Mandela Effect Theory

a reply to: Badgered1

A few years later, there were a couple of Wembley shows, and later still Mandela was released from prison (Now you all remember the song, "Free Nelson Mandela"..?? It was being played on the radio constantly back then. Why would they want to free a dead man?).

Exactly. You have very clear, specific memories that jibe perfectly with mine. A small number of people would simply argue that we, and millions of others, are simply wrong because they remember things differently.

Apartheid activist dies in jail --> Mandela dies in prison.
Celebrity composer Leonard Bernstein --> Ber(e)nstein Bears.

Depictions of Australia in isolation:



--> Inability to locate the island relative to Asia:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: Badgered1

A few years later, there were a couple of Wembley shows, and later still Mandela was released from prison (Now you all remember the song, "Free Nelson Mandela"..?? It was being played on the radio constantly back then. Why would they want to free a dead man?).

Depictions of Australia in isolation:

--> Inability to locate the island relative to Asia:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

I can easily and reasonably dismiss this suggestion as I've never seen that picture before. My memories of where I remember Australia in relation to Asia come from being fascinated with my older brother's globe of the earth when I was younger.
It's the same reason I dismiss the "globe to flat map projection" explanation.
If you then suggest that I am not remembering the position properly in the exact same way everyone I have spoken to about it mis-remembers too, coincidentally, because that's the most logical and reasonable explanation, in your mind, I will dismiss that too, because that many people randomly all mis-remembering the exact same specifics is far from logical.

a reply to: Gryphon66

Don't be discouraged merely because some of us have looked at the data and found a non-fantastic explanation.

"We looked at the data" blah blah. You make it sound like you did something great. The only thing you guys did was counter with the easy and obvious argument "you have a bad memory".

Half of you don't even seem to get what the effect is supposed to entail with invalid arguments like "you remembered wrong because it's always been like this".

a reply to: DutchMasterChief

Half of you don't even seem to get what the effect is supposed to entail with invalid arguments like "you remembered wrong because it's always been like this".

What part of "OMG the entire universe has changed and I'm the only one who notices" do you think we do not understand?

a reply to: Ruiner1978

Interesting. Have you tried looking at Australia's current position on a globe, instead of a map?

originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: Ruiner1978

Interesting. Have you tried looking at Australia's current position on a globe, instead of a map?

Yes and Australia is much closer to Asia (also south America far too Eastward) whether on flat map, globe or Google earth than what myself, family and friends remember.
I also dismiss "group confabulation" for the same reason I find the idea of group hallucinations an unreasonable explanation for multiple sightings of something strange.

a reply to: DJW001

I just qouted the type of argument that is invalid.......

a reply to: DJW001

Exactly. You have very clear, specific memories that jibe perfectly with mine. A small number of people would simply argue that we, and millions of others, are simply wrong because they remember things differently.

Here, this what I mean. Noone is saying that you remember things wrong. At least this is not what the ME theory proposes.

a reply to: DutchMasterChief

Here, this what I mean. Noone is saying that you remember things wrong. At least this is not what the ME theory proposes.

I said we remember things "differently." This means our memories are correct in this universe, whereas you recollect things from an alternate universe that this universe has split off from in some way. The problem is, there is no objective evidence that, for example, the Berenstain Bears were ever called anything but the Berenstain Bears. The other examples of the effect are all easily explicable. Reba is a distinctive enough name that it was seldom necessary to spell out her full name. (Like I am doing.)

a reply to: DJW001

That's not what you said, but whatever.

The problem is, there is no objective evidence that, for example, the Berenstain Bears were ever called anything but the Berenstain Bears.

Still not getting it. Why would you even expect direct evidence of the other spelling in this universe?

So no it can't be proven. I am just saying that your type of argument is invalid. Even though you have this reality and your own memories to back it up, you still can't prove that some people didn't shift to your universe. There is no way for you to disprove this, and no way for them to prove they did.

Off course the most obvious explanation is that it is due to faulty memory, but that doesn't mean it's right in all cases, no matter how implausable it may sound.

