It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Obamacare will lower your premiums! Wait, oops...

page: 5
17
<< 2  3  4   >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Jun, 4 2015 @ 04:32 AM
link   
a reply to: buster2010

Yep there is
Most of Europe dumped most their defense expenditure over the past 50 years and they begged the US to defend them.


That why our defense cost is so high.




posted on Jun, 5 2015 @ 08:02 AM
link   

originally posted by: tothetenthpower
a reply to: peskyhumans


This is a direct contradiction to the "facts" presented by Obama right before passing Obamacare into law. He said that increased competition would reduce premiums for everyone, and that in order to help Obamacare stay on budget, they would find ways to make medical care more cost-effective and efficient.


Ah no..that would have only happened had there been actual competition, like a state or fed sponsored plan for the insurance companies to compete with.


So what happened? I thought Obamacare was going to be a socialist utopia of medicine. Everyone gets covered, premiums are reduced for everyone, and medicine becomes cheaper everywhere? Somehow we ended up with the complete opposite - millions are not covered and have to pay fines because of the mandate, medicine is more expensive than ever, and premiums keep rising.


That's because the public option was stripped from the bill or any discussions about the bill.

Effectively what Obamacare turned out to be, was a giant hand out to the insurance companies, without any framework that forces them to level the playing field in costs or quality of service.

Which I imagine, is just what they wanted anyway.

~Tenth


And the best thing about it? It's a wholly owned Democrat fiasco. THEY stripped the public option, THEY handed the insurance companies the goose that lays the golden egg.

Not one Republican vote for it. Not one.

They stripped the public option to appease Joe Lieberman. To get his vote.

Backdoor deals, appeasements, and not a single bit of bipartisan cooperation has given us a total mess of a law.

You cannot add all those uninsured people, most of whom were low income and were put into the Medicare system, and expect premiums to NOT rise sky high!

Now, we are forced to buy into a destined to fail system.

They should have tackled medical costs, and lawsuit reform. Period. Lower costs first, cover everyone at a later date.

I've went on record here before saying I fully support a national healthcare system in the US, 100%. There are zero valid reasons not to support it, IMO. And the Democrats had an opportunity to do that, yet they caved for one man.

They put the cart before the horse, and of course, it's not going to work.



edit on 5-6-2015 by poncho1982 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 5 2015 @ 10:25 AM
link   
a reply to: poncho1982

And what has the other side done to get the option back in?

All they want to to do is scrape the whole thing and go back to how it was.



posted on Jun, 5 2015 @ 10:51 AM
link   
a reply to: Aazadan

What you missed in defending pharma was the injection of competition in pricing structure and consumer choice. Matters of patent infringement would of course come to light if firms were actually allowed to market in the US.

The real gist of the link provided was how to write a simple bill in Congress that removes the ability of the medical industry as a whole to price fix, collude on pricing, charge people differently for same service, avoid anti-trust violations, not price service prior to the service etc.

Using automobile example, you drop car off for an alternator and upon pickup are presented with a bill that includes facility costs, tool purchase, diagnostic by several mechanics, an electronic equipment charge, oil and fluid change that was not needed and an emergency wrecker team never utilized - the final billing $3750.

In the hypothetical above your insurance covers all but $37.50 which is your garage visit cost with insurance.

As you are leaving you overhear outrage as next customer exclaims "what do you mean I owe $5000 for an alternator?"

Do you see the problem???

How long before the auto repair industry needs an Ocarcare bill to continue operating as always?

Right now Insurance and government collusion is serving to cover up that which is economically untenable by fooling the people that they need insurance for most if not all medical service never once getting to the true reason costs are out of sight.

That reason is governmental exceptions to laws applying to all other businesses allowing excesses to occur.



posted on Jun, 5 2015 @ 11:05 AM
link   

originally posted by: beezzer
a reply to: peskyhumans


Imagine TSA now running your healthcare.


Giving prostate exams while going thru airport security!!



posted on Jun, 5 2015 @ 11:09 AM
link   

originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: poncho1982

And what has the other side done to get the option back in?

All they want to to do is scrape the whole thing and go back to how it was.


What we had was better than what we have now.

Yes, I just said that.

I never said the other side wanted the public option, just that I did.

My point is the other side was NEVER even allowed to put their input into the ACA. So, we don't know what the bill would have been like, because they were essentially locked out.
edit on 5-6-2015 by poncho1982 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 5 2015 @ 11:15 AM
link   

originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: poncho1982

And what has the other side done to get the option back in?

All they want to to do is scrape the whole thing and go back to how it was.


The "other side" is strapped with a "less than 60" Senate and a President unwilling to bend and sign.




posted on Jun, 5 2015 @ 11:23 AM
link   
yeah, it's a good thing the republicans worked with democrats trying to make healthcare affordable and...oh yeah, they didn't....well, at least the republicans brought up sensible ideas to fund....oh...that's right...they voted to kill the act over 52 times....well, now that they have the control the entire congress maybe they can work with the next president to drive down insurance costs for the ACA....oh that's right...they are actively vowing to repeal it....
the motto of the republican 2016 election should be "working to make the top 10% of this country wealthier, and get the bottom 90% to pay for it"



posted on Jun, 5 2015 @ 11:24 AM
link   
a reply to: xuenchen

It's no matter which side of the aisle so long as their result amounts to nothing more than cost shifting all the while the crooks keep getting their due and politicians get lots of lobby money from insurers, medical groups and big pharma never getting to the real solution.



posted on Jun, 5 2015 @ 11:28 AM
link   

originally posted by: jimmyx
yeah, it's a good thing the republicans worked with democrats trying to make healthcare affordable and...oh yeah, they didn't....well, at least the republicans brought up sensible ideas to fund....oh...that's right...they voted to kill the act over 52 times....well, now that they have the control the entire congress maybe they can work with the next president to drive down insurance costs for the ACA....oh that's right...they are actively vowing to repeal it....
the motto of the republican 2016 election should be "working to make the top 10% of this country wealthier, and get the bottom 90% to pay for it"


I'm sorry, were the Republicans even ALLOWED to work with the Democrats on tha ACA?

