Legalising war crimes: USA has gone too far

Maybe the USA only wants embedded journalists covering their war zones so they won't report anything the Pentagon doesn't approve of?

They learned from Vietnam. When Anericans were shown the damage, the killing and mayhem up front and close. It helped form the anti war movements.

Now they want some uber hip VICE type "journalist" to go to Ukraine or Venezuela in order to spin a US friendly perspective, wrapped around hipster prowess.

Journalism is dead. It has been for some time. 95% of our media is warped by money.

a reply to: JeanPaul

Hmm no that's not it.

What else you got?

a reply to: JeanPaul

Now they want some uber hip VICE type "journalist" to go to Ukraine or Venezuela in order to spin a US friendly perspective, wrapped around hipster prowess.

Most Americans are unaware of the American troops occupying Caracas! Since you are obviously much better informed, why don't you post some video of the United States war crimes there?

a reply to: NavyDoc

Can you show me where the Geneva convention outlaws depleted uranium and can you show me some real science (not hysterical stuff) that depleted uranium is any more "evil" than any other hyper dense material?

Yes i could show you evidence but the images would be against ats terms and conditions... do a google search for high denstiy of babies in iraq being born with severe deformoties..

originally posted by: purplemer
a reply to: NavyDoc

Can you show me where the Geneva convention outlaws depleted uranium and can you show me some real science (not hysterical stuff) that depleted uranium is any more "evil" than any other hyper dense material?

Yes i could show you evidence but the images would be against ats terms and conditions... do a google search for high denstiy of babies in iraq being born with severe deformoties..

Considering that Saddam is known to have used chemical weapons, that is not surprising.

a reply to: DJW001

Considering that Saddam is known to have used chemical weapons, that is not surprising

i can present you with the facts its up to you want research them or just add a throw away opinion...

kind regards

purp..

originally posted by: purplemer
a reply to: NavyDoc

Can you show me where the Geneva convention outlaws depleted uranium and can you show me some real science (not hysterical stuff) that depleted uranium is any more "evil" than any other hyper dense material?

Yes i could show you evidence but the images would be against ats terms and conditions... do a google search for high denstiy of babies in iraq being born with severe deformoties..

Correlation vs causation. Scary pictures of babies do nothing to prove a cause. Consider all of the other chemical exposures in Iraq from petrochemicals, to burning plastics, poor hygiene, poor prenatal care.

From actual measurements, if a tank crewman were to stay continuously inside a "heavy armor" tank that uses DU armor panels, fully loaded with only DU ammunition, with the gun pointed to the rear to maximize any exposure - 24 hours a day, 365 days a year - he would receive only about 25 percent of the permitted annual dose. Since nobody sits inside such a tank 24/7 for an entire year, exposure levels from realistic times, such as 900 hours per training year, are about the same dosage you might receive from cosmic radiation on a round-trip between New York and Los Angeles.

These are proven facts. They result from actual measurements that anyone can reproduce. They are not open to discussion, argument, or conjecture. They are what they are, and nobody can change them.

DU: the myth that won't go away

Secondly, for something to be a "war crime" it has to be intentional. Nothing has demonstrated any intentional attempt to cause birth defects in Iraq.

Somebody needs to study up on what a war crime actually is other than Huffpo.

originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: JeanPaul

Now they want some uber hip VICE type "journalist" to go to Ukraine or Venezuela in order to spin a US friendly perspective, wrapped around hipster prowess.

Most Americans are unaware of the American troops occupying Caracas! Since you are obviously much better informed, why don't you post some video of the United States war crimes there?

VICE, very subtlety and sometimes not so subtlety (as was the case with their Venezuelan coverage) back the Pentagon's play. You think Obama and Joe Biden would go on and lap it up with Shane Smith if they were actually hard hitting investigative journalists objectively covering US foreign policy?

I liked VICE when they first came out but I slowly began to notice how they reported on the Venezuelan and Ukrainian situations. It's not objective journalism. They have some good journalists (working for pennies) but the big stories involving US foreign policy are slanted. They reported in favor of the Venezuelan protestors and in favor of the Ukrainian's seeking to join NATO and hence backed the USG's play in both nations.

a reply to: JeanPaul

Translation - they dont back putler and your sad.

a reply to: NavyDoc

Secondly, for something to be a "war crime" it has to be intentional. Nothing has demonstrated any intentional attempt to cause birth defects in Iraq.

