5G Just Got Weird

I hesitate to post this thread, but I feel this topic is interesting. I'd like to ask though if the thread can be kept on topic and not diverge into the typical conspiracy theory nonsense about this. There's lots of angles that can be touched on about this. Please...no '5g is bad for our health', '5g causes corona' type stuff. It's nonsense.

What I would like to discuss in this thread though are the implications behind this newly released standard 16 and the upcoming standard release 17 touched on in the article. I'm going to post a small summary of new changes.

spectrum.ieee.org...

Release 16 is where things are getting weird for 5G. While earlier releases focused on the core of 5G as a generation of cellular service, Release 16 lays the groundwork for new services that have never been addressed by cellular before. At least, not in such a rigorous, comprehensive way.

The 5G vision has always been this unifying platform,” says Tseng. When developing 5G standards, researchers and engineers saw no reason that wireless cellular couldn’t also be used to connect anything wireless.

One of the flashiest things in Release 16 is V2X, short for “Vehicle to Everything.” In other words, using 5G for cars to communicate with each other and everything else around them.

Release 16 also introduces a new technique called sidelinking. Sidelinks will allow 5G-connected vehicles to communicate directly with one another, rather than going through a cell-tower intermediary.

it can theoretically apply to any two devices that might need to communicate directly rather than go through a base station first. Factory robots are one example,

In past generations of cellular, three cell towers were required to triangulate where a phone was by measuring the round-trip distance of a signal from each tower. But 5G networks will be able to use the round-trip time from a single tower to locate a device.

Millimeter waves means it will be possible to build a network just for an office building, factory, or stadium. At those scales, 5G could function essentially like Wi-Fi networks.

I'm going to start with my opinion on 5g and this big push towards it by pretty much every company.and government. It worries me on one hand, but on the other there seems to be big potential.

The worrying thing for me is the lack of control for users and consumers vs larger companies. The article touched on private networks and device to device communication using 5g that bypasses cellular network towers and can be used like wifi.

Their examples were all large corporate examples, autonomous car manufacturers, factory robots, business networks.

Vehicle to vehicle communication seems perfect for abuse by law enforcement, random hackers and trolls. It's all fun and games until a random passerby or cop takes over your vehicle and forces it off the road.

How many of these device to device networkin options will be available for consumers in the way wifi and Bluetooth radio devices are now? How much control will cellular network providers have over these private networks? A local wifi network is private. If I pay for.internet services, run a private network in my house that interfaces with this, my ISP doesn't see anything other than incoming and l outgoing traffic, in a private network connected to a 5g router, using 5g to communicate between devices, is that traffic still private from the ISP?

Location and tracking will pe possible through a single cell tower now, giving even more fine grained data to the companies acquiring this to us.

Why is there a push towards a centrally controlled 5g cellular system for devices that are advertised to be connected locally rather than distributed wifi mesh networks or other locally controlled networks?

The 'things' being enabled by 5g networks is already more than possible with current technology. The problem in my view and why this concerted push and lobbying and PR towards 5g has more to with the open accessible standards of our current technology and the locked down centrally controlled 5g future.

The push should be towards open standards, accessible by the public and everyone, that allows simple radio communication between devices without a centralized entity controlling the channels.

This is how it worked for years with radio. The thing everyone seems to forget is that cellular and wifi signals are the same #, 5g isn't about a new technology, it's about licensing a section of spectrum around corporations and their control over it and rushing new devices and standards to conform to these standards and allow these companies to control communication over this spectrum. The scary thing is, these devices are going to have a level of communication unlike anything we've seen before and they won't be working for us.

a reply to: dug88

Please...no '5g is bad for our health', '5g causes corona' type stuff. It's nonsense.

Good luck with that.

a reply to: dug88

It is plain and simple the start of SkyNet, as I call it, or The Internet of Things by it's proper name. 5G is not being laid out so we can download movies and games quicker.

The NWO control grid needs 5G, to set up a complete CCP like control system. The big corp's need 5G for their driverless cars, drones, robots, AR and all the other nifty things they have waiting for us.

Yea kind of like me yapping on about it wont matter if you do not have a home internet connection. If you have devices within the range of a transmitter it becomes a two way device at the whim of government, corporate ad trackers fine tuning the various personality and consumer profiles about you they trade daily en masse between each other, and the growing number of people who know how to easily crawl and find open ports for direct access to voyeur your home from anywhere in the world.

Got a video game headset but the internet is off?? No matter, if it is connected to a controller and drawing current it can and will also bebauto tapped and recorded at all times into the fusion center. Or it can simply be activated by most snoops being nosy.

Think of that old service chat roulette. As long as any powered device is within the 5g transmission range, creeps around the world can do something very similar.

Control access to your movile devices, time to learn to disengage if you ever want your privacy back.

a reply to: dug88

The worrying thing for me is the lack of control for users and consumers vs larger companies. The article touched on private networks and device to device communication using 5g that bypasses cellular network towers and can be used like wifi.

We have no control as it is. We have never had any. We are sold like slaves for our data with no opt out as such.

The wifi could only operate over a small distance within receptivity range. That means close up. That is why we need towers, satellites and cable. How can that be matched so that Australian buttons can be pushed by UK fingers?

