There are no giants in the original bible

originally posted by: stormbringer1701
actually despite its occasional translation errors and some are important errors the KJV is the version that comes closest to the original manuscripts.

That's why I'm using the original...

originally posted by: DISRAELI
a reply to: chr0naut
To be fair, my dictionary gives the English word "giant" as derived from "gigantes", via the Old French "geant". The Old French must have been slurring their words a bit.

Possibly, but the old french word described an Ogre. The Modern English word has absorbed the meanings of the old English words "ent" and "eoten".

The current definition means 'fantastical, man-like creature of enormous size' not the offspring of Gaia & Uranus.

Words are merely symbols for concepts. We shouldn't assume the similarities of the symbols are significant if the underlying concepts are different and specific.

originally posted by: cavtrooper7
a reply to: Marduk

What's a Nephilim look like ?

because they were fallen angels (ignoring the distinction between angels and cherubim) they would probably look like all angels are described in the bible: a pleasant looking, fit but slightly androgynous male appearing between 20 to 30 years old of average or slightly above average height. (Angels did not have wings. cherubim did)
The fallen angels would not appear monsterous. they couldn't and be doing what they were doing at the time of Noah or what they will do in the latter days.

a reply to: Marduk

LOTS of things in the bible didn't exist in the original texts... three of the biggest ones, far bigger than giants ( no pun intended ) .. the rapture, the virgin birth and hell .. none of those were in the original texts ..

According to the original texts, everyone is going to heaven...

Also interesting to note that back in "those days" the idea of resurrection was pretty common..

But you won't be able to convince anyone of those facts..

originally posted by: miniatus
a reply to: Marduk

LOTS of things in the bible didn't exist in the original texts... three of the biggest ones, far bigger than giants ( no pun intended ) .. the rapture, the virgin birth and hell .. none of those were in the original texts ..

According to the original texts, everyone is going to heaven...

Also interesting to note that back in "those days" the idea of resurrection was pretty common..

But you won't be able to convince anyone of those facts..

you could if you'd produce documentation for those claims.the only ones i have documentation for on your claims are the hell thing and the rapture thing with caveats. the rapture thing is more or less true though only in the sense that pretrib or mid trib rapture doctrine is nonsense. The end trib rapture is still true and supported. as for hell; it does not exist...yet. Nor is it eternal torment. that's sick.

Spanish word for huge or giant is gigante (transliterated: hee-gan-te).

originally posted by: miniatus
a reply to: Marduk


According to the original texts, everyone is going to heaven...

Everyone ?
Are you sure

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
Spanish word for huge or giant is gigante (transliterated: hee-gan-te).

That's not surprising
Italian is also gigante
The French word is géant
Romanian is gigant
Heres why
en.wikipedia.org...

a reply to: Marduk

I know, but why do you think gigante came to mean giant. If gigantes was in reference to the Titans, then calling someone a giant is saying they are as big as a Titan.

So then, why would the LXX translators use gigantes in place of nephilim if the nephilim where nothing more than celebities?

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: Marduk

I know, but why do you think gigante came to mean giant. If gigantes was in reference to the Titans, then calling someone a giant is saying they are as big as a Titan.

So then, why would the LXX translators use gigantes in place of nephilim if the nephilim where nothing more than celebities?

Because the word originally just meant "great size or strength", it didn't come to mean "Giant human" in English until the 13th Century.

It replaced Old English ent, eoten, also gigant (from Latin). The Greek word was used in Septuagint to refer to men of great size and strength, hence the expanded use in modern languages; in English of very tall and unusually large persons from 1550s; of persons who have any quality in extraordinary degree from 1530s.

All the tribes later called giants are simply described as tall, sometimes ferocious, in the original text.

a reply to: Marduk

I understand the Philistines were originally the same people who moved from Central Asia into Ionia and the Peloponnese, and whom we know today as the ancestors of the Ancient Greeks. Can you confirm or refute this? It throws a whole new perspective on the Hebrew-Philistine confrontation: Proto-Greek hoplites battling hairy mountain tribesmen who were doing their damnedest to stop the march of civilization...

A related question occurs: was early Talmudic scholarship Greek-influenced? The Hebraic peoples were surrounded on all sides by culture that was essentially Greek.

I suppose these questions are a little off topic, so please ignore them if you so see fit.

OP the math is a bit fuzzy. Going by the biblical measurement posted of 1 cubit measuring 18 inches. It seems that the 9 cubit bed mentioned in Deuteronomy 3:11 is a bit larger than the 9 feet that was calculated, 9x4 cubits would be 13.5x6 feet. While certainly not giant, it is much larger than today's standard kind size bed of 6.33x6.66 feet, or even the California King 6x7 feet.

