UK Wants Unemployed Youth to Do Unpaid Work for the State. State Sponsored Slavery or.....?

a reply to: grainofsand
Here's scenario, what if you are given 300 hours community service then placed on workfare. hows that for a nightmare scenario. you would be better off in jail that how insane this is getting. I have a friend in jail.. 7.5 years. visit him a few times a year. he's now at a open prison and cant wait to get out, I've advised him to stay where he is.

So basically, terms of the agreement is
"I will give you your dole money if you work for less than the minimum wage"

Wont be surprised when young men start choosing to go to prison rather than "work" because they know there's no real jobs available to them and this working for your dole money is just a farce while the government laugh's it way to its banker's houses to beg for political donations.

The rich are screwing this country. Its appalling.

originally posted by: Soloprotocol
a reply to: grainofsand
Here's scenario, what if you are given 300 hours community service then placed on workfare. hows that for a nightmare scenario.

True, nightmare.
...but if you can't do the time don't do the crime, or perhaps don't get caught.

originally posted by: grainofsand

originally posted by: Soloprotocol
a reply to: grainofsand
Here's scenario, what if you are given 300 hours community service then placed on workfare. hows that for a nightmare scenario.

True, nightmare.
...but if you can't do the time don't do the crime, or perhaps don't get caught.

or in my mates case, Dont get caught, then turn up at court late out yer nut on downers, fall asleep in the dock, wake up and threaten to put a witness "in a Box" then proceed to call the Judge a "Old Peadophile Bastard"...in the HIGH COURT.

Seven and a half years for his first,"caught" offence and he didn't even know WTF just happened...he found out when he woke up the next day from his 20 Jellie sleepover....what a idiot.

a reply to: Soloprotocol
Haha the 'paedo b'stard judge' line will never help for a minimal punishment, twat lol but mates is mates, good you've visited him. I've visited mates inside before now, it's important if you're a mate.
On-topic though jobseeker 'agreements' always take probation/CS into consideration and have never been cause on their own for a sanction. A jobsworth DWP worker may initiate a sanction if someone is late because there was a wait at probation or whatever, but when the claimant gets verification of it the sanction is lifted and money is backpaid.
Crap for the person involved at the time but if you know the system then you can get through it, and the information to get through it is provided, eg: "if you get proof the sanction can be lifted"

This is absolutely barmy! I think the politicians in the UK should be locked up.
If peeps have to work for their benefits then they are no longer benefits because they are working.
This is a disgrace....If they want people to get off of benefits then the jobs have to be there in the first place.(which they're not)
If the Government can find work for the unemployed then they can pay minimum wage.
Think about it...if people have to work 40 hours p.w for say £72 per week(if thats what jsa is?)then that is under £2 per hour and corporