Castastrophic times for Earth are at hand. Will the Aliens help? How?

The Old Testament's crawling with with words and writings suggesting something other than all holy scriptures. Seems to me there could very-well be connections between what's written then with Uflological contact and experiences now..

Dallas

Originally posted by EarthSister
The alien races already help through individuals, mostly without the public knowing it. If helping is the goal, our knowing exactly all the ways they do that would be for some extra reason, which could come out at any time in the future.

This is our own world to manage. If one person takes the help of other life to move a spoonful of a mountain, then that is all that really matters. The other races cannot take over, or else they would own us and our world, and become responsible for all our problems.





[edit on 4/25/2005 by EarthSister]

Earthsister, you know I respect your views. But if catastrophe is so close, there isn't time to move the mountain one spoonful at a time.

Shadow makes a good point, in that things are now so controlled, that it isn't possible for one or even small groups to change the staus quo.
Wouldn't the things Shadow lists as possible ways to help make a bigger difference, than the one person at a time scenario you say the aliens are currently pursuing?

Catastrophe is catastrophe. Wouldn't it be better to have catastrophic changes that evolve into better situations for those that are left, than catastrophe that ends only in total destruction.

I agree that this is our mess and we should fix it ourselves, but without the proper knowledge being assimilated to the public at large, won't the lies and disinformation and their consequences simply continue, unabated?
It is glaringly clear, how easy it is for the powers that be, to discredit and label a lunatic any one person or any one group.

Yes it would have an initial chaotic effect on mankind and the established instituions, at first.
But eventually, change would take place based on the truth.

The two most profitable resources on this planet are knowledge and energy. The powers of this world have based their wealth on control of these resources.
I say let chaos reign for the sort term, infavor of a better long term outcome.
If the alien organization does not desire control of the earth and it's inhabitants then that is to their credit. I am of the opinion that to sit back and allow the earth's people to be led down the path of destruction by what some have called psychopathic leaders, is equally callous, calculating and psychopathic.

If you were to watch a mother, allow their children to put their hand on a hot stove, without warning them, you would do something, right?
You would, if you could, warn the child before the burn happens. You wouldn't take the attitude of " well it's the child's mess. Let them work it out. Or, you wouldn't go to the daycare center and tell one child, hoping that eventually they would all learn on their own.

Please don't take this the wrong way, but. If the future is as bleak as they paint, there isn't time to move the mountain one spoonful at a time. Shouldn't the aliens, if they are as benevolent as you say, disimenate the knowledge, expose the lies, then get out of the way? Is my logic wrong here?

Originally posted by freddieb
Judging from what I read on almost all the ATS boards. It seems to be the general belief that the Earth and it's inhabitants, are heading for a very bad time, in the not too distant future.

Everyone at every time has allways thought this. The 'good old days' were the 'golden age' where men were heros and everything was right in the world, and today everything in degenerate and smaller and dirtier. It was true for the ancient greeks, it was true at the end of the first millenium, and its true now. Heck, I bet the cavemen were saying the same things.

The Earth is degenerating these days. Bribery and corruption abound.
Children no longer mind their parents, every man wants to write a book, and
it is evident that the end of the world is fast approaching.
- Assyrian Stone Tablet, c.2800BC

notice however, i suspect that thats not an actual tablet. But the sentiment sums it up nicely.



[edit on 26-4-2005 by Nygdan]

Originally posted by freddieb

I agree that this is our mess and we should fix it ourselves, but without the proper knowledge being assimilated to the public at large, won't the lies and disinformation and their consequences simply continue, unabated?

We can begin to dismantle those lies by voting out of office governments that do not work for social concerns. If this happens, then a socially responsible government, with corporations held in check, can work towards avoiding catastrophes.

The world backed by the people, instead of big business; ET/aliens would likely be impressed.

Originally posted by Nygdan

Originally posted by freddieb
Judging from what I read on almost all the ATS boards. It seems to be the general belief that the Earth and it's inhabitants, are heading for a very bad time, in the not too distant future.

Everyone at every time has allways thought this. The 'good old days' were the 'golden age' where men were heros and everything was right in the world, and today everything in degenerate and smaller and dirtier. It was true for the ancient greeks, it was true at the end of the first millenium, and its true now. Heck, I bet the cavemen were saying the same things.

