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Freightliner's level 4 autonomous truck and the social impact of automation on our economy

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posted on Dec, 26 2018 @ 04:43 PM
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For clarification I put this thread in social issues and civil unrest due to the implication's of autonomous vehicles impact on the marketplace and jobs and not in the Global Meltdown forum because in the long term this will be more of a social issue than economic one.

Secondly, I've heard your platitudes about how automation (notice I'm not calling it AI for a reason) is going to create as many jobs as it replaces and that's totally false. Automation is going to replace somewhere around 80 million jobs in the next 10 years and that is a low number in my estimation. So, the only way you can open me up to that idea is by showing me actual data on how many jobs automation is creating. If you can show me an equal ratio of jobs lost to jobs create I will listen, otherwise don't waste my time with more platitudes and rhetoric.

I sit here writting this as I build scripts in Python for my CCNP labs automating redudant task.

Inspiration truck


Freightliner Cascadia Evolution series production model, thousands of which can be seen on US roads. And it is approved for autonomous driving on public highways in Nevada.



Secondly, in order to take pressure off the drivers and make their job more attractive by assigning them other tasks. Last but not least, the total cost of ownership (TCO) plays an important role in the transport industry. The high degree of automation lowers the TCO even further.


Daimler's level 4 autonomous vehicle on roads in next 5 years


The company, a division of German automaker Damiler AG, also said it will pour about $3 billion into research and development this year and next. That includes about $600 million on automated driving features and advance technology such as electric drivetrains.


That's nothing btw compared to the total market on automation investments. I would have to do a series of several threads detailing how much is being dumped into this.


Daimler is looking to develop trucks that can operate with Level 4 autonomous capability and could be ready for sales to fleets in about five years, executives said. The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration defines a Level 4 autonomous vehicle as one that can drive itself in most situations, with some exceptions, such as weather or construction, where a human may need to take control.


Autonomous driving levels



This is nothing. If you think your construction jobs and white collar jobs aren't replaceable it's to late for you.



Ex Google China president, white collar jobs obliterate by automation


The upcoming worldwide workforce reckoning that artificial intelligence is expected to bring will happen much sooner than many experts predict, the former president of Google China told CNBC on Monday.




"Robots are clearly replacing people jobs. They're working 24 by 7. They are more efficient. They need some programming. But one programer can program 10,000 robots."




"We need to redefine the idea of work ethic for the new workforce paradigm. The importance of a job should not be solely dependent on its economic value but should also be measured by what it adds to society." "We should also reassess our notion that longer work hours are the best way to achieve success," he concluded.


And here you can see the future. Weather you guys like it or not your old ideas and ways of thinking are being replaced with a new paradigm shifting technological revolution that isn't slowing down. Actually, it's happening so fast most of you can't even see it.

Continuing to sit here and argue age old platitudes and rhetoric is a total waste of time. The market is changing and our point of view on this market and how we move into the future will have to change with it.

Time to let the old ideas die and to work on new ones.






edit on 26-12-2018 by toysforadults because: (no reason given)




posted on Dec, 26 2018 @ 05:04 PM
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a reply to: toysforadults

It's pretty obvious automation is going to replace the vast majority of jobs.
Maybe I missed whatever threads you're talking about. But I haven't seen these automation "deniers" you're ranting on about. Just seems silly and unnecessary to me to be so combative about this topic. Take a chill pill.



posted on Dec, 26 2018 @ 05:09 PM
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a reply to: watchitburn




Take a chill pill.


Maybe you should reread your own post before talking about being combative.

It's a debate forum and I have made several threads relating to automation and I get that argument in every one. Maybe you need to chill out buddy.



posted on Dec, 26 2018 @ 05:10 PM
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a reply to: toysforadults

The trucking industry has a pretty significantly different outlook on automated trucking. There's a lot of work that still needs doing, and they're looking at various levels of automation. They're at least 10 years from seeing any kind of large trucking revolution from what the industry is saying, probably more than that.
edit on 12/26/2018 by Zaphod58 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 26 2018 @ 05:15 PM
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I'm a home health aide. A member of one of the most needed most understaffed and underpaid industries in the world.

