I bet the German Co-pilot was on Anti-Depressants

a reply to: andy06shake

Agree with you plus in all the supposition going on here, its not known whether other medication which reacted badly with anti depressants wasn't being taken.

a reply to: thekaboose

Hey I never took that view when reading your post - we're cool.

a reply to: kosmicjack

Have you read about the unintended consequences of guns?
Have you seen the many threads here on ATS on how guns have negatively impacted people?

Its absurd to blame the manufacturer, be it guns or pharmaceuticals unless there is evidence of a faulty product, gross negligence etc.

a reply to: boymonkey74

It's a tough choice...lots of people top themselves because of these drugs, that much is known.

Remember we had so-called 'suicide pockets' here in the UK not too long ago, i think that was due to teenagers being prescribed SSRI's like sweets a few years ago. There was a pocket of about 17 or 18 kids killing themselves in Port Talbot i seem to remember.

I had an interesting talk with a GP a few years ago when i was after something to help me sleep (insomnia)..she reached for her script book and started writing a chit for antidepressants straight away...i asked what the drugs were, she told me and i said, no thanks, i can't sleep and don't fancy adding suicidal thoughts to the list!

She looked at me and told me that around 70% of ALL British Men, Women AND Children were regularly taking antidepressants in Britain at that time..which was ironic, as i left her surgery feeling pretty bloody depressed.

Refused the suicide pills needless to say!

a reply to: Shiloh7

Personally i imagine life these days or more precisely the quality of life one experiences has rather more to do with the route problems regarding depression.

That chemical imbalance is a direct result of the experiences and everyday occurrences that lead to a depressive state. Trying to address the issue by substituting one mentally induced state for another chemically induced stare rarely alleviates the problem and to be quite frank doesn't even begin to address the depression or reason for such in any appropriate manner.

As to the issue of the co pilots actions, chemically induced or otherwise we will probably never know what actually transpired.

Which is why they should incorporate live video feed to some kind of ground control facility regarding commercial aviation, after all if a picture paints a thousand words then video does even better.

a reply to: WineAndCheese9

Sertraline, more commonly known as Zoloft across the water, has worked wonderfully for me. Does that make me a shill? I'm a pleasant guy (Most the time), if anything it's made me even more calm. It's very much steadied my chemically imbalanced brain.

Antidepressants aren't without their side effects, it's about finding one that works and whether or not the benefits out-way the negatives. Everyone's different of course

a reply to: OnionHead

You do relies through that anti depressants simply alleviate the problem. They do nothing to address the cause of the depression short of the condition being of a clinical nature

If you had a headache that was constantly there you would not just keep taking Paracetamol to fix the situation. Obviously further study would be required to address the root cause of the symptoms. It should be the same regarding mental illness.

And I bet people with heart bypasses have more heart attacks than the average person. Therefore, heart bypasses cause heart attacks!

Nice logic there, OP.

prozac is known making humans suicital zombie's...
ofcourse the pharma maffia denies it

a reply to: kosmicjack

Why is it big pharma's fault?

How many people have taken and are taking these meds and have had their lives restored to them? How many instances do we know of where people have reacted badly?

I think this goes back to society's hangup with the idea of mental instability and how to deal with it properly. It isn't as simple as popping a pill, and even if the pills are going to help you regain your mental balance, it will take a period of months before you really settle out and are fully stable.

But very few understand this.

originally posted by: andy06shake
a reply to: OnionHead

You do relies through that anti depressants simply alleviate the problem. They do nothing to address the cause of the depression short of the condition being of a clinical nature

If you had a headache that was constantly there you would not just keep taking Paracetamol to fix the situation. Obviously further study would be required to address the root cause of the symptoms. It should be the same regarding mental illness.

I do more or less have a headache that is always there. I have chronic migraine. It was why I was put on anti-depressants. Some of them can also be used for migraine prophylaxis.

In my case, they more or less know that migraines are somehow genetic, and they even know the underlying mechanics behind them. They know they are somehow related to epilepsy without really being epilepsy, but none of that has brought them closer to a cure.

So until them, they do what they can to find the combination of treatments for each individual patient that best addresses and controls our symptoms.

I am guessing that depression is much the same.

originally posted by: andy06shake
a reply to: OnionHead

You do relies through that anti depressants simply alleviate the problem. They do nothing to address the cause of the depression short of the condition being of a clinical nature

If you had a headache that was constantly there you would not just keep taking Paracetamol to fix the situation. Obviously further study would be required to address the root cause of the symptoms. It should be the same regarding mental illness.

Some of the time brain chemistry itself is the cause of the problem. Our brains are run on chemicals, and having one chemical being out of whack can cause all sorts of perceptual changes in one's reality.

There doesn't have to be some element in a person's life to make them depressed, or some underlying psychological disorder. Simply by bringing the levels of serotonin into an "average" range helps millions of people.

I get really upset at the suspicion and hostility on ATS for people that are against antidepressants. Not everyone in the scientific community is out to screw us over and control our minds. Remember, these drugs came about due to research and study of the brain.

a reply to: ketsuko

Good posts from yourself and MystikMushroom, definitely along my way of thinking. You know, rather than embracing ignorance.

