The issue with atheism

originally posted by: ClovenSky

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Peeple

Stating your personal opinion isn't definitive proof of existence.

Hold up a sec?
When did this turn into wanting definitive proof of the existence of God??
The issue here was wanting to know WHY people believe in God.

Move the goal posts much? Very scientific!

as a matter of fact, the initial contention was that atheism is presumptuous and conceited. followed by discussion.

is it safe to assume that you clicked the thread because you were interested in sharing why you believe in god? perhaps.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of god is no longer relevant based on your specific interest? probably not.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of any kind would make even a little difference in the debate?

...lets just say its okay to dream.

I'm completely unsure of my beliefs. Ever changing and difficult to comprehend myself, let alone put into words. So sharing, no

I don't think any kind proof would make any difference at all.

I think evidence would and should make all the difference in the world. I can certainly show why evidence should make a difference and i can convince you that evidence can sway your opinion.

I meant specifically proof of God.
I think most would still deny due to the real reason most don't want to believe.

Oh please please tell me the real reason why I don't want to believe .... please ....

Lol, You already know...

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: ClovenSky

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Peeple

Stating your personal opinion isn't definitive proof of existence.

Hold up a sec?
When did this turn into wanting definitive proof of the existence of God??
The issue here was wanting to know WHY people believe in God.

Move the goal posts much? Very scientific!

as a matter of fact, the initial contention was that atheism is presumptuous and conceited. followed by discussion.

is it safe to assume that you clicked the thread because you were interested in sharing why you believe in god? perhaps.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of god is no longer relevant based on your specific interest? probably not.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of any kind would make even a little difference in the debate?

...lets just say its okay to dream.

I'm completely unsure of my beliefs. Ever changing and difficult to comprehend myself, let alone put into words. So sharing, no

I don't think any kind proof would make any difference at all.

I think evidence would and should make all the difference in the world. I can certainly show why evidence should make a difference and i can convince you that evidence can sway your opinion.

I meant specifically proof of God.
I think most would still deny due to the real reason most don't want to believe.

Oh please please tell me the real reason why I don't want to believe .... please ....

Lol, You already know...

I know my reasons: freedom, personal responsibility, personal accountability, self determination, free will, not wanting to build a prison around myself, wanting to fully experience this reality..

I know I know...it is like we are twins...those were your identical justifications for why people don't believe in god....hmmm, what does that say about YOUR reasons for wanting to believe....

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Peeple

Stating your personal opinion isn't definitive proof of existence.

Hold up a sec?
When did this turn into wanting definitive proof of the existence of God??
The issue here was wanting to know WHY people believe in God.

Move the goal posts much? Very scientific!

as a matter of fact, the initial contention was that atheism is presumptuous and conceited. followed by discussion.

is it safe to assume that you clicked the thread because you were interested in sharing why you believe in god? perhaps.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of god is no longer relevant based on your specific interest? probably not.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of any kind would make even a little difference in the debate?

...lets just say its okay to dream.

I'm completely unsure of my beliefs. Ever changing and difficult to comprehend myself, let alone put into words. So sharing, no

I don't think any kind proof would make any difference at all.

I think evidence would and should make all the difference in the world. I can certainly show why evidence should make a difference and i can convince you that evidence can sway your opinion.

I meant specifically proof of God.
I think most would still deny due to the real reason most don't want to believe.

well, You were obviously convinced at some point by some piece of information. The question is, was that piece of information reasonable?

I am assuming that it was not, since you do not seem to want to share it here for discussion.

a reply to: Woodcarver

we don't need approval, which seems to be your problem

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance
a reply to: Woodcarver

we don't need approval, which seems to be your problem

We don't need your approval to think all claims of gods are unverifiable bull# either.


EDIT
I think gypsie curses are bull# as well, but cast a decent enough spell on me and I'll change my mind.
God claims have as much to support them as gypsie curses...basically nothing aside from personal testimony.

a reply to: CornishCeltGuy

not sure what you mean, perhaps you'll be sorry

a reply to: Out6of9Balance

Which bit did you not understand?
Quote me and I'll rephrase it in clearer language, not a problem.

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy

originally posted by: Ruiner1978
People do have experiences that they percieve to be God. No?

As Annee said "Energy Euphoria" or caught up in a crowd. I prayed for years after my brainwashing as a child, zero, nothing, nada from any gods wishing to say hello in some 'experience' so I think it's a load of bull# obviously.
I can't comment on any 'experience' you may or may not have had, that's your gig, but you must imagine why I think it's a load of bollocks?
"Can I have an experience God???!!!" lol I'd be open to new opinions if I had an 'experience' but I haven't and gave up believing after many years.
The Christian god is crap at recruiting people, I'd be all over the world if I was a god, A list star on all TV networks and my name trending the # out of social media.
Nah, load of bull# I reckon, but any new verifiable evidence I'm open to changing my mind.

