The #1 heresy today... Why we don't have to "repent of sin" to be saved...

I hope you are not a preacher in some church.

Good luck with your thread, I see this is a waste of my time.

originally posted by: ThyJudgeCometh
I didn't side step the question, I just simply pointed out the the bible says demons believe in ONE God... what does Lucifer having anything to do with people being reconciled to God??? He isn't human, nice straw man though...a reply to: DeathSlayer

This thread has is absolutely about salvation and weather repenting of sin is needed to be saved...a reply to: DeathSlayer

Your position is indefensible, I assure you it's not a waste of time, and you should repent of your dead works...a reply to: DeathSlayer

a reply to: ThyJudgeCometh
John is talking about the same thing, but using different words.
You point to "belief" as John's preferred wording, but let me observe that John distinguishes between believing THAT and believing IN. Two different prepositions in the Greek. The first is about accepting the truth of a statement,the second is about truating a person. Historically the church has fcoussed on the first, because it is easier to define and monitor, but New Testament salvation really depends on the second. We come back to God by trusting in Christ and what he has done. We come back to God by trusting in God.

In other words, "repentance" and "belief" are the same thing, for God's sake, when they are both properly understood. Adam and Eve distrusted God's will and turned away from God. We place our trust in God and turn back to him.

Too many disputations and divisions in church life have come about because people have created artificial distinctions, failing to recognise when differeent expressions may be two different ways of saying the same thing. I once had a book on "Scottish theology", which had a chapter recounting the great "Marrow controversy". As far as I can tell (because Calvinist argument always makes my head spin), the dispute arose because people were distinguishing between "repentance" and "turning to Christ" and arguing about which came first. You are in danger of falling into the same trap, creating an artficial controversy about different expressions.

The argument in your opening post was that people were misunderstanding what the word "repentance" means and demands. I thought you were right, and I was agreeing with you. I still think we are in fundamental agreement about what God wants from us, so my task is to get you to understand that we are saying the same thing.

a reply to: DeathSlayer
You could see that my post was answering the OP's question to me about the relationship between repentance and salvation.

While I agree that you have to repent to be saved, it wasn't repentance that saved you, it was believing...

Take Mark 1:15 repent ye, and believe the Gospel... in this instance we are repenting from not believing the Gospel, to believing in it... repentance is not a synonym for believe... repent means to change your mind, and believe means to be convinced something is true...a reply to: DISRAELI

And I'm not a Calvinist btwa reply to: DISRAELI

a reply to: ThyJudgeCometh
I was not accusing you of being a Calvinist. The failure to appreciate when different expressions are talking about the same thing is very widespread because it is one of the side-effects of Biblical literalism. It goes along with a failure to recognise when the same word has different meanings in different places, partly because different people are using it.

For example, the only difference between "Kingdom of God" and "kingdom of heaven" is that the second expression is limited to Matthew's gospel, but you will find people on these boards actively distinguishing between them.

I still think your first line of argument, "People misunderstand the word "repentance"" was the better one.

a reply to: DISRAELI

I'm not disagreeing that words by authors have different contextual meanings, but in the case of repentance it just means a change of mind.... Now there is no doubt that in Revelations it's talking about repentance from sin...

Contextually speaking for instance fire in scripture is more commonly used as an allegory for God's chastisment on his children for wrong doing, meaning temporal judgement... And used less commonly when referring to the lake of fire or eternal judgement... It's all based on context the the actual meaning of the word doesn't change...

originally posted by: DeathSlayer
Lucifer believes in Jesus so is he saved?

He also sinned.....

a reply to: ThyJudgeCometh

But does it accept Jesus as lord and saviour?
It’s a silly argument

Go read the sermon on the mount and see if you are good enough

Let’s just say repentance is turning to Jesus to make up our short comings
From there, the fruit of the Spirit renews our lives in line with Gods will and our works/deeds, our desire is to love and serve as Christ taught

For me the biggest failing of the church is the sinners prayer
It doesn’t make you a Christian by saying it, deeds must follow

a reply to: Raggedyman

I will have to disagree that deeds MUST follow...

Romans 4:5
But to him who worketh NOT but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly his faith is counted for righteousness...

a reply to: Raggedyman

Also no, the sinners prayer does not save, faith does...

originally posted by: ThyJudgeCometh
a reply to: Raggedyman

I will have to disagree that deeds MUST follow...

Romans 4:5
But to him who worketh NOT but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly his faith is counted for righteousness...

Fruits of the Spirit

Mathew 7/15 “You will know them by their fruit”
James 2/20. “Faith apart from works is useless”

Morals are what people should live by.

Sin is a man made device to control people. Sin is a religious tool to keep people in line.

So please have some morals, but sin, that I don't believe in.

a reply to: Raggedyman

In Matthew you will know false prophets by their fruits, not other Christians....

In James 2, it does not say "faith without works does not exist" because it does exist according to Romans 4:5

Do you know what the fruit a Christian produces is?

a reply to: MiddleInsite

I never understood that argument, what exactly am I to be obedient to that you aren't??? The Mosaic law is referred to as the Moral law, so what keeps you in line???

Basically sin is a transgression of the Moral law, so yes you do agree with it...

originally posted by: MiddleInsite
Morals are what people should live by.

Sin is a man made device to control people. Sin is a religious tool to keep people in line.

So please have some morals, but sin, that I don't believe in.

Who decides morals, you?

a reply to: ThyJudgeCometh

Well I think so but, please let me know your opinion
Pretty sure the fruit of the Spirit is pretty obvious

a reply to: Raggedyman

The fruit of the spirit is most people's answer, but even Satan would appear as an angel of light... It's actually other people, think about it Jesus said he would make you a fisher of men...

Proverbs 11:30
30 The fruit of the righteous is a tree of life; and he that winneth souls is wise.