ATS (was not hacked)

I kinda hope that with regards to the government, the hackers win, with regards to independent websites such as ATS, i hope they lose

"Hacker's Challenge 'Could Be Hoax"

www.news.com.au...^1702,00.html

However.

The site announcing the challenge has been taken off the internet but the authorities in the United States and computer security experts have told companies to make sure their systems are not vulnerable.

Umm, didn't we all just go look at that site?

And,

Zone-H has however noted a marked decline in notifications of new defacements in recent days which it said indicated that hackers may be waiting for Sunday.

Interesting article. Seems like perhaps a reporter jumped the gun about the defacers-challenge site being taken down.
Also gives a little more info on zone-h.org.


[Edited on 6-7-2003 by Banshee]

Yes... perhaps they are waiting until Sunday, maybe even Monday. I think they may attack after we take our guard down. Maybe this was all part of the plan... or maybe they wanted the government to know so they could really test their hacking skills. I guees we'll never know untill it's all over.

As of this exact moment both zone-h.org and zone-h.com are not working.

Did you ever think that the so-called hackers could be the government???

(Just one man's opinion, nothing to take seriously)

It seems that for the moment both sites are up again.. Go Hackers!

I just like to see the rebels/underdogs win the fight.

Hey now,
We want zone-h to stay up, but they're not involved with this hack. They're just a site that keeps stats on hacks and defacements, provides security info, etc.

AV, that thought had occured to me. Not somuch that the hackers themselves are gov't, but that this whole hackers challenge is some sort of smokescreen. Script kiddies love any reason to hack, so to come across something like this, well...not many could resist it. =)
Funny that this one is getting so much attention when these contests are pretty routine. Either another media bandwagon thing, or, well...see above.

-B.

[Edited on 7-6-2003 by Slaviik]

Could you guys please post any sites that you find that have been hacked? i'd find them to be interesting.

Check zone-h is all I can say.. When it's up I mean.

Started going down my favorites list to check it out, all other sites seem up. But had to get here the long way.
Because the skulls( the hacker's page) was up about ten minutes ago.

I would definately agree with you that this whole issue is totally overblown. My personal opinion of it all is this:

Who cares. This is nothing new. Hackers are idiots and they will get caught and end up working for the government anyway. Some of these ignorants that pray for the hackers to do damage are fools. I think that hacking is horrible and is no different than terrorism. In fact I often call it that cause it is.

These hackers are weak and don't know how to act like adults, even though they may claim to be.

Basically I could careless what they do. Cause I know what will happen to them and in time it will all work out for the better. They will soon be apart of that which they were once against. Trust me, I know these things. I have seen this stuff happen before.

Originally posted by Abraham Virtue
I would definately agree with you that this whole issue is totally overblown. My personal opinion of it all is this:

Who cares. This is nothing new. Hackers are idiots and they will get caught and end up working for the government anyway. Some of these ignorants that pray for the hackers to do damage are fools. I think that hacking is horrible and is no different than terrorism. In fact I often call it that cause it is.

These hackers are weak and don't know how to act like adults, even though they may claim to be.

Basically I could careless what they do. Cause I know what will happen to them and in time it will all work out for the better. They will soon be apart of that which they were once against. Trust me, I know these things. I have seen this stuff happen before.

Ok then... here's my "Personal Opinion".

I think you're quite the idiot yourself for thinking this way about really and truely skilled hackers...

First of all... I've only read this thread and not followed or checked up on the attacks... The impression i'm getting from the comments here about ddos attacks and defacements is that the so called "hackers" playing this game are nothing more then script kids and possibly crackers...


Allow me to explain... someone who reallly wants to hack a server (that is to get acces to the machine) would NEVER use a DDOS attack on the machine in question.

DDOS is short for Distributed Denial Of Service, this means that one attacks the services offered by the computer that is under attack in such a way that the services are "overloaded" and therefore shutdown and are no longer available to the public.

In short laymans terms one crashes the server so noone can access it anymore.

This is something done only by script kiddies...

I'll continue...
Defacing a website is the second thing that i saw posted here as a goal of the "hackers". Defacement is different from a ddos attack... one has to hack a server (without damaging it i.e. keep the services running so you can acces the server) and replace the website (or part of it) with an altered site...

Again in short laymans terms you replace the website with whatever you want it to show.

This is something done by advanced script kiddies.

Now for the Important point i wanted to make...

A real hacker makes sure that he gets into a server without being detected and without destroying anything!!!

That means... no ddos attacks because then he wouldn't be able to access the server anymore.
And no defacements... as a system admin would know that he had been hacked if his site was altered.

Motives of real hackers differ... basically the good guys (people who seek out flaws in systems and notify sysadmins of their mistakes) are called hackers.
The bad guys (people who hack systems for personal gain) are called crackers.

But all in all a hacker is someone who enters a server without being detected... and in order to stay on the system and remain undetected he is carefull not to destroy anything that might give him away.