As you pointed out, antidepressants can also serve other purposes. Like your good self I've also been troubled with headache/migraine most of my days, I'm now in my mid thirties, 10 years ago (Or there about's) I was referred to one of the best neurologists in the country. My GP referred to him as (No lie) "A bit of an odd bastard", fine by me as I'm a bit odd myself. True enough he was an odd bastard but he described my constant sore head as a migraine that hasn't or wont come to a head (Pun excused).

After an MRI pushed for by myself, which showed normal, he prescribed Amitriptyline ( An Tricyclic antidepressant), a beta-blocker, and aspirin. And it worked. Bear in mind that prescription drugs are free here, so no hidden agenda.

From experience, Zoloft is also prescribed to treat OCD. For example if you have a patient that has OCD, and they've done some research or has an interest in medicine. Rather than go to the Dr and tell them they've OCD and go through that process and be branded an OCD'er, they could much more easily say their depressed and push for Zoloft as treatment.

I've went off on one regarding alternative treatments using antidepressants, apologies.

Chemical imbalances, some Dr's entertain the notion, some don't. I personally believe that some people have a genuine chemical imbalance, and it needs medication. I guess some people are just geared differently.

How can I tie all this blabber into the OP, well.. antidepressants don't suddenly make you lose your morales or change yourself to the point were you'll harm others. That evil is present in you before you start.

as a long-time consumer of anti-depressant pills i can say that at no time have i ever considered taking anyone else with me when attempting suicide. this is of course only my own perspective, however i feel that there may be a danger of labelling 'depressed' as 'dangerous', judging by some of the headlines i am reading.

a reply to: MystikMushroom

Sounds like clinical depression your are describing, i did say "short of the condition being of a clinical nature".

I relies there are multiple forms of depression with numerous different and varied causes. In a way thats part of the problem regarding our GPs handing out anti depressants like candy. Considering they simply do not have adequate mental health care and/or resources available to address the problems people seem to face in today world. So the only means available is to resort to prescription medication.

Its not the scientific community we need to worry about, its the people and organisations the profit that should be called into question.

a reply to: andy06shake

Edit: This was directed at an earlier post.

I take your point. You do have people that are depressed and that genuinely don't know why, chemical imbalance? I don't know. Some Dr's are hesitant to that way of thinking. You know you go to an old family Irish GP and he'll tell you to take up a new hobby and stop drinking too much, you go to a younger generation Dr and they'll tell you you're chemically imbalanced and should be medicated. It's hard to treat if you don't know the cause. It's never a cure, it's only a helping hand. Unfortunately a magical cure just doesn't exist, so anyone starting an antidepressant thinking it's a cure is sadly mistaken. Then you've people thinking that not only is it a magical cure, it's an instant cure. With any antidepressant your talking 6-8 weeks for full effect.

I agree though, it most cases there's probably an underlying problem that needs addressed. If antidepressants can help someone though that has yet to work out their demons then I support them.

originally posted by: RoScoLaz4
as a long-time consumer of anti-depressant pills i can say that at no time have i ever considered taking anyone else with me when attempting suicide. this is of course only my own perspective, however i feel that there may be a danger of labelling 'depressed' as 'dangerous', judging by some of the headlines i am reading.

I fully agree. Is it any different than being intoxicated and stabbing someone in the street, using alcohol as an excuse. Don't know about you, but if I'm drunk the most your getting is a bear hug and a kiss. That evil has to be in you from the start, nothing to do with antidepressants.

Evil caused this, F all to do with antidepressants and pharmaceutical companies

a reply to: OnionHead

Im not suggesting they dont help, ive been prescribed them myself for the last 4-5 years. Sertraline, Fluoxetine and now Flupentixol in conjunction with Sertraline. I just dont see them as a long term solution yet my GP seems to request i keep on taking the things.

Have they allowed me to address my depression and the problems associated with such? Honestly i dont really know.

Thing is though one has to wonder when enough is enough.

a reply to: andy06shake

I totally understand what your saying, sorry if I came across the wrong way. You're right, they're not a long term solution. My GP described Sertraline/Zoloft as "Ohhh it's a great drug son" lol. What kind of ****** up local GP's I have I don't know. I'd be interested what you think of Sertraline, if anything it's numbing for me. It's you, only a slightly more spaced out numb you. Luckily there's never been a day when I've thought of harming myself, yet alone anyone else. I mean it's never going to suddenly turn the evil switch on, it works for me. I've seen people describe Zoloft as the best drug they've taken and hope to stay on it forever. Personally I hated the fact that I had to take medication, it took a lot of suffering before I could ask for it. I'm one of the chemical imbalanced it seems, I've no real reason to be depressed. I've had tests for just about everything. I'll work away at it, although recently I thought of quitting it. That's when it becomes dangerous, this should definitely be done with the supervision of the GP.

There are strict guidelines for pilots and copilots and they are randomly tested for drugs on a regular basis.
The copilot flew into MT Cimet so for some reason I was thinking he might be suffering from sour stomach.
Don't know if pilots can fly on Tagamet or not?
Fighter pilots chasing through the valleys of the Alps would be held to a higher standard than commercial pilots but still..