If you use a wepon with known side effects then its use is intentional. Would you give DU to your pregnant wife..?

originally posted by: purplemer
a reply to: NavyDoc

Secondly, for something to be a "war crime" it has to be intentional. Nothing has demonstrated any intentional attempt to cause birth defects in Iraq.

If you use a wepon with known side effects then its use is intentional. Would you give DU to your pregnant wife..?

Have there been controlled studies to prove that these alleged side effects exist?

a reply to: JeanPaul

I liked VICE when they first came out but I slowly began to notice how they reported on the Venezuelan and Ukrainian situations. It's not objective journalism. They have some good journalists (working for pennies) but the big stories involving US foreign policy are slanted. They reported in favor of the Venezuelan protestors and in favor of the Ukrainian's seeking to join NATO and hence backed the USG's play in both nations.

In other words, you only like news that is biased to support your personal beliefs. You probably think that the Neo-Nazis occupying Donetsk are valiant freedom fighters, and that the coalition government in Kyiv, which includes Russian speakers and Jews are all Nazis. You probably think that Venezuela's command economy would be perfect if not foe secret United States subversion. Venezuela's economy is in a shambles because that brand of socialism just doesn't work. Price controls don't stop inflation, it stops merchants from selling their goods and services at a loss.

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: JeanPaul

Translation - they dont back putler and your sad.

Calling Putin another Hitler is ahistoric.

Anyhow, one need not "back Putin" to realize what the USG did to provoke the Ukrainian situation. My view on the situation isn't some binary good vs evil nonsense so many Americans are being sold. Both sides are wrong. VICE "news" is incapable of this sort of objectivity and thus just another blowhorn for the Pentagons policies. As subtle as it may be. What's your excuse?

originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: JeanPaul

I liked VICE when they first came out but I slowly began to notice how they reported on the Venezuelan and Ukrainian situations. It's not objective journalism. They have some good journalists (working for pennies) but the big stories involving US foreign policy are slanted. They reported in favor of the Venezuelan protestors and in favor of the Ukrainian's seeking to join NATO and hence backed the USG's play in both nations.

In other words, you only like news that is biased to support your personal beliefs. You probably think that the Neo-Nazis occupying Donetsk are valiant freedom fighters, and that the coalition government in Kyiv, which includes Russian speakers and Jews are all Nazis.

I know for a fact the Right Sector and Svoboda parties are actual fascists. The ones in charge of Ukrainian state security.

If some peoples heads weren't lodged so far up their own ...people would admit these things.

www.jta.org...

My personal "beliefs" surround the fact that both the US and Russia should let Ukraine develop without imperialistic strings attached. I advocate actual democracy- not the sort IMF will push on working Ukrainians. Dam sure not the sort Russia will push.


"You probably think that Venezuela's command economy...."


You don't even know what a command economy is. Stop wasting my time.

a reply to: DJW001

Yes there is evidence if you choose to look no here has chosen to look instead peeps would rather use words to wriggle out of an uncormatable postition.

OFC using DU its a war crime...!

Torture is a war crime.

Invading a sorverign state or two without just cause is a war crime

about 1.5 million peeps dead due to the occupation mostly women and children (theres you scientific study) only one sofar on the death causalties of the war) is a war crime

shall i continue..?

a reply to: NavyDoc

Are you a navy doc are you going to anwser my question.

Would you feed depleted uranium to your wife if she was carrying you baby

plently of docters have come out and stated there is a correlation here. British ones included.. ofc its war crime problem is no one has a big enough stick to prosocute atm. That will change and ever solider will be held to account for his actions in accordence to the geneva convention. dont forget what happened with the nazis and the nuremburg trials.

these wars where not ratified by the un.. well out of the remit of internation law and slippy tonqued peeps still like to defend these actions.. you might think different if it was your family in the mix..

a reply to: purplemer

Yes there is evidence if you choose to look no here has chosen to look instead peeps would rather use words to wriggle out of an uncormatable postition.

I didn't say "evidence," I said "controlled study." I have seen photographs of malnourished children, thank you. What I want is a scientific study that can justify your claims. If you cannot provide a link to such a study, all you are doing is spreading false propaganda.

OFC using DU its a war crime...!

Please provide a citation from the treaty that makes the use of depleted uranium a war crime.

Torture is a war crime.

Define "torture."

Invading a sorverign state or two without just cause is a war crime

No, it is just war.

about 1.5 million peeps dead due to the occupation mostly women and children (theres you scientific study) only one sofar on the death causalties of the war) is a war crime

Please back this statement up with references.

shall i continue..?

