Habib reunited with family

Originally posted by D
Habib Released

ANd Maximus, you think he's done some "pretty bad studd". What would you know? He's accused of training in martial arts with some other Arabs and the US military got a "confession" out of him. You probably don't even know half the story.

Ill say this much, I would beleave our US Military, because I served in it for 6 years. Most of us are Brave, Honest men trying to help others and protect our countrys way of life. Can you look in the mirror and say the same? You actually take the word of a suspected terrorist over the US Military??

Please tell me I mis-quoted you and Im mistaken.

Maximu§

Originally posted by GI_WOLVES
Sorry, but I do think that terrorist do not apply the Geneva Convention and not recognized as an army. So they are not coverd by CG. In order for the CG to be in act, if Afghanistan and the USA were at war with each other. Since they are not, both are fighting terrorist who are not protected under this.
[edit on 29-1-2005 by GI_WOLVES]

[edit on 29-1-2005 by GI_WOLVES]

Guess what? The US hasn't formally declared war since WWII! There was an 'armed conflict' in Afghanistan, as long as the US military was used there, and it was not carried out as a law enforcement matter it was a military matter, it does fall under the geneva conventions like it or not. When the invasion of Afghanistan happened, the Taliban weren't fighting terrorists to my knowledge, they were harbouring them.

I love how the US mentality is able to throw away such a brilliant document when it doesn't suit them yet cry bloody murder if someone would dare put a US serviceman on trial for war crimes.


thanks,
drfunk

Originally posted by drfunk
I believe Guantanamo Bay is a direct violation of the Geneva Convention, so the US military or the Bush Administration deserves no respect in this instance. If you don't follow the rules don't expect your enemy to either.

If you love Islam so much, why don't you change your avatar to an Islam built fighter bomber?

Ah, nice name by the way. You talk of following the rules. Did the terrorists follow any specific rules I'm unaware of when they crashed two planes into the trade center? And the one on the Pentagon and the fourth that our heroic citizens managed to have crash without damaging anything other than themselves.....

Are you blaming the sh#$ being done to our people on what's going on in Guantanamo? The be-headings, the car bombings, the suicide bombings, the other bombings and murders, etc......are you telling me you think we are to blame? Because if so, you don't belong in this country.

Originally posted by groingrinder
If you love Islam so much, why don't you change your avatar to an Islam built fighter bomber?

Ahh here we go, the 'with us or against us' mentality. My question is to you, why do you hate islam so much? I don't hate America, America is good (rollercoasters, women and movies) but I don't like the American Government, the right wing nuts running it or their exploitation of American soldiers in illegitimate wars. I am already predicting that you will say I should keep quiet because we owe America and that voids my right to disagree

A religious built fighter bomber!! I love it! The ayatollah's can all fly around in one.

thanks,
drfunk

Originally posted by Zabilgy
Ah, nice name by the way. You talk of following the rules. Did the terrorists follow any specific rules I'm unaware of when they crashed two planes into the trade center? And the one on the Pentagon and the fourth that our heroic citizens managed to have crash without damaging anything other than themselves.....

Are you blaming the sh#$ being done to our people on what's going on in Guantanamo? The be-headings, the car bombings, the suicide bombings, the other bombings and murders, etc......are you telling me you think we are to blame? Because if so, you don't belong in this country.

here we go. Another argument of the American zealot. I ask you, why did the terrorists want to attack America?

Terrorists don't follow any conventions, simple as that. But by not following these conventions yourselves (which the detainees in Guantanamo legally apply to), you are acting as low as the terrorists yourselves and also throw any morality or honour that away and in future conflicts why would someone want follow the geneva conventions if America doesn't?

The fact is that the US military illegally detained people in Guantanamo and they had little evidence for many of them except speculation and accusations of ties to terrorist groups. That's why a lot of them are being released, because they got nothing hard on them.

I don't think he was attacking america by the way, and if he was doesn't he have as much right as you do to live in the US? don't you agree with the first amendment?

thanks,
drfunk

Originally posted by drfunk

A religious built fighter bomber!!

I love it! The ayatollah's can all fly around in one.

This brings a new meaning to the term "carpet bombing"

Originally posted by drfunk

Originally posted by groingrinder
If you love Islam so much, why don't you change your avatar to an Islam built fighter bomber?

I am already predicting that you will say I should keep quiet because we owe America and that voids my right to disagree

thanks,
drfunk

You owe us nothing Drfunk. Just like you owe nothing to the Iraqi people.

[edit on 29-1-2005 by GI_WOLVES]

Originally posted by LA_Maximus

Originally posted by D
Habib Released

ANd Maximus, you think he's done some "pretty bad stuff". What would you know? He's accused of training in martial arts with some other Arabs and the US military got a "confession" out of him. You probably don't even know half the story.

