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ABUSE CRISIS: Iraqis Irate Over Graner Sentencing

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posted on Jan, 16 2005 @ 05:41 PM
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Stating that he should have been punished by death under Iraqi law, citizens expressed scorn and dismay over the sentence handed out to the U.S. Army Reservist accused of being the ringleader at Abu Ghraib. Graner was sentenced to 10 years in prison for his role in the systematic torture of Iraqi prisoners. The images of Graner smiling as he was lead out of the courthouse further enraged Iraqis.
 



story.news.yahoo.com
BAGHDAD, Iraq - Word that a U.S. Army reservist was sentenced to 10 years behind bars for physically and sexually abusing Iraqi detainees at the Abu Ghraib prison drew scorn Sunday from Iraqis who thought he should have been tried here and punished with death.

Iraq's interim government had no official reaction, but a handful of ordinary Iraqis interviewed in Baghdad said the trial and its outcome brought no justice. Rather, it bore a humiliation just as potent as the shame that came when pictures of the abuse first emerged in April.

Abdul-Razak Abdul-Fattah, a 65-year-old retired army officer, said he was shocked to see TV footage of Army Spc. Charles Graner Jr. leaving the court smiling and laughing even while his legs and hands were shackled.


Please visit the link provided for the complete story.


While I cannot blame the Iraqi's for being upset and the light sentence that Graner received, I cannot help but to think that thier anger is being misdirected. The real outrage is not the 10 years sentence, but the fact that he is the highest officer in the case that is being charged with this. These crimes should be accountable all the way to the top. From Rumsfield, to Gonzales, to Wolfowitz, they at the very least allowed it to happen.

Related AboveTopSecret.com Discussion Threads:
ABUSE CRISIS: Graner Found Guilty, Sentenced to Ten Years




posted on Jan, 16 2005 @ 05:50 PM
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How did they allow this to happen FredT?

We already saw the report of the green light that was given to some torture measures, and it said very clear in the memo that they should not touch the prisoners. Only sleep deprivation, and other minor forms of torture, but nothing to amount to beatings to death, or rape...that was done because there were some soldiers and officers that were involved in this and they are sadistic animals. There were reports of other soldiers who didn't take part of this and were witnesses as to what happened....they made a choice not to take part of it and to report it.

---edited for errors---


[edit on 16-1-2005 by Muaddib]



posted on Jan, 16 2005 @ 06:00 PM
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I agree that those at the prison that participated in the abuse should and are going to jail. However, mounting evidence, shows that warning of the abuse and the treatment were ignored at higher levels. The fact that at the punishment is not even getting out of the enlisted ranks is beyond comprehension.



posted on Jan, 16 2005 @ 06:03 PM
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The military has bowed to PC pressure. There was NO abuse in Abu Graib. There was no "Torture". This guy should have gotten a Medal. If the Iraqi's are angry so what? I shed no tears for those whom were forced to "eat pork" or have the Israeli flag in them. Scream loud, there are about 30 who can not hear you anymore becuase they have no HEAD. American will lose this war because of the Liberal Media.



posted on Jan, 16 2005 @ 06:06 PM
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I thought Graner smiled as he went into the Courthouse, with BS about the level of support that he and his parents had received. He was not smiling as he left in the news item that I saw.

Dr Horacid, your denial is extreme. The trial is complete and the man is guilty, on actual evidence.

[edit on 16-1-2005 by MaskedAvatar]



posted on Jan, 16 2005 @ 06:07 PM
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Hey Fred I am willing to bet if the shoe was on the other foot and they had sentenced an Iraqi to death they would complain about that since the ruling was made by a US court. Darned if you do darned if you don't. I am sure you get my point.



posted on Jan, 16 2005 @ 06:10 PM
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When I hear the reports of these cases, the one thing that keeps coming to mind is the Stanford Prison Experiment. I wonder if this could be applied to the situation of the soldiers who are assigned to work in these prisons, doing something they haven't the training for. Perhaps it might start to explain how these things happen?



posted on Jan, 16 2005 @ 06:35 PM
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Occurs they should be outrage they sentence the wrong person, he was just the fall guy for the kinds of Rumsfeld and the ones that work with him.

They are still at large, and by the way my husband thinks that he will get 5 as long as he take the resposibility for the abuses, and do not hold the government accountable.



posted on Jan, 16 2005 @ 06:58 PM
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Too all the people crying (and i do mean crying) for Graner's head:

I'm not going to argue the point that he's a sick bastard.

But I must ask you one question...

If Zarqawi (who was responsible for beheading human beings on television, including aid workers, women, and other innocents) is found, will you be crying for him to be executed as well? Or will you join the chorus of "human rights groups" who will say he should only be imprisoned. What's good for the goose...



posted on Jan, 16 2005 @ 07:39 PM
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I don't think these soldiers deserve a medal and I don't think they were acting on orders from above. The actions at Abu Ghraib were stupid and senseless and damaging to the credibility of the US. These were night shift idiots playing out their perversions at the expense of the prisoners and the people of the US. Everyone in the world should be outraged by this.

On the other hand, the abuses were small potatoes in the grand scheme of abusive behaviors and ten years in Leavenworth is a just sentence, in my judgement.



posted on Jan, 16 2005 @ 07:47 PM
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I thought 10 years was a pretty heavy sentence for what happened. That Graner left smiling, etc. (I saw the video) speaks volumes about his personality. Deserved or not, I can't help feeling the world is better off with him out of circulation.

As far as the Iraqi citizens are concerned, it probably depends who you ask. But claiming he deserves death speaks volumes about the harshness of Iraqi justice, and probably reflects the skewed expectations of the Iraqi following 30 years of Saddam, as well as the Middle Eastern culture in general. At this point, they would not have the experience to understand western standards.



posted on Jan, 16 2005 @ 08:04 PM
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Originally posted by GradyPhilpott
I don't think these soldiers deserve a medal and I don't think they were acting on orders from above.


Grady, while I doubt highly that the actions of the guard detail were performed in responce to say a memo that has Rumsfields signature on it, they still had to have had tacit appoval from above to do this. Not to mention the SF teams in there threatening people to keep quite and the like.

You, I recall are a military man. Leaders are responsable for the activites of thier troops. Its no different than when I am out on a transport. i am the team leader and any actions we take I am responsable for. The same should be applied here. Admin had many reports of issues way before the story broke and chose to do ntohing. This alone points the finger of guilt in there direction.



posted on Jan, 16 2005 @ 09:34 PM
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Originally posted by FredT
Grady, while I doubt highly that the actions of the guard detail were performed in responce to say a memo that has Rumsfields signature on it, they still had to have had tacit appoval from above to do this.


If you would have seen what I have seen you wouldn't be so sure that these individuals were acting with approval. If there was tacit approval it did not extend very high in the chain of command. The actions of these individual was so devoid of logic and of any interrogative purpose that no one with an with a triple digit IQ and a career to protect would have let this happen.

I have seen what can happen when the only person around to fool is the Officer-of-the-Day, who might come around twice per evening, if that and would have no way of sneaking into the cell block where these activities were taking place.

These were acts of gross pervesity carried out by idiots.



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