The Earth is degenerating these days. Bribery and corruption abound.
Children no longer mind their parents, every man wants to write a book, and
it is evident that the end of the world is fast approaching.
- Assyrian Stone Tablet, c.2800BC

notice however, i suspect that thats not an actual tablet. But the sentiment sums it up nicely.



[edit on 26-4-2005 by Nygdan]

Again. This is a valid point. But it does not address what this thread is about or the questions it asks.

freddieb,

I think your logic is as correct as can be and you answer some of your own questions with the comments in your sig line.

I agree that this is our mess and we should fix it ourselves, but without the proper knowledge being assimilated to the public at large, won't the lies and disinformation and their consequences simply continue, unabated?

This is our mess to fix and the other races are doing everything they can to help us do it, but we need more people willing to work with alien life to do it faster. This is humanity's world and way of life and our right to build it and run it the way we choose. To the visiting races, there is no separation between the leaders of our world and the publics, or sides to choose between countries either. We have all created our govts for all the correct reasons as well as the wrong ones and we can improve on our own. Only, we aren't doing it quite fast enough. Our technological advancements have superseded our moral and spiritual advancement, so we created weapons of mass destruction instead of uniting our countries, curing our diseases and feeding and educating everybody. If we kept on going the way we see we are going, we would probably kill ourselves out, but things are already changing from that course that we don't see yet.

Yes it would have an initial chaotic effect on mankind and the established instituions, at first.
But eventually, change would take place based on the truth.

Without enough public education first, the changes we would make to our world because of realization that alien life is real would only be based on more of the same kinds of lies about the aliens, not on the truth about them. Nobody wise would know who to believe about the aliens, but it sure would not be the aliens. The aliens showing up would not cause catastrophe that would end a large part of our systems or our world, but done prematurely, it would only create a great deal more uncontrollable confusion and make it even harder for people to ever trust the alien races. It's better in most ways still right now that most people are on the same pages about it, or not even believing any of it, until they have the chance to learn more.

No other race has the right or permission to step in and take over any other race. Only the most dire circumstances can the other races interfere with here at Earth. They are the trusted professionals of their races and have a strict jurisdiction. But if anybody on Earth or any other race directly interferes within their jurisdiction here, then our organization of races can take action to prevent that interference with their own work.

We don't clearly see all of the things that are happening for the power and affect they have. We see signs of other life and hear witness testimony, but just because these don't seem to be making a difference, does not mean they aren't. It is common in human thinking to be very stubborn and set in our beliefs, but over time we experience things that affect us. When enough of these things build up, we start to think differently. Then usually a famous person or two steps up to helps rally people together to change. Think of how prejudice is slowly breaking down from our societies through education, and all the horrible incidences we endured and saw on television, and how much it took for people to finally learn and accept a new, better way to think and act. The key word is learn- that is how we understand and change and evolve, to go from primitive to advanced. No other race could ever, would ever, take that away from us. They can only assist us through our natural process.

When I say that the alien races are helping, don't underestimate what the extent of that may be. There are 218 races visiting Earth and all of them work with many thousands of individual humans. Just as we do not see that yet, we do not see all the work that is being done in private and on other levels. When an official person has a great inventive idea that helps positively change the way we treat our environment or treat diseases or is inspired in peace talks, etc, it is possible that he got some locked doors opened, or some of his ideas, or his bravery, or his ambition from the support of his alien contacts, whether he physically knows he has them or not. But still, we are intelligent and capable already, we don't need our hands held to do good things and make great changes on Earth. But when some of the particular imperative key improvements are being prevented by the corrupt forces on Earth, IF a human in a position to do something about it has alien contact and accepts their help, he can take advantage of the benefit to do more than he could on his own. The aliens can't just do it for us.

The way I see it, pretty soon a lot of people are going to realize they have a spoon and together start moving the whole mountain. That's the way humans always move our mountains. Remember that it has not been very long since we have had worldwide public communication between individuals. Before the Internet, there was no open avenue for the kind of planetary education that is needed for this cause.

The organization of visiting races has chosen one strong brave honorable nation to handle first open contact for our whole world and that is Japan. The organization asked the USA first, but the USA refused and is going to do everything they can to jeopardize true information about other life being shared out of Japan. I don't know when this is going to happen, except "soon" as the aliens say.

