Trump NFL Anthem Free Speech Protest and Willful Ignorance

originally posted by: notsure1

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: notsure1

Kapernik originally started his protest by sitting he realized that it upset a lot of people so he stated that from now on he would kneel out of respect but would continue not singing until the anthem represented everyone equally.

So?? He is still protesting our flag/anthem/country.. There is alot of ways to protest Kali you dont have to disrespect our flag anthem.

Its very dear to our hearts.

How, exactly, is he disrespecting it? Did he whip the bird? Burn a flag? Unleash George Carlin's "7 Dirty Words" to the tune of the anthem? I hate to break it to you, but if you've ever bought any disposable tableware, napkins, or attire with the flag on it, etc, YOU are actually more disrespectful to the flag than Kapernick is. The list of rules making clear how to respectfully display the flag say as much.

And when did we pop into the Bizarro Universe where kneeling silently in respectful protest is disrespectful?

a reply to: Kali74

A lot of people don't find it disrespectful though. What good is a flag or a song that is supposed to represent the ideals of a nation, ideals such as equality and liberty when that nation is not ensuring those ideals for everyone?

I'm not asking you to agree with the method, no one is... but I do think it's important to support their right to protest in the manner that they are and not support violating the 1st.

originally posted by: fiverx313

originally posted by: notsure1
Its very dear to our hearts.

it's dear to you because you believe that promise of the land of the free, but they protest it because they believe it's not free for everyone. that's what the point of the protest is, for you to realize that what you're holding dear is not true for everyone.

The one thing you should hold dear is that flag. What it represents is why you even have a right to protest at all. That is what you dont seem to get.

originally posted by: Nyiah

originally posted by: notsure1

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: notsure1

Kapernik originally started his protest by sitting he realized that it upset a lot of people so he stated that from now on he would kneel out of respect but would continue not singing until the anthem represented everyone equally.

So?? He is still protesting our flag/anthem/country.. There is alot of ways to protest Kali you dont have to disrespect our flag anthem.

Its very dear to our hearts.

How, exactly, is he disrespecting it? Did he whip the bird? Burn a flag? Unleash George Carlin's "7 Dirty Words" to the tune of the anthem? I hate to break it to you, but if you've ever bought any disposable tableware, napkins, or attire with the flag on it, etc, YOU are actually more disrespectful to the flag than Kapernick is. The list of rules making clear how to respectfully display the flag say as much.

And when did we pop into the Bizarro Universe where kneeling silently in respectful protest is disrespectful?

Well I believe he is disrespecting our flag deliberately for his protest. He could choose to do it at anytime other than the anthem right??

So how is it not disrespectful?

If I ever went to another countrys sporting event and they played their national anthem and I didnt stand up for it that would be disrespectful would it not?

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: Kali74

A lot of people don't find it disrespectful though. What good is a flag or a song that is supposed to represent the ideals of a nation, ideals such as equality and liberty when that nation is not ensuring those ideals for everyone?

I'm not asking you to agree with the method, no one is... but I do think it's important to support their right to protest in the manner that they are and not support violating the 1st.

Its as bad a p*ssing on a flag or in a veterans face, I personally do not find myself being patriotic but when someone bashes the armed forces or the flag / queen I will raise my voice in protest against the people who mock the fallen. The issue I see is that in a country where you can make a name for yourself even from the lowest levels of poverty, people tend to choose pack mentality and choose not to better themselves then blame EVERYONE ELSE. But as we all know from the feels politics, only black people can be poor and treated badly. No other race or people of a religion could have been treated as bad in their past and thus are now allowed to speak. If they do, they are shrugged off (Asian decent etc) or called a racist (white decent). We all bleed the same colour, we all have the ability for greatness but alas most of us are willing to sit back and play the victim whilst blaming everyone else for their own downfall.

originally posted by: notsure1
The one thing you should hold dear is that flag. What it represents is why you even have a right to protest at all. That is what you dont seem to get.

the flag is a symbol. i can acknowledge that the country is not living up to its promises to all its citizens and still love my country.

that is what YOU don't seem to get.

originally posted by: notsure1

originally posted by: fiverx313

originally posted by: notsure1
Its very dear to our hearts.

it's dear to you because you believe that promise of the land of the free, but they protest it because they believe it's not free for everyone. that's what the point of the protest is, for you to realize that what you're holding dear is not true for everyone.

