Define Socialism... IN YOUR OWN WORDS.

originally posted by: xBWOMPx

originally posted by: Akragon

originally posted by: xBWOMPx

originally posted by: Akragon

originally posted by: xBWOMPx

originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: xBWOMPx

And this is exactly why people give socialism a bad name...

again, defined by history... not by what i should or could be

when the ideals are given over to dictatorship... it all goes wrong

Theres no reason why a socialized government would control anything in the every day life of the individual in their country...

Perhaps democratic socialism is a better term

Kinda like "The Korean Social Democratic Party", Socialism has always looked good on paper but never has worked in the 170 years its been around... It gave itself a bad name.

Would that not be a dictatorship?

my point is the fact you can add "democratic" in the name right behind socialism but it does not change what socialism is. They either end up under a dictator, communism, poor and broken but wealthy leaders or a little bit of all of it. Tell me a successful socialistic country that is not going down hill and has been around for quite awhile... None, it doesn't work, looks great on paper but it is a fantasy utopia, just like star trek

Hello... Im from Canada...

We are a socialized country for the most part... and have been for many years

Probably the one of the safest countries on the planet... and we do pretty well

except for a few people trying to steal the ice from our igloos of course

Oh hello from Canada, you do know Canada is more capitalist then socialist right? Good, glad we can clear that up. Now can anybody else tell me a socialist country (not kinda socialist) that has been around for quite awhile and not turned to garbage?

yup... We are a very capitalist country as well...

again, Real socialism has NEVER been practiced.... Ever

So you're looking for something that has never existed

originally posted by: Akragon


communism and socialism are not the same thing.... so theres no point relating the two

I'm not trying to relate them except for they both look good on paper until those pesky humans are mixed into it all.

Humans have tried both a number of times and all have failed. You said this below and I agree, I just do not think they can ever be done right.

IF its done right... its most definitely not a bad thing

originally posted by: Akragon

originally posted by: xBWOMPx

originally posted by: Akragon

originally posted by: xBWOMPx

originally posted by: Akragon

originally posted by: xBWOMPx

originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: xBWOMPx

And this is exactly why people give socialism a bad name...

again, defined by history... not by what i should or could be

when the ideals are given over to dictatorship... it all goes wrong

Theres no reason why a socialized government would control anything in the every day life of the individual in their country...

Perhaps democratic socialism is a better term

Kinda like "The Korean Social Democratic Party", Socialism has always looked good on paper but never has worked in the 170 years its been around... It gave itself a bad name.

Would that not be a dictatorship?

my point is the fact you can add "democratic" in the name right behind socialism but it does not change what socialism is. They either end up under a dictator, communism, poor and broken but wealthy leaders or a little bit of all of it. Tell me a successful socialistic country that is not going down hill and has been around for quite awhile... None, it doesn't work, looks great on paper but it is a fantasy utopia, just like star trek

Hello... Im from Canada...

We are a socialized country for the most part... and have been for many years

Probably the one of the safest countries on the planet... and we do pretty well

except for a few people trying to steal the ice from our igloos of course

Oh hello from Canada, you do know Canada is more capitalist then socialist right? Good, glad we can clear that up. Now can anybody else tell me a socialist country (not kinda socialist) that has been around for quite awhile and not turned to garbage?

yup... We are a very capitalist country as well...

again, Real socialism has NEVER been practiced.... Ever

So you're looking for something that has never existed

America has some socialistic attributes, does not make us socialist though. We have food stamps, health care and other assistant living benefits for all the leaches who dont want to work. But again, it does not make us socialist.

a reply to: xBWOMPx

Except it kinda does... neat eh

Just like canada certain aspects of real socialism have been adopted in your country

So again.. IF its done right... it can work, as long as people are not relating it to nazism... which is a very common relation that its given

originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: xBWOMPx

Except it kinda does... neat eh

Just like canada certain aspects of real socialism have been adopted in your country

So again.. IF its done right... it can work, as long as people are not relating it to nazism... which is a very common relation that its given

Still dont like it, all the nazis will live off welfare, leach off the hard working class, beat others up for there opinion, take their guns and their speech. Small businesses get shut down, #ty health care, taxed like fuuuuu**... nope nope aaand NOPE!

a reply to: xBWOMPx

LOL... kinda sounds like the states to me...

Minus the taking of your guns... We all know that ain't happening

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: soberbacchus

Medical care is a product. It is a service.
It is a commodity.

Pay us or die is not a legitimate product or service.

In order for capitalism to effect medical costs, there needs to be choice, like between McDonalds and Burger King.

Medical care as a profit engine is fake capitalism, because demand is created by simply existing. That is why prices are ridiculously inflated.

a reply to: soberbacchus

At the same time, it isn't like medical care is a good like a house or a computer. It is provided by skilled practitioners who spend years above and beyond what most of us do (even those of us who go to college for our degrees) in training and schooling going deep into debt learning how to provide that service to the standards society expects and then have to spend egregious amounts of money on insurance against mistakes because we expect them to perform to such high standards.

