Presidencies. How many have you been through?

originally posted by: rickymouse
I was only about eight when Kennedy was shot, I remember that day at school. I have heard quite a few political lies in my life. All presidents lied or hid the truth, why should Trump be any different.

I started with Eisenhower. True, politicians do lie and obfuscate. But no reasonable person can say that Trump's behavior is in-line with your typical politician. He has brought lying, distorting, and ignoring truths to a level that few would have predicted possible. His behavior is so outlandish and regrettable that he has become a caricature of himself.

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: DanDanDat

So if people aren't as old as you are they can't possibly deduce good and bad?

To a degree. Someone who is older than I am has more life experience than I do. That's just simply self-evident.

I feel a big part of what's wrong with our society today is a growing lack of respect for elders. Other social structures are based on the wisdom of the aged; ours seems obsessed with the relative ignorance of youth. I know you don't like hearing this... few young-uns do... but it's true. You've never been as old as your elders, but every one of them has been as young as you.

And book learning isnt a valid means of education?

Valid? Yes. Independently sufficient? No, not really.

TheRedneck

There's nothing wrong with expressing the opinion that with age comes greater wisdom through experience.

What is wrong is placing once self on a pedestal due only to ones advanced age.

It is entirely possible to live a very long and sheltered life; with relatively few new experiences. Such a person would not be better able to comment on life compared to a younger person who has been through a lot more situations.

I know you don't like hearing this... few oldies do; but age is not a magical power that makes one smarter and better able to tell right from wrong. It sure can help; but it's no guaranty.

I do however agree with your larger point that we as a society do not fully utilize the weth of knowledge that older generations have as a collective.

a reply to: DanDanDat

No one is saying that age alone is a definite indicator of wisdom... but it is one indicator of expected wisdom.

I recall when I was young... I felt the same way. I had all these great ideas how to make the world better, but whenever I told them to the old men, they would all laugh. I thought they were laughing at me, the old fogies. But later, I heard a young guy tell me some of those same ideas, quite similar to the socialistic ideas floated about today, and I laughed... not at him, but at how ironic it was that I had had those same thoughts and had learned as I aged and learned how impractical they really were. Those old men weren't laughing at me... they were laughing at the irony and reminiscing.

Based on your post,I am assuming you are younger than I am, so let me repeat myself: I have been your age; you have not been mine. When you have been, you will be able to see the world the way I do. Until then, you simply cannot.

TheRedneck

a reply to: St Udio

I was 4f in 67 and soon in the streets marching against those elites plans to make the US the police of the world. For little good it did us to protest then. Back then we call them ''the man''.

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: DanDanDat

No one is saying that age alone is a definite indicator of wisdom... but it is one indicator of expected wisdom.

I recall when I was young... I felt the same way. I had all these great ideas how to make the world better, but whenever I told them to the old men, they would all laugh. I thought they were laughing at me, the old fogies. But later, I heard a young guy tell me some of those same ideas, quite similar to the socialistic ideas floated about today, and I laughed... not at him, but at how ironic it was that I had had those same thoughts and had learned as I aged and learned how impractical they really were. Those old men weren't laughing at me... they were laughing at the irony and reminiscing.

Based on your post,I am assuming you are younger than I am, so let me repeat myself: I have been your age; you have not been mine. When you have been, you will be able to see the world the way I do. Until then, you simply cannot.

TheRedneck

I believe I read that you where born during JFKs presidency? If I read that correctly it doesnt make you a lot older than I am. But I certainly understand your point about age giving you a different prospective. I would describe it as aging giving you an understanding of coming to understand that you dont know as much as you think you do. A concept many young people dont have.

But realizing this doesnt make one smarter; just more humble. Its entirely possible for those young brash people to have the right idea and for older people to stifle it because they think they know better.

a reply to: DanDanDat

No...not at all. But affected by Presidential policies, wage cuts and gains, war, fuel rationing lines..and then more growth or backtracking that affected us and our families...shapes those years in ways someone born in our modern age..only reads about, and not experienced...

Loss and suffering, budgets and benefits...hero's home...kids coming home from war in boxes...then a new incoming admin w worse or better life changes for the country..all this experienced in reality...no matter how far you do or don't go back...is what I'm asking.

How many different admins. has each thread respondent experienced?

Thanks!

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: DanDanDat

So if people aren't as old as you are they can't possibly deduce good and bad?

To a degree. Someone who is older than I am has more life experience than I do. That's just simply self-evident.

I feel a big part of what's wrong with our society today is a growing lack of respect for elders. Other social structures are based on the wisdom of the aged; ours seems obsessed with the relative ignorance of youth. I know you don't like hearing this... few young-uns do... but it's true. You've never been as old as your elders, but every one of them has been as young as you.

