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T.L. Osborne has raised over 100 people from the dead in Africa.
originally posted by: Oannes
Just because we aren't capable of resurrection, doesn't mean that Jesus or Ets can't. Actually, any race advanced enough would probably achieve this eventually. We can clone already. Who's to say there aren't others out there who can achieve much more?
originally posted by: windword
a reply to: Murgatroid
The 'swoon' theory has been disregarded by almost all scholars.
I'm so sick of this kind of BS when it come to the fallacies of religion, and specifically, the resurrection of Jesus. What you really mean is, most intellectually dishonest, biased Christian Bible scholars disregard the "swoon" theory.
People don't rise from the dead. If Jesus existed, and the stories are to be believed in the slightest, then Jesus survived his ordeal. Either that, or people were making stuff up. Bodies don't come back from the dead.
originally posted by: FurvusRexCaeli
Bollocks! Had his suffering-or-not been controversial it would most likely NOT have been any references to it
Of course it was controversial. And of course controversies are the subject of creeds. That's why they had councils and wrote creeds--to resolve controversies. The really big ones, back in the day, were primarily Christological. That's why the Son gets so much attention in the Nicene Creed, the Father only a brief introduction, and the Holy Spirit is just a footnote. The Creed emphasizes the distinct personhood of the Son vis-a-vis the other persons of the godhead, that this person (the Son) and not the others suffered, and that the suffering was real.
It doesn't say giving up his spirit. It says giving up his pnauma, his breath, his lungs stop working. I did that once meself actually. Had to go through the exact same procedure as Jesus too actually, but I am still alive. To stop breathing doesn't mean that you die. It means you stop breathing. Like I said, it happens, no death need apply.
If you want to cherry-pick definitions and ignore context, sure. We could also say Jesus "gave up his flatulence" and let loose a mighty fart. It would be contrary to a couple thousand years of unbroken tradition, but if we were really obstinate, we could force that reading onto the text.
Of course, it's not only the Gospels that say Jesus died. Paul says so, in 1 Cor 15:3. John of Patmos says so in Rev 1:5. Clement of Rome says so in 1 Clem 24:1. And there's Ignatius of Anticoch in his letter to the Ephesians (19:1). And Irenaeus in Against Heresies (V.7). It was the universal belief of the Ante-Nicene Church that Jesus died on Golgotha.
What ever happened to «Jesus died to atone for the sins of humankind?» Try to question that in front of a packed Easter Mass. You don't wanna do that. Trust me.
Right, it's generally considered bad form to go to a religious observance and start theological arguments in the middle of the ritual. Some religions, in some places, would have tortured you or killed you for that. Rudeness is not tolerated equally around the globe.
originally posted by: Utnapisjtim
a reply to: Pinocchio
Catholicism is a pact with Satan, easy as that. Satan can't walk properly, priests aren't allowed to, you know. Result of the shambles is a bunch of sacraments some sort of soul-pact over the destinies of man. They seem to basically fight over who can be the most disgraceful and deceiving. And matched against the level of cheering and worship from the crowd at their feet. They love their art and furniture way more than they love their subjects.
originally posted by: Oannes
Jesus has an ability that goes beyond anything were capable of. He can open a hole in space time. It is known as the Ru gate. If you see images of Jesus in a gate way (usually seated) that's him parting the fabric of existence. There's even a church near my place that depicts this very thing. This is also why he is known as the King of Tear. There are even 16th century paintings showing him opening a fiery hole in space time. Never limit what he is capable of. CERN is trying to do the exact same thing, and look at how they have to achieve it. Not even a close second.
Well, there's not even evidence of Jesus having ever existed anyway, no proof of a historic Jesus outside of the Bible.
Scholars generally consider Tacitus's reference to the execution of Jesus by Pontius Pilate to be both authentic, and of historical value as an independent Roman source.
Tacitus, another second-century Roman writer who alleged that Christ had been executed by sentence of Pontius Pilate, is likewise cited by Righi. Written some time after 117 C.E., Tacitus' claim is more of the same late, second-hand "history." There is no mention of "Jesus," only "the sect known as Christians" living in Rome being persecuted, and "their founder, one Christus." Tacitus claims no first-hand knowledge of Christianity. No historical evidence exists that Nero persecuted Christians--Nero did persecute Jews, so perhaps Tacitus was confused. There was certainly not a "great crowd" of Christians in Rome around 60 C.E., as Tacitus put it, and, most damning, the term "Christian" was not even in use in the first century. No one in the second century ever quoted this passage of Tacitus. In fact, it appears almost word-for-word in the fourth-century writings of Sulpicius Severus, where it is mixed with other obvious myths. Citing Tacitus, therefore, is highly suspect and adds virtually nothing to the evidence for a historical Jesus.
Such are the straws believers must grasp in order to prop up their myth.
originally posted by: Utnapisjtim
a reply to: SlapMonkey
I was banished from my first church when I was sixteen. They said the music we played made them all wiggly and funny making them think forbidden thoughts, so they decided we were the devil and tossed the whole band out, cursing us banning us from ever returning. I was from another town so no big deal for me, but the other two were actually going there like every week, so for them it was pretty hairy afterwards. I don't think they were ever admitted back. So much for the Heavy Rock of Peter....