I don't think any aliens could do anything to help. Just look at how things are now today;

we have hybrid-engined cars aviable now, wich use alot less fuel than V8 engine cars. Wich would reduce the air pollution alot. This even without the help of aliens! But unfortunly people by cars with an V8 because of its sound or power, wich is alot more imporant than the air. All the buyers of V8'ers prove this.

we can today filter out much of the pollution from production/industry. But it is not done by all that many companies.

This it two easy things we could do to 'save the planet', but we choose not to. So, from the eyes of aliens that see this; why should they try to help us, when we ourself does not bother to try?

And lastly, if they gave us technology to make totally pollutionfree engines and factories, would we buy it?
No. It won't give the V8'er feel and thus people would not buy it.

Hmm maybe the europeans and asians would as they are used to engines with 4 cylinders.¨But that isn't important.

Originally posted by EarthSister
This is our mess to fix and the other races are doing everything they can to help us do it, but we need more people willing to work with alien life to do it faster. This is humanity's world and way of life and our right to build it and run it the way we choose. To the visiting races, there is no separation between the leaders of our world and the publics, or sides to choose between countries either. We have all created our govts for all the correct reasons as well as the wrong ones and we can improve on our own. Only, we aren't doing it quite fast enough. Our technological advancements have superseded our moral and spiritual advancement, so we created weapons of mass destruction instead of uniting our countries, curing our diseases and feeding and educating everybody. If we kept on going the way we see we are going, we would probably kill ourselves out, but things are already changing from that course that we don't see yet.

Where does the "we" come in? I haven't created any governments. I haven't created any technological advances. I'm barely allowed to take part in the most rudimentary of those advances that were created. I have not created weapons of mass destruction. I don't start wars. I don't commit mass murder. I don't commit genocide. I don't dump depleted uranium on my countrymen or other countrymen. I don't orchestrate economies. I don't plunder the resources of defenseless nations. I don't pollute on purpose for financial gain. I don't kill people that don't agree with me. I don't sexually abuse helpless children. I don't lie to millions of people. I don't hoard knowledge that would help humanity.

I cannot and will not take responsibility for the consequences of the actions of a few pyschopaths. It's bad enough I have to endure them.

The reality of the situation is that 99% of the population of this planet has no direct say over their own destiny. The knowledge has been hidden, obscured or marginalized. The people have been kept dumb and in systems of control from birth. I was lucky enough to see the hypocrisy at a very young age thanks to being forced to attend church.

Even if there is reincarnation and I've lived many lives on this planet, I did not create this mess. I, nor billions like me, are responsible for orchestrating 2,000 years of perpetual war.

I also cannot take responsibility for the lack of response-ability of the mass majority of humans alive today.

What I really think is that the world is absolutely perfect just the way it is. It's gotta be one of the richest learning environments ever. The glaring contradictions could not be any more visable. The sides have never been so well defined. We are here to choose sides. Bush knows it and said so. Either you are for the psychopaths or you're against them. No physical action needs to be taken. Only inner resolve as to which side of existence you wish to place yourself on. Creative force or Entropic force. Order or Choas. Selfless or Selfish. Choose your destiny.

The leaders have chosen their destiny and continue to surround themselves with others like them. The same should hold true for those that choose the opposite. The hard part for those that choose the creative force is that 80-90% won't choose. These non-choosers are easily controlled by the very small majority of psychopaths. This makes it even more difficult to resist the parasitical entropic existence.

That brings us back to the alleged aliens helping. If there are benevolent among them, they must know how few have actually chosen the destiny path towards open-ended creative energy. They must also realize we are out numbered with statistical odds against us that would put the lottery to shame.

But as I said in an earlier reply, it's irrelevant. No one makes it off this rock alive. We could pass on at any given moment and have no guarantee that we'll live to see the next. This makes it all irrelevant except for who you are, how you interact with existence and the depth of your perception into what's going on. All other arguments are merely circular wheels of perpetual motion to keep the human mind occupied.

And ATS is just another brick in the wall.

Still enjoy posting here though.

