Autism.Asbergers.ADHD spectrum

Corporal punishment is the way to go. Forget all the liberal soft handed BS, that is the root cause of most of the problems in this society. I think the best way to straighten these kids out is to hand them over to their peers and allow them to take care of it, with a little supervision by adults to make sure things don't go too far. This type of thing often works in high school and college where hazing is often used to get people to accept certain social norms. While many programs go way overboard, which is truly horrific, these types of programs tend to change the "anti-social" behavior of others to a more acceptable range of behavior.

To be honest you just sound like a bit of a bully like you fear people into been nice around you and lets be honest ive not met a big tough autistic child/person in my life, I had ADHD they gave me ritalin in school which just wasn't for me i couldn't behave in school and sit down and memorize what im been told i still can't, Luckily for me i found boxing and it turned my life around, now im 35 and have now retired from the sport im still super hyper still annoy everyone around me but thats me and no body will threaten me to behave around them like you do...

Wonder why that is ?

a reply to: theruthlessone

Nope, if you read my post properly I speak only of defensive violence when someone allegedly on the spectrum is giving it the aggressive violent one.
It is the same with everyone, pecking order, violent guys only pick on people who they know they can beat.
ADHD people seem to control their anger if they know they'll get a punch in the face...strange that they can actually control it.

a reply to: CornishCeltGuy

Dude, you should really try to educate yourself on this some more - it does come across as proper ignorant. For a member to educate you on this is a big job.

Repect to Trollz for trying but it sounds like your experience is very limited.

originally posted by: stormcell

originally posted by: Subaeruginosa
a reply to: CornishCeltGuy

Asperger's syndrome is just a made up condition... for people that don't like making eye contact with strangers and who refuse to comply with social norms, due to a superiority complex, which convinces them they're 'above' the common folk.

I do love what Hollywood has done with the mythical condition though... Sheldon Cooper on 'The big bang theory' and Abed on 'Community', are totally bad arse...

It was known that only children who had lost their fathers during the war, were more likely to suffer from Aspergers. It's not due to a superiority complex, but simply due to them never having anyone to practice socializing with. They just did their own thing through lack of social contact. Parents never having parties meant they never had any practise learning from children older than themselves or their parents; boys copy their dads, girls copy their mothers.
Nothing physiological or mental but just a lack of social experience.

There is a very real reason why medical students are screened for aspergers and rejected as doctors if they have it, it's not to do with lack of social experience, it's more about lack of feeling and empathy. A lack of social experience doesn't really equal socially retarded.

a reply to: skalla

Which bit? Autistic kids with no dad's around attack their mothers but don't attack males who will fight back, choosing instead to have a tantrum in the corner.
Educate me then, why is that?

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
Genuine questioning topic so don't get all arsey and pissed off by my anecdotal observations.

Every documentary/news piece I see on kids with such diagnosis it is always a single mother parent. No dad on the scene offering dad 'justice'.
I was just watching one now, the 12 year old was effectively beating his mother up and there was nothing she could do.

So how have all these diagnosis become a thing?
I can't comment for the US but I know some members will suggest diet etc because you sell your citizens #ty additive ridden food which the EU doesn't. That said, why the 'explosion' of diagnosis in the UK when our food is so different to yours?

My gut instinct is lack of fear.
Lack of fear of dad, or mam's partner.

I have friends who are highly autistic and all of them at some point have got arsey with me me and I've replied with something like "Do that again and I'll knock you the # out you cheeky #" or similar. It's amazing, functioning autistic people understand fear of having a smack in the face if they attack me. 100% success rate, no need for therapy, just an understanding that if you do X or Y then expect me to react in a way I would to anyone treating me like a prick.
70's/80's/90's Britain kids knew that, and there were much fewer kids with a 'diagnosis' because fear of punishment, or rather reasonable force and defence against violent behaviour, so they behaved.

Call me a prick who doesn't understand the finer points of welfare for people on the spectrum, but it is a fact that every person I've ever met who is claimed to be on the spectrum behaves themself with me because they don't want a violent defensive reaction. Every person I've ever met in fact, look in the eye "don't try your # with me" and they behave.