Also what is interesting is that while in Deuteronomy 3:11 the cubit measurement stayed the same and in 1 Samuel 17:4 the cubits change from 6 to 4. I wonder how something as simple as a measurement could be miss translated?

Let's say that Goliath did come in a 6 cubits, 9 foot tall is fairly large. If someone that tall were alive today they would certainly be called a giant. "World Record" height for a human is 8'11". So I guess at what height does someone no longer be called tall but rather giant? And is there a ratio of average height to a statistic anomaly where someone becomes a giant. As an example someone 4 foot tall might feel that someone that is 6'5" is a giant. Would someone 6'5" feel that another person 9' tall is a giant?

a reply to: Marduk

So you claim to know the original bible? where do they keep the #1 issue?

The Fallen angels mated with the daughters of men and produced the Giants or Demigods who had super powers, and built the pyramids, and mega structures around the world.

Nephilim = Giants www.crystalinks.com...

Who Were The Nephilim?

The Nephilim have several meanings to their names depending on the verse one takes to gather its meaning.

The official definition in the Merriam-Webster Encyclopedia is: A biblical race of giants or demigods

Pronounced: Neph-i-lim

www.altheadlines.com...

originally posted by: JesusSavesEvery1
Let's say that Goliath did come in a 6 cubits, 9 foot tall is fairly large. If someone that tall were alive today they would certainly be called a giant. "World Record" height for a human is 8'11". So I guess at what height does someone no longer be called tall but rather giant? And is there a ratio of average height to a statistic anomaly where someone becomes a giant. As an example someone 4 foot tall might feel that someone that is 6'5" is a giant. Would someone 6'5" feel that another person 9' tall is a giant?

Interesting question, but the giants from mythology are usually descendants of Gods or monsters and so not actually human beings, consider for instance the Cyclops Polyphemus (son of Poseidon) from the Odyssey. The tribes named as giants in later translations of the bible are all normal human tribes. So are just tall.

I met someone who was seven feet tall once and I thought he was a giant and I am 6' 5

originally posted by: Curious69
a reply to: Marduk

So you claim to know the original bible? where do they keep the #1 issue?

No idea, probably in the popes toilet at the Vatican

originally posted by: The only 1 who knows the
Nephilim = Giants

Who Were The Nephilim?

They were a tribe encountered by the Hebrews,

sorry i didn't read every reply so if some of this has been covered i apologize in advance.

Nephilim- Strong's Exhaustive Concordance
giant
Or nphil [nef-eel']; from naphal; properly, a feller, i.e. A bully or tyrant -- giant.
see HEBREW naphal
Forms and Transliterations

Emims-Strong's Exhaustive Concordance
Emims
Plural of 'eymah; terrors; Emim, an early Canaanitish (or Maobitish) tribe -- Emims.
see HEBREW 'eymah
Forms and Transliterations
אֵמִֽים׃ אמים׃ הָֽאֵימִ֔ים הָאֵמִ֥ים האימים האמים ’ê•mîm ’êmîm eMim hā’êmîm hā•’ê•mîm haeiMim haeMim


This taken from the jewish virtual library
Rephaim-REPHAIM (Heb. רְפָאִים). The Rephaim are known from biblical, Ugaritic, and Phoenician sources. In the Bible two uses of the term are discernible. The first is as a gentilic (e.g., Gen. 14:5; 15:20; Deut. 2:11) referring to a people distinguished by their enormous stature. Especially singled out are Og king of Bashan (Deut. 3:11) and the powerful adversaries of David's heroes (II Sam. 21:16, 18, 20). The biblical authors trace their designation to an apparently human eponym Rapha(h) (e.g., II Sam. 21:16, 18, 20;I Chron. 20:8). The Bible's emphasis on the size and might of the Rephaim is responsible for the Septuagint's renderings gigantesand titanes as well as for gabbārē of the Pe#ta and gibbarāyyā of the Targums. The Genesis Apocryphon(21:28) on the other hand prefers the noncommital rephāʾayyā.
In its second use Rephaim designates "shades" or "spirits" and serves as a poetic synonym for metim (מֵתִים; Isa. 26:14; Ps. 88:11). It thus refers to the inhabitants of the netherworld (Prov. 9:18). This second meaning is also found in Phoenician sources. King Tabnit of Sidon curses any prospective despoiler of his tomb: "May there be no resting-place for you with the Rephaim" (H. Donner and W. Roellig, Kanaanäische und aramäische Inschriften (KAI, 1962), 13, lines 7–8; COS II, 182), King Eshmunazar (ibid., 14, line 8; COS II, 183) employs the same formula in the plural, adding "… and may they not be buried in a grave." The chthonic aspect of the Phoenician Rephaim is made even more explicit in a neo-Punic bilingual which equates the לעל [נם] אראפאם with dis manibus sacrum KAI (ibid., 117, line 1).