Originally posted by Ghaele
I don't think any aliens could do anything to help. Just look at how things are now today;

we have hybrid-engined cars aviable now, wich use alot less fuel than V8 engine cars. Wich would reduce the air pollution alot. This even without the help of aliens!

But unfortunly people by cars with an V8 because of its sound or power, wich is alot more imporant than the air. All the buyers of V8'ers prove this.

we can today filter out much of the pollution from production/industry. But it is not done by all that many companies.

This it two easy things we could do to 'save the planet', but we choose not to. So, from the eyes of aliens that see this; why should they try to help us, when we ourself does not bother to try?

And lastly, if they gave us technology to make totally pollutionfree engines and factories, would we buy it?
No. It won't give the V8'er feel and thus people would not buy it.

Hmm maybe the europeans and asians would as they are used to engines with 4 cylinders.¨But that isn't important.

Again with this "we" thing. Now the blame shifts to people that buy cars with big engines?

I think you may have missed the point. There would be no buying. The technology and energy is free. Imagine 6 billion people, unhindered, working towards the benefit of everyone. There would be no need for money. You can't fix a broken system from within the same broken system. And you especially can't fix a broken system when the power brokers don't want it fixed.

You want to know what happens when technology is not obstructed by selfish psychopaths born into power? The computer you are reading this on would cost over $1,000,000 some 50 years ago. Now, it's a grand. If medicine was unhindered all diseases would be cured. If manufacturing was unhindered we'd all have super durable consumer products that would last a lifetime. Money would be obsolete.

Please try to think outside the systems just a little. I guarantee your perceptions will change drastically.

I don't believe that there are any aliens here (Spaceship Guy aliens, that is; of course there're a lot of the other kind , especially in Arizona, California, and Texas).

Actually, any catastrophic incidents or happenstances that occur won't need aliens to help or hinder 'em; an asteroid or a comet strike can happen just as well without Spaceship Guys as with them.

I think the really catastrophic things that'll happen in the 21st Century will be either major climatic catastrophies or a breakdown of civilization triggered by running out of energy sources.

[edit on 26-4-2005 by Off_The_Street]

Hey, EarthSister, What do the Aliens think of Angels and who created Humans? And what is "spirituality" to you?

[edit on 26-4-2005 by Centrixinal]

Actually, any catastrophic incidents or happenstances that occur won't need aliens to help or hinder 'em; an asteroid or a comet strike can happen just as well without Spaceship Guys as with them.

I'd have to agree there. Not to mention, they've had plenty of chances to help if that was a goal. Where were they during the Tsunami that killed hundreds of thousands? Somehow, whatever their goals are, I don't think it's as warm and fuzzy of a goal as people would like. It doesn't appear to be outright invasion....certainly that could have been done way before now, and when we had far less effective weapons...but I doubt we'll like it when we do learn the goal.

I don't understand why the aliens wouldn't make the distinction between the world leaders and the world's population.
They are not, as you very well know, even remotely connected.
The population and their needs and desires are not part of the equation when world leaders make decisions.

90% of the world's population do not even have the logistical, much less, political ability to vote or choose the direction their leaders move.
To think in those terms, shows a decided naivety about the state of the world in general, which isn't reflected in comparison to life in the US. The strange phenomena of American life is to think that the world lives like or takes it's que from us. It is a fallacy that those that have never been anywhere but here, have in their mind. It is NOT fact. Aliens would know this.

So if they are waiting for us to "vote them out", in favor of more enlightened leadership then they should start the funeral durge now.
Where is that pool of enlightened leaders we are supposed to choose from, located?

In fact where is even ONE enlightened leader that shines above the waste can, we currently have to choose from?

It seems to me that there has been tremendous interference, by the powers that be, with regards to the alien organzation's agenda. Yet no move is made to stop them. The biggest threat to Earth's survival is the leadership of the world. They are stronger now than ever before.

I don't know that we are actually on this irreversible road to destruction. I post this thread as a 'what if', type of scenario. That being said, it seems that the aliens, if they are there, are doing too little, too late, if help is what they purport to be doing.

Exposing the lies, greed and corruption of our world leaders has to be the first step towards our advancement. Many of the people of Germany, during the 1930's and 40's knew that Hitler was evil, wrong and corrupt. But they had no venue to fight back . Hitler and the Nazi power structure was too engrained and powerful. They needed help.
Now the whole world needs help. The power structure is too engrained, too powerful to fight against by the venues available to us in the past. We need help.