Ill say this much, I would beleave our US Military, because I served in it for 6 years. Most of us are Brave, Honest men trying to help others and protect our countrys way of life. Can you look in the mirror and say the same? You actually take the word of a suspected terrorist over the US Military??

Please tell me I mis-quoted you and Im mistaken.

Maximu§

Oh great, I hope you're not one of those who look down on others ecause they haven't served in the military yet. And I'm just saying you can't believe everything every institution tells you, no matter how close you are to it. Do you believe everything your government tells you? Cause if you do, you should be careful. And don't pull that 'you haven't served in the military' crap on me. "Can you say the same?" because maybe I haven't completed my studies to the level that I am able to serve in a position of preference in the Australian Defence Force. You have no idea how arrogant you sound. And I am not slagging the US military. Though they may have been the ones who drew a "confession out of him, I still blame the Australian Government for doing nothing to secure his release or negotiate something with the US government. I'm sure you would not want to see an American citizen being detained illegally for 3 years in another country. Well, thats how many Australians feel.
I hope you're not only going to argue the bravery and honesty of the military just because you know that I will not argue that or dispute that. And I really do not see how the bravery and honesty of the men of the US military comes into play in such an issue.

This is a more of a matter of justice more than anything and I wish you would look into the background of Mr. Habib's case before you say anything. Most people know the US Military arrested a lot of people in Afghanistan who had nothing to do with terrorism and were subsequently released. And Mr.Habib was one of them. But it is the length of time that took for him to be released is what annoys me. I hope for you own sake, that you do not believe everything the US military tells you. I have nothing but respect for those who have served in the military, but you cannot always believe everything people and institutions tell you.

[edit on 29/1/05 by D]

Originally posted by GI_WOLVES

Originally posted by cargo
The Age

LA Maximus. That's fine that you choose to believe your military. But they hold him for 3 years and then release him without charge or proof that he did any of the things they accuse him of. If he is as guilty as you'd like to believe, then as a free man he is a risk to you and you country. Yet you still seem to hold your military in such high regard. They released him. That would make your military stupid, no? Or maybe he just isn't guilty?

[edit on 28-1-2005 by cargo]

You seam to make a habit of saying America is wrong every chance you can get. You are our enemy simple as that.

I have friends in America who were actually born there and others who were born in my country and live in the US for work reasons. My American friends live in Texas, Arizona, Cali, New York, Michigan, Oregon, Missouri and Florida. I believe to be called your enemy would be akin to nothing... as according to you, anyone who you don't agree with is your enemy. Hell, your own countrymen are your enemy right? You know, those who don't agree with you? Your country is so divided with hate that I actually find it disturbing.

By the way, I live in Australia. One of the only allies you have left. How many people do you know in Australia? You even hate your allies.

Originally posted by cargo


I have friends in America who were actually born there and others who were born in my country and live in the US for work reasons. My American friends live in Texas, Arizona, Cali, New York, Michigan, Oregon, Missouri and Florida. I believe to be called your enemy would be akin to nothing... as according to you, anyone who you don't agree with is your enemy. Hell, your own countrymen are your enemy right? You know, those who don't agree with you? Your country is so divided with hate that I actually find it disturbing.

By the way, I live in Australia. One of the only allies you have left. How many people do you know in Australia? You even hate your allies.

My comment was only to you and I know you do not speak for all in Australia. Please in the future do read my post carefully. It did not say Australia, ok. I said you. hint. I would like to restate "You are our enemy". I am sorry for the wording as such. You are my enemy. I have family who live down under. You do bash America every chance you get. Why would I listen to what you had to say? Look how you present your words of how wrong the USA and conduct performance. I would not consider you personally a allie to these United States. I have to put up with the people who live here and work here for what they say. I do not with you. Good day to you sir.


[edit on 30-1-2005 by GI_WOLVES]

Why would I have a problem with you having family in Australia? Do you realise how childish that sounds?

You explicitly stated that I bash America every chance that I get. Well you made that statement, and I will call you out on it:

I want you to show me exactly where I bash America. I want my words in quotation boxes and a link to the thread they are contained in. Failure to submit these will be taken as an admission of defeat. Get searching.

By the way GI_Wolves, I am as Australian as it gets. Generations of forefathers in this land and grandfathers who fought in WW2. I seriously think you are mistaking me for someone else here regarding this bash America every chance I get bullsh*t, and have put your mouth in drive while your brain is in neutral. But you made the comment, so I call you on it. It is true though that I am an enemy, of fools.

Edit: Note, GI_Wolves made the comment in his post: "I have family who live Down Under. Do you have a problem with that, mate?" and edited it out. For anyone reading the consecutive posts and not understanding my first sentence in this post.

[edit on 30-1-2005 by cargo]

Originally posted by cargo
Why would I have a problem with you having family in Australia? Do you realise how childish that sounds?