In short, being a doctor ain't cheap and it ain't a material thing.

You want the best, you are paying a professional who is worth his or her fees for his or her service.

To decide you have an arbitrary right to simply have this individual provide their skills to you because you have decided that his or her services cost too dearly to you cheapens all of what I described above simply because you prefer not to have to pay someone to use their skills on your behalf.

You know what? You want to the benefit of my labor? You'll pay for it. If you don't like my rates, then you'll either forego my labor and look for someone else willing to provide that service or do without, but of course, this is the problem with socialism ... you want to reduce everyone to servants/slaves of the state who *must* provide for you on demand.

originally posted by: soberbacchus

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: soberbacchus

Medical care is a product. It is a service.
It is a commodity.

Pay us or die is not a legitimate product or service.

Of course it is.

In order for capitalism to effect medical costs, there needs to be choice, like between McDonalds and Burger King.

Then have government stop interfering!

Medical care as a profit engine is fake capitalism, because demand is created by simply existing. That is why prices are ridiculously inflated.

No. You always have a choice.

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: soberbacchus

At the same time, it isn't like medical care is a good like a house or a computer. It is provided by skilled practitioners who spend years above and beyond what most of us do (even those of us who go to college for our degrees) in training and schooling going deep into debt learning how to provide that service to the standards society expects and then have to spend egregious amounts of money on insurance against mistakes because we expect them to perform to such high standards.

And doctors inflate fees to deal with insurance agencies discounting their work so that the insurance agencies can make huge profits.

No one is suggesting doctors shouldn't be paid their worth.

There are inefficiencies in the system. A non-profit single payer in this country could reduce the cost of medical care easily by 40%-50% without doctors taking a pay cut. That is basic math.

Insurance companies suck and they don't deserve to rake in billions every year for intentional sub-standard service to patients and nightmarish billing and coding with doctors.

You want the best, you are paying a professional who is worth his or her fees for his or her service.

Any single payer model includes a private option for people that want the best surgeon in the world etc.

To decide you have an arbitrary right to simply have this individual provide their skills to you because you have decided that his or her services cost too dearly

You seem to be continuing off the reservation.
Single Payer does not mean that doctors don't get paid or get paid very well in accordance with their skills and education?

You know what? You want to the benefit of my labor? You'll pay for it.

Weird.

I don't want your labor?

Doctors still get paid with single payer, just no more insurance companies screwing over both doctors and patients to carve out their Billions in the middle.

And Psst...a solid majority of American Doctors support Single Payer health care.
khn.org...
www.fiercehealthcare.com...
www.seattletimes.com...

There is Socialism like in Venuzuela.
And then there is a socialist democracy or whatever they call it in the nordic countries.

Bernie sanders and most of his supporters want the US to adapt some policies like the successful nordic countries not like actual Socialism. There's a big difference.

Also let's talk about free stuff it's not free it's where they want our tax money to go.

Pretty easy to understand. Nobody want's socialism. They want the Nordic model.

NOt sure why there is even a thread on socialism. LOL

a reply to: DBCowboy

Smoking is a link in the chains that enslave people. Just like credit cards and inflated medical care prices.

And government levied fines.

originally posted by: amazing
There is Socialism like in Venuzuela.
And then there is a socialist democracy or whatever they call it in the nordic countries.

Bernie sanders and most of his supporters want the US to adapt some policies like the successful nordic countries not like actual Socialism. There's a big difference.

Also let's talk about free stuff it's not free it's where they want our tax money to go.

Pretty easy to understand. Nobody want's socialism. They want the Nordic model.

NOt sure why there is even a thread on socialism. LOL

Kinda like Denmark lol. Bernie kept comparing a socialist system he wanted to theres but they were very annoyed that he kept saying that because they are not socialist at all. No, in reality Bernie loved Russia's model most and wanted it like the big bad Russians. He loved it so much he was rooting for Russia during the cold war, spent honeymoons there, vacations. He was as bad as Hillary, he was a dreamer and made a lot of promises he would have never been able to fulfill with destroying the economy. Anyway, thank god he didnt win.

a reply to: soberbacchus

Nope. No more insurance companies ... just the government taking over their role which means the same thing.

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: soberbacchus

Nope. No more insurance companies ... just the government taking over their role which means the same thing.

Non-profit single payer is the fundamental antithesis of the insurance industry.

originally posted by: xBWOMPx

originally posted by: amazing
There is Socialism like in Venuzuela.
And then there is a socialist democracy or whatever they call it in the nordic countries.

Bernie sanders and most of his supporters want the US to adapt some policies like the successful nordic countries not like actual Socialism. There's a big difference.

Also let's talk about free stuff it's not free it's where they want our tax money to go.