And book learning isnt a valid means of education?

Valid? Yes. Independently sufficient? No, not really.

TheRedneck

Thanks, Red! You can't roller skate in a buffalo herd..tho some will try!

Thanks much! MS

a reply to: mysterioustranger

Wilson!

That bastard! Gave women the right to vote!

I wish there was a President with a real vision for America. And don't tell me Obama had one. Presidents these days are just clerks working for the people who financed their campaigns. They see the Presidency as a way to get the keys to the Treasury so their cronies can loot it.

originally posted by: conspiracytheoristIAM
a reply to: mysterioustranger


Born in '46 , so Truman to Trump ? I was in high school , when Kennedy was killed......the beginning of my conspiratorial thinking ! I voted fro George Mcgovern vs. Nixon after tours in Viet Nam and then never voted again til , maybe Reagan ? As I've gotten older , with more time on my hands, the rabbit hole has been more compelling.

1st off...thank you for your service. I was a protestor at Chicago, Kent State, Berkely, Ann Arbor...trying to bring you guys home from across the world...

2nd...it was BECAUSE of your service to our country..that allowed us the freedoms to protest in the 1st place...you did a great thing.

Thank you for it. God Bless!*

*PS...I voted for McGovern as well....didn't win...but seemed a good choice compared to the "other guy".

originally posted by: mysterioustranger
2nd...it was BECAUSE of your service to our country..that allowed us the freedoms to protest in the 1st place...you did a great thing.

It would be nice to think that the protests of the 60s stopped the war in Vietnam and gave us more freedom to protest. Unfortunately, that's just not true. Demographics and the economy made it unfeasible to continue the Vietnam war. When people are waiting in line for gas, then the war and the moon program got canceled. One thing Baby Boomers have always been good at is self-aggrandizement.

Considering the vibe of the OP, particularly how the point of "The more you have been affected by living and/or suffering or benefitting through all changes, ideas and faux pas of the different presidencies.. the more in depth you understand the long term policy making, legal and ethical changes each admin. brought to the table... Good and bad," it bears mentioning that Donald Trump soundly won the popular vote among voters age 40 and above, increasing with each successive age jump per exit polling. I think experience and wisdom spoke volumes in that race and those voices are still heard today in the form of who is sitting in the White House.

originally posted by: Blue Shift
I wish there was a President with a real vision for America. And don't tell me Obama had one. Presidents these days are just clerks working for the people who financed their campaigns. They see the Presidency as a way to get the keys to the Treasury so their cronies can loot it.

Washington, Adams, Lincoln, Kennedy...tops I.M.H.O.

a reply to: burdman30ott6

I was going for that. We all will look back and explain this and any other changes the presidencies enabled or denied us to our children.

And they too may not quite understand what Trump or Obama, Nixon or any of them...was going for, why and to what end..good or bad, right or wrong, intuitive or misguided...we wont know. Not until it's passed.

You don't have to approve or like him or any other president (I don't, but I support the office)...but it's the fact that history will prove them all right or wrong.

This was my O.P. direction. How much will have each seen and experienced w consecutive or lack of...Presidential policy?

Thank you for your remarks here...best, MS

originally posted by: Blue Shift

originally posted by: mysterioustranger
2nd...it was BECAUSE of your service to our country..that allowed us the freedoms to protest in the 1st place...you did a great thing.

It would be nice to think that the protests of the 60s stopped the war in Vietnam and gave us more freedom to protest. Unfortunately, that's just not true. Demographics and the economy made it unfeasible to continue the Vietnam war. When people are waiting in line for gas, then the war and the moon program got canceled. One thing Baby Boomers have always been good at is self-aggrandizement.

We didn't have any...or carry any falsities today that we were achieving anything other than exposure. We know our protesting didn't stop anything...we weren't going for that in the end. AWARENESS at the dinner table was pretty good if all we did was stimulate discussion about it all...

I was at Kent State when Nixon was scared and the Ohio National guard opened fire on us with live rounds...KILLING 4 kids with cardboard signs, bullets wizzing past our heads.


And in high school...I was a White Panther...John Sinclair and Pun Plamondon (went to prison for bombing)...John went for possession of 2 joints. Yes, some we're misguided.

By 1975 and after Nam was winding down...we were under no illusions we achieved anything other than awareness.

My thread poses the idea that however many presidencies we go thru...they change us and the country in ways not understood by those who didn't.

Thanx! Peace

originally posted by: mysterioustranger

Dwight Eisenhower (2)
1953–1961
John F. Kennedy
1961–1963
Lyndon Johnson
1963–1969
Richard Nixon
1969–1974
Gerald Ford
1974–1977
Jimmy Carter
1977–1981
Ronald Reagan (2)
1981–1989
George H. W. Bush
1989–1993
William J. Clinton (2)
1993–2001
George W. Bush (2)
2001–2009
Barack Obama (2)
2009–2017
Donald J. Trump

How old were you under Dwight?

originally posted by: DanDanDat

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: DanDanDat

No one is saying that age alone is a definite indicator of wisdom... but it is one indicator of expected wisdom.

