Long-lasting flow battery could run for more than a decade with minimum upkeep

Major problem: Solved. Cheaply and safely. World changing.

Long-lasting flow battery could run for more than a decade with minimum upkeep

Researchers from the Harvard John A. Paulson School of Engineering and Applied Sciences (SEAS) have developed a new flow battery that stores energy in organic molecules dissolved in neutral pH water. This new chemistry allows for a non-toxic, non-corrosive battery with an exceptionally long lifetime and offers the potential to significantly decrease the costs of production.

The research, published in ACS Energy Letters, was led by Michael Aziz, the Gene and Tracy Sykes Professor of Materials and Energy Technologies and Roy Gordon, the Thomas Dudley Cabot Professor of Chemistry and Professor of Materials Science.

Flow batteries store energy in liquid solutions in external tanks — the bigger the tanks, the more energy they store. Flow batteries are a promising storage solution for renewable, intermittent energy like wind and solar but today’s flow batteries often suffer degraded energy storage capacity after many charge-discharge cycles, requiring periodic maintenance of the electrolyte to restore the capacity.

By modifying the structures of molecules used in the positive and negative electrolyte solutions, and making them water soluble, the Harvard team was able to engineer a battery that loses only one percent of its capacity per 1000 cycles.

a reply to: soficrow

If it does what it says on the tin than this can only be good news regarding some of the energy storage problems we have.

a reply to: soficrow

These aren't your run of the mill AA batteries they speak of, it's a massive scale energy plant sized battery.

Kickass for sure, but not a revolutionary tech for batteries to be honest.

Now it's time for industrial scale. Imagine having a wind/solar farm and being able to store the energy in olympic sized swimming pools for the off days of low output, not to mention being able to store it in huge vats underground.

Now the question becomes how much energy is stored per cubic meter of water, wattage that is. If I can store enough power to run my house for week or a month in a tank the size of a large storage vessel, it'll tank a couple.

originally posted by: Vector99
a reply to: soficrow

These aren't your run of the mill AA batteries they speak of, it's a massive scale energy plant sized battery.

Kickass for sure, but not a revolutionary tech for batteries to be honest.

Hmm. The energy storage problem has been a major hurdle for green energy. So yeah, not just kickass but also revolutionary tech.

Is the new electrolyte solution toxic in any way? If so, then containment and spill prevention/cleanup is a big issue which is itself a high cost of scale.

a reply to: soficrow

There isn't an energy storage problem for energy producers. It's transferring the energy over distance that is the issue.

We can't all have giant swimming pools full of electric-friendly liquid in our backyard.

originally posted by: soficrow
Major problem: Solved. Cheaply and safely. World changing.

Practice will be about costs, capacity, and efficiency. Is it cheaper to pump water uphill during times of excess production and let it flow down when power is needed? Will the solution of organic electrolyte be susceptible to attack by microorganisms? [one of the big problems with biofuels] What volume will be needed in a typical application and what vessels will be required to contain it? What will the electrodes be made of?

This is just a gee whiz announcement for some press.

originally posted by: Krakatoa
Is the new electrolyte solution toxic in any way? If so, then containment and spill prevention/cleanup is a big issue which is itself a high cost of scale.

From the OP link:

...This new chemistry allows for a non-toxic, non-corrosive battery with an exceptionally long lifetime and offers the potential to significantly decrease the costs of production.

a reply to: soficrow

Everything flow battery is covered over here: Has The Great Flow Battery Battle Started?

And me b1tching about the original Harvard announcement timeline further on the same thread.

Here is me actually explaining the Harvard announcement your post is years late to.

Here is my post on the Harvard announcement in their own newspaper.

And there is the original announcement in 2014 of this same announcement here on ATS.

There is nothing really new here on ATS! If you do a little searching you will find a thread on it.

a reply to: TEOTWAWKIAIFF

I think the more posts, the better!

I'm not sure the general public understands how big of a bottleneck energy storage really is to this whole topic.

Everything from cost to size to efficiency are all a bit problematic. I can't wait until someone can design, say, a solar panel or wind system where storage is not only an afterthought, but the smallest expense of the whole system.

The current battery banks are such a pain on nearly every level. Even with an ultra-efficient, revolutionary generator design that could be run constantly, being able to store the excess will only ever make the system better. Should be pretty cool to see where we are in a decade or two.

a reply to: Serdgiam

I thoroughly agree!

So, softcrow, I'll star and flag but with the caveat that this has been around ATS for years. And I'm sure somebody will post some nuclear fusion breakthrough thread on stuff that has already been posted... and again for years (Wendelstein 7-X, most likely). People do searches!! And toss a little love to some ancient OPs and previous threads (and hey, I'm guilty of that too! ).

@Serdgiam, the floor needs to be addressed (i.e., $100/kWhr) as that seems to be the magic number where flow batteries become truly cheap enough to gain true inroads. This RFB seems to toss that number out!

@all ATS, keep an eye on China and Massachusetts. See my thread for reasons why. But it seems flow batteries will soon swamp Li-ion for long term storage.

PS - BTW, my whole "tin foil hat" self has been saying since joining the mosh pit of ATS, that energy storage and electricity distribution (i.e., room temperature superconductors) will need to be in place before the grand daddy of all conspiracy theories (i.e., we already have it! And it powers the triangles flying about our skies), nuclear fusion.

This will be great for wind and solar.
It would be nice if this could be brought into a more efficient electric grid
if we ever get off our butt and improve the grid.

a reply to: SolAquarius

That is just it! The utility providers will say "solar" but then realize that they can load balance and save money.

There are installations going on around the country (US) with China and Scotland doing wind-solar installations. The regular grid will benefit by having sudden loss of a station being buffered by RFBs.

a reply to: TEOTWAWKIAIFF

...So, softcrow, I'll star and flag but with the caveat that this has been around ATS for years.

I do not need stars and flags, do not care about them either. Just want to see more at the top of the board than hate. Also do not have time to search. Stretching my 'commitment' as it is. But go ahead and kill the interesting threads if you think it's all about who gets "credit" instead of about raising awareness, knowledge, consciousness.

dupe

a reply to: TEOTWAWKIAIFF

...So, softcrow, I'll star and flag but with the caveat that this has been around ATS for years.

I do not need stars and flags, do not care about them either. Just want to see more at the top of the board than hate. Also do not have time to search. Stretching my 'commitment' as it is. But go ahead and kill the interesting threads if you think it's all about who gets "credit" instead of about raising awareness, knowledge, consciousness.

a reply to: soficrow

So if I post something about DNA that trashes your kick @ss thread you wouldn't get po'd just a little?? Seen you respond just like mine... kettle etc...

Already said "get the word out"... so why do you think I'm sinking your thread? Because that's not the case. This is cool tech and people need to know. Just said that this is ATS and has already been posted by several people. Not just me...

a reply to: TEOTWAWKIAIFF

So if I post something about DNA that trashes your kick @ss thread you wouldn't get po'd just a little??

Nope.

Go at it.