Pretty easy to understand. Nobody want's socialism. They want the Nordic model.

NOt sure why there is even a thread on socialism. LOL

Kinda like Denmark lol. Bernie kept comparing a socialist system he wanted to theres but they were very annoyed that he kept saying that because they are not socialist at all. No, in reality Bernie loved Russia's model most and wanted it like the big bad Russians. He loved it so much he was rooting for Russia during the cold war, spent honeymoons there, vacations. He was as bad as Hillary, he was a dreamer and made a lot of promises he would have never been able to fulfill with destroying the economy. Anyway, thank god he didnt win.

I still think his basic modern platform and really anyone that identifies with his politics and most social democrats or green party candidates all want some policies like the nordic countries.

I don't think Bernies a commie. I mean Trump is best friends with a real commie, putin. So...isn't trump more of a commie than Sanders? Serious question.

originally posted by: amazing

originally posted by: xBWOMPx

originally posted by: amazing
There is Socialism like in Venuzuela.
And then there is a socialist democracy or whatever they call it in the nordic countries.

Bernie sanders and most of his supporters want the US to adapt some policies like the successful nordic countries not like actual Socialism. There's a big difference.

Also let's talk about free stuff it's not free it's where they want our tax money to go.

Pretty easy to understand. Nobody want's socialism. They want the Nordic model.

NOt sure why there is even a thread on socialism. LOL

Kinda like Denmark lol. Bernie kept comparing a socialist system he wanted to theres but they were very annoyed that he kept saying that because they are not socialist at all. No, in reality Bernie loved Russia's model most and wanted it like the big bad Russians. He loved it so much he was rooting for Russia during the cold war, spent honeymoons there, vacations. He was as bad as Hillary, he was a dreamer and made a lot of promises he would have never been able to fulfill with destroying the economy. Anyway, thank god he didnt win.

I still think his basic modern platform and really anyone that identifies with his politics and most social democrats or green party candidates all want some policies like the nordic countries.

I don't think Bernies a commie. I mean Trump is best friends with a real commie, putin. So...isn't trump more of a commie than Sanders? Serious question.

Serious answer, trying to have good relations with a country that we have a history of having bad relationships with is actually a good thing and doesn't make him Trumps best bud. We both have the largest nuclear arsenal pointed at eachother. Bernie was rooting for the Russians back during the cold war, Trump wasn't spending his honey moons and every vacation to Russia like Bernie was, Trump is not comparable to Bernies commie A*ss Bernie use to hang USSR flags in his office, he was very unpatriotic, I hope a sink hole finds him along with Hillary and Obama and his husband wife, whatever it is.

originally posted by: xBWOMPx

originally posted by: amazing

originally posted by: xBWOMPx

originally posted by: amazing
There is Socialism like in Venuzuela.
And then there is a socialist democracy or whatever they call it in the nordic countries.

Bernie sanders and most of his supporters want the US to adapt some policies like the successful nordic countries not like actual Socialism. There's a big difference.

Also let's talk about free stuff it's not free it's where they want our tax money to go.

Pretty easy to understand. Nobody want's socialism. They want the Nordic model.

NOt sure why there is even a thread on socialism. LOL

Kinda like Denmark lol. Bernie kept comparing a socialist system he wanted to theres but they were very annoyed that he kept saying that because they are not socialist at all. No, in reality Bernie loved Russia's model most and wanted it like the big bad Russians. He loved it so much he was rooting for Russia during the cold war, spent honeymoons there, vacations. He was as bad as Hillary, he was a dreamer and made a lot of promises he would have never been able to fulfill with destroying the economy. Anyway, thank god he didnt win.

I still think his basic modern platform and really anyone that identifies with his politics and most social democrats or green party candidates all want some policies like the nordic countries.

I don't think Bernies a commie. I mean Trump is best friends with a real commie, putin. So...isn't trump more of a commie than Sanders? Serious question.

Serious answer, trying to have good relations with a country that we have a history of having bad relationships with is actually a good thing and doesn't make him Trumps best bud. We both have the largest nuclear arsenal pointed at eachother. Bernie was rooting for the Russians back during the cold war, Trump wasn't spending his honey moons and every vacation to Russia like Bernie was, Trump is not comparable to Bernies commie A*ss Bernie use to hang USSR flags in his office, he was very unpatriotic, I hope a sink hole finds him along with Hillary and Obama and his husband wife, whatever it is.

Oh. You're one of those people that likes to make fun of politicians family and wives when you disagree with their policies. Got it.

a reply to: intrepid

Now you should do a thread like this for proponents to describe the differences between Socialism / Communism / Anarchism.

originally posted by: IgnoranceIsntBlisss
a reply to: intrepid

Now you should do a thread like this for proponents to describe the differences between Socialism / Communism / Anarchism.

Not a bad idea. Maybe later when I've had more than one coffee.