"Family Values" Republicans who don't practice what they preach

originally posted by: Oldtimer2
a reply to: peter vlar

So you put down a couple of instances,there are millions of Republicans,sounds like your grasping at straws at best,opinionated liberal

Thanks for the laugh! An opinionated liberal? Considering my stance in the second amendment alone, most liberals would disagree with that statement. Maybe read the citations before resorting to infantile ad hominem attacks because I'm not calling out all republicans or conservatives, I'm calling out a couple of recent individuals who ran on some BS platform of family values when they apparently have none.

If I were just an opinionated liberal, why would I refer to Weiner as a pedophile when many try to defend or at best, side step the issue? People see 'Republicans' in the title and lose their minds and go straight to DEFCON Snowflake.

a reply to: Allaroundyou

He's not behind bars yet, but is set to be sentenced November 30th and is looking at anywhere from 10 years to life behind bars.

a reply to: TrueBrit

Oh absolutely, the concept of "family values" is fairly subjective in interpretation and is little more than window dressing for homophobia. These two clowns however, were quite specific about their rabidly anti gay platforms. Factor in the bills they sponsored or cosponsored and their voting record, particularly in regards to bills that would have grossly negligent consequences on gay and transgendered people in their respective states and they are massive hypocrites.

Shortly for example was a huge proponent of a bill that passed one part of the Oklahoma legislature that would allow business owners to discriminate against gay people and refuse them service.

Maybe I'm still naive at my age because I just can't fathom the level of hypocrisy and moral degeneracy that it takes to publicly attempt to criminalize something that privately you are all for and practice with utmost fervor. The fact that in Oklahoma, Shortey was actively taking advantage of minors is beyond the pale. Thankfully he will go away for a long time.

Hopefully one day, society can move beyond these anachronistic post WW2 Donna Reed tropes. Unfortunately I don't see it happening any time soon here in the US where parts of the country can't divest their politics of religion and the two are so intertwined that their political ideations are motivated largely by their religious inclinations and they become synonymous. Particularly so in evangelical Protestant parts of the country who still think it's 1950.

a reply to: ketsuko

I look at a lot of things. Having lived in the south I fnd it confusing, deeply religious yet sexual assault and rape are some of the worst. I see states that refuse to raise taxes and ask for government handouts to pay for the budget.

Red states in south need to start paying there way and also invite industry in. Making things like bathroom laws is the opposite of that.

A lot of these states hold their religious values then require the US to pay for their budgets after demanding religious freedom which often is what stifles their economic growth to begin with.

Northern red states and south western have a bit better situation but the south creates an anchor.

Gotta love those family values....

a reply to: luthier

I wouldn't call it as simple as that.

The south never fully recovered after the Civil War. It has just recently started to boom again. Bathroom laws are not the cause of anything as they are just recent in the grand scheme of things (within the past 5 years max).

There has been a gradual shifting of economy from states like Cali to states like Texas and Florida, and at the same time, there are many residents in the states like Alabama and Mississippi and Louisiana who are poor and often minority. You can see a solid core of blue counties in those states that reflect that.

The South certainly has a more conservative culture, but it is also the place where industry and business was relocating because it was also more business friendly than many other states in terms of tax and regulatory structure.

A business may pay lip service to PC, but it also has to stay afloat financially.

a reply to: peter vlar I hope he gets it and if and when he does I will throw my award in the trash. I will make my own and have my mom hand it to me.

a reply to: Allaroundyou

I'm sorry that something you obviously earned through your own merit is tainted by such filth. He will get his and I'm sure he will make some fella a fine companion while incarcerated.

originally posted by: EternalShadow
A couple bad apples do not a party make.

Same with cops.

Your two examples are not indicative of the entire Republican party, sorry. Nor the whack jobs on the left, i.e., Waters, Pelosi, fill in the blank...

I don't think the point was that the entire party (left or right) is bad...just that the level of hypocrisy is quite astounding... AKA: those that talk the talk but don't walk the walk.

You a reply to: kelbtalfenek

That was precisely the point I was trying to make.

a reply to: peter vlar

I don't think you'll find many actual Conservatives defending either of these sickos. I certainly know I won't waste any of my time trying to defend the indefensible.

a reply to: peter vlar

I agree with you.

I think it might be time that people understood that the separation of church and state is all very well, but its important to also separate the church from the individual states legislature as well.

a reply to: ketsuko

I mentioned the south west.

However the deep south is not really blooming.

Florida has residency not really industry.

The bathroom/religious law effected billions of dollars in industry.

Whether you like it or not the majority of corporations dont want to deal with the cultures that could bring up law suits on a regular basis. So they invest far less in states and counties that are deeply religious and push that into public policy.

The growth in Texas for instance is in liberal cities. Austin is very liberal, Houston is liberal. San Antonio is liberal, Dallas is pretty neutral...Texas is far more libertarian than then the deep south as is most of the south west.

