A self-harming transgender teenager and a conflict of moral decision-making

originally posted by: ThreeDots
Oh, this is your expert friend.

I do not believe I referred to an Expert Friend.

But, Freija can answer your questions in regards to Transgender.

a reply to: Annee

You are wrong...it's you that is acting the expert here.

Latching onto a case about a troubled teen, trying to twist and use it for your own benefit whatever that may be. You use this nonsense rhetoric about how they're hurting and deserve to be happy, but you don't care and that's blatantly obvious.

No, this is, like I said, a gift in your eyes. A tool you can use to spout your agenda for all and sundry. I'm talking on topic, this isn't a transgender issue.

She's also anorexic, why are you ignoring that? Would you say that an anorexic, adolescent is in a fit state of mind to be making potentially life-altering gender choices?

Please, you can't be thinking rationally about this. No, this is more a mental health issue than it is a transgender one.

I'm not talking to your friend about transgenderism for one simple reason, it's off topic, or deliberately trying to steer the thread in a particular direction, which is sneaky and quite sinister. No, you and your friend are free to have such discussions...perhpas she will be kind enough to teach you what she knows, sake you having to dump a disclaminer about how you're an inexperienced, unqualified expert on the subject.

originally posted by: ThreeDots
a reply to: Annee

You are wrong...it's you that is acting the expert here.

What is important - - - - - correct and factual information.

If you really want that - - - in regards to transgender - - - Freija can answer your questions.

Don't waste my time because you want to argue.

originally posted by: ThreeDots

I'm not talking to your friend about transgenderism for one simple reason, it's off topic, or deliberately trying to steer the thread in a particular direction, which is sneaky and quite sinister. No, you and your friend are free to have such discussions...perhpas she will be kind enough to teach you what she knows, sake you having to dump a disclaminer about how you're an inexperienced, unqualified expert on the subject.

You are the only one trying to steer the discussion here.

BTW, Annee is one of the most knowledgeable and best informed people about trans issues on this whole board. She is well read and current and has no hidden agenda. I trust what she has to say and it might be worth your while to listen and learn.

ETA: Mr. Dots doesn't want to ask questions, just push opinions.

a reply to: Annee

I want facts that are relevant to this particular case.

Not for two people with a clear agenda to hijack the thread and turn it into something else entirely. Do you have any insights into this particular case? Does your friend?

If so...present them for everyone. Yes, I am arguing, natrually.

Two people are making a really obvious and contrived effort to derail and assume some level of authority over a thread.

Why are you ignoring the anorexia and self hard aspects and focusing solely on the transgender issue as though that's all that matters?

Anyone who is self harming, suffering an eating disorder...and they suddenly say oh...I'm the opposite sex, too...I'd take it with a pinch of salt, you know?

Some people are like:

Right, get her to a clinic to be evaluated!

She needs medicated, not to be influenced further by people seeking to confirm their own bias.

Ridiculous.

originally posted by: ThreeDots
I want facts that are relevant to this particular case.

Not for two people with a clear agenda to hijack the thread and turn it into something else entirely. Do you have any insights into this particular case? Does your friend?

If so...present them for everyone. Yes, I am arguing, natrually. [sic]

Two people are making a really obvious and contrived effort to derail and assume some level of authority over a thread.

No one is "assuming authority" over this thread but rather attempting to present information that may be relevant to this case. I have no agenda other than to inform and actually, being transgender is the last thing I would wish on anybody. Fact is though that some people and some children are and I believe they should have the best care possible.

Why are you ignoring the anorexia and self hard [sic] aspects and focusing solely on the transgender issue as though that's all that matters?

Because what you fail to recognize or acknowledge are that these co-morbidities and behaviors are very common and often associated with gender dysphoria in adolescence. In fact, they are the symptoms of it and why professional diagnosis is extremely important so that other issues can be ruled out or addressed specifically.

Like I said, the pattern is obvious and typical for gender dysphoric children in unsupportive environments. It may not specifically apply to this case but I've heard the stories from many many parents of transgender youth whose secondary problems have cleared up or gone away completely once a child has been accepted and affirmed as the gender they know themselves to be.

Yes, it is anecdotal but this case is stereotypical. True, we cannot know for sure if this child is truly transgender but presenting as a boy, wanting to be called Mark instead of Melissa and holding hands with a girl certainly seem to point that direction. I hardly think this is something she caught from school as you seem to suggest with your own agenda that you seem to be pushing hard for.

a reply to: Freija

Symptoms of transgenderism? LOL!