Anakim-NAS Exhaustive Concordance
Word Origin
from the same as Anaq
Definition
"neck," a giant people around Hebron and in Philistia
NASB Translation
Anakim (9).


Cubit-a cubit is about 18 inches.. That’s the most conservative estimation I could find.
So ogs bed was 13 and a ½ feet and goliath was 9 feet conservatively.


What was the people of olds interpretation.
Flavius Josephus of the Antiquities of the Jews — Book I
CHAPTER 3.
Concerning the Flood; and after what manner Noah was saved in an Ark, with his kindred; and afterwards dwelt in the plain of Shinar.
1. NOW this posterity of Seth continued to esteem God as the Lord of the universe, and to have an entire regard to virtue, for seven generations: but in process of time they were perverted, and forsook the practices of their fore-fathers; and did neither pay those honours to God which were appointed them, nor had they any concern to do justice towards men. But for what degree of zeal they had formerly shewn for virtue, they now shewed by their actions a double degree of wickedness. Whereby they made God to be their enemy. For many Angels of God (14) accompanied with women, and begat sons that proved unjust, and despisers of all that was good; on account of the confidence they had in their own strength. For the tradition is, that these men did what resembled the acts of those whom the Grecians call Giants. But Noah was very uneasy at what they did: and being displeased at their conduct, persuaded them to change their dispositions, and their actions for the better. But seeing they did not yield to him, but were slaves to their wicked pleasures, he was afraid they would kill him, together with his wife and children, and those they had married. So he departed out of that land.

Heres an entry in josephus antiquities book 5 chapter 2 verse 3
3. For which reason they removed their camp to Hebron; and when they had taken it, they slew all the inhabitants. There were till then left the race of giants, who had bodies so large, and countenances so entirely different from other men, that they were surprising to the sight, and terrible to the hearing. The bones of these men are still shown to this very day, unlike to any credible relations of other men. Now they gave this city to the Levites as an extraordinary reward, with the suburbs of two thousand cities; but the land thereto belonging they gave as a free gift to Caleb, according to the injunctions of Moses. This Caleb was one of the spies which Moses sent into the land of Canaan. They also gave land for habitation to the posterity of Jethro, the Midianite, who was the father-in-law to Moses; for they had left their own country, and followed them, and accompanied them in the wilderness.

Now I know this is piss poor and I done it hastily but I feel it puts up a more credible argument for giants than what you presented against.

Actually, to get this stuff ya have to read it....It takes a bunch of digging deep.


there are so many other Scriptures pointing at the possibility. Did you know Unicorns are real and God makes the neatest statement about what must have been a special creation for Him.....I can tell by the inflection in His voice when He states the BEHEMOTHS were one of His first creatures....tickles me, you too?

originally posted by: Marduk

originally posted by: Kukri
Going by the dreaded Wikipedia a cubit is anywhere SNIP

TMI

The Biblical cubit is the correct measure

The Near Eastern or Biblical cubit is usually estimated as approximately 46 cm (18 in).[9][10] In Deuteronomy 3:11 it is referred to as the 'standard cubit' in the New King James Version and the 'common cubit' in the Revised Standard Version. The King James Version refers here to the 'cubit of a man'.

Too much information?

Why?

I simply converted cubits to inches and feet for the benefit of fellow members. So assuming Wikipedia is correct in the conversion charts it would make the giant hypothesis true, at least for the period and if you believe the Bible/Talmud.

Or is it "too much information" because it doesn't jive with your OP?

originally posted by: Kukri


Too much information?

Why??

Because you are talking about a bed, not the person who slept in it.

originally posted by: Kukri

I simply converted cubits to inches and feet for the benefit of fellow members. So assuming Wikipedia is correct in the conversion charts it would make the giant hypothesis true, at least for the period and if you believe the Bible/Talmud.

The oldest text of Samuel (dead sea scrolls), states 4 cubits, which is corroborated by other contemporary sources, anything after that is irrelevant for the purposes of his height, but valuable to understand myth making.

Goliath's stature grew at the hand of narrators or scribes: the oldest manuscripts—the Dead Sea Scrolls text of Samuel, the 1st century historian Josephus, and the 4th century Septuagint manuscripts—all give his height as "four cubits and a span" (6 feet 9 inches or 2.06 metres) whereas the Masoretic Text gives this as "six cubits and a span" (9 feet 9 inches or 2.97 metres;

en.wikipedia.org...