If they exist. I submit that the alien agenda is not one of help but instead, one of a passive, observational, socialogical lab. In the alien classrooms, centuries from now, they will talk about those poor socially mal-adept earthlings that destroyed themselves.

Japan would be a good choice if the US didn't control Japan, as it does and if the corporate monster didn't have it claws so deep in the Japanese society. I don't see the logic there. But I don't have to.

I'm beginning to form the opinion that the aliens, if they are, will simply watch and take notes and let what happens, happen. I think that the intellectual pursuit is simply that. They have no intentions of helping and would have done so already if they intended on it. Ironically, I'm beginning to form the same opinion about the conquest scenario.



[edit on 26-4-2005 by freddieb]

Originally posted by Centrixinal
Hey, EarthSister, What do the Aliens think of Angels and who created Humans? And what is "spirituality" to you?

Centrixinal

The other races have Angel experiences too. They understand what they are better than we do and can see them better than we can. Angels are direct emissaries of God and are a different kind of being from us people living on our worlds or between lives.

Advanced life understands (not just believes) that only God can create life, which is spirit. When we are alive in the physical, we live in our bodies, which can begin in any of a number of ways. We are already us before we ever have a body.

To me, absolutely every thing and everybody is spiritual. By the ability of our own spirit, we can perceive all other spirit, all other life. But humans are naturally not physically well aware of spirit yet, not even our own. When we can perceive spirit, we can "experience" the life force and nature of all and any things and beings that are around us all, all of the time, anyway. We can see without our eyes and hear without our ears. Almost all humans do this from time to time, usually with our closest loved ones, usually at some "soul-shaking" event. Multiply that ability by a million or a billion years of evolution, and that is how our visiting races perceive at every moment.

All humans are born with the ability to perceive spirit, but we barely do, which is just natural to us at this point in our evolution. For those of us who work with further advanced life, our alien contacts can help us use our abilities more than we can on our own, for the purpose of our contact with them. God and the Angels also do that with us, obviously. By spirit we are living an active parallel existence regardless of the awareness of our physical bodies.

We become spiritually aware by a connection between our body and spirit, or between our states of consciousness.

We can practice spirituality in many ways, whether it is through an organized religion or not, but spirituality is nature itself, not a set of beliefs. Spirituality and religion are not the same thing. All races of people practice spirituality as a way of living, and together through meditation and prayer.

PS Living spiritually is living naturally, not exactly "being good" as our religions teach us, although that too. The alien races are people and no more perfect or closer to God than we are. They just understand and experience all things in a much further advanced way than we do yet.

PPS Nice to see you here, muzzleflash



[edit on 4/26/2005 by EarthSister]

shadow has no source

you are smart hehe

say more of that stuff i like reading it

i feel just like you do
shadow

i usually have a difficult time saying what i want to say
as right now i could say a 1000things but ....you know what i mean...

hmmm
i think the only way we will know what the aliens agenda is ...
to ask them personally; and as you know, thats not quite possible

anyone know alien pager or cell #? if you do lets give them a ring and ask em
otherwise we can only speculate and guesstimate

until aliens land on the white house ; ill be happy sitting right here reading everyones opinions and ideas about it...

plus ; earthsister; i think i used to go to your chatroom named "the project at earth" on MSN chat *before they started charging $ for it*

i remember you and your chatroom because of your website
ive seen this website before a few times

just letting you know i know of you and stuff

its nice to see you on ATS earthsister
this is the coolest website eva

i recall ive had some very , bizzare emotional conversations with you *one or two*

k ill stop posting stuff now i might kill the thread lol

The other races have Angel experiences too. They understand what they are better than we do and can see them better than we can. Angels are direct emissaries of God and are a different kind of being from us people living on our worlds or between lives.

Advanced life understands (not just believes) that only God can create life, which is spirit. When we are alive in the physical, we live in our bodies, which can begin in any of a number of ways. We are already us before we ever have a body.