The one thing you should hold dear is that flag. What it represents is why you even have a right to protest at all. That is what you dont seem to get.

Maybe that is also what you dont understand.

The flag is just a piece of fabric.
The constitution is a just a piece of paper.

You are over glorifying inanimate objects.

I didnt join the Army to fight for a flag. I joined to Army, quite frankly for my personal reason.. "to liberate the opressed"... I joined the Army to defend our FREEDOM and contribute to our society.

None of that has anything to do with a flag or an anthem.

What DOES threaten what I fought for, are domestic entities impacting my fellow citizens rights and freedoms. That makes me angrier than what anyone does during an anthem, or towards our flag.

The country isnt a flag... it isnt land... it isnt money.. it isnt the military.. the country is the citizens it is made up of.

To be a patriot is to defend our country.. our people.. FROM ALL THREATS.. foreign.. AND DOMESTIC

a reply to: thekaboose

What about the vets that support the protests? Please don't start with the strawman arguments that only black people can be victims. No one is saying that. You agreed that the basis for for the protest was valid just a few posts ago. You just don't agree with their method.

a reply to: Kali74

They have every right to disagree that being said they need to own there eyes and not knee jerk the reaction. They need to research the individuals before calling them xyz. You would be more than surprised I imagine to see how many of these football players grew up in poverty and crime ridden areas and have seen this injustice first hand.

Yes they may be multi millionaires now but for most anyways they didn't grow up that way. Many do give back to there local community as well as the community that there team plays in front of.

Marcus Peters of the Kansas city chiefs is a great example of letting his actions speak for him. He donated both time and money to both his home area and to the chief's community. He doesn't do it for publicity often times coming in unannounced and speaking with inner city youths or helping to get school supplies for financially challenged students. You won't read much about these acts on ESPN or fox sports but if you look you will see the teens and the families of teens along with school staffs reaching out to thank him for what he does.

So yes these players are working to make a difference by silently taking a knee at the game but also in there off time.

To the people making this out to be about Trump, well no it's not, please stop feeding his ego. This started last season while Obama was still in office and it didn't have anything to do with him either.

This about educating and eradicating the disparity in the judicial system for minority citizens. Of you don't think it's real please go look up the statistics I will wait........


Ok good for you if you looked it up, if you chose to do so, what you will see is much harsher sentizing for people of color vs "whites" based on similar crimes. If you were to dig draper you would find that people of color are also more likely to be stopped by police, I watched an interesting videonjust yesterday that showed this all to well. (Sorry don't have a link to it)

But to sum it up a black man living in a well off area in Michigan was surrounded by about 10 officers because hit "fit" a description of a suspect who had been flashing females in the area. The man was 40 year's old 5' 6 ish if I remember correctly and after the fact was found to more than innocent when it came to light that the suspects was approx. 5' 11 mid to early 20s and get this WHITE.

to be fair to the officers in the video, while two were hyper aggressive there was one who stayed very calm and kept the situation from escalating to levels that would have been tragic for all. The man in question is a current firefighter and ex cop from detroit. I urge you to find the video and watch it, it is worth the time.

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: thekaboose

What about the vets that support the protests? Please don't start with the strawman arguments that only black people can be victims. No one is saying that. You agreed that the basis for for the protest was valid just a few posts ago. You just don't agree with their method.