It however has a few things going for it. One you can go home with a good concience for having helped those in need and two without full AI with the ability to understand emotional needs and deal with the erraticism of things like dementia there's no threat to losing my job due to automation.

Maybe if more jobs become automated those in need might get more of the help they deserve.

Then again not likely. We're horribly underpaid and it results in too many aides that instead take advantage of the elderly and infirm. So will likely be a lot more of that.



posted on Dec, 26 2018 @ 05:17 PM
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a reply to: Zaphod58

I've read various views from trucking companies on what their projections are for level 5 automation. Freightliner and Dailmer have stated this year that they plan on level 4 in the next 5 years in the article I linked above. That's driverless, no driver in the cab.

www.ttnews.com...


In China, autonomous trucking is coming faster than expected. Chinese driverless truck startup Fabu Technology said June 12 that its driverless trucks already have taken part in open road tests and it plans to offer intercity cargo transportation this year, which is expected to radically reshape the nation’s freight transportation market.

“Our self-driving truck is expected to achieve intercity cargo transportation this year, within-city freight delivery by 2019 and interprovince delivery by 2020,” said He Xiaofei, founder and CEO of Fabu, who was also former senior deputy president and a top self-driving expert of Chinese ride-hailing giant Didi Chuxing.


Less than 1 year away.

www.theatlantic.com...


The trucks that roam the highways of the Australian outback are a lot bigger than the average 18-wheeler. Instead of towing one container, these road trains, as Australians refer to them, pull at least three self-tracking semitrailers behind them, which follow each other like train carriages. The trailers are packed with heavy goods—cattle, gas, coal, cars—and sent roaring through the continent’s interior to deliver supplies to coastal cities.


www.theverge.com...

www.ft.com...


Please use the sharing tools found via the share button at the top or side of articles. Copying articles to share with others is a breach of FT.com T&Cs and Copyright Policy. Email licensing@ft.com to buy additional rights. Subscribers may share up to 10 or 20 articles per month using the gift article service. More information can be found at www.ft.com... www.ft.com... Volvo Group already has a fully automated truck operating in Kristineberg mine in Sweden. It also recently demonstrated a fully driverless truck in China that can drive between delivery hubs without the need for a human operator.


I think it's going to happen faster. 1 evolution in thought can revolutionize an entire industry overnight.



posted on Dec, 26 2018 @ 05:19 PM
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I may work at automating arguing. That's a field that will never end.



posted on Dec, 26 2018 @ 05:23 PM
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a reply to: toysforadults

Freightliner and Daimler may plan that, but the guys that buy the trucks just saw their orders tank in the last month or so for the first time in several years. The trucking bubble is in danger of going, and if that happens, they're not going to be spending large amounts of money on systems that are going to require major changes in the near future. The talk from multiple companies and trucking organizations is largely that it's not going to happen soon.



posted on Dec, 26 2018 @ 05:23 PM
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originally posted by: toysforadults
a reply to: watchitburn




Take a chill pill.


Maybe you should reread your own post before talking about being combative.

It's a debate forum and I have made several threads relating to automation and I get that argument in every one. Maybe you need to chill out buddy.


No, this is one of the "conspiracy theory" forums. The debate forum is a separate forum altogether.

But you just proved my point for me. I recommend growing some thicker skin buttercup.



posted on Dec, 26 2018 @ 05:24 PM
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a reply to: Puppylove

I wish I could see evidence of this technology improving our society on a social level but I don't see evidence of that.

Maybe there is a dark period before the light in regards to the social impact of automation?



posted on Dec, 26 2018 @ 05:27 PM
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a reply to: watchitburn

I recommend discussing the topic or shutting up.