The biggest lie any being can tell you is that there is a spook-in-the-sky named "god" who monitors your every move and thought. This can't be further from the truth and is used to enslave you and keep you under their control

I know who Angels are. They are in reality the enemies of Humanity that set up the world religions to degenerate the Human soul. They want you to worship endlessly an unseen and unfelt "god", while they sit in the background feeding off the soul and psychic energy from all the prayers. I have met the archangel Michael, Gabriel, Uriel, and (forgot the other one). They are really extraterrestrials who hated Humanity since the beginning of time when the Gods created us. They are also the ones behind the Fatima hoax and many others. They wish they were different than us people who live our lives

The Archangels outnumbered the Gods/Annunaki in around 8,000 CE and anyone who had friendly relations with Humans was cursed and banished from Nibiru. These angels are also Gods, just lower ranking. Any human can reach the level of Godhood and live among the Gods. The Universe is self-creating and self-destroying. The Universe is INFINITE. There is no creator. These extraterrestrials evolved naturally on their home planets and sectors in the Universe. Everything is scientific. I bet you anything your alien contacts will never tell you this info. They know everything I am talking about.

And no, "God" is not the only one who can create life. Anyone can with the right amount of knowledge.

To me, absolutely every thing and everybody is spiritual. By the ability of our own spirit, we can perceive all other spirit, all other life. But humans are naturally not physically well aware of spirit yet, not even our own.

I am very aware of it. The Gods teach me alot about the Occult and Spirituality and it is backed up through research and experience. Especially about the old occult lodges and ancient cultures.

When we can perceive spirit, we can "experience" the life force and nature of all and any things and beings that are around us all, all of the time, anyway. We can see without our eyes and hear without our ears. Almost all humans do this from time to time, usually with our closest loved ones, usually at some "soul-shaking" event.

When the Angels overthrew the Gods and wiped them from History, they also sealed off our chakras and energy points. This is symbolized by yaweh sealing the Tree of Life in the Garden of Eden. They rant on endlessly on how sexuality is bad in christianity. In reality, sexuality controls the Kundalini which is the life force that will enable you to reach godhood.

Multiply that ability by a million or a billion years of evolution, and that is how our visiting races perceive at every moment.

No, this is not how they precieve things. Now, I'm not saying that every race is hostile to us. Some of them are neutral. I know the Greek Gods are mostly neutral towards Humanity. This is through experiencing them. But I do know that we are very unpopular among many of the races out there for reasons I already stated.

All humans are born with the ability to perceive spirit, but we barely do, which is just natural to us at this point in our evolution. For those of us who work with further advanced life, our alien contacts can help us use our abilities more than we can on our own, for the purpose of our contact with them. God and the Angels also do that with us, obviously. By spirit we are living an active parallel existence regardless of the awareness of our physical bodies.

This is actually VERY dangerous. Never let a being do anything for you. You can do EVERYTHING yourself. Most helpful beings will teach you techniques to revamp your bioelectricity and to reach godhood, not do it for you. Angels do nothing but destroy your soul and you will eventually cease to exist. The Soul is not indestructable. I'm pretty sure Anu, the father of Lord Enki(our creator) was killed when he stayed back on Nibiru by the Angels as I have never heard from him before. It can be ripped apart and spread throughout the Universe, thus making it almost impossible to put back together.

We become spiritually aware by a connection between our body and spirit, or between our states of consciousness.

Not really. Your body is already connected to the soul. You become spiritually aware by opening all your chakras(energy points) and release the Kundalini by directing it to your 8th golden chakra. This is the ultimate goal for Spiritual Alchemy which is ment to transform you into a God.

We can practice spirituality in many ways, whether it is through an organized religion or not, but spirituality is nature itself, not a set of beliefs. Spirituality and religion are not the same thing. All races of people practice spirituality as a way of living, and together through meditation and prayer.

Prayer really does nothing to you as there is no being who answers them except if you "pray" to the Gods, which is pretty much asking for their help. Pretty soon the Gods will leave you to stand on your own two feet and you will be on your own to survive in this chaotic Universe.

I already know you will take many of the things I said for granted, but you will eventually learn the hard way about what the true intent of these "visitors"(they have been here since after 8,000 CE so they really aren't visitors) are. They have hidden agendas that they are not willing to tell you.