These hacks that are supposed to be happening (or have happend) are the work of script kiddies...

Abraham, You should have the greatest respect for the computing skills that real hackers (the good guys) have... without them... the internet would be a mess... It is they that think of new ways to secure things (from the bad guys and script kids) it is they that have the skill to install servers properly and program like no other... Be gratefull for them and their skills...

If what you said earlier is what you think of this last group (the only real hackers) then i can't help but say that you're an ignoramous that knows sh!t about hackers.

Last thing i wanted to say is about you calling hacking terrorism. Abraham,.. my pretty ignorant ATS cyber friend... he who is doing the bidding of the Bush administration in calling any- and everything terrorism so the government can wipe it out with brute force.

Hacking isn't terrorism... it's a common crime like breaking and entering... not an act of terrorism... I agree that it's a crime but it's definetely NOT terrorism...

Wake up,.. smell the coffee... you are being manipulated by Bush and his thugs... Think for yourself... make up your own mind.

Peace out,

MrFreeze

Well I am not a technical computer expert, I will admit that much. What I do know is this:

Hackers don't go public. They work in deceptive ways. So refute the claims that these people are the REAL DEAL. That isn't what is important though. I can believe that this is a hoax and you can believe that this is the real thing and that is okay. We can disagree on that cause it doesn't matter, cause in time one of us will prove the other wrong by way of word of mouth. In time the hackers or fakers will tell us the answer to that story.

However:

I was trying to point out that in the end these guys get caught. They are not all powerful and the government works with the best of the best to track these punks down. If you want to dispute that then I can't help you there buddy. Cause it is well known that I can't just go around and ask some FED about these matters. For these matters are very sensitive and are on a need to know basis. So let us drop that.

What gets me is your excuse that these so-called hackers are defined by good guys and bad guys. Well take time to notice that crime is crime. When you hack something you are a criminal regardless of the circumstances. Just because the Government has hackers working for them doesn't mean they are out of the loop on criminal activity. All crime is crime, plan and simple. When the CIA did hits(They still do, but not offically.) they were committing crimes. There were no exceptions. Why do you think spies are tried and shot??? Cause they are criminals even though we all know the game that is being played. There is no difference with that and hackers. They are playing a dangerous game that is played by criminals and they can get their heads cut off for doing so. It is all about who you know.

When a hacker gets caught and they are good enough to be used for those that caught them, then they are given a choice, join us, or rot in jail. Simple as that. Do you really think that if this goes down that the Governments of the world will just sit back and watch???

No. They are going to find out who these terrorists are. For they have sweeping powers in other nations and in those nations they have methods that would make John Rambo talk. So please don't insult my intelligence by saying I don't know what I am talking about. I know quite well how the game works. That game goes like this:

You mess with us, we mess with you. No if's and's or butt's about it.

As for terrorism:

Well let me just put it like this. Terrorism is that which is indiscriminate aggression towards a people or place of interest for reasons revolving around a means to an end. If you have an agenda and you use a policy of indiscrimate attack to implement that policy then you are a terrorist. Plan and simple.

Please don't tell me that I am a puppet of some ideal brought forth by the Bush clan. I have been preaching against terrorism ever since I was a little kid when I was watching GI Joe and looking up to James Bond. I grew up seeing violence in my homeland between my brethren and I always feared the backlash of terror from our overt support to war and deception between the waring parties in the Middle East. I asked why it was us who had to stick our nose the violent lands of Iraq and Iran. I often said,

"Why do we have to fight the wars when they are already being fought?"

"Why should we get involved when we are not at fault???"

These are the questions I often asked as a little kid. I knew that one day that war would come to us because of our support and our arrogance in these matters. We should have stayed out of the fight. I didn't know why we even bothered. I didn't know at the time it was all about the cash. Now I know better cause now I have grown up and learned more than I may want to know.

So please don't tell me that I am the one being controlled. I brought this on myself, as did America. America got what was coming to them when those terrorists first struck the towers in the early 90's. I knew it was coming and so did they(They being the military-industrial complex). It was no mystery to them and it was no mystery to me. Trust me buddy, when your father says stuff like,

"Where do you get all this from? Why do you think like this? What makes you so sure?" you are not someone out of the loop.

You are not someone being told. You are the one telling. When the terror hit us hard that day on September 11th, I brazenly and bashfully said, "See, I told you so."

Everyone I knew was speechless, and for good reason. Who wouldn't be??? I was no different. I expected less, not that which came. Yet there is a catch. Wanna here it???

Here goes:

That was only the beginning.

There will be more to come and we must fight to stop it once and for all. I am not a fool. I am not going to sit back and let those terrorist destroy our nation. I am going to fight them in any form they come. So should you. So as long as they come to rape and destroy our ways and our peoples then we shall do them the harm that they deserve.

It just blows my mind that you can't see how these hackers are terrorists. They want to destroy the infrustructure of countless of entities. And for what??? Some sort of prize??? Yeah right. They do this cause they hate. They hate the system and they want it destroyed. If they only knew that the system feed and clothed them then they wouldn't be so insistant on doing so. They are the ignoramuses, not me.