No I do not, I do not see that insulting the fallen of your country is a valid form of protest. Its like when p*ssing on a war memorial because a "bad man" is in charge. But it must be ok, the sheep will follow

a reply to: Lucidparadox

to you it is just a piece of fabric. To me it is alot more. Just curious how old you are?

a reply to: crimsongod21

We're on the same side lol. I know a good lot of pro sports players give back in huge ways.

f I ever went to another countrys sporting event and they played their national anthem and I didnt stand up for it that would be disrespectful would it not?

Still a valid question

a reply to: TerryMcGuire you come off as a whiny liberal kid,the ones that live in mom's basement always come up with answers that make little to no sense,it's so cool to be a rebel,and add to your gaming cred

originally posted by: notsure1
f I ever went to another countrys sporting event and they played their national anthem and I didnt stand up for it that would be disrespectful would it not?

Still a valid question

Shakey question, I would say 99% of the time I would say not honouring another countries anthem / customs is bad... but 1936 Olympics

originally posted by: thekaboose

originally posted by: notsure1
f I ever went to another countrys sporting event and they played their national anthem and I didnt stand up for it that would be disrespectful would it not?

Still a valid question

Shakey question, I would say 99% of the time I would say not honouring another countries anthem / customs is bad... but 1936 Olympics

And the 1936 protest was for the sole purpose of DISRESPECTING Germany and Hitler.

originally posted by: notsure1
a reply to: Lucidparadox

to you it is just a piece of fabric. To me it is alot more. Just curious how old you are?

I am almost 29

If I worked at Burger King, and I wanted to protest what a racist Country I lived in there, should I be fired?

If one idiot named Kaepernick wants to show how dumd he is and protest against the one and only country where he can throw a pigskin around (even as a second string no talent quarterback) and get paid millions then fine, by all means, he should go ahead and "exercise his first amendment rights."

But don't do it at work. People don't care about your politics. The world does'nt care about your feelings. All people want to see is injuries, touchdowns and sacks and these players get paid exhorbitant sums of money to do so. I know I don't care to hear any of these guys talk, most of them are dumb as a second coat of paint.

originally posted by: Lucidparadox

originally posted by: notsure1
a reply to: Lucidparadox

to you it is just a piece of fabric. To me it is alot more. Just curious how old you are?

I am almost 29

Did you have to pledge allegiance in school? Im not sure when that stopped. Im 46 BTW.

originally posted by: Lucidparadox

originally posted by: notsure1

originally posted by: fiverx313

originally posted by: notsure1
Its very dear to our hearts.

it's dear to you because you believe that promise of the land of the free, but they protest it because they believe it's not free for everyone. that's what the point of the protest is, for you to realize that what you're holding dear is not true for everyone.

The one thing you should hold dear is that flag. What it represents is why you even have a right to protest at all. That is what you dont seem to get.

Maybe that is also what you dont understand.

The flag is just a piece of fabric.
The constitution is a just a piece of paper.

You are over glorifying inanimate objects.

I didnt join the Army to fight for a flag. I joined to Army, quite frankly for my personal reason.. "to liberate the opressed"... I joined the Army to defend our FREEDOM and contribute to our society.

None of that has anything to do with a flag or an anthem.

What DOES threaten what I fought for, are domestic entities impacting my fellow citizens rights and freedoms. That makes me angrier than what anyone does during an anthem, or towards our flag.

The country isnt a flag... it isnt land... it isnt money.. it isnt the military.. the country is the citizens it is made up of.

To be a patriot is to defend our country.. our people.. FROM ALL THREATS.. foreign.. AND DOMESTIC

It always amazes me that when members of the military tell people what they actually fought for and believe in, the naysayers still ignore it, continue on with their diatribe, and keep deciding what serving means in blanket terms. You didn't feed somebody's desperate narrative, bad solider!

But seriously, good on you for speaking up, it's nice to see. It's becoming more apparent that you folks (active & veterans) get a major case of the heebie jeebies when the civilians go all drooling sycophant on ya.