Strange lights on dwarf planet Ceres have scientists perplexed

originally posted by: TamtammyMacx
I'm going to go with a Dyson sphere. Looks like the shell got cracked by meteor impacts.

How tiny is the star that it surrounds?

originally posted by: game over man
We need much faster space craft piloted by robots or humans to zip by all of the moons and planets and get a real good look once and for all. I'm hoping this will happen with a private space company. Then the space agencies can build a base on the Moon and launch from there.

Best idea I've come across lately

Although I'm afraid the "private companies" already were thinking about this brilliant idea 100 years ago.

Piloted by robots or humans.., hmmmm.. Got me to think of taxpayers being one species of robots. Greys another. Excellent idea (if your not a taxpayer).

In addition; I believe the "fast spacecraft" you mention are already buzzing around in the solar system. The problem is that the technology could be based on "free" energy and anti-gravity and stuff. -And which could be weaponized by the more creative chimps amongst us if it got out in the open. We may need to mature a tad before that happens.

Although it's not called democracy, for now it's best to have the private companies play around with our tax money in secrecy. In the meantime we can have Apollo and space shuttle missions. And ET's in UFO theories of course.

Anyways good thinking, got me inspired!

originally posted by: raymundoko
a reply to: JadeStar

Your posts have been refreshing in this thread. Thank you for the constant update for users from an informed perspective

You're welcome.

I -think- there will be another set of images taken tomorrow.

Great blog on Ceres here from The Planetary Society...

Great quote on the spots which demonstrates how a scientist overcomes their bias of what they want something to be:

The bright spots generally seem to have an association with craters, so I'm going to assume that they resulted from an impact exposing subsurface, brighter material until I see evidence to the contrary. I won't speculate on what that material is until Dawn gets closer. But we still don't know what is happening on Ceres yet, and have to keep open the possibility that they are volcanic. Why do I prefer the crater interpretation to the volcano interpretation? It's about my geological bias. it would be much more exciting for the bright spots to be volcano-related than crater-related; I really want it to be true that they're volcanic, because then there'd be a more exciting geologic history story to tell. So I have to calibrate my interpretation by dialing down my suspicion that they're volcanic, and insisting mentally that they must be impact-related until someone shows me incontrovertible evidence that they are volcanic. And then I will let myself be excited about volcanism on an asteroid!

Likewise all alien hunters here should keep that bolded part in mind.

Even though she WANTS the source to be volcanos she's going with the exposed ice theory even though it is less exciting, because it is more plausible. If it turns out to be volcanos then she'll be thrilled.

Like I said earlier in the thread, I'd love these spots to infact be "lights" of some sort which is why I am going exactly the opposite direction and looking for natural things which might explain them.

My current theory is that Ceres may have a core which has a lot of radioactive elements like thorium which still heats a deep subsurface ocean. In certain craters the force of the impact that created the crater caused a fissure going down to these deep salty ocean.

Because salty water freezes at a much lower temperature this water oozed onto the surface where it froze but it continues to trickle out in periodic geysers. Water shooting up freezes with frozen "snow" falling down forming a tall column or pillar of ice in Ceres's low gravity which replenishes itself.

originally posted by: wotyathink

originally posted by: game over man
We need much faster space craft piloted by robots or humans to zip by all of the moons and planets and get a real good look once and for all. I'm hoping this will happen with a private space company. Then the space agencies can build a base on the Moon and launch from there.

Best idea I've come across lately

Although I'm afraid the "private companies" already were thinking about this brilliant idea 100 years ago.

Piloted by robots or humans.., hmmmm.. Got me to think of taxpayers being one species of robots. Greys another. Excellent idea (if your not a taxpayer).

In addition; I believe the "fast spacecraft" you mention are already buzzing around in the solar system.

Then why haven't satellite trackers/enthusiasts and amateur astronomers spotted them?

a reply to: Blue Shift

You sure it`s not your avatar sending out signals? I can definitely see a resemblance

Seriously though, it might be explained through natural occurence. But could also be aliens, an outpost perhaps? Who knows.

Great find nonetheless by the OP. S+F

originally posted by: JadeStarThen why haven't satellite trackers/enthusiasts and amateur astronomers spotted them?

Haven't they? Well there could of course be all kind of reasons for why people haven't spot them. But it be a long list and I didn't mean to disturb

just an observation...

the pair of spots in that one crater stay light or bright regardless of the position of the picture taking spacecraft... that would seem to indicate the spots/circles of a brighter or lighter color are not the result of light reflecting off of anything... so they must presently be surface features...

a closer photo/image might reveal that the features are not strictly circular but roundish

now... If a 3rd bright spot appears then we might have something linked to our Earthly Giza Pyramids & the 3 Orion Belt Stars pattern...... & that would be eerie

a reply to: wotyathink

Thank you!

I agree with JadeStar why haven't any of these been seen by professionals, but at a certain distance from Earth, I think they would not be seen. Stars and planets are massive, a small craft, traveling very fast beyond the Moon, would probably remain undetected. The Moon is the only celestial object we can zoom in enough to see the surface from Earth, if I'm not mistaken. Everything else observed from Earth we just see the round planet or moon. So amateur astronomers probably could not catch a craft traveling at extreme rates way out by Mars or farther. In close proximity to Earth, or the Moon, yes, astronomers could observe one. Anything farther, unlikely.

a reply to: St Udio

You know, they will not admit it until they are ordered to, or until the moment whoever is behind those structures, on Ceres, Mars or elsewhere, appears in broad daylight.

NASA won't be the initiator of scientific discovery and interpretation that includes new paradigm, although it offers its service to those who still can do it.

Until now, they have chosen not to do anything with all those "strange" data coming from Moon or from the farthest parts of solar system, or the WOW signal. At least not for the public that includes both me and you, regardless of our views on that.

Perhaps the "others" will, finally. Remains to determine who the others are - the Russians, Chinese, or much farther than them.

a reply to: 2012newstart

NASA won't be the initiator of scientific discovery and interpretation that includes new paradigm, although it offers its service to those who still can do it.

I never completely bought into the "We never went to the moon" fad, but now I'm questioning NASA.

Just tonight I discovered that Apollo15 did not complete the stated mission. They never went on their picture tours using the rover. They stayed within the area of the base camp. I guess they never figured anyone would take a close look.

So yea, NASA has some credibility issues.

originally posted by: game over man
a reply to: wotyathink
The Moon is the only celestial object we can zoom in enough to see the surface from Earth, if I'm not mistaken. Everything else observed from Earth we just see the round planet or moon. So amateur astronomers probably could not catch a craft traveling at extreme rates way out by Mars or farther. In close proximity to Earth, or the Moon, yes, astronomers could observe one. Anything farther, unlikely.

Not saying there's gotta be things going on there, but we do have the dark side of the moon. Some 45% of the moon is never seen from Earth. And which is a curious thing on it's own by the way. So curious that Newton once said "the only thing that gives me a headache is the Moon".

Also astronomy is limited from Earths surface. Astronomy in space (Hubble) has a much larger potential, but may be censored.

Lets say IF some guys are playing around with anti-gravity tech, then faster than light travel may have been achieved. And do we at all see something that travels faster than light?

But OK.... what has been seen or not seen would need to be discussed on UFO forums I guess.

I find the lights on Ceres super exiting but agree with what 2012newstart says - quote:

Until now, they have chosen not to do anything with all those "strange" data coming from Moon or from the farthest parts of solar system, or the WOW signal.

I'm not holding my breath either.

originally posted by: 2012newstart
NASA won't be the initiator of scientific discovery and interpretation that includes new paradigm, although it offers its service to those who still can do it.

Until now, they have chosen not to do anything with all those "strange" data coming from Moon or from the farthest parts of solar system, or the WOW signal. At least not for the public that includes both me and you, regardless of our views on that.

I don't know about that. NASA has been at the forefront of initiating ideas about the solar system based on the data their probes have collected.

Here's an example of NASA astrobiologist Chris McKay (a staunch supporter of the possibility of other life in the solar system) describing the possibility of "Methane-based life" on Titan being one explanation (non-life explanations also exist) for the disequilibrium of certain compounds in Titan's atmosphere, namely hydrogen and acetylene, and proposing that life on Titan is consuming those compounds:

What is Consuming Hydrogen and Acetylene on Titan?

excerpt:

This lack of acetylene is important because that chemical would likely be the best energy source for a methane-based life on Titan, said Chris McKay, an astrobiologist at NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, Calif., who proposed a set of conditions necessary for this kind of methane-based life on Titan in 2005. One interpretation of the acetylene data is that the hydrocarbon is being consumed as food. But McKay said the flow of hydrogen is even more critical because all of their proposed mechanisms involved the consumption of hydrogen.

"We suggested hydrogen consumption because it's the obvious gas for life to consume on Titan, similar to the way we consume oxygen on Earth," McKay said. "If these signs do turn out to be a sign of life, it would be doubly exciting because it would represent a second form of life independent from water-based life on Earth."

