Dyson Shell

Ok so basically a Dyson Shell is like.



About 40 light years from our solar system there is a Sol-like star that is so young, nothing but asteroid-size objects orbiting it.

So hypothetically speaking it is possible for us one day to turn this particular solar system material into an object/sphere that extends for the sake of argument about 150 AU around this particular star. Such an effort would not by any stretch of the imagination be simple.

But the benefit of such an endeavor would translate to the ability of our civilization to reproduce quantitatively in perspective.

Such a project would involve many potential ethical issues but nonetheless, it seems an apparent advantage in relation to survival.

Thoughts?

a reply to: Kashai

pretty sure if we had the ability to travel 40 light years away, we'd be well on our way to surviving with or without earth.

Astroengineering is engineering at astronomical scale, i.e. at planetary, stellar, stellar system, galactic or even larger scale. It is a form of megascale engineering. An example is the hypothetical Dyson sphere.

en.wikipedia.org...

a reply to: Kashai
There was an episode of Star Trek TNG (the best Star Trek hands down) where Picard and crew encountered a Dyson Sphere. It was a neat episode. I always thought it was just something from fiction, I did not think it was a real theory.

a reply to: worldstarcountry

a reply to: Kashai

Sol contains nearly all of the mass in our solar system so I'm guessing you'd need a lot more materials.

But then again the whole idea of a Dyson shell is way far off from where we are, maybe if machines did it for us... Lots to consider really.

Right now we've got a huge problem with energy. We've got loads of ways to produce it, some of these hold promise for the future but we're seriously lacking in energy storage.

We live with a scenario of "juice on demand" this is why important infrastructure tend to use backup generators and not batteries.

A Dyson sphere would only be viable to a civilization that has already mastered fusion and are already using it in power production on a scale that deems it viable.

Energy storage though, I imagine that will always be key. We work with the idea producing energy on site or nearby, power lines ain't cheap and they are not exactly 100% energy efficient, hence why major power plants are near large populations and industry. It's something worth considering.

How would such a civilization power themselves?

If it's localised energy production, like petrol in a car that powers an engine then a Dyson sphere is pointless.

Super duper batteries I'm guessing. Or some way of transferring energy and converting it efficiently... I'd hate to see power lines riddled through space.

a reply to: RAY1990


Essentially all the energy that is produced by a Sol-like star, would be converted to usable energy.

The Earth is about 92 AU from Sol so given an object encompassed such an area and literally surrounded that space and so surrounding Sol?

It would be able to absorb all the light emitted from Sol at such a distance.

That is essentially a Dyson Shell.

a reply to: RAY1990

a reply to: Kashai

I know what one is, I was just musing on the prospects of such a thing.

Sol contains 99.85% of the matter in our solar system, you couldn't encompass the sun with what's available.

A Dyson Sphere wouldn't be converting just light either, a star pumps out all sorts of convertible energy.

The Earth is about 92 AU from Sol so given an object encompassed such an area and literally surrounded that space and so surrounding Sol? 

Why that big? I'd assume the concept of a "goldilocks zone" would be long lost on a civilization with such ambitions.

But then so would be conventional energy production and probably material production too. As I mentioned, such constructions are so far off into theory that anything we can comprehend would probably be way off mark anyway.

I mean think about it. A space-faring species would probably have cracked energy production such as fusion (what stars do) already either that or a superior way of storing energy.

Or just consider the reason Earth or any nation upon it doesn't have just 1 energy source. It isn't feasible and we'd need a revolution in energy transfer for such projects to be feasible... Unless energy creation is so abundant that waste literally didn't matter.

See I'm going in circles now. Lol

I guess my point is Dyson spheres are useless to a civilization that can ill afford to build them, ones that can are probably capable of things we cannot comprehend yet.

I see the prospect as a conundrum, why lasso a star when you can have a portable one?

Then again such astronomical energy needs are way beyond our scope of reasoning. I'm basically saying what's the point?

originally posted by: Kashai
a reply to: RAY1990


The Earth is about 92 AU from Sol so given an object encompassed such an area and literally surrounded that space and so surrounding Sol?

Actually the Earth is just one Astronomical Unit (AU) from the Sun. The distance from Earth to the sun is called an astronomical unit, or AU, which is used to measure distances throughout the solar system. The AU has been defined as 149,597,870,700 meters (92,955,807 miles). Astronomers use the AU for measuring distances throughout the solar system.

a reply to: Kashai Okay I had a look and this is the same star I was thinking of. This star is otherwise known as Tabby’s Star. There have been several threads about this star. This is my second favorite star! (the firs being Sol of course)

This star is very cool and very interesting. I look around every once in a while for some updated information on this star but I haven’t heard anything new on it yet. Fingers crossed! I really want this to be a Dyson Swarm/Sphere, I think everyone probably does.

a reply to: Kashai

Robots capable of reproducing themselves along with doing the work could build it.

never heard it called a dyson shell before

a reply to: Kashai

Try to explain to me how you can create an enclosing ball of material of some sort around a star.
Where would that material be found, within reason, to bring back to that star?

Fred Dyson's sphere theory was as ill-conceived as was his Orion Project that would use hydrogen bombs to push a gigantic space ship from the surface of the earth with little regard to the effects of a bomb exploding every half second in the atmosphere.

originally posted by: worldstarcountry
a reply to: Kashai
... I always thought it was just something from fiction, I did not think it was a real theory.

Professor Freeman Dyson (who hypothesized about these structures, and after whom they are named) is still around, albeit he's almost 94 years old.

How would you radiate the heat? I would imagine that the inside of the sphere would become uninhabitable due to the inside of the sphere absorbing the heat from the star and then re-radiating it back into the enclosed space.

Perhaps a partial sphere could be "practical" but a total sphere would be problematic, in my opinion.

originally posted by: Aliensun
a reply to: Kashai

Try to explain to me how you can create an enclosing ball of material of some sort around a star.
Where would that material be found, within reason, to bring back to that star?

Fred Dyson's sphere theory was as ill-conceived as was his Orion Project that would use hydrogen bombs to push a gigantic space ship from the surface of the earth with little regard to the effects of a bomb exploding every half second in the atmosphere.

von Neumann proposed that we could use the various asteroid belts as the source for metal ores. Self-reproducing robot craft would be sent out to mine and harvest the asteroid belts. Their first priority is to replicate themselves and make more mining craft. Then after a suitable number have been generated, they alternate between replicating themselves and making the building blocks for the Equatorial Dyson ring or "Ringworld". Then they could move onto making rings that cross the poles.

a reply to: Kashai

My thoughts would be that if we ever devise a means of getting there and/or conquer the energy requirements involved in doing so then harnessing a Star for its power will be rather an easy task if rather redundant.

Now the matter and other resources of the star and system, well that's another story, and will indeed be required if we are planning on building anything on a cosmic scale.

a reply to: BomSquad

Depends on how you would utilize the energy inside.

Might be converting said heat into microwaves or other as of yet undiscovered states of energy, then beaming it to other star systems or areas of the universe where required. They could even utilize said microwaves beams or streams of energy for transportation purposes, you would be bound by light speed all the same.

Also, any kind of solid sphere would simply be impractical down to the tidal and gravitational forces exerted no matter the material used to construct really.

Possibly a ringworld could be built, whether or not its as big as in the book, I don't know, but more practical than a sphere.