other threads on this at ATS.

No, it hasn't.

If it had - you wouldn't know about it, would you?

If that evidence was supressed, the likes of you and I would never know it had been supressed.

But more to the point, I keep seeing, over and over, these same posts which never manage to offer anything other than plain old rumour-mongering.

Where's the proof?

How come nobody has yet been able to even comment on the facts pertaining to the fallacy of satanic abuse?

No, it hasn't.

If it had - you wouldn't know about it, would you?

If that evidence was supressed, the likes of you and I would never know it had been supressed.

"Conspiracy of Silence" was pulled from the television listings at the last minute. What would you call that, if not suppression?

Have you watched this documentary? What are your thoughts on what these kids had to say? Are you calling them liars?


[edit on 12-8-2005 by smallpeeps]

Originally posted by eudaimonia
And who are you to say with absolute certainty and authority that these are just rumours?

Who are you to claim I eat babies!

I have already tried to get you to stop being lazy and actual look up that Crowley quote.

For the highest spiritual working one must accordingly choose that victim which contains the greatest and purest force. A male child of perfect innocence and high intelligence* is the most satisfactory and suitable victim.

The * is the footnote folowing

*It appears from the Magical Records of Frater Perdurabo that He made this particular sacrifice on an average about 150 times every year between 1912 e.v. and 1928 e.v. Contrast J.K.Huyman's "La-Bas", where a perverted form of Magic of an analogous order is described.
"It is the sacrifice of oneself spiritually. And the intelligence and innocence of that male child are the perfect understanding of the Magician, his one aim, without lust of result. And male he must be, because what he sacrifices is not the material blood, but his creative power." This initiated interpretation of the texts was sent spontaneously by Soror I.W.E., for the sake of the younger Brethren.

First of all if you think this actually means killing a child, do you really think anyone (especially someone who was under public scrutiny) could kill 2400 kids in 16 years?

another footnote by the editor of the on-line edition

WEH ADDENDA: When Crowley speaks of sacrificing a male child, his diaries and other writings indicate that he thereby obfuscates the actual practice. Crowley did this by diversion of the act of sexual intercourse and other sexual actions. He considered contraception as human sacrifice. There is no indication in any of his writings that he ever performed infanticide. In fact, Crowley was even against abortion.

::EDITED TO ADD::
this is another footnote to that quote, this time from Liber ABA

Although Crowley intersperses cautions against literal interpretation of his remarks throughout this chapter, his detractors frequently cite this statement out of context to assert that he advocated literal human sacrifice, a practice he repudiated.

sacrificing a male child = spanking the monkey or other sexual acts that can not by their nature create a child.

The idea behind this euphemism is the same reason the catholic church is against birth control it prevents (or kills) the resulting child. The French euphemism for orgasm 'La petit mort" or The little death also is a basic part of Crowley's use of the word sacrifice.


[edit on 8/12/2005 by Cug]

Originally posted by eudaimonia
Sorry, but just the fact that there's been DISCUSSION (NOISE) about all this should have others PAUSE and STEP BACK and reconsider if they really want to join something that has been tainted by these horrible stories.

FYI:
I would like to point out to everyone who believes that this poster is fabricating CRAP in order to generate (as she puts it) NOISE and to stir up the drama...

I've seen her point count go up 1500+ just today alone. I'm not contributing to any more of this garbage.