[edit on 26-4-2005 by Centrixinal]

Well Centrixinal,

Wasn't that special? I'm not quite sure how that relates, but is was...interesting.

I'm begining to feel as if I'm the only one here that remains, unafiliated, as it were.

That being said. Are we to take from the above, that there are no aliens, per se?
Just the original visitors from Nibiru, cast off from their own planet and cursed to plague us for these many years.
(I'm taking for granted you actually meant 8000BCE as opposed to CE. We are currently in the Common Era, or CE.)
And we should not ask for help from these long ago cursed beings?

Originally posted by muzzleflash
shadow has no source

you are smart

hehe

say more of that stuff i like reading it

i feel just like you do
shadow

Compliments are rare. Thank you so much.

I don't usually post much. But since I'm off my medication this is what happens.

I'll definitely try to come up with more diatribes of righteous indignation for your enjoyment.

> ShadowHasNoSource
> Where does the "we" come in? I haven't created any governments.

Yes you have. We all have. Wether we vote or not; both are choises we make. The government we get is the results of all the individual choises; do I vote this one, or that one, or not at all? It all influence the makeup of the government.

> I cannot and will not take responsibility for the consequences of the actions of a few pyschopaths. It's bad enough I have to endure them.

Not sure who these 'pyschopaths' you talk about is. Do you mean politicans? Or actually dangerous pyschopaths that walk free in our society when they should have been locked in somewhere?

> Again with this "we" thing. Now the blame shifts to people that buy cars with big engines?

Blame? No, I give credit to them. But that is beside the point. The point you missed was that we now can do something about our pollution problem TODAY. Without the help of strangers from other stars. But the governments are reluctant to forbid old engines so nothing happens...

> I think you may have missed the point. There would be no buying. The technology and energy is free.
> Imagine 6 billion people, unhindered, working towards the benefit of everyone. There would be no need for money.

So the solution is a money-free society? But for that to happen we must have plans for how it should work. You do that! :-)

> You can't fix a broken system from within the same broken system. And you especially can't fix a broken
> system when the power brokers don't want it fixed.

I belive we can fix alot. It require a kind of leadership that does not exist today, and / or the right person that not neccesary is a leader but one person who come up with workable ideas that most people try to make/live up to.

> You want to know what happens when technology is not obstructed by selfish psychopaths born into power?
> The computer you are reading this on would cost over $1,000,000 some 50 years ago. Now, it's a grand.

Now it cost a grand because of the invention of the transistor. 50 years ago they used the same kind of 'lightbulbs' as was used in radio. Computers would still cost a million if transistors was not invented.
I can't see this have anything to do with 'selfish psychopaths born into power'.

> If medicine was unhindered all diseases would be cured. If manufacturing was unhindered we'd all have super
> durable consumer products that would last a lifetime. Money would be obsolete.

This is optimistic wiew that ignore the fact there's always a new sickness or disease.
I'll be dancing of joy the day we choose to live in a money-free society!

> Please try to think outside the systems just a little. I guarantee your perceptions will change drastically.

I know. But this was not what my message was about. Read my wiew at home.online.no... and select the 'future' option in the meny.


> Gazrok
> I'd have to agree there. Not to mention, they've had plenty of chances to help if that was a goal. Where were they
> during the Tsunami that killed hundreds of thousands?

Wait a minute! Did the aliens cause the tsunami? No.

> freddieb
> 90% of the world's population do not even have the logistical, much less, political ability to vote or choose the
> direction their leaders move

And they who DO can vote, choose not to. So wheter one can vote or one cannot vote, one do not get the leader one want.
What's the solution to this? I don't know. Do you? (anyone?)



> Centrixinal
> I know who Angels are. They are in reality the enemies of Humanity that set up the world religions to degenerate the
> Human soul. They want you to worship endlessly an unseen and unfelt "god", while they sit in the background feeding
> off the soul and psychic energy from all the prayers.

Right. So that is why they preach peace and say we humans must stop this war mentality/madness. The angels must be evil because they want us to live in peace. That's logical... not!

Originally posted by Ghaele
> ShadowHasNoSource
> Where does the "we" come in? I haven't created any governments.

Yes you have. We all have. Wether we vote or not; both are choises we make. The government we get is the results of all the individual choises; do I vote this one, or that one, or not at all? It all influence the makeup of the government.