Absolutely! Provide:
1. Link to a controlled study of the side effects of depleted uranium
2. Link to a treaty that bans the use of depleted uranium
3. Link to a treaty that defines torture and forbids its use on non-uniformed combatants (partisans).
4. Link to a treaty which legally requires a causus belli
5. Link to a reliable source that indicates that most of the Iraqis killed during the American occupation were women and children.

Or you can admit that your just a Baathist propagandist who thinks using nerve gas on Kurds is funny.

a reply to: purplemer

Would you feed depleted uranium to your wife if she was carrying you baby

Would you feed lead to your wife? You are posing an incredibly stupid question. The purpose of munitions is to kill.

a reply to: DJW001

.

I didn't say "evidence," I said "controlled study." I have seen photographs of malnourished children

I suggest a better google search because there are many picutres of deformed chidren theat goes far beyond malunourishment..

In regards to the lancet report i dont need to link look it up. It gets a lot of critism because the death toll is so high but to date is the only peer reviewed study done on the total death toll. If you dont think it mostly women and children look at the states yourself

Studies again they are there if we choose to look

Military research on mice shows that depleted uranium can enter the bloodstream and come to rest in bones, the brain, kidneys and lymph nodes. Other research in rats shows that DU can result in cancerous tumors and genetic mutations, and pass from mother to unborn child, resulting in birth defects. Iraqi doctors reported significant increases in birth defects and childhood cancers after the 1991 invasion. Iraqi authorities "found that uranium, which affected the blood cells, had a serious impact on health: The number of cases of leukemia had increased considerably, as had the incidence of fetal deformities," the U.N. reported.

Depleted uranium can also contaminate soil and water, and coat buildings with radioactive dust, which can by carried by wind and sandstorms.

www.nbcnews.com...-37tQ


More studies..

A study performed in April of 2007 by researchers at the University of Southern Maine concluded that, “exposure to particulate DU may pose a significant genotoxic risk (risk of genetic mutation) and could possibly result in lung cancer." A paper published in the same year in the scientific journal, 'Science of the Total Environment,' found high concentrations of DU particles in soil, stream sediments, as well as household dust in the vicinity of a DU weapons factory in Colonie, New York 23 years after the plant had closed and despite massive efforts at clean up by the U.S. Army Corp of engineers.

It also presented the fact that traces of DU contamination still remain in the urine of former workers and neighbors of the plant.

www.disabled-world.com...

Depleted uranium as a war crime...

The illegal use of DU as sanctioned by the UN

United Nations Commission on Human Rights. Many of the tanks employed in Iraq fire DU-coated projectiles, and many experts insist that the larger missiles used in “shock and awe” were also DU coated. In any case the U.S. concedes it uses DU weapons, but insists, in the face of overwhelming opinion to the contrary, the DU weapons are not illegal. 1 5 However, as UN and other experts argue, DU weapons can be considered illegal because of the prohibitions in The Hague Convention of 1907 on poisons, the 1925 Protocol on Gases, Protocol I of the 1983 Convention on “Conventional” weapons that prohibits non-detectible fragments 1 6 and because they are indiscriminate. DU particles cannot be contained to the legal field of battle, cannot be “disengaged” when the war is over, cause medical catastrophes (cancer, birth defects, genetic damage, and the like) long after the cessation of hostilities and are therefore inhumane, and pollute the environmen

www.consumersforpeace.org...

How bad is depleted uranium

Doctors in southern Iraq are making comparisons to the birth defects that followed the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki in WWII and have numerous pictures of infants who have been born without brains, internal organs outside of their bodies, no sexual organs, no spines, and other deformities. Birth defects of these kinds were exceptionally rare in Iraq before the large scale use of DU weapons; now they are commonplace. Mothers no longer ask, 'Doctor, is it a boy or a girl?' Instead they ask, 'Doctor, is my child normal?

Now i dont expect you to agree with me i guess you will argue the points. I dont mind what you want to think and no it not just war. We have protcol put in place to stop what nazi germany did in the second world war. Its a sad fact that nations today want to side step such protocal.

Will we ever learn from our mistakes

kind regards

purp.

a reply to: DJW001

Would you feed lead to your wife? You are posing an incredibly stupid question. The purpose of munitions is to kill.

Yes you are correct but there are internation laws in place that dictate when a war is over the use of ammunitions ceases. How do you do that with DU