I recall when I was young... I felt the same way. I had all these great ideas how to make the world better, but whenever I told them to the old men, they would all laugh. I thought they were laughing at me, the old fogies. But later, I heard a young guy tell me some of those same ideas, quite similar to the socialistic ideas floated about today, and I laughed... not at him, but at how ironic it was that I had had those same thoughts and had learned as I aged and learned how impractical they really were. Those old men weren't laughing at me... they were laughing at the irony and reminiscing.

Based on your post,I am assuming you are younger than I am, so let me repeat myself: I have been your age; you have not been mine. When you have been, you will be able to see the world the way I do. Until then, you simply cannot.

TheRedneck

I believe I read that you where born during JFKs presidency? If I read that correctly it doesnt make you a lot older than I am. But I certainly understand your point about age giving you a different prospective. I would describe it as aging giving you an understanding of coming to understand that you dont know as much as you think you do. A concept many young people dont have.

But realizing this doesnt make one smarter; just more humble. Its entirely possible for those young brash people to have the right idea and for older people to stifle it because they think they know better.

There are enough who's right who's wrong political threads on this board to begin with. The spirit of the post I took from the OP at least was to just understand where other people's perspectives come from. LOL pretty tired of the arguing and the division in this country we need to more accepting of each others beliefs on both sides. Of course the young and brash could be correct on some issues, but what are the chances the are correct on every issue this country faces? Nobody is that omnipotent especially if its decided from a narrow perspective.

Like I said my parents weren't political didn't hear too much about it at the dinner table, they were just concerned about raising 4 kids, keeping a roof over their heads keeping them fed and teaching them right from wrong. Wasn't much time for anything else. As a teenager and even early 20's didn't get caught up in politics, it was the 80's after all. You just knew those bastards from the government took a chunk of your first jobs paycheck and you would rarely if ever comment on a president or much less a politician among friends unless they got shot or did something stupid. Nor were we bombarded dare I say brainwashed by the flood of news and opinions like we are today. Lets face it you take a young inexperienced mind and blast them with all kinds of political ideology at the right time and some of it is going to stick. I dont know if I want Jimmy millennial who just got through playing GTA or Madden 14 hours straight or Suzy Snapchat be the only voice in our political system. Note I said the only voice,they got every right to organize and vote and I salute them for participating early in their lives, but not going to pretend their every perspective, every hope and dreams from our government are going to be the correct option much less close to mine.

a reply to: mysterioustranger


This is my 8th

originally posted by: jtma508

originally posted by: rickymouse
I was only about eight when Kennedy was shot, I remember that day at school. I have heard quite a few political lies in my life. All presidents lied or hid the truth, why should Trump be any different.

I started with Eisenhower. True, politicians do lie and obfuscate. But no reasonable person can say that Trump's behavior is in-line with your typical politician. He has brought lying, distorting, and ignoring truths to a level that few would have predicted possible. His behavior is so outlandish and regrettable that he has become a caricature of himself.

There hasn't been a good honest president in all of the ones I have witnessed since the mid sixties. Trump is being forced to expose his lying more than other presidents. He is being targeted to respond, most of the presidents preceding him would just blow off the journalists and only take questions that were preapproved. No other president had so many press conferences as Trump has.

Anyone challenging the president farther back than ten years or so would have had the IRS targeting on them. That even happened during Obamas time, but it was common before that as were calls from secret service or Federal policing agencies.

Hillary was much more of a liar than Trump and would not have put up with these investigations without axing the heads of the FBI or anyone who challenged her authority. She would not have put up with the crap like Trump is, Obama didn't either but he was not nearly as ruthless as Hillary would have been.

Kennedy (only a month, but it counts.)

Johnson.

Nixon.

Ford.

Carter.

Reagan.

Bush.

Clinton.

Bush.

Obama.

Trump.

Eleven of 'em. Some better than others. Some were in over their heads, in fact, I'll be so bold as to say most of 'em were...Carter comes quickly to mind, along with Obama.

Others did well, though many will not, I'm guessing, will agree with my assessments.

In foreign policy matters, Nixon did well. Not to worry, I've my earplugs in, scream as you like. Clinton, too, did well, with domestic policy.

Ford, I think, would have done well with more time...but America wasn't ready to forgive Nixon just yet, if ever, and since he wasn't there any more, Ford bore the brunt of the anger. We got a good man as President, though he was not a good President, in Carter.