EDIT
As an aside, when my son was born we decided not to have him baptised because it was not our place to impose a religion on him, even though his mother believes in the Christian trinity. We both agreed that if there is a Christian god and it punishes an innocent child for the crimes of its parents then he/she/it can go # itself for being immoral.
I'd actually love there to be a god so I could call it a murderous barbaric monster to its face.

"Energy Euphoria" might explain their experience for you, but they percieved God so that's what it is to them. It doesn't matter what you call it.
It's a personal perception of what is true to the individual.
That's why people believe what they do. I know Woodcarver isn't gonna be satisfied with that, but tough #, that's just how it is.

I had a feeling you may have been raised with it by your attitude towards it. And that's completely understandable.

Incidentally, my dad told me once that my grandmother was nagging him about getting me baptised when I was a baby. He told her something very similar to what you said.


My experiences were odd, #ing terrifying. In all honesty I don't know what to make of them. But, but I completely understand exactly why someone would believe it was God.

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance
a reply to: Woodcarver

we don't need approval, which seems to be your problem

You also don’t seem to need logic and reason to come to conclusions either.

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance
a reply to: CornishCeltGuy

not sure what you mean, perhaps you'll be sorry

Oh damn!!! The first threat of the thread.

Do me next!! Do me next!!

originally posted by: ClovenSky

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: ClovenSky

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Peeple

Stating your personal opinion isn't definitive proof of existence.

Hold up a sec?
When did this turn into wanting definitive proof of the existence of God??
The issue here was wanting to know WHY people believe in God.

Move the goal posts much? Very scientific!

as a matter of fact, the initial contention was that atheism is presumptuous and conceited. followed by discussion.

is it safe to assume that you clicked the thread because you were interested in sharing why you believe in god? perhaps.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of god is no longer relevant based on your specific interest? probably not.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of any kind would make even a little difference in the debate?

...lets just say its okay to dream.

I'm completely unsure of my beliefs. Ever changing and difficult to comprehend myself, let alone put into words. So sharing, no

I don't think any kind proof would make any difference at all.

I think evidence would and should make all the difference in the world. I can certainly show why evidence should make a difference and i can convince you that evidence can sway your opinion.

I meant specifically proof of God.
I think most would still deny due to the real reason most don't want to believe.

Oh please please tell me the real reason why I don't want to believe .... please ....

Lol, You already know...

I know my reasons: freedom, personal responsibility, personal accountability, self determination, free will, not wanting to build a prison around myself, wanting to fully experience this reality..

I know I know...it is like we are twins...those were your identical justifications for why people don't believe in god....hmmm, what does that say about YOUR reasons for wanting to believe....

What makes you think I want to believe??

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: ClovenSky

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: ClovenSky

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Peeple

Stating your personal opinion isn't definitive proof of existence.

Hold up a sec?
When did this turn into wanting definitive proof of the existence of God??
The issue here was wanting to know WHY people believe in God.

Move the goal posts much? Very scientific!

as a matter of fact, the initial contention was that atheism is presumptuous and conceited. followed by discussion.

is it safe to assume that you clicked the thread because you were interested in sharing why you believe in god? perhaps.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of god is no longer relevant based on your specific interest? probably not.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of any kind would make even a little difference in the debate?

...lets just say its okay to dream.

I'm completely unsure of my beliefs. Ever changing and difficult to comprehend myself, let alone put into words. So sharing, no

I don't think any kind proof would make any difference at all.

I think evidence would and should make all the difference in the world. I can certainly show why evidence should make a difference and i can convince you that evidence can sway your opinion.

I meant specifically proof of God.
I think most would still deny due to the real reason most don't want to believe.

Oh please please tell me the real reason why I don't want to believe .... please ....

Lol, You already know...

I know my reasons: freedom, personal responsibility, personal accountability, self determination, free will, not wanting to build a prison around myself, wanting to fully experience this reality..

I know I know...it is like we are twins...those were your identical justifications for why people don't believe in god....hmmm, what does that say about YOUR reasons for wanting to believe....

What makes you think I want to believe??

You just blew my mind. That is awesome!!!!

So you are saying you don't really want to believe, but through your personal experiences, you are forced to believe in god?

Did god force themselves on you?

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Peeple

Stating your personal opinion isn't definitive proof of existence.

Hold up a sec?
When did this turn into wanting definitive proof of the existence of God??
The issue here was wanting to know WHY people believe in God.

Move the goal posts much? Very scientific!

as a matter of fact, the initial contention was that atheism is presumptuous and conceited. followed by discussion.

is it safe to assume that you clicked the thread because you were interested in sharing why you believe in god? perhaps.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of god is no longer relevant based on your specific interest? probably not.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of any kind would make even a little difference in the debate?