Perhaps transgenderism is also a symptom. Congratulations, you guys managed to do your duty, thread derailed.

It's dead, anyway. Enjoy.

originally posted by: ThreeDots
a reply to: Annee

I want facts that are relevant to this particular case.

My granddaughter is now 17. We went through much of what is in the article (but, not gender questioning).

A friends daughter decided she was Pansexual at age 15 and posted a video of herself discussing her sexuality on YouTube.

What got us all through it? A cooperative support system. Parents, counselors, kids working together on self esteem. IMO Self-Esteem and parent support is the key.

Self-Esteem, accepting yourself, believing in yourself - - comes before anything.

The parents stating she has to wait till she is 18 shows their ignorance to knowledge of today. They seem more concerned about procreation/fertility then what's best for their child.

BACK to FACTS & KNOWLEDGE: willful ignorance to available facts and knowledge for a transgender teen.

What's important. Facts & Knowledge.

a reply to: ThreeDots

Clap Clap Clap. You really did fool me in your first post in which you tried to mask your true identity. You joined ATS today and apart from a derogatory post concerning Muslims this morning you have really let your true nature out on this thread.

I initially suspected someone else but discounted it after further investigation. Your real post history confirmed to me that it is you, the writing style, the semantics down to little idiosyncrasies in your text.

What I am really surprised about is that I actually respected and liked you in a previous discussion we had on another subject and very long thread. To be honest I am rather disappointed in you. If you genuinely do feel this way and believe you have legitimate concerns then why not post these under your usual username.

I can only surmise that you do not have the courage to stand behind your convictions. I find it a bit weird to be honest as most of us are anonymous. I won't embarrass you by naming your real username. Its not in my nature to do something like that.

originally posted by: ThreeDots
a reply to: Freija

Symptoms of transgenderism? LOL!

Perhaps transgenderism is also a symptom. Congratulations, you guys managed to do your duty, thread derailed.

It's dead, anyway. Enjoy.

It's not your thread.

I'm not seeing an objection from the OP.

[edit] This has turned into one of my write all Saturday night dirges that seem to have developed into a pattern for me recently trying to escape some of the hysteria of this election season and talk about something else. Please bear with me for yet another TL;DR post. I write for the readers and the thinkers, not the Facebook, Twitter et al. crowd. [/]


After a pleasant evening, a nice meal, streaming a live online sporting event I love that had me in tears during the trophy presentation (MotoGP from Sepang) and several (way) too many late Saturday night glass of wine, I've revisited this thread and read through from the start. There were some good, well written and intelligent comments here that I ignored once a detractor entered the picture diverting my focus from responding to the actual issues in this discussion. I apologize for that and to the OP and know it's kind of after the fact but these are discussions that I think need to be had.

My commenting here puts me in kind of a weird place and it's hard for anybody, including myself at times, to know how objective I'm being because of my personal connections to and experience with this issue. I don't want to assume that everyone is familiar with my history so briefly, I am a (nearly) 62 year old woman of transsexual history. I was a feminine, androgynous "boy" so there wasn't much of a "transition" for me but I have never thought of myself as male or been or lived as a guy/man. I've been known to the world and my parents and extended family only as a girl from the time I was 18 years old with many awkward and troubled years leading up to that point. I've lived since that time (1973) as just your normal girl next door, have been through the medical process of changing sex and have been privileged to live my life assumed to be cisgender (not trans). I've been in a long term marriage and through divorce and several other phenomenal relationships and life experiences. I've been in the workforce my entire adult life and am now 21 years gainfully self-employed in my own small business. My life has been fulfilling and at times wonderful and magical in spite of the challenges of my childhood which only served to strengthen me.

There is nothing really unusual about my story of being transgender as a child and teen. My path is fairly common and directly relates to the transgender youth of today so it is easy for me to understand that perspective but what is different about me is I went through all this in the 1960's through the mid 1970's. Considering how many people were going through the sex change process as a teenager/late adolescent back then, there may be less than a few thousand living people worldwide that share my experience and even that may be an overly optimistic number? You could say that I am an elder in my community but the odd thing is, I am not and have never been part of any trans or LGB() communities. I exist in the "normal", cisgender, hetero normative world as just an average, everyday woman.