You explicitly stated that I bash America every chance that I get. Well you made that statement, and I will call you out on it:

I want you to show me exactly where I bash America. I want my words in quotation boxes and a link to the thread they are contained in. Failure to submit these will be taken as an admission of defeat. Get searching.

Edit: Note, GI_Wolves made the comment in his post: "I have family who live Down Under. Do you have a problem with that, mate?" and edited it out. For anyone reading the consecutive posts and not understanding my first sentence in this post.

[edit on 30-1-2005 by cargo]

Example: on this thread even. Listing all would have the mods telling me I can not list all information. So this is a perfect example:

posted on 28-1-2005 at 04:53 AM Post Number: 1126255 (post id: 1148148)
The Age
LA Maximus. That's fine that you choose to believe your military. But they hold him for 3 years and then release him without charge or proof that he did any of the things they accuse him of. If he is as guilty as you'd like to believe, then as a free man he is a risk to you and you country. Yet you still seem to hold your military in such high regard. They released him. That would make your military stupid, no? Or maybe he just isn't guilty?
[edit on 28-1-2005 by cargo]

There are others, Cargo, defeat I am not. I know and that is enough for me. It is the way you present it that is a shame due to others will not listen. Childish of having family downunder and have a problem with it. This statement is for concern of my family from you who may want to hurt them. You never know who you are talking to, you know. I have my right to ask this, specially when family is dear to my heart. It is the way to type your comments, Cargo, that I find myself wondering since you say allie to me. I do think that trust can be established due to your character only on the typed words. You may be a good person, just as I am a good person. But does it not make a person feel to speak out upon these screen more so than speaking with people in person. I am not a perfect person, nor think other wise. I have family overseas and I will not have my family or the service men and women come home thinking the world accuses them of wrong doing. You can have your say, but what does your words say that you did not mean, or did you? I have read your comments on others threads. May be you and I better express ourselves to understand. May be we won't.

[edit on 30-1-2005 by GI_WOLVES]

Ok, firstly: In that quote you gave, I gave 2 options. Either the US military was stupid for letting him go because he is a huge threat, or they just didnt have enough evidence to convict him. Whatever happened to innocent until proven guilty? I don't think the US military is stupid at all, so therefore we must assume he is not guilty. Not a very good example of my so called "America bashing", man. But I can tell you that if you look harder, you will not be anymore fruitful. Keep looking for these "others" though.

As for the other rubbish you posted about me harming your family, I had a great laugh over that. But only after I got over being utterly offended by it. I never asked where they are or who they are. I couldn't care less. For all I know you could be BS'ing *shrug*. It doesnt matter either way, forget about it.

As for the way I present my comments. I speak and write perfect english (typos excluded). There shouldn't be any problem. Americans accuse the rest of the world of wrong doing every day, and the rest of the world does the same to America. You need to get over it. I'd like to think that I am the first person to blast my governments handling of policies and the like. That's a patriot. I too will speak out against the US gov if I think it deserves it. That's life. I'd expect you to do the same thing to your gov, and my gov if you cared to. You are welcome to, I don't mind. And hey, if you have family here then you should probably begin by blasting John Howard, the man George Bush refers to as the "Man of Steel" in regards to disarming them. eh?

I'm tired. And there is nothing left to say in this thread. I'm going to bed.

Cargo, What I read, sorry I still take it as is. Good night and see ya around.

HABIB UPDATE

Australian 60 Minutes interviewed Mamdouh Habib last week. Here is link to the transcript:

sixtyminutes.ninemsn.com.au...



Habib had made a number of trips to Afghanistan and during the 60 minutes interview he refused to divulge the reasons behind these trips to Afghanistan or who was paying the airfares etc.

ASIO (Australian Security & Intelligence Organisation) had been tapping Habib's phone and was under surveillence for more than 2 years prior to his last trip to Afghanistan. Habib was a known associate of extreme elements of the Islamic community in Australia. America alterted our authorities to his activities prior to 9/11.

Habib had links to two terrorists - Ibrahim El-Gabrowny and cleric sheik Omar Abdul Rahman - convicted of conspiring to carry out a campaign of terrorist attacks in New York and were both linked to World Trade Centre bombing in 1993. Authorities were monitoring phone and fax calls between Habib and Rahman - a man who applauded the 9/11 attacks.

The interview also claims that Habib was aware of the 9/11 attacks before they happened and that he even made phone calls from Afghanistan to his wife in Australia to warn that something big was going to happen in New York. And why was Habib in Afghanistan? He won't tell!!


I may not agree totally with the treatment given to Habib but I do feel he is guilty and has probably given the Govt information to secure his release.
The Australian Govt has him under close surveillance and have not ruled out the possibility of bring charges against him here.