...lets just say its okay to dream.

I'm completely unsure of my beliefs. Ever changing and difficult to comprehend myself, let alone put into words. So sharing, no

I don't think any kind proof would make any difference at all.

I think evidence would and should make all the difference in the world. I can certainly show why evidence should make a difference and i can convince you that evidence can sway your opinion.

I meant specifically proof of God.
I think most would still deny due to the real reason most don't want to believe.

well, You were obviously convinced at some point by some piece of information. The question is, was that piece of information reasonable?

I am assuming that it was not, since you do not seem to want to share it here for discussion.

Could you rephrase please? I'm not entirely sure what you're asking?

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Peeple

Stating your personal opinion isn't definitive proof of existence.

Hold up a sec?
When did this turn into wanting definitive proof of the existence of God??
The issue here was wanting to know WHY people believe in God.

Move the goal posts much? Very scientific!

as a matter of fact, the initial contention was that atheism is presumptuous and conceited. followed by discussion.

is it safe to assume that you clicked the thread because you were interested in sharing why you believe in god? perhaps.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of god is no longer relevant based on your specific interest? probably not.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of any kind would make even a little difference in the debate?

...lets just say its okay to dream.

I'm completely unsure of my beliefs. Ever changing and difficult to comprehend myself, let alone put into words. So sharing, no

I don't think any kind proof would make any difference at all.

I think evidence would and should make all the difference in the world. I can certainly show why evidence should make a difference and i can convince you that evidence can sway your opinion.

I meant specifically proof of God.
I think most would still deny due to the real reason most don't want to believe.

well, You were obviously convinced at some point by some piece of information. The question is, was that piece of information reasonable?

I am assuming that it was not, since you do not seem to want to share it here for discussion.

Could you rephrase please? I'm not entirely sure what you're asking?

Do you believe in gods, supreme beings, spirits, or goblins?

originally posted by: ClovenSky

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: ClovenSky

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: ClovenSky

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Peeple

Stating your personal opinion isn't definitive proof of existence.

Hold up a sec?
When did this turn into wanting definitive proof of the existence of God??
The issue here was wanting to know WHY people believe in God.

Move the goal posts much? Very scientific!

as a matter of fact, the initial contention was that atheism is presumptuous and conceited. followed by discussion.

is it safe to assume that you clicked the thread because you were interested in sharing why you believe in god? perhaps.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of god is no longer relevant based on your specific interest? probably not.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of any kind would make even a little difference in the debate?

...lets just say its okay to dream.

I'm completely unsure of my beliefs. Ever changing and difficult to comprehend myself, let alone put into words. So sharing, no

I don't think any kind proof would make any difference at all.

I think evidence would and should make all the difference in the world. I can certainly show why evidence should make a difference and i can convince you that evidence can sway your opinion.

I meant specifically proof of God.
I think most would still deny due to the real reason most don't want to believe.

Oh please please tell me the real reason why I don't want to believe .... please ....

Lol, You already know...

I know my reasons: freedom, personal responsibility, personal accountability, self determination, free will, not wanting to build a prison around myself, wanting to fully experience this reality..

I know I know...it is like we are twins...those were your identical justifications for why people don't believe in god....hmmm, what does that say about YOUR reasons for wanting to believe....

What makes you think I want to believe??

You just blew my mind. That is awesome!!!!

So you are saying you don't really want to believe, but through your personal experiences, you are forced to believe in god?

Did god force themselves on you?

I think you're confused. Where exactly have I stated my subscribed belief?

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: ClovenSky

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: ClovenSky

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: ClovenSky

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Peeple

Stating your personal opinion isn't definitive proof of existence.

Hold up a sec?
When did this turn into wanting definitive proof of the existence of God??
The issue here was wanting to know WHY people believe in God.

Move the goal posts much? Very scientific!

as a matter of fact, the initial contention was that atheism is presumptuous and conceited. followed by discussion.

is it safe to assume that you clicked the thread because you were interested in sharing why you believe in god? perhaps.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of god is no longer relevant based on your specific interest? probably not.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of any kind would make even a little difference in the debate?

...lets just say its okay to dream.

I'm completely unsure of my beliefs. Ever changing and difficult to comprehend myself, let alone put into words. So sharing, no

I don't think any kind proof would make any difference at all.

I think evidence would and should make all the difference in the world. I can certainly show why evidence should make a difference and i can convince you that evidence can sway your opinion.

I meant specifically proof of God.
I think most would still deny due to the real reason most don't want to believe.

Oh please please tell me the real reason why I don't want to believe .... please ....

Lol, You already know...

I know my reasons: freedom, personal responsibility, personal accountability, self determination, free will, not wanting to build a prison around myself, wanting to fully experience this reality..