Where some of my weirdness comes in is that I am well studied in the current awareness that there are transgender children and of their issues and options that are available to them that weren't when I was a kid. I am familiar with the political arguments about transgender rights and problems but have never really been affected by them so it does possibly sound sometimes like to some I'm towing the party line or spreading "the transgender agenda". Due to my age and experience, I am a generation older than most parents dealing with their own trans children and have offered myself as a resource to help them understand what their kids may be going through. Different eras, different times but the fundamental issues are the same.

Although I've been fortunate enough to live a life of cisgender privilege by not being visibly or out as trans (except here), that doesn't mean I don't have my finger on the pulse of what is going on for today's crop of trans kids and people - the politics, the social and the familial issues and the effects of peer pressure and acceptance in this connected digital world. Not to toot my own horn too loudly but I am very knowledgeable, well read and experienced in the subject of transgender youth and their familial relationships, acceptance, rejection and the hardships endured by others in the LGB() fold.

Having a transgender or gender non-conforming child is a complicated situation, never easy and challenging for all parties involved. This is especially true because there is no one-size-fits-all solution or path. Things have been further complicated by the emergence of non-binary gender identities and those known as transtrenders including the 50+ Tumblr or Facebook labels of identification which is contentious due to different interpretations of the language involved. Truly transgender, gender dysphoric people are typically binary and gender conforming in the traditional sense. Parents wrestle with understanding if their child is truly transgender, going through a phase, maybe only gender non-conforming or just gay? Trust me, these concerns are universal. A good story from the mother of a transgender daughter touching on these topics can be found here: Difficult Conversations

No, I/we cannot determine the true nature of the situation laid out in the OP. Even the title of this article is clickbait and the author's bias evident, but it sounds all too familiar to me.

What are these parent's moral obligations or those of any parents of a potentially transgender child? They should be to insure their child is healthy and happy with a productive future putting aside their own moralistic reservations or confusion about their child's identity. This isn't pandering or kowtowing to a manipulative child. Certainly we all change and grow as we get older and do go through many stages and phases. I urge you to think back to when you were 14 and how secure you were in your own identity as a boy or a girl. I venture to say that no matter what else was going on in your life, fears, teen insecurities, having a certain look or whatever other changes you were going through, there was little internal debate as to what gender you were? In other words, for most of you this wasn't even on the radar. For transgender kids, the radar returns are overwhelmingly contradictory and a fundamental issue superior to all others that clouds the picture.

The level of distress experienced by an individual about their gender is the measure of gender dysphoria as listed in the DSM-V, the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual or the American Psychiatric Association. Gender dysphoria in and of itself is not a mental illness but the co-morbid conditions such as depression, anxiety, suicide ideation and attempt and often things like cutting, anorexia/bulimia and other self-destructive behaviors such as substance abuse are linked. Is this so hard to understand? When something at the core of personality and identity is fundamentally wrong, is there any doubt that that this can be expressed in negative ways?

--continued-

--continued from above (I am long winded and alcohol powered)

There is a lot of shame, embarrassment and self-loathing involved with being transgender. With societal, peer and familial pressures and all, is it any wonder why? Coming to self-acceptance of this is hard because it goes against everything we are raised with and against all expectations and even our own bodies and dealing with internalized phobias difficult and even something I still struggle with at times.

Although some subsets are higher, transgender children in unsupportive family environments for example, overall, 41% of all transgender people attempt suicide sometimes in their lives (most before the age of 20) compared with 1.5 to 1.8% of the general population. I would offer a guess that 100% think about it because realizing that you are trans, coming to terms with it and doing something about it is one of the hardest internal struggles a person can face.

I know. I've been there and have the emotional scars to prove it even though there was little choice in my own experience with transsexualism/gender dysphoria (transgender isn't an ism). I have no problems relating to the challenges and empathizing with the issues faced by others. My perspective is based in dealing with my own parents and dealing with school life from the viewpoint of a transgender child and even though this was many years ago in different times, fundamentally it is the same as it is today. Knowing what I know and what I've been through, does it surprise anyone that I can't help but advocate or educate on the matters of trans youth?

Although obnoxious and redundant at times, I feel my voice here and the perspectives I offer have some merit. Where else are you going to hear things straight from the horse's mouth, as it were? I present the opportunity for others to learn and have put myself out there toward this end.

Yes, this does bring a great deal of my own bias to the table but where I feel I gain a measure of credibility is not only have I lived through the process of changing sex and gender, I have read, consumed and studied the scientific and medical research and literature about gender dysphoria/transsexuality for well over fifty years that is still ongoing to this day. Undoubtedly, my perspectives may be clouded by my experiences, I would be a fool to think that they weren't, hence my conundrum. I attempt to provide an objective point of view based on my knowledge of scientific and medical understanding but can I really without interjecting opinion? I want to make friends and allies, not be a harpy bitch.