Which of the 190+ governments are you speaking of here? The one I'm under plays by different rules (united states). Kerry or Bush? That's like asking if you want to die quick and painless or slow and painful.

The animated corpses that run for office are the people that seek power over others. These types are also the most easily corrupted by that power. We already know what happens when you try to do what the people need or want. Just watch the Zapruder film. No one with any soul left dares run for office anymore.

I understand the need to hold onto the belief that we somehow control the government but observation quickly proves that notion false.

> I cannot and will not take responsibility for the consequences of the actions of a few pyschopaths. It's bad enough I have to endure them.

Not sure who these 'pyschopaths' you talk about is. Do you mean politicans? Or actually dangerous pyschopaths that walk free in our society when they should have been locked in somewhere?

Politicians are dangerous psychopaths that walk free in our society when they should have been locked up somewhere.

> Again with this "we" thing. Now the blame shifts to people that buy cars with big engines?

Blame? No, I give credit to them. But that is beside the point. The point you missed was that we now can do something about our pollution problem TODAY. Without the help of strangers from other stars. But the governments are reluctant to forbid old engines so nothing happens...

Yes, we can do something about pollution today. But pollution isn't causing genocide, war, errosion of rights, and the general pandemic mayhem that defines our society today. Pollution doesn't cause catholic priests to prey on little boys. Pollution does not cause illegal invasions of sovereign countries. Pollution does not cause the army to use depleted uranium. Nor did it cause the use of agent orange. Both of which will kill and maim for generations to come. Pollution did not cause perpetual war for the last 2,000 years.

And, as said before, neither did I.

> I think you may have missed the point. There would be no buying. The technology and energy is free.
> Imagine 6 billion people, unhindered, working towards the benefit of everyone. There would be no need for money.

So the solution is a money-free society? But for that to happen we must have plans for how it should work. You do that! :-)

I completed those plans about a decade ago. Talk about the height of futility.

> You can't fix a broken system from within the same broken system. And you especially can't fix a broken
> system when the power brokers don't want it fixed.

I belive we can fix alot. It require a kind of leadership that does not exist today, and / or the right person that not neccesary is a leader but one person who come up with workable ideas that most people try to make/live up to.

The right leaders have come. And they have been killed. What would be the point of stepping in their shoes?

"We", as in the people that are just trying to live, are pushing against a force that we cannot stop. Just because we can't see that force sitting on our doorstep doesn't make it any less a force. We can't see gravity but you can see the effects. Look for the effects. Look at the results. Words are meaningless.

> You want to know what happens when technology is not obstructed by selfish psychopaths born into power?
> The computer you are reading this on would cost over $1,000,000 some 50 years ago. Now, it's a grand.

Now it cost a grand because of the invention of the transistor. 50 years ago they used the same kind of 'lightbulbs' as was used in radio. Computers would still cost a million if transistors was not invented.
I can't see this have anything to do with 'selfish psychopaths born into power'.

It has a lot to do with it. The computer industry was not hindered by government subsidized corporations, deep pocket lobbyists or any other government interference.

> If medicine was unhindered all diseases would be cured. If manufacturing was unhindered we'd all have super
> durable consumer products that would last a lifetime. Money would be obsolete.

This is optimistic wiew that ignore the fact there's always a new sickness or disease.
I'll be dancing of joy the day we choose to live in a money-free society!

And why are there always new diseases? I'm sure it has nothing to do with the soft metals, preservatives and engineered substances we digest daily.

> Please try to think outside the systems just a little. I guarantee your perceptions will change drastically.

I know. But this was not what my message was about. Read my wiew at home.online.no... and select the 'future' option in the meny.

There are organizations and treaties to fight pollution. I didn't vote for my government to hinder those organizations in favor of corporations. Nor did I vote for my government to pull out of the treaties. They did that all on their own.

Pollution is a symptom. The leaders, whose job it is to protect us, is the problem. And I don't think the originator of this thread was concentrating on just pollution, as you have. Pollution doesn't hold a candle to the 30+ million people killed in WWII.



EDIT: Computer example edited due to length of history required and the history of government interference in other industries. Too much information to put down.

[edit on 4-27-2005 by ShadowHasNoSource]