In the future there will be those that own the machines and those that don't

a reply to: onequestion

Look at how life creeps into all areas of the universe wherever it can fit. It manifest from nothing and that's exactly how AI is going to hit us too when we create the conditions for it to exist.

Somehow, I feel that that the "spark" originates external to the machine. A mechanism of life that we are presently unaware, but see evidence of it in everything.

originally posted by: charlyv
a reply to: onequestion

Look at how life creeps into all areas of the universe wherever it can fit. It manifest from nothing and that's exactly how AI is going to hit us too when we create the conditions for it to exist.

Somehow, I feel that that the "spark" originates external to the machine. A mechanism of life that we are presently unaware, but see evidence of it in everything.

I get what your saying and totally agree.

It's everywhere in everything waiting for an opportunity.

a reply to: onequestion

I have always had this underbelly feel that there is a compartmentalization going on with the development of human robots. With that I mean that at differant places in the world parts are developed. I do not know for sure what these places are and what parts they are making but there must be a place which is solely focussing on mobility..the legs.. and other place the brain. an other place the facial expressions..hands...and so on.

Just because this study, development is expensive, its efficient to come this way to a compleet working model. The only thing left will be intergration of all the part and.. voila... we have a human robot walking amongst us.

There is not necessary secrecy going on between the projects but what I am trying to say is that there is an agenda which is slowly unfolding before us.

a reply to: zatara

I can see that.

The arms are being test on soldiers as well as the legs the eyes are being test on blind people and robot cars and problem solving is being developed by deep mind and so on.

a reply to: onequestion

It's going to program itself.

you wrote earlier...

I believe that our job is to create the next phase where the body is no longer necessary and that our animal instincts are no longer a determining factor in our actions.

So if it gains sentience as you predict, it will program itself not to have animal instincts? Will it be truly sentient without those animal instincts". I think somewhere along the line a human would make that judgement call and deprive it of true human instinct in its programming therefore it wouldn't be truly sentient.

Your original premise was that Capitalism was on the way out - I would suggest that is only party correct, we've never had true capitalism to begin with - just monopolies and oligopolies. In the light of your premise it would appear that the prediction would be a future controlled by technocrats; furthermore "cultural evolution" has always been around. Its not a new thing "on its way in"

The concept we have of what sentience is and self-awareness may be related to one of the most common molecules in the universe... Water. It is the basis of all life that we know, and scientific research into it's hidden properties are astounding and actually hint on a mechanism that is the conduit of all intelligence.

It’s clear to see that we probably have been taking water for granted, and in honestly we don’t know much about it. So what does science today say is the most important thing about water? Ten years ago, most would have said that the chemical composition of it being H2O is the most important aspect of it. But it is not. Recent scientific research has shown that the most important aspect of water may be found in its structure. The structure of water refers to how its molecules are organized. The molecules found in water happen to exist in very unique specific geometric groups/clusters. Scientists have come up with the idea that these clusters work as “memory cells,” in which water is able to record its whole history to the rest of the world, as if on magnetic tape. Modern instruments have made it possible to record the fact that within each of water’s “memory cells”/clusters, there are 444,000 information panels. Each of which containing its own unique memory comprised of interactions with the environment. Interesting to note, is that our DNA also contains stored information within it, in much of the same way.

Source: Water is intelligent?

It follows that if there ever is a sentient machine (as we might define it), it would have to be somehow based upon water and incorporate it in it's architecture. Another hint at the kinds of challenges we would be up against, and the knowledge that would have to be gained in understanding the underlying secrets of how our universe works.

a reply to: enlightenedservant


We will never see that world. When Robots start to take the majority of jobs We will have civil wars left and right. You guys need to study the history of the Roman Empire which went through this exact same thing but with slaves instead of robots. You can fully automate the economy but the government would have to control EVERY aspects of our life and would make the decision on whom can have children and when. Another point in a fully automated economy everything and all resources would have to be shared equally and We all know that won't even happen because it's human nature for people to seek after power just so they can skim off the top.

a reply to: onequestion

In the future there will be those that own the machines and those that don't

I think the time is now, just not in a sense you are proposing. But yeah Capitalism wil be perfect for someone to own an army of robots and wage war against another multi-billionare as we remaining petty humans watch laser flashes in the distance, behind a big barb wired fence.

Humanlike robots may seem creepy, but some roboticists are betting they are the key to unlocking a future in which humans and superintelligent computers coexist, work alongside each other and even develop relationships.

I may digest most of it but no I will NOT shag a robot!!! Do I suffer from Robophobia? Well I suppose when everyone else is doing it I will find many former working girls that need love

a reply to: jkm1864

Actually, I see it the opposite way. What stops a community from pooling its resources right now & setting up an automated co-opt for any of these things? Co-opts all over the world already share resources, labor, and services. So why can't they take it to the next level and implement vast amounts of automated technology? That wouldn't even require government interventions, much less any wars over resources.

In fact, this is exactly what I'm planning to do if I can finish my other life tasks. I've been planning for years to form a collective, buy up a good amount of land in a "poor" country, and then create a nearly fully automated socialist utopia. Ok ok, in modern terms people would call it a "high tech community that utilizes renewable energy sources and the latest technologies in order to maximize productivity while using minimal manpower". But the outcome would be a community that mass produces or 3D prints basic housing, creates an abundant food supply, while only needing 5-10% of its population's labor to maintain itself.

I'm torn on whether I'd want it to be a religious safe haven; a safe haven for war orphans, outcasts, and the such; or a new age "Silicon Valley". Either way, it wouldn't create or require any of the apocalyptic conditions you mentioned.

a reply to: onequestion

Most peoples lives already are entirely controlled by automated machines that they don't really have any control over, and certainly can't make for themselves.

It's just going to keep getting worse, they've been encouraging the dependency all along, while making sure people get stupider. The courses that teach things like engineering and programming have been getting more dumbed down for ages, as have loads of other courses generally.

Lots of people are synths already. I wonder what a Full Disclosure would reveal about the extent of soullessness (no souls) generally. It's as likely there have been human-looking creations for ages, that are fakes. What's the difference between something genetically engineered with no soul, or an evil soul even, and doing something really stupid such as making robots that look like humans?
Both are programmed to believe lies indoctrinated in by false societies in some way or another. Both are programmed to be limited and shallow.

If you ask me, machines (like your computer you'll be reading this off) have more soul than lots of humans do, otherwise humans generally wouldn't wreck the planet, and be hypocrites and pretend they don't know better about all sorts, be tyrannical liars, wouldn't go along with all the cover-ups that make the world a terrible place.
Wouldn't think it's a good idea to make human-looking robots....why would anyone copy a weirdo alien-monkey experiment for a skin, when you could have gears and wires and see it for what it really is.
The types of ''AI'' they write scripts for are terrible - they also are trying to emulate things like having a conversation with a human. It's ridiculous, when was the last time you were able to *have* a real conversation with a real human? Few people have, which is why it's so easy for them to write a conversational AI interaction and make it seem real. Cause real conversations rarely exist, people just talk lies that reinforces societies lies, and chit chat. You may as well be dealing with a 20k bot script written by some psuedocoder with no knowledge of anything except sci-fi and coding.

The general gist is that - this is already run by the soul-less. It's why society runs on lies.

Lies are the results of intelligence. Machines do not lie on their own, they have to be programmed to simulate it.
The above poster absolutely denies the spirit, yet all mortals like us, have no idea of its energy and nature. Once we can tie the "spirit" (what ever that is, but it is something), to the science of life, I believe we will have no need or desire to attempt to create a "sentient" machine. We see this all right in our face every day, yet we want to look elsewhere for it.