Some thoughts on North Korea and Kim Jong-Un.

a reply to: Byrd

Some good examples please. Specifically during his regime. Oh and lessening of sanctions isn't a reward to help save you time. It's a lessening of a punishment with the implied threat of more punishment.

a reply to: Byrd

You're right. I missed that one. Still once? That's not exactly stellar, either.

a reply to: Byrd

Before you run off "For shame!"-ing me, realize that the structure of the meeting allowed TWO different versions of the meeting to be told: one from Trump's view and one from Kim's view. The only people in the room were those two and translators.

That possibility exists in every situation. Do you really think that they have forced arbitration via a witness? Ever? North Korea and the USA are sovereign countries... if they want to do something bad enough, only force can stop them.

I think it's a piece of paper that Kim can wave and then do whatever he likes. Plus he got a concession on one item he's been after for a long time - ceasing exercises in the area. We got "I'm committed to it... in the future (whenever that is.)"

Again, no troops withdrawn. Everything is right where it was before the summit.

Kim has already made concessions: he voluntarily stopped his missile tests (to Japan's great relief, since they were loosely aimed in their direction). We made a similar concession. He still has his missiles; we still have our troops. Maybe you really aren't aware of this, but it is customary to give a little to get a little. The only problem there is when someone (*cough* Obama *cough*) gives everything up front and then gets as little as the enemy thinks they can get away with giving up (*cough* Iran *cough*).

This is the first time any US President has ever met face to face with any North Korean leader, certainly the first time Kim and Trump have met face to face. What exactly did you expect in two hours?

So did my dad. And my brother. And I'm not being disrespectful.

I happen to think you were. You accepted the word of a known propaganda machine operated wholly by Kim over that of our Commander in Chief without questioning it. If that is not disrespectful to our military, I don't know what is.

And with Kim's recent behavior, I see no reason to step down the situation.

So you prefer war over letting Trump attempt peace talks.

We've been trying to do this for the past 50 years.

So just give up and accept war?

That is what you are proposing. No talks equals war.

Well, no, they're not in the air that fast. And I do know how long it takes to scramble troops in an emergency (and how things have to go through command chains and everyone has to be rounded up from wherever they are, and fueling has to be done, etc, etc, etc. Hollywood movies give an unrealistic view of how long it takes to coordinate and launch an attack. The destroyers and subs my son served on can't teleport to a strike range that quickly, either.

I'm not far off. In the attack on Pearl Harbor, it was by complete and utter surprise, yet a few planes manged to still get in the air. Not enough, of course.

The difference here is that nothing else has been stepped down. We will stop conducting joint military training exercises near the DMZ as long as Kim stops firing missiles toward our allies. That in itself is a reasonable deal. Our troops are still on alert (they're in Korea, duh), and have the benefit of long range sensors (that weren't available in 1941).

And yes, I'd like to see the troops home. But first I want to see Kim reined in.

By force only, I take it.

As they've done before. If you recall, the groundwork this time was laid back in April. They've been negotiating for peace since 1953:

It would be helpful if we had some sort of set policy for how long we can talk to another nation before launching attacks.

I always assumed it was as long as possible/necessary to prevent war. My bad.

I think that the two different versions of what was said at the talks are both correct. You seem terribly upset that I would think that North Korea is saying and believing something very different than what Trump says and believes.

I am upset that someone as intelligent as yourself would take the word of North Korean media over that of our top commander. No information whatsoever is allowed to be presented on air in North Korea unless scripted by Kim's regime. Any deviation is punishable by death. All you get from their media is what Kim wants them to have.

We have biased media here, too, but nothing like they do. At least we get both biases. We know this from the few defectors that have managed to escape the regime.

You seriously need to get your ire under control (as I do mine, I suppose). I don't care if you hate Trump, but when you start giving aid and comfort to the enemy, you are insulting every single soldier that ever marched under our flag... including my kin. Yes, dammit, that upsets me. Thank God it does. It should you, too.

ETA: This video of a defector is worth the time IMO to try and understand the situation through the eyes of the people of North Korea:


TheRedneck

originally posted by: TheRedneck

You seriously need to get your ire under control (as I do mine, I suppose). I

Once again... I'm not irate or upset. The outcome is pretty much as I expected.

If Trump had the same sort of record for integrity and truth-telling as GW Bush or GWH Bush or even Reagan, I'd believe him.
He does not.

I am not going to believe any elected official simply because they got elected. Holding an office is not a sign that someone is truthful.

a reply to: Byrd

I am not going to believe any elected official simply because they got elected.

I have to ask... this does not include Kim Jong Un, right?

I mean, you seem to believe him without question... that is my issue.

TheRedneck

a reply to: Bloodydagger


Yeh lets give DPRK a break, if we don't these hotties will never been seen in the West

Then on a less militaristic note

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: Byrd

I am not going to believe any elected official simply because they got elected.

I have to ask... this does not include Kim Jong Un, right?

I mean, you seem to believe him without question... that is my issue.

TheRedneck

You have made a number of statements about my views - but in reality, I agree with you about Korea and the military and so forth. You never actually asked what I believe; you told me what I believe.

And you got angrier and angrier about these beliefs that you've told me I have and have lectured me about my poisonous ideas.

Now you have just told me that I believe Kim unquestioningly.

I wonder who you are arguing with.


It's not me.

Adieu.

Deep state,Japan,a Trump tweet,something is going to screw this up 6 ways sideways.

He's a lot more open to change than he's given credit for. I worked for an ex Grenadier Guard Billy Wilson, aka Mr Mouse of Tough Guy fame - we were in talks to build an army assault course and peace garden in the DMZ zone to solve the conflict for years in our War Without Weapons (compete in assault courses, not wars) that has 52 counties signed up to it.

He was up for a boxing match with my boss to solve the conflict a few years back, only just missed out on funding for it from Branson.