I know I know...it is like we are twins...those were your identical justifications for why people don't believe in god....hmmm, what does that say about YOUR reasons for wanting to believe....

What makes you think I want to believe??

You just blew my mind. That is awesome!!!!

So you are saying you don't really want to believe, but through your personal experiences, you are forced to believe in god?

Did god force themselves on you?

I think you're confused. Where exactly have I stated my subscribed belief?

You haven't. Can you blame a person for trying to understand your views, especially when you so carefully hide them?

Why? Maybe I am starting to understand your reasoning, but I am probably wrong. You enjoy the debate itself and the structure is more hospitable without fully exposing your beliefs?

Do you argue for both sides or is there one particular thought pattern that you are trying to get people to understand?

You could just come out and state your beliefs, or would that ruin the fun?

a reply to: Ruiner1978
Fair enough mate, as I said, I can't comment on whatever experiences you perceived, and I wish you well, but I'm sure you understand why I don't hold any faith as you do. Personal experience is all.
As an aside I'm actually drawn to Therevada Buddhism tenets, they sit well in my interpretation of life and require no faith.

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Peeple

Stating your personal opinion isn't definitive proof of existence.

Hold up a sec?
When did this turn into wanting definitive proof of the existence of God??
The issue here was wanting to know WHY people believe in God.

Move the goal posts much? Very scientific!

as a matter of fact, the initial contention was that atheism is presumptuous and conceited. followed by discussion.

is it safe to assume that you clicked the thread because you were interested in sharing why you believe in god? perhaps.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of god is no longer relevant based on your specific interest? probably not.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of any kind would make even a little difference in the debate?

...lets just say its okay to dream.

I'm completely unsure of my beliefs. Ever changing and difficult to comprehend myself, let alone put into words. So sharing, no

I don't think any kind proof would make any difference at all.

I think evidence would and should make all the difference in the world. I can certainly show why evidence should make a difference and i can convince you that evidence can sway your opinion.

I meant specifically proof of God.
I think most would still deny due to the real reason most don't want to believe.

well, You were obviously convinced at some point by some piece of information. The question is, was that piece of information reasonable?

I am assuming that it was not, since you do not seem to want to share it here for discussion.

Could you rephrase please? I'm not entirely sure what you're asking?

Do you believe in gods, supreme beings, spirits, or goblins?

I have a belief in possibility, if that gives you any ammo?

a reply to: Out6of9Balance

Your thread is close to my heart. Don't let
the haters get to you. Their hate holds them
in senselessness and bondage. They hate
the path of righteousness.

originally posted by: ClovenSky

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: ClovenSky

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: ClovenSky

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: ClovenSky

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: Ruiner1978

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Peeple

Stating your personal opinion isn't definitive proof of existence.

Hold up a sec?
When did this turn into wanting definitive proof of the existence of God??
The issue here was wanting to know WHY people believe in God.

Move the goal posts much? Very scientific!

as a matter of fact, the initial contention was that atheism is presumptuous and conceited. followed by discussion.

is it safe to assume that you clicked the thread because you were interested in sharing why you believe in god? perhaps.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of god is no longer relevant based on your specific interest? probably not.

is it safe to assume that definitive proof of any kind would make even a little difference in the debate?

...lets just say its okay to dream.

I'm completely unsure of my beliefs. Ever changing and difficult to comprehend myself, let alone put into words. So sharing, no

I don't think any kind proof would make any difference at all.

I think evidence would and should make all the difference in the world. I can certainly show why evidence should make a difference and i can convince you that evidence can sway your opinion.

I meant specifically proof of God.
I think most would still deny due to the real reason most don't want to believe.

Oh please please tell me the real reason why I don't want to believe .... please ....

Lol, You already know...

I know my reasons: freedom, personal responsibility, personal accountability, self determination, free will, not wanting to build a prison around myself, wanting to fully experience this reality..

I know I know...it is like we are twins...those were your identical justifications for why people don't believe in god....hmmm, what does that say about YOUR reasons for wanting to believe....

What makes you think I want to believe??

You just blew my mind. That is awesome!!!!

So you are saying you don't really want to believe, but through your personal experiences, you are forced to believe in god?

Did god force themselves on you?

I think you're confused. Where exactly have I stated my subscribed belief?

You haven't. Can you blame a person for trying to understand your views, especially when you so carefully hide them?

Why? Maybe I am starting to understand your reasoning, but I am probably wrong. You enjoy the debate itself and the structure is more hospitable without fully exposing your beliefs?

Do you argue for both sides or is there one particular thought pattern that you are trying to get people to understand?

You could just come out and state your beliefs, or would that ruin the fun?

Lol is it ruining your fun that you can't pin down what I'm all about?