I'm not calling for corporal punishment, but they understand fear of violence so if they are acting violently I genuinely think the lack of fathers on the scene is a contributing factor.
I told a guy the other day he was milking his autism, and I saw in his eyes he knew he'd been sprung.
All thoughts welcome, including outraged parents of children on the spectrum.

I understand you....and I have empathy for you....you poor wreck of a human being......it is not violence against self from men that garners respect it is the comfort that there is a Black Hat hanging in mom OR dads Closet that can be put on to protect the family from the uncertainty which exists beyond the front door.

Only an idiot has to harm those they love to demonsrate willingness to protect and love.......harm someone else...like some bully who gives the hairy eye-brow to Autistic type kids and intimidates them even more in a world that already scares them heartless...and do it in front of your family so they can see how Black daddys hat can really be when it is justified.This is my technique.I dont believe in hitting nor intimidating women or kids....there are plenty of screwed up men to make examples of.

These kids are VISUAL THINKERS...they are an UPGRADE over your simpleton mind......YOU cannot connect to them because they are HIGHER ON THE CEREBRAL FOOD CHAIN THAN YOU ARE....lol...LMAO....you have things diametriclly opposite to reality....typical thinker I guess.

Most of the methods typical thinkers try to use with advanced minds comes throught like white noise to them...because they DO NOT REQUIRE 75% of the inputs typical people must throw at them to communicate...they are bright assumptive thinkers....YOU are a not so bright typical thinker who will likely live your life and never experience nor understand what a visual thinker is....this is how it is suppossed to be...you are being made obsolete by kids you believe are in some ways deficient...ROFLMAO.

To be Frank....these kids have a hard time tolerating idiots aka typical thinkers and idiots must break everything down into small bites....like 75% TO MANY BITES...it is over-kill......the VERBOSITY.....this is what frustrates them...they think you are stupid and IMHO in many cases the kids are justified.

a reply to: one4all

Interesting thoughts.
So can you explain why 'spectrum' boys attack their mothers but not males who will fight back, choosing instead the tantrum on the floor in the corner?
I suggest they understand self preservation and don't wan't to get hurt by someone who will defend themselves, ie, they can control their behaviour after all.
Obviously please offer another suggestion if you think I'm incorrect in my musings.

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: one4all

Interesting thoughts.
So can you explain why 'spectrum' boys attack their mothers but not males who will fight back, choosing instead the tantrum on the floor in the corner?
I suggest they understand self preservation and don't wan't to get hurt by someone who will defend themselves, ie, they can control their behaviour after all.
Obviously please offer another suggestion if you think I'm incorrect in my musings.

I suggest you go to your loo or bathroom or privy.....stand in front of the mirror...take a good long hard look at yourself...then ask yourself this one simple question...do you think other humans can feel your LOVE emanating from you dripping like honey like they can feel your HATE dripping off of you like a goats offal....you ARE the one PROJECTING EMOTIONS RIGHT.

I myself believe I am a high functioning human who carries these traits....my IQ is over 145 ....and I didn't finish basic schooling......I am autodidactic....spent lots of time in my life berating breaking down and sometimes kicking the snot out of bullies....for other people usually...until I was taught how unfair it was for me to look down on typical thinkers by someone who understood the dynamic in play.

Your answer is simple....women are more empathetic and intuitive than men are BY A LONG SHOT...and these kids are overly intuitive and overly empathetic compared to a simpe basic typical thinker like you and like the MAJORITY of people....you are OVERLY VERBAL...even their moms who they connect to naturally due to these facts are to verbal for them...you see they DO NOT NEED OVER-STIMULATION and it drives them nuts to have to think down so much to have to be spewing out a millions words to explain one simple concept....they are conceptual thinkers not simpletons who have to verbailse every single breath of their reality just to be able to co-operate together.

You have it backwards...you are the simpleton who simply cannot understand how these kids are seeing the world...they are visual thinkers...not typical thinkers....they are the NEXT STEP......their genetics have been targeted by big pharma because they are the NEXT EVOLUTIONARY STEP.

FYI throughout history these types of people have been the right hand giudes to the most powerful in the world...en.wikipedia.org... are many many more examples.

Of course we are discussing a very generic group here because the diagnosis and of each level of this advanced evolution is currently being given a different name. ...hence the spectral part of the equation.There is no CURE-ALL....but empathy and intuition and anticipatory thinking which is what you used in a bassakwards way will bring you closer to the advanced methods of communication these kids prefer to use and naturally fight for.