It will only be useful locally as it. It is a development though, no doubt.

This interesting ways this might go is that the very WWW could fragment. Certainly the security issues will encourage governments and the like to have their own webs that can be completely independent of the main WWW. Maybe there are already independent webs they are using with their own satellites. I think there could be.

In terms of universality what can improve on A making B happen five thousand miles away? 5G can only make it a bit stronger in signal and compared to fibre it is still limited. It really is not a big deal, just a faster and better signal for mobile communication. mini independent wifi being the only new development as you have described. Bluetooth already has device to device communication through a base station and does not have to go through the tower.

a reply to: dug88

The concern seems to be everything is being broadcast over the open air For intercept but it’s just as easy to track activity with hardwired devices.
Good god, people are putting fricken wire taps on their kitchen tables just for the convenience.

The truth is that most people are to boring or lazy to bother to monitor.

a reply to: Kakamega

The big change is the speed and bandwidth. Many new things that have been developed need almost real time info. Like a driverless car, lag would kill. There are other systems that need this "instant data" like to keep people under control without them even realizing it.

a reply to: dug88

To some extent, there is greater security in that data gets streamed in separate channels which have some degree of discreteness from other channels.

The 'channelized' nature of 5G data transfers means that an individual app that communicates in a particular data format, doesn't have to extract its own relevant data from a jumble of what to the app is irrelevant noise. Hence lower overhead on the app side of things and greater separation of data streams by function.

The device to device daisy chaining comms is really just like another way of MIMO networking where you get greater throughput by routing stuff around any overloaded (and therefore bottleneck) nodes.

a reply to: dug88

Welcome to the future where everything is connected.

btw several cars on the market are already exploitable.

www.theverge.com...

a reply to: grey580
We just need to convince the right hated politicians and ceos to jump in one, and have it drive over a cliff. Rinse and repeat until the technocrat is eliminated.

This is nothing new. Onstar has been spying on us for years. Even if you dont subscribe to the service. Guy i know was screwing around doing burnouts in a cornfield. Crashed into a rock. He does not subscribe to onstar but its equipped. They communicqted with him in the cqr and asked if he needed assistance. He said no. Cops showed up 3 minutes later.

They slip up once in a while in my GMC and queue up onstar announcements out of nowhere. 5g is just another conduit.

If everything in our life is connected. What happens when SkyNet becomes self aware or someone takes complete control of it.

At least in BSG they were able to air gap some tech when the Cylons took over.

a reply to: dug88

Please...no '5g is bad for our health', '5g causes corona' type stuff. It's nonsense.

Since you decided to state it is nonsense that gives others the right to tell you how foolish they think you are.

a reply to: worldstarcountry

We're gonna need a few thousand jeeps.

a reply to: SeaWorthy

Go for it, i try to back up the things I say with references and facts. I get a little heated and say dumb # sometimes i'll admit it, but saying a viral pandemic is caused by radio wave frequencies just displays a fairly large lack of even basic knowledge in biology, electronics and physics.

Anyway, I'm breaking my own thread rules now so...# this.

I don't have a cable or sat internet connection, just a smart phone hot spot. So I created a private WiFi LAN to connect all my devices. It's crude but sounds similar, expect with thess new 5G systems you don't need special apps, or decryption, or a Home Group or other network, or any need to do administrative tweaks when the network gets screwy. In fact you have zero control it sounds like.

In past generations of cellular, three cell towers were required to triangulate where a phone was by measuring the round-trip distance of a signal from each tower. But 5G networks will be able to use the round-trip time from a single tower to locate a device.

Phased antenna arrays in the chip sets of 5g devices still use a triangulation process to define the relative location between devices. It is pretty tricky how two points of the triangle have been condensed into the one chip.

Sounds like work is going on to establish a peer to peer network among devices. Might cut down on some infrastructure costs. As for where the whole Internet of things is going, I don't know. I liked the days I could work on my car, keep it simple. If I had a space ship then some of this tech could help.

originally posted by: LookingAtMars
a reply to: dug88

It is plain and simple the start of SkyNet, as I call it, or The Internet of Things by it's proper name. 5G is not being laid out so we can download movies and games quicker.

The NWO control grid needs 5G, to set up a complete CCP like control system. The big corp's need 5G for their driverless cars, drones, robots, AR and all the other nifty things they have waiting for us.

Gotta get that grid online for an effective Neuralink program!

a reply to: MichiganSwampBuck

In fact you have zero control it sounds like.

Seems like the point of 5g entirely to me. Removing yet more contol from the end user and increasing the need to rely on large companies.

originally posted by: drewlander
This is nothing new. Onstar has been spying on us for years. Even if you dont subscribe to the service. Guy i know was screwing around doing burnouts in a cornfield. Crashed into a rock. He does not subscribe to onstar but its equipped. They communicqted with him in the cqr and asked if he needed assistance. He said no. Cops showed up 3 minutes later.

They slip up once in a while in my GMC and queue up onstar announcements out of nowhere. 5g is just another conduit.

Thought their goal was to sign you up first. Legally they don't have to forward you to 911 as a third party provider