Alabama, Georgia, Tennessee, Kentucky, south Carolina, Mississippi, Lousiana, have plenty of poor whites. In general have far less education and some of the countries worst health and poverty.
It's funny how people say oh racism was 50 years ago with Jim crow stop complaining, yet say the south never recovered from the civil war over 100 years ago.

Yeah no kidding the people are stuck in the past.

I have lived in 8 states as a libertarian. The deep south version of religious behaviour was in my opinion the worst and most hypocritical. The kids at the University my wife teaches at were by far the worst and most sexual provacative. They get very wasted at the football games and are very deep into Greek life. I prefer the mid west and even the remote new England states like NH over the deep south and it's hypocrisy and self harm of its policies. Like not raising taxes to get elected then requiring constant federal funding.

"Republicans" are politicians who are exerting the will of their voters. Or rather, trying to portray those values while supporting them legislatively.

This has nothing to do with the actual people. The actual people represent a wide spectrum of family values beliefs.

What you are railing against are actors that are too ugly for TV, and that choose instead to act in politics. Im unsure why anyone would be surprised that any politician represents a grand hypocrisy...they are nothing more than actors.

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: peter vlar

I don't think you'll find many actual Conservatives defending either of these sickos. I certainly know I won't waste any of my time trying to defend the indefensible.

I would hope not, I can't see anything. But their behavior worthy of defense. I would hope that particularly Shortey in Oklahoma gets more than the 10 year minimum sentence. I'm not sure what's worse, his vile degree of hypocrisy, taking advantage of a minor, the abuse of public trust aced in him or hw the fallout will affect his family. Especially his 4 children. I don't care what party someone claims as their own, if you take advantage of and/or abuse minors, I have zero sympathy for what comes next. Same with Weiner. Solicit underage girls? Let him hang for it too. Figuratively not literally... And all of these alleged sexual assault and abuse scandals raging through Hollywood and Congress... If they're guilty, let 'em hang for that too, regRdless of party affiliation.

I don't support Franken keeping his seat in the Senate anymore than I think Moore should stay in the Alabamaa special election. They're both pigs if guilty. I'm a bit taken aback though by all of the support Moore still has because his potential constituents would rather have a serial abuser in office than a Democrat and those currently in D.C. Feel ok ignoring his behavior because they need him to get their tax bill passed. I think it's reprehensible that people will put up with such disgusting behavior in order to preserve partisanship. I find it all incredibly hypocritical and nauseating.

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

I guess I'm naive that way in that I expect people to honor the courage of their convictions. If they run on an anti gay platform, sponsor bills that are anti gay and anti transgender and vote for similar bills I would hope that they aren't soliciting minors for gay sex or buggering their friends in their office where staff and constituents can walk in on them.

originally posted by: peter vlar
a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

I guess I'm naive that way in that I expect people to honor the courage of their convictions. If they run on an anti gay platform, sponsor bills that are anti gay and anti transgender and vote for similar bills I would hope that they aren't soliciting minors for gay sex or buggering their friends in their office where staff and constituents can walk in on them.

Do you really expect that level of granularity in platforms in a system where only 2 ideals can be represented?

These people switch parties frequently, which tells me that "politician" is a job title, with "party" being the employer.

Even worse, We The People have demanded so much prying into the personal lives of our politicians that anyone with any sense of shame at all would never run for office. It takes a special kind of twisted to even want to be put through that.

Seriously...what else do you really expect?

a reply to: peter vlar

I despise Franken, mostly because of how snide his opinions tend to be.

That said...he was a comedian. Not a good one, but a comedian nonetheless. I've known weirdo's that were not ill intentioned doing stuff like Franken because they were trying to be funny (and not succeeding).

Franken is in a different category, and at a cursory glance im not so sure I buy that he's a derange sicko in the context of this discussion.

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

That's why. I said IF he's guilty. I was never a fan of his comedy and thought his SNL sketches were some of the worst in the shows history. But you're right, compared to Weiner or solicitation of minors and getting caught in bed with one at the local Super 8 or getting it on on huge desk of your office where you represent your constituents... It's not really a close comparison.

originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan

originally posted by: peter vlar
a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

I guess I'm naive that way in that I expect people to honor the courage of their convictions. If they run on an anti gay platform, sponsor bills that are anti gay and anti transgender and vote for similar bills I would hope that they aren't soliciting minors for gay sex or buggering their friends in their office where staff and constituents can walk in on them.

Do you really expect that level of granularity in platforms in a system where only 2 ideals can be represented?

These people switch parties frequently, which tells me that "politician" is a job title, with "party" being the employer.

Even worse, We The People have demanded so much prying into the personal lives of our politicians that anyone with any sense of shame at all would never run for office. It takes a special kind of twisted to even want to be put through that.

Seriously...what else do you really expect?

I guess. I shouldn't expect more but I certainly hope for better. Like. I said, I'm just a naive idealist and would like to see better from our politicians when they claim some faux moral high ground and vote to criminalize behavior they are actively engaging in.