For christsakes I can use non-verbal communication with my frigging cat...he didnt meow for the first four or five years of his life....he didnt know what the hades a meow was...he was weaned young and never heard meows...ever...today when he wants treats he will come up and gently touch my leg with his paw-pads...I go get him some treats....I walk AWAY from him about 6-7 feet and keep my BACK TO HIM....on non-verbal command I hand wave him over from behind me....he comes up and walks just 2 feet past me and sits down in front of me at attention FACING TO THE FRONT OF US....NOT LOOKING BACK....and STAYNG PUT...while I turn around and walk away to a different spot to deposit his treats on the floor....he STAYS PUT....lol..then I walk back to hm give him a pet call him a good boy and then slowly lead him with my finger tip to his treats....now....he cheats....he has always peeked over his shoulder to watch where I put his treats and then he hides hs peek from me and pretends he doesnt know where the treats really are...he WAITS for me to give hs attaboy and pet then he PRETENDS to follw my fingertip lead to his treats.

You see he is SMARTER THAN ME when it comes to non-verbal communication...he HUMORS ME....he works WITH ME....not for me.Together we do amazing things NO ONE CAN UNDERSTAND.Does this last sentence help.Buddy my cat has been taught to bug hunt and to bring them to daddy....then he gets permission to EAT the little buggers...but first he BRINGS THEM TO ME...to SHOW ME WHAT HE HAS ACCOMPLISHED....he verbalises the word NO when it is his bath-time.....I could go on and on...I taught crows and magpies to talk when I was a kid....this is not complicated....it is about understanding OUR OWN SHORTCOMINGS and ACCEPTING that WE are the DISADVANTAGED ONE...then overcoming our lack of ability by working harder at using our empathy and intuition to CUT BACK ON THE VOLUME OF WASTED WORDS AND TIME......at the end of the day who really needs so many words...these kids...or US.

The true irony here is that you have inadvertanty stumbled upon the crux of the issue...which is to use LESS WORDS...less verbosity....conceptual thinking ..anticipatory thinking...way beyond typical....this ishow you will connect and how you will BEGIN TO LEARN FROM THESE KIDS...you can heal yourself if you learn from them....stop worrying about healing them...lol....we need it not them.

a reply to: CornishCeltGuy

You are asking me to educate you when it appears to me that you have made no effort to do it.

Based off tv doccos and few people you know (excellent sample size) it's like "if i say i'll hit them, i dont get hit back therefore asd = bollocks"

And i'm to spend time smartening you up lol?

a reply to: CornishCeltGuy

Maybe this will help.

I can vouch for the reality of Asperger’s and ADHD because I’ve lived it, have never been so close to losing my mind over the people I love and have dedicated my life to (first in glorious love for such people, then as a necessary need to help them cope through simple life, never mind the chaos that follows them and impacts all in their vicinity). ADHD (attention deficit hyperactivity disorder), ADD (attention deficit disorder) shows itself in lack of emotional as well as self-control and is a driving, almost instinctual, need to stimulate their brains in ever increasing ways of escalation.

ADHD and Asperger’s runs in my husband’s family. My husband is 53 and he finally agreed to try medication about fifteen years ago. It changed his life. He has lost jobs, friendships, has caused our separation(s), ruined his previous marriage, and has impacted his life in severe ways. He has lost business deals, has had life altering physical injuries due to acting impulsively, and was in the “special” group of kids in school. He can’t spell to this day the simplest of words, has been tested at a grade 3 level of education, yet he tests at genius level. He has no social or people skills, says the most hurtful and cold things, has no sensitivity and never shows affection or intimacy. He is incapable of understanding other people’s emotions or feelings when another person is upset, even if a death has occurred. If one didn’t know him as a person and the struggles he has been through they would consider him a bully, jerk, dictator and unloving. Yet, he can be loving, giving, would give the shirt off his back, etc. There is a soul inside that is buried because of the puppet-master - his ADHD brain. It controls him and makes him act in unstable, unpredictable and impactful ways.

This is an excellent article that may help www.additudemag.com...
I would not believe this article if I hadn’t lived it via my husband, my child, my husband’s child, my father-in-law, my mother-in-law, and having several ADHD colleagues.