At any rate, it's after 7:30 AM and I'm somewhat drunk and stoned rambling and do regret somewhat defensively getting sidetracked in my earlier posts. As I said previously, my intent is to inform and educate - to open up a dialog about trans people and issues to an audience that quite honestly, is generally not accepting of different viewpoints and often unwilling to deny the ignorance of their own understanding of these things.

I wish people would ask me questions that were willing to consider my answers in an intelligent and open-minded discussion with a willingness to learn. At one point back a few years ago, several other members and myself wanted to organize a trans AMA thing but it never happened so when I see a thread with a transgender topic, I am still compelled to observe if not usually participate. This is not part of an organized agenda. It is more personal.

Search transgender on YouTube for example and you will find most trans people uploading videos are trying to explain to non-transgender people what the transgender experience is really like. Many, and even myself through my postings here feel it is important to communicate and educate and get information out there that people like us, and I'll include myself in that demographic this time, feel we should be heard by people that have no experience with trans stuff or have never had someone trans in their family. I don't really give a damn if you don't ever understand "us" or even me personally but what does disturb me is that so many people have preconceived or erroneous misconceptions based on lack of awareness or some political or moralistic conventions that are brain locked into their dogma and unwilling to listen and intelligently consider other points of view. I get the impression here that some think the site's motto is to spread ignorance rather than deny it.

In my time here, others have told me they have learned or come to more awareness and a better understanding about transgender children and people through some of the things I have written and there is nothing more I could hope for

originally posted by: Morrad
a reply to: ThreeDots

Clap Clap Clap. You really did fool me in your first post in which you tried to mask your true identity. You joined ATS today and apart from a derogatory post concerning Muslims this morning you have really let your true nature out on this thread.

I initially suspected someone else but discounted it after further investigation. Your real post history confirmed to me that it is you, the writing style, the semantics down to little idiosyncrasies in your text.

I'm always a little leery when a brand new user account starts right off with all the ATS buzzwords, phrases and tactics like an old pro. I recognized something familiar there but couldn't pinpoint it exactly as someone else. There are a couple of recently former members that I'm kind on the lookout for their return but again couldn't make the connection. Kudos for what amounts to troll debunking.



Off to bed until noon when F1 from Mexico starts.

I might not comment on your posts Freija but I always star them. I was a bit worried about you a month ago. I noticed a subtle change in your posts and wondered if you were quite low.

ETA I often wonder if the fear that underpins most bigotry is due to the process of change. Accepting new ways of thinking often includes the realisation that what you have believed all your life, is in fact wrong. We are defined somewhat by our life experiences. It take courage to to look at yourself in a critical way. Its even more courageous to let go of negativity when you have the fear that you will lose part of yourself. It is sad that many people do not get to the stage of realising that it is always replaced with something positive and enriching.

More confirmation on the member I suspected. A quick glance at their recent activity indicates they post every day. The member logged on this morning briefly and guess what? No posts. Probably in shock.

For anyone still reading.

I have often posted threads relating to articles on Spiked, one of my favourite websites. The readership is primarily university students and academics with many articles being contentious and thought-provoking facilitating intellectual discussion. I am a big fan of Brendan O'Neil who is the editor.

They have very recently started a Gender Politics section. It started well with one of the articles looking at the history of transgender although it did have a slant towards the end while creeping into non-binary territory. I was quite dismayed to find blatant ignorance in the comments section. One poster in a pseudo-intellectual gibberish way was suggesting that transgender is medical violence against homosexuals *shakes head slowly* That really is a new one on me. I would be shocked to find an ignorant uneducated comment like that on ATS, let alone an intellectual website.

Well today there is a new article in this section which is the topic of this OP. The source is the Times and I am unable to see their report as I am not a paid member. I was disappointed to see the Spiked author Naomi Firsht had not put any real effort into her report and its quite ignorant and judgemental. There is only one comment so far but I thought I would post a link here as some may like to follow the comments as there are not many comments on this my thread.

Link

If anyone would like to read the transgender history article it can be found here.

Link

I have never actually commented on Spiked as I tend to pull articles of interest over to ATS for discussion.

originally posted by: Morrad
I might not comment on your posts Freija but I always star them. I was a bit worried about you a month ago. I noticed a subtle change in your posts and wondered if you were quite low.