You See??????

Yeeeha,

Freezie's got a debate on his hands...

Abraham... have no fear i'll respond to your every word.. I like your point of view... on some points you're right and on some you're dead wrong... I have to go fix a friend's computer soon so right now... i don't have the time to respond. But i will tonight... rest asured you will not be forgotten

Peace,

MrFreeze

Terrorism is easy to define: an act of aggression on an innocent party to get the attention of other parties you believe not to be innocent.

Unwanted intrusion into computer networks/systems can be defined as a form of terrorism, no matter how you attempt to justify the motives of hackers/crackers with terms like white hats or black hats.

This defacing challenge has been organized by a reasonably talented group under the guise of a semi-notorious hacker called Eleonora[67]. Don't bother searching on that name, the "[67]" in brackets prevents effective searches on the whole name. The group is attempting to pretend to be out of Brazil and working through Estonian connections. The broken english and amateurish page are a pretense to make most assume they are not a serious threat.

In reality, this is likely a very serious threat to websites and Internet security. This group is using this contest as a way to fool script kiddies into helping build a list of exploitable websites. Most sites that are easily defaced, are also easy victims to more serious intrusions and zombification. 6,000 coordinated zombies would be a very serious problem.

I don't know where you are getting this info, and I guess I don't care. I have a lot of confidence that this is just a bunch of junk. Not William's statements, but the claims of these so-called hackers or crackers what ever you want to call them. I just think that even if this does go down I doubt that it will see much publicity. Why???

Cause I think that our men in the intel and Fed agencies will realize that if they give these hackers attention then they will only give them what they want. I doubt that our Feds will give these jerks anything. They will treat them as terrorists just as i would. They aren't going to put on the same level as Ramzi Yossef but they will take their threats just as seriously and they will not conceed to their demands just as they wouldn't with hijackers. Cause lets face it, that is exactly what a hacker is. He or she is one who hijacks sites and they don't necassarily demand anything but they do intend to make a difference.

It is my opinion that if they intend to make a difference then they will hope to make the biggest influence possible. The best way for them to make an influence is to promote fear and even propagate their doctrines. There will be two types of reactionists out there if the hackers plans come about. Those being:

Those that fear and tremble at the terror the hackers create.

And

Those that look up to or praise the terror that is propagated among the peoples.

Now they, the hackers will benefit from both of these actions from the reactionists. So that is why I don't expect to see much publicity over this issue. Nonetheless that doesn't mean that they will not do great damage. That is another story. A story I can't tell; For I lack the knowledge on these matters. That is for someone else to answer. So if anyone can answer the following questions then I will be pleased. Those questions are those that follow:

Can the hackers shut down our major nuclear stations?

Can they erase bank records?

Can they shut down street lights?

Can they bring down planes?

Can they shut off our lights?


I know they can shut down the water supply, but what about the others???


Thanks


Love,
Abraham

Originally posted by William

Originally posted by phoenix_cross
i know something about yoooooou.

I'll bet you don't... but I'll confirm if you're correct via U2U.

No you won't! LOL

Now I don't know much about hacking/cracking etc. but petty vandalism pisses people off. Surely these people will be caught? They had to register the domain name right?
I'm not a private detective either , but I looked up www.defacers-challenge.com on WHOIS database and found lots of information:
Registrant:
of, Day (TPEEWXQFBD)
11 Albert Rd
AMITYVILLE, NY 11701
US

Domain Name: DEFACERS-CHALLENGE.COM

Administrative Contact:
of, Day (35473296P) [email protected]
11 Albert Rd
AMITYVILLE, NY 11701
US
(631) 842-5471
Technical Contact:
Affinity Hosting, LLC (TS1126-ORG) [email protected]
16611 S. Vermont Ave
Gardena, CA 90247
US
310-354-2626 fax: 310-354-1592

Record expires on 21-Jun-2004.
Record created on 21-Jun-2003.
Database last updated on 6-Jul-2003 03:23:20 EDT.

Domain servers in listed order:

NS1.MYDOMAIN.COM 64.94.117.195
NS2.MYDOMAIN.COM 216.52.121.228

Tadaa - Address for the person who registered the domain name. They have to be involved? Further looking into the phone number gives a name too -

I Wehner
11 Albert Rd
Amityville, NY 11701
Phone: 631-842-5471

Now, is this person partly responsible for any attacks that occur for owning the domain with that on, or is it solely the h/cr ackers?

(BTW all of this information was publically available, so I'm not infringing on anyones privacy am I?)

www.networksolutions.com... for WHOIS
www.infospace.com... for reverse phone number lookup
www.intellius.com... also says that approx ages for the people at 11 albert rd are 56 and 61.

-Mr.Dead... (providing more and more useless info everyday)

The defacers-challenge domain registry holds no clues.

Start here: www.hypnotic0.hpg.ig.com.br/index.html