The ever present symptoms: talks obsessively about same issues all the time, focused on self (only person that matters, so it seems to an outsider), huge ego, says completely inappropriate things, exaggerates, puts down other members of family, puts self first, makes decisions for family and changes their mind at last minute affecting every aspect of family life and responsibilities, high addiction issues whether gambling or pornography or sugar or spending money on obsessive hobbies, putting family in debt, acts like a dictator with family, explodes in rages, puts family at risk and then walks away when unable to cope with end result leaving family to resolve the issues legally/financially/morally, can’t find their own belongings to save their life, puts all the blame for things they have done on other family members (not accepting any responsibility or consequences), love to complain and go into rages and just as quickly they end, make others feel uneasy, socially inept, unable to show normal facial cues, i.e.: don’t smile when seeing you after being absent for days/weeks, others walk on eggshells constantly afraid to awaken the monster within or to be blamed for something that isn’t real or has nothing to do with them, self-destructive behavior.
This is an excellent site to find out more about Asperger’s heartlessaspergers.com...

Everyone can portray these symptoms at times, but with people who have ADHD/Asperger’s these are daily issues, they are blatant – they define that person more than the person defines who they are/want to be.

People with ADHD need stimulation and they will do anything to obtain it, whether it means acting out, or aggravating another person. For some kids, especially if they don’t have life skills, it may mean pushing all their parents’ buttons until they get the physical beating that they are not enjoying but are driven to obtain. Thankfully, when my daughter started becoming physical with me I discovered that an all-enveloping body hug stopped her aggression in its tracks. And, after living with my husband for so long and having his insight into why he behaved the way he did as a kid allowed me to know what was happening. I easily could have turned into a child beater. The child wants nothing more than love and to be understood but they are driven to feed that part of the brain that needs stimulation. This is key, of such importance that I can’t express it enough. Unfortunately, my daughter now will not allow any physical contact, but she has gained enough skills to self-monitor her reactions to her emotions, etc. and there are no aggression issues. This has been an exhausting life skill for both her and I to work on TOGETHER. It is something they will never learn on their own.

I have seen the opposite occur in other families: the self-harming (cutting), the violence, furniture destroyed, ambulances and police called. I believe it is absolutely essential to teach children from the moment they enter this world about self control and again, for the Asperger’s/ADHD child they are extra emotional, they want that stimulation, they have no way of self regulation and it’s almost like a cause and effect: child needs or has caused stimulation, child needs more, child is now so out of control that anything can and will happen. And unfortunately, when a child is too young to share (and often too young to know WHY they are feeling the way they are), they are incapable of expressing their needs or feelings because they don’t have any verbal skills yet, have limited verbal skills, don’t have the words to even express their feelings if they can speak in any way. And, if the parent/caretaker doesn’t know what is going on, or doesn’t have the level of skills necessary, before long both parties will be acting out based on emotions instead of any cognizant awareness.

ADHD can lead to aggression in the child, as well as the parent because they don’t know how to verbalize their frustrations. Their brain requires constant stimulation and they will act out in ways to get that stimulation even if it means negative attention. I am sure those kids who are hitting their parents are doing so because the situation has escalated to that degree and neither party knows how to change or stop it. And, as the child gets bigger the aggression they show to an adult become worse. I am sure there are cases where as you state you gave them a good socking made them realize the consequences and if it worked then I actually am grateful.

CONTINUED --

a reply to: CornishCeltGuy

I am not advocating violence or child beating (as some would accuse you of, or accuse me of because I simply just said those words).
www.understood.org...

Hope this helps. Let me know if I can help in any other ways. Such people are absolutely brilliant, they operate in ways most of us will never achieve (I often feel like a drugged snail next to them) and it’s often frustrating trying to communicate with such as their communication abilities are weaker, less developed BUT they still have the same wants, feelings and intelligence as anyone else. They are not stupid or less than anyone else; their brains just work in a different way. And, what is normal??? I think that’s the big question. We must, as a society, stop thinking of everyone as having to belong in the same “box” in terms of what is normal.

originally posted by: InvisibleLady
a reply to: CornishCeltGuy

I am not advocating violence or child beating (as some would accuse you of, or accuse me of because I simply just said those words).
www.understood.org...