I'm so lucky to have a flexible schedule and make a fair living without working too many hours and a quick reply has turned into a glass of wine, a tank of vape and a late night smoke and another hours long dump straight from the brain to the keyboard. This is all over the place and may be incoherent at times but I obviously have the time and enjoy writing so take it for what you will.

originally posted by: Morrad
I was disappointed to see the Spiked author Naomi Firsht had not put any real effort into her report and its quite ignorant and judgemental. There is only one comment so far but I thought I would post a link here as some may like to follow the comments as there are not many comments on this my thread.

Thanks for the links. Borderline anti-trans if you ask me and I love it when cis, straight and probably white bloggers that have probably never met a transgender kid in their life and certainly never faced the challenges of raising one act like they know what they're talking about. Even the title, The Trans Agenda is Undermining Parents, reeks of bias and it appears the author did little more than parrot the Daily Mail clickbait article. Pathetic journalism, if you can even call it that?

originally posted by: Morrad
I was a bit worried about you a month ago. I noticed a subtle change in your posts and wondered if you were quite low.

First, thanks for the stars and thanks for the concern but I am fine and dandy. The tone of some of my posts has changed recently but not from being "low" but perhaps I have been a bit more pensive and shown more of myself personally? Most of my time here has been spent advocating for trans youth, presenting scientific and medical research and quite honestly, often fending off or rebutting ignorance and even hostility. By nature, I am not a fighter although my time here has forced some of that to the surface.

Even though ATS is kind of a bad addiction, lately, I've been so sick of this place with all the election and political hysteria that I have made the conscious decision to step back from it all and approach things here with a slightly different tact. I've even made a few threads myself in off-topic. Rather than just the science and facts mixed with a bit of opinion, I've opened up more emotionally with my thoughts and feelings and with some of the ways I think and perceive things. I have felt a certain degree of vulnerability in doing this but there is a method and point to my madness.

Studies have shown that more people claim to have seen a ghost than to have known someone trans. Although I am not really representative of the majority or part of any trans community and I haven't faced any of the problems we commonly hear that some transgender people do, I feel the more I expose of myself as a regular person, the more some of the folks that do read my posts will maybe be able to say they do sort of know someone like me? It's all about bringing awareness.

Like everyone, I have my ups and my downs and if that comes across sometimes it just shows I'm human and have a heart. Other than being socially isolated, life is good, work is good and I live comfortably and I laugh every day and want for little. I have my "days". Who doesn't? Life throws its challenges at all of us at times but I'm a grown-up that knows life isn't always rainbows and unicorns and that it is easy to underestimate the good without a little of the bad thrown in once and a while for calibration. In spite of observations, I'm in a rainbows and unicorns phase and other than having a cavity that needs to be filled and some unwanted thickness around my middle, I've got nothing to complain about.

In spite of how outwardly typical and normal my life is and has been, it is sometimes frustrating to see how politicized being someone that has changed sex has become. It is everywhere and it is frustrating to read posts and blog comments from so many full of fear or hate and misunderstanding and many thing that are simply nasty and horrible. Even if I don't take these things personally from my high-horse privilege of being known as and accepted as cisgender, I still can't say that these negative opinions and attitudes don't make me want to scream sometimes.

Complicating all this is the Tumblr, Facebook, Snapchat and Instragram generation of fifty non-binary or intermediate genders all now claiming that being a feminine boy or a masculine girl somehow makes one transgender? This social movement or trendy identity group doesn't do any favors for those that are actually trans and suffering with crippling gender dysphoria. It further blurries things that were already blurry in the first place but gender and sexual identity is not the same thing as gender expression and I'll admit that it does concern me somewhat that every kid and their gender non-conforming brother that used to be their sister is coming out as transgender.

There isn't more that you can do but sit back and watch with interest and hope like hell the multi-disciplinary teams of doctors that deal with trans and gender variant young people know what the they are doing. My confidence is high but not blindly absolute.

I know all this has been off topic and hope it doesn't get removed but since some have questioned how I'm doing, I thought an explanation was indicated. I do think a lot, I've always been that way and do realize that while it has very little to do with my day-to-day life, it is kind of hard to ever forget some of the things I've been through in life. It still seems all very weird at times and with each passing decade the things I went through when young are almost like a movie I watched about someone else's life.