That's right, no they were not.

They brought up MANY sensible ideas. Tort reform, and lowering medical costs.

Yes, they have voted to kill it. As they should, because it is going to collapse under it's own weight, and then there will be collateral damage.

The Democrats campaign slogan should be, "Equally poor for everyone."



posted on Jun, 5 2015 @ 11:31 AM
link   
a reply to: jimmyx

OMG, have you even asked yourself who really beniffitted from passage of ACA both business and politician?

I think high time partisanship on this subject go away as its allowing just the type atmosphere where the people ignore the elephant in the room so they can scabble for crumbs of their choice.

Meanwhile business as usual.



posted on Jun, 5 2015 @ 12:41 PM
link   
a reply to: buster2010
LOL
I had medical insurance.
My employer dropped our group so we were all forced onto much more expensive.....covering almost nothing....ACA.



posted on Jun, 5 2015 @ 04:54 PM
link   
I got a call yesterday from our program manager at work about our health care. It's going up. A LOT! They don't know WHAT to do! Thank GOD, it will not effect me (yet- but they will find a way) as I'm a veteran with over 20 years active duty and I receive health care through Tri Care. I don't know how people are going to manage. It really needs to be free for all!



posted on Jun, 16 2015 @ 08:22 PM
link   
I am new here and have read several posts in several forums already (just signed up last night), and have seen many unkind responses to the opinions of others. I desperately hope that my words won't offend someone. And hope that I am not attacked for my own opinions (to which, I believe, the United States Constitution still gives me). I am ill and don't think that I can take much more pain. So, if you disagree with me, please be kind. I have no ill-will for anyone with another opinion. I don't think of opposing opinions as coming from someone who is crazy, stupid, or worthless. My sincere wish is that none would think poorly of me, either. If your opinion differs from mine, I respect your right to hold your own opinion and ask that you afford me the same consideration.

I am a 60 year old female with health issues. Our insurance premiums have risen 30% and we've lost both vision and dental coverage, AND we now have a higher deductible - and now prescriptions aren't even counted toward the deductible. My husband is working past retirement age, just so that we can have 'good' insurance - and now it's nowhere close to 'good'. While we certainly believe everyone should have access to healthcare, surely there must have been a better way - and as we understand it, there are still millions of folks who have no access to healthcare. I can't understand why people aren't marching en masse on Washington, demanding a better solution or at least a return to the days before "ACA" (talk about a misnomer!). However, I fear we've gone too far to ever get back.

Not only have all the financial demands of an insurance policy skyrocketed - now if my doctor orders a test, procedure, or surgery, the insurance can't pay any part of it unless a separate government entity approves it - no matter how badly that I may need it or how much my doctor wants to relieve me. There's no such thing as 'elective surgery' anymore - not unless you can afford and want to pay the whole outrageous bill yourself. And it doesn't matter how much pain a patient is in - if the powers that be don't consider it life-threatening or totally debilitating, then surgery is a no-go. That means that the only alternative is pain medication.

Under new regulations, for my doctor to prescribe pain meds, I have to physically GO TO his office for a new written prescription every month - no matter how inconvenient that may be for someone who is in constant pain, can't work, and has difficulty getting there. The insurance premiums are so high that we had to sell our car and so now have only the SUV my husband drives to work. So when I need a new prescription (EVERY month), my husband must TAKE OFF WORK to go get it - in a different town than the one he works in - so he misses a couple of hours of work every month for that. As I've been told by my doctor, many doctors won't do 'pain management' anymore because of the hassle of the regulations. Therefore they have to send patients to a 'pain management center' - even if there isn't one nearby.

What a mess! Politicians. God help us! Perhaps they'll soon decide that if a patient is ill, in pain, and can't be productive, they'll just euthanize us. In my case, there are many days when THAT would be a blessing. Just sayin'.

I didn't vote for Obama, but had (what have proven to be) FOOLISH HOPES that he would do America good in some way - or would, at the very least, do us no harm. No hope of that anymore. We can only hold out hope that our nation will survive his reign. However, that seems doubtful, I fear.



posted on Jun, 16 2015 @ 08:49 PM
link   
It's not Obama who's raising the premiums, it's the heath care industry who are taking a hit.

Given the fact that they now have to cover a lot of stuff that they didn't before, it was only logical.



posted on Jun, 16 2015 @ 09:18 PM
link   

originally posted by: babybunnies
It's not Obama who's raising the premiums, it's the heath care industry who are taking a hit.

Given the fact that they now have to cover a lot of stuff that they didn't before, it was only logical.


But Obama insisted that premiums would be lower.




posted on Jun, 17 2015 @ 04:30 AM
link   

originally posted by: xuenchen
But Obama insisted that premiums would be lower.


For people who had insurance that is considered adequate premiums did go down. Most people had rather poor health insurance that was nearly worthless in the event of catastrophe, hence all the stories you may have read of people who would get financially wiped out despite having insurance. For the people that were buying the right plans, prices did go down. For everyone else who wasn't buying the right plans premiums went up, but that's because they were paying for something masquerading as health insurance in the first place.



new topics

top topics



 
17
<< 2  3  4   >>

log in

join