Hope this helps. Let me know if I can help in any other ways. Such people are absolutely brilliant, they operate in ways most of us will never achieve (I often feel like a drugged snail next to them) and it’s often frustrating trying to communicate with such as their communication abilities are weaker, less developed BUT they still have the same wants, feelings and intelligence as anyone else. They are not stupid or less than anyone else; their brains just work in a different way. And, what is normal??? I think that’s the big question. We must, as a society, stop thinking of everyone as having to belong in the same “box” in terms of what is normal.

Hope this helps.....LMAO.....nice hatchet job there Doc Holiday.....lol....spare us the passive aggressive propoganda......

Their communication abiities are not weaker....lol...they are STONGER and more ADVANCED and more NATURAL....it is nature overcoming genetic manipulations and it is happening more and more and more....get used to it....this is directed straight at you InvisibleLady.......no one can hide that this is happening via these kids....medicate them and try to ostracise them and try to minimise the importance of their devolution...good luck with that......because there was a WAVE of kids like this in the past...but...LMAO.....there are now newer waves of kids who have refined the devolutionary steps and they are not being tagged and pigeonholed...intuition and empathy are growing stronger and stronger in all of these kids...and one day the need for spoken and written words which is how we are controlled as a species will be negligible.......the fewer the words the clearer the message and shorter the transit times....eventually the human state will revert back to telepathy....on its own Mother Nature will always find a way to overcome interference.

You are locked into a lifetime game of emotional poker....lol....1/2 your life and time is spent bluffing.....You smile when you shouldnt smile...you frown when you shouldnt frown....you talk 10x more than you need to mostly when you do NOT need to verbalise...your social training has led to to be absolutely deceptive in your emanations of body language and emoting......you take comfort in volume of words gestures because within volume things can be hidden and you dont really want people to know who you are or what you are thinking.....I could go on makng observations about you and what you call normal from the subjects perspective...why bother...point made.....your hidden poker hands are showing to these subjects you try to pigenhole....lol...they read you clear as a bell and you cannot read them back....you have no echo ....lol...nothing empathetic or intuitive bounces off of you back to anyone else .... everything is just absorbed into a seeming black-hole because YOU are the one-way street that NEEDS verbal diarreah just to communicate simple things. ......you are ANALOG.....the kids you just hatchet-jobbed are digital.....lol....but as an analog type you simply cannot comprehend this and you just keep spewing out more and more useless data in a massive pile of printout paper on the proverbial floor.

a reply to: one4all

Again interesting points but you avoided answering my question why 'spectrum' boys attack people who won't defend themselves, such as their mothers.
You can be as angry with me as you like but it is a genuine question. People argue that they are unable to control their behaviour yet if they fear a punch in the face back they control it and do a tantrum in the corner instead.

a reply to: skalla

Do whatever you like fella, I'm having a conversation and asking a relevant question.
No 'spectrum' boy would attack me again after defending myself with a punch to the face. They do however attack weak targets such as their mothers. My argument is that they are actually able to control their violence if they fear the reaction of someone who will defend themself.
It seems you are arguing that this observation is not correct. Now if you think so please explain why you do or leave the conversation.
Sniping from the sidelines that I need to educate myself is lame, this is a discussion forum, so if you think I'm wrong explain why.

So, how are spectrum boys able to control their violent behaviour when dealing with males who will defend themself, but not their mother?
I say an awareness of self preservation is the answer, but please feel free to dispute this instead of telling me to educate myself. Lame as #.

a reply to: InvisibleLady

Thanks for the really interesting reply
The human mind is certainly fascinating, and I'm grateful for your understanding that I am not a hater of people with these conditions, just musing about the violence they sometimes instigate but only with people who they know won't hit them back in defence.
The control of behaviour when faced with someone who will defend themselves indicates to me that they are able to make choices regarding the use of violence or not.

My mates 15 year old son (major autistic) punched me years ago when I tried to stop him doing something dangerous, I punched him back in the face and he was never violent towards me again. He did however continue being violent towards his mother when they were alone though.
This is the question I'm asking, just a pity so many responders in this thread are outraged and butt hurt. It's pathetic.

originally posted by: one4all
Hope this helps.....LMAO.....nice hatchet job there Doc Holiday.....lol....spare us the passive aggressive propoganda......