You are just another 1 person in a sea of people who don't discuss the topics. Unlike you the other posters in this thread are commenting effectively on the topic and creating an engaging conversation.

It's to bad I can't /block people like you.



posted on Dec, 26 2018 @ 05:30 PM
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a reply to: toysforadults

Yeah, note my last paragraph. Will likely still remain underpaid and result in simply more elderly being taken advantage of and abused since the opportunities are both easy and constant. If I weren't honest and caring the crap I could get away with is absurd.

I can't imagine how much worse it would be if most aides were in the industry because it was the only job available and not because they care.



posted on Dec, 26 2018 @ 05:32 PM
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originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: toysforadults

Freightliner and Daimler may plan that, but the guys that buy the trucks just saw their orders tank in the last month or so for the first time in several years. The trucking bubble is in danger of going, and if that happens, they're not going to be spending large amounts of money on systems that are going to require major changes in the near future. The talk from multiple companies and trucking organizations is largely that it's not going to happen soon.


Ooooo, I would love to read more about the trucking bubble can you provide some more info please? are you a truck driver?

thanks



posted on Dec, 26 2018 @ 05:33 PM
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originally posted by: Puppylove
a reply to: toysforadults

Yeah, note my last paragraph. Will likely still remain underpaid and result in simply more elderly being taken advantage of and abused since the opportunities are both easy and constant. If I weren't honest and caring the crap I could get away with is absurd.

I can't imagine how much worse it would be if most aides were in the industry because it was the only job available and not because they care.


that's probably a situation you are already facing isn't it?

I know that's happening in my sector of the economy. I meet network tech's and IT guys all the time who don't have the fundamentals down but are paper tigers.


(post by watchitburn removed for a manners violation)

posted on Dec, 26 2018 @ 05:37 PM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Dec, 26 2018 @ 05:46 PM
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a reply to: toysforadults

Pretty much. Many places have even stopped drug testing to get more workers. Keep in mind what this industry is about and the opportunities available to acquire peoples opiates and that should be scary as hell.

Worst part is. I can understand the temptations. Money can be tight and it's just left out by people who will forget it was ever there or that they even had it. A person can be one bad day from going from a good aide to a thief.

In some ways I wish the job could be automated if for no other reasons than to protect the vulnerable. That won't work either though as sometimes in order to help a client you need to bend or even break the rules. It's both a risk and judgement call a machine can't or won't take.



posted on Dec, 26 2018 @ 05:52 PM
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a reply to: Puppylove

true, I can see what you are saying. but having said that you're industry is still susceptible due to the fact that it will be flooded with candidates willing to work for nothing
edit on 26-12-2018 by toysforadults because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 26 2018 @ 05:54 PM
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a reply to: toysforadults

For another year or so, then I'm running like hell.

I'll see what I can dig up tonight or tomorrow. The industry is going to end up a hot mess. The big companies have driven freight prices way down, but driver pay is currently the equivalent of early 1980s pay. The market is strong, but truck orders were cut at least in half for the first time in several years. It used to be really easy to put a warm body in the seat, and driving was a revolving door. Now, these young guys that think it's a really easy job that they can make a lot of money at get out there, realize they're not going to get paid for crap until they get years under their belt, and even then they won't make a lot of money, run as fast as they can. There's a major driver shortage looming.



posted on Dec, 26 2018 @ 06:00 PM
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a reply to: toysforadults

They need to pay us a reasonable wage in the first place for that to be a risk. Even with the shortage some are trying to pass bills to get rid of travel pay requirements between clients. The whole industry is insane. But yes an influx of workers willing to get paid peanuts and sit around doing nothing and stealing from the elderly will not help.

There will be no hope of the industry improving with a worker influx. We can barely make a difference with how in demand we are already. Instead of improving incentives they just lower standards. They'll have even less incentive to improve with excess workers.



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