Why not just let it go? There is no real valid argument that you can make here.

a reply to: Badgered1

You're absolutely correct

Here is a video of highlights from 1988 at Wembley
www.youtube.com...

And here is the classic written by the Specials Jerry Dammers (and infamously trashed by the late Amy Winehouse)
www.youtube.com...

a reply to: destination now

You're absolutely correct

Off course, this was always correct in this universe.......

a reply to: Badgered1

A few years later, there were a couple of Wembley shows, and later still Mandela was released from prison (Now you all remember the song, "Free Nelson Mandela"..?? It was being played on the radio constantly back then. Why would they want to free a dead man?).

So he couldn't have died in prison after they made that song? The song came out in 1984, and he was released in 1990. The fact that such a song exists says absolutely nothing about the possibility of him dying in jail or not.

I am not making any further point, just pointing out that your argument is a fallacy.

a reply to: DutchMasterChief

Well if he was released from jail in 1990, he certainly couldn't have died in jail then could he?

Sorry, but millions of people remember the events leading up to Mandela's release and the subsequent ending of apartheid in South Africa, due to Mandela becoming president.

You can argue all you like about you (and a few others) somehow being in another timeline where events were different, but ask yourself, is there still apartheid in South Africa? And if not, why not?

a reply to: destination now

Well if he was released from jail in 1990, he certainly couldn't have died in jail then could he?

Wow some people are obtuse. I didn't say he did, did I. I pointed out that the fact that there was a song in '84 does not mean he could not die in jail after that. I even added that I only wanted to point out the fallacy and that I wasn't making any further point.

Sorry, but millions of people remember the events leading up to Mandela's release and the subsequent ending of apartheid in South Africa, due to Mandela becoming president.

I don't deny this at all nor would I expect any different.

You can argue all you like about you (and a few others) somehow being in another timeline where events were different, but ask yourself, is there still apartheid in South Africa? And if not, why not?

This is getting amusing. You still dont get why arguments like the one you are using are fallacies. No there is no apartheid anymore in South Africa, and Mandela was released, in this universe. No one is denying that he was released in this universe.

a reply to: DutchMasterChief

So was there ever apartheid in your universe and if so, how was it changed. Serious question btw

a reply to: destination now

Yes there was and I remember Mandela being released and becoming president. I was just pointing out that some of the arguments used are invalid.

What does seem different to me is geography, human anatomy, the position, color and brightness of the sun, to name a few, although I am only a 100% sure about the sun being different.

a reply to: DutchMasterChief

That's fair enough. I suppose what I am getting at is that any changes, big or small to the anatomy, environment or history would have a major impact on the world around it. Example, if Australia was in a different place in a different universe, many things about Australia would also be different, the climate and therefore the flora and fauna would also have been different, but anyone I have spoken to about this says that nothing else had changed except for the location, but if it was in a different location its relativity to the equator etc would also be different and therefore the climate and subsequent flora/fauna would also be.

I'm genuinely not trying to be obtuse, I personally have had a weird experience which I described in a thread about disappearing houses, but certain posters have a tendency to be overly dramatic, making fantastical claims about their reality shifts, which really do make a mockery of the whole thing and just tends to shut down any reasonable discussion, because you can't really argue with "well that was in my timeline, so you wouldn't know" type of response, that and being labeled a troll simply for making points and asking pertinent questions, unfortunately turns the whole subject into a minefield.

a reply to: destination now

because you can't really argue with "well that was in my timeline, so you wouldn't know" type of response

Exactly, which is why skeptics should back off, if they can only point out bad memory. I mean you can't, and don't have to argue about it.

Also, I don't think the difference in latitude that some people notice is enough to cause a notable difference in climate in Australia.

For me personally it's South America that seems way off to the West. It seems so ridiculously close to Africa now and I remember it more directly below North America, back to the East.

a reply to: ZeroFurrbone

OR and I know this is radical. People remember things wrongly? It could you know be the answer?