It is very strange that even however queer, girlish and confusing to others I was as a "boy", those were the pronouns that were used and the kind of name I was known by until I was 18. In the 44 years since then and through the struggles to make the stupid male body I was somehow born into as female as possible, I've learned a few things about life and people and men and women. This does give me an interesting perspective on things that truthfully fascinates me to some degree. Everybody likes a curiosity and I recognize myself to be one.

Recently, I made a thread pondering the question how much some of these views I have may be influenced by my past because it is hard for me to know sometimes and I wonder about the things that may make me different from cisgender women and I tend to look for those things. That just comes with the territory of being trans and for someone with gender dysphoria. All women compare and look at other women. I'm no exception but most other women don't look at other women and wonder what it would have been like to be born female like them or how natal women may be physically different from me. (socially, there is no difference)

(Oh crap! Sorry to write so much)

--Continued below --

--Continued from above, unfortunately --

That's one of the sucky things about being trans - remembering you had a physical disadvantage going in. No matter how pretty you are, and I'm not unattractive, or what surgeries you've had, it's hard to not imagine what my body would have been like if not influenced by testosterone. Fortunately, the case of male puberty I did have was late and pretty lame but the things it did do to me are still the things that have and always will bother me about my physicality even if other people can't see it. This is why I'm an advocate for puberty blockers for properly diagnosed youth. I don't have serious body issues, those have been resolved - it's just nit picky things. I imagine most everyone has nit picky things about their physical selves that bug them but I doubt thinking about remnants of being born the wrong sex are one of them? This puts a lot on my plate but is just normal for me and something there's never been a time in my life I've lived without. When you don't know anything different from this unwanted level of sensory and emotional input, it doesn't seem like such a weight. At times, it can even be blessing.

That's one of the curse parts of gender dysphoria that gets better with treatment but never really goes away. I think few like me would admit that. Before my medical transition was complete the husk I existed in was a jab to the psyche at every turn. It was like being an unwilling passenger on a train with no stops going somewhere you didn't want to be. Fortunately, with the help of science and medicine, the worst of all this went away and me, who I am and my body all began to get along and has for the majority of my life but this is not something I've ever been completely able to forget somewhere in the back of my mind. This voice is nowhere as noisy as it used to be but I still hear it sometimes. I'm sure others probably do too but I find it curious I still have this level of processing going on. It's just an extra filter I've learned to live with.

It's only been within the last two years or so, the rise of the transgender [sic] in the media and public consciousness about this whole thing that I've even thought about it. Kind of odd at my age and after so many years to come out here on ATS after a lifetime of "stealth" (hate that term - I'm not a jet plane). Talking about my life here has dredged up some old memories I'd rather forget and others that I will cherish forever. I've never really spoken about the trans aspects of my life to anyone as much as I have here, even and maybe even particularly to my husband and other people I have partnered with. This is a stage of growth for me that has been difficult from time to time but have no worries. It's all good and I'm good.

Thanks to my friends for looking out and caring.

a reply to: Morrad

I am throwing a few rambling thoughts out here, maybe you can throw some light

on them.

I come from a time when homosexuality was very much under the carpet, so now

when it is very much more open the % must be quite high. I tried to get figures for

it but it seems to be constantly changing, one graph I saw the change/differintial

came with age, which if true I find surprising.


The contraceptive pill was introduced when I was young, I never took it because,

as every female baby is born with their complete ova/egg supply already in place

I was concerned my taking the hormones/pill would effect the fertility of future

generations. It appeared to me quick fix ... but what about the future?


Going back to my youth.... few homosexuals, even less transgender sooooo could

it be something in the water Lol!! I jest,


Seriously though I have read articles where fish are being effected and the sea is

where our pill pollution and bodily waste goes? so maybe there is something in the

increase in gender confusion due to excess hormones?


The sea like the planet is being polluted, I did state at the start .... a rambling

post ... your thoughts?

originally posted by: Freija

That's one of the curse parts of gender dysphoria that gets better with treatment but never really goes away. I think few like me would admit that. Before my medical transition was complete the husk I existed in was a jab to the psyche at every turn. It was like being an unwilling passenger on a train with no stops going somewhere you didn't want to be. Fortunately, with the help of science and medicine, the worst of all this went away and me, who I am and my body all began to get along and has for the majority of my life but this is not something I've ever been completely able to forget

I too am a thinker I find it useful to understanding ...

Have you considered that had you been born 100 or more years ago, before science

and surgery made it possible for you to lead the life you wanted ... what would you

have done then?