Their communication abiities are not weaker....lol...they are STONGER and more ADVANCED and more NATURAL....it is nature overcoming genetic manipulations and it is happening more and more and more....get used to it....this is directed straight at you InvisibleLady.......no one can hide that this is happening via these kids....medicate them and try to ostracise them and try to minimise the importance of their devolution...good luck with that......because there was a WAVE of kids like this in the past...but...LMAO.....there are now newer waves of kids who have refined the devolutionary steps and they are not being tagged and pigeonholed...intuition and empathy are growing stronger and stronger in all of these kids...and one day the need for spoken and written words which is how we are controlled as a species will be negligible.......the fewer the words the clearer the message and shorter the transit times....eventually the human state will revert back to telepathy....on its own Mother Nature will always find a way to overcome interference.

You are locked into a lifetime game of emotional poker....lol....1/2 your life and time is spent bluffing.....You smile when you shouldnt smile...you frown when you shouldnt frown....you talk 10x more than you need to mostly when you do NOT need to verbalise...your social training has led to to be absolutely deceptive in your emanations of body language and emoting......you take comfort in volume of words gestures because within volume things can be hidden and you dont really want people to know who you are or what you are thinking.....I could go on makng observations about you and what you call normal from the subjects perspective...why bother...point made.....your hidden poker hands are showing to these subjects you try to pigenhole....lol...they read you clear as a bell and you cannot read them back....you have no echo ....lol...nothing empathetic or intuitive bounces off of you back to anyone else .... everything is just absorbed into a seeming black-hole because YOU are the one-way street that NEEDS verbal diarreah just to communicate simple things. ......you are ANALOG.....the kids you just hatchet-jobbed are digital.....lol....but as an analog type you simply cannot comprehend this and you just keep spewing out more and more useless data in a massive pile of printout paper on the proverbial floor.

So you are advocating it the other way, that people on the spectrum are 'superior' to people who are not.
If they are able to hold down a job without support workers and the rest of it I might agree, but right now I don't agree with your rantings.

a reply to: one4all

Ha, ha - I LOVE IT.

Classic narcissistic response. Thank you for a demonstration of exactly what YOU share with the rest of the world.

I love my husband and my daughter, and I admire their abilities and insights.

But yeah, when a cousin died, she was like a sister to me, my husband said he was sorry to hear the news. When I was still in tears the next day he said, "She's dead, now it's time to get on with your life." THIS is what I am trying to explain to others who are genuinely curious, or for those who deny it exists, what Asperger's is.

They have as wonderful qualities as others but it's either buried down deep, has never developed because they ignore their emotions/can't deal with them, but they are as human as anyone else. They have fantastic qualities. We all have our good sides and bad sides, some are stronger in some areas than others, but the fact is that the science is there that it is a brain condition.

You could try to educate people and explain your experiences, but no you have to go and attack every person you can on this post. That's a shame because you're probably a really nice person, and I'm sure so is everyone else taking part. Are you willing to share with us all here how many jobs & friendships you have lost, or perhaps how much your life revolves around chaos? Or... maybe you are perfect?

a reply to: CornishCeltGuy

I hear what you are saying and have been thinking about what you have shared. My thoughts are that along with standing your ground, not allowing nonsense/aggression to brew, but not giving up on these people, and by sharing your love and being the male figure of trust, support, etc that you are able to communicate with such people and from there bonds are created, they try harder, friendships are formed and wonderful relationships are created.

It is always a pleasure discussing opinions and thoughts with you.

a reply to: InvisibleLady

Ah thanks, I genuinely care for anyone with behavioural conditions but violence towards me, never, nobody gets a hall pass if I'm attacked.
The lad in my earlier story is now a 20 something young adult who often shouts me if he needs help with stuff/life, and I look at him like a nephew or something. He's grown out of his violent outbursts as well, and over the years I've seen him develop well. Still massively autistic but able to function because he's learned what is acceptable behaviour in society and what is not. He doesn't 'get it' but he's learned the rules.

I was saddened when I banged him back after he punched me, but it fixed the relationship with us because it stopped him doing it again and I could concentrate on our relationship instead helping him learn how to get through the thing called society.

...I am grateful for your rational stance discussing things, a breath of fresh air from reactionary outraged posters who just seem to me to be looking to be outraged and offended.