Here is an older paper (from 2003) done by a NASA scientist named Geoffrey Landis that discusses research by NASA astrobiologist David Grinspoon about the possibility of life in the clouds of Venus:

Astrobiology: The Case for Venus
NOTE: The link opens directly to a PDF file

Here is an interesting excerpt from that NASA paper. It basically states that there are chemical dis-equilibriums in Venus' atmosphere that suggest the possible presence biological processes:

There is some evidence that the trace-gas constituents of the Venus atmosphere are not in chemical equilibrium with each other. On Earth, the primary source of disequilibrium in theatmospheric chemistry is the activities of biological processing; could disequilibrium on Venusalso be a sign of life? In 1997, David Grinspoon made the suggestion that microbes in the clouds and middle atmosphere could be the source of the disequilibrium. In 2002, Dirk Schulze-Makuch independently proposed that observations of the Venus atmosphere by space probes showed signatures of possible biological activity.

As noted by Grinspoon and Schulze-Makuch, the Venus atmosphere has several trace gasses which are not in chemical equilibrium. The Venera missions and the Pioneer Venus and Magellan probes found that carbon monoxide is scarce in the planet's atmosphere, although solar radiation and lightning should produce it abundantly from carbon dioxide. Hydrogen sulfide and sulfur dioxide, two gases which react with each other and thus should not be found together, are also both present, indicating some process (possibly biological?) is producing them. Finally, although carbonyl sulfide is difficult to produce inorganically, it is present in the Venusian atmosphere. On Earth, this gas would be considered an unambiguous indicator of biological activity. While none of these chemical combinations are in themselves an unambiguous sign of life, it is interesting enough to warrant a more careful look at the atmospheric chemistry.

So NASA is not only collecting the data, they are also doing groundbreaking research and formulating cutting edge hypotheses based on that data. NASA has an entire arm dedicated to looking for life elsewhere in the solar system, galaxy, and universe named the NASA Astrobiology Institute.

Click Link:
NASA Astrobiology Institute.

Anyone got word on the strange lights yet? I searched google and mums the word.

By the way, does anyone else get suspicious of all these recent space activity by NASA? Going here and there, searching and analyzing this and that...it's like we're looking for and exit strategy or something. Is it because we're in a collision course with Andromeda galaxy...like these are baby steps for exiting the planet and eventually our galaxy?

originally posted by: IQPREREQUISITE
Anyone got word on the strange lights yet? I searched google and mums the word.

By the way, does anyone else get suspicious of all these recent space activity by NASA? Going here and there, searching and analyzing this and that...it's like we're looking for and exit strategy or something. Is it because we're in a collision course with Andromeda galaxy...like these are baby steps for exiting the planet and eventually our galaxy?

That merging of the Andromeda Galaxy with the Milky Way won't happen for another 4 Billion years. Humans will likely be long extinct in 4 Billion years. Besides, the Sun will heat up to a point that in about 2 Billion years, the Earth will be too hot to be able to support having liquid water. But, like I said, the human race will almost certainly be extinct by then, too. No species of animals on Earth have lasted that long.

The reason you haven't heard anything new about the bright spots is that the orbital orientation of the Dawn spacecraft has taken it around the dark side of Ceres, and it is not yet in position to research that area of Ceres. The latest opportunity for observation of the bright spots were in those last images that were released last week (taken in late February).

a reply to: Soylent Green Is People

Thanks for the clear up. But will they still be able to take a closer look at those lights? Or is the opportunity already missed?

Regarding the 2 billion years into the future extinction of mankind via Sun...I think TPTB know it and I'm sure they will do everything they can to ensure that humans will live on. These little forays into our solar system are just baby steps. Or else why are we wasting millions of dollars, I'm sure the reason is proportionate with the spending. Just a theory.

a reply to: IQPREREQUISITE

Dawn will have many many opportunities to get a good look at the bright spots (and all of Ceres) and be able to gather a lot of data about the entire dwarf planet. It will be there for at least 14 months, and will eventually get as close as about 230 miles (375 km) above its surface. Its orbiting at an altitude of about 8,300 miles (13,500 km) right now, but will slowly decrease that orbital altitude over the next year.

As for humans being around in 2 Billion years? 2 Billion years is a very, very long time. Put it this way -- complex animal life on earth of any kind has only been around for less than 1 billion year. Compared to 2 billion years ago, the time of the dinosaurs would be considered a recent event. The time of humans (who have been around for only about 250,000 years) is like a blink of an eye.

a reply to: IQPREREQUISITE

We've merged with Galaxies during the life cycle of this solar system. We are currently merging with a few...

We are in the dead middle of a merger even now:

Source

More than likely we'd survive another merger. We're in a sweet spot.

So no more bright spot images until April? How convenient.

originally posted by: disregard
So no more bright spot images until April? How convenient.

You want to use ion propulsion, you get slow orbital insertion, and for past-Mars objects, you have to finish braking on the far side. Can the snarkiness and open your mind.

a reply to: rossacus
I thought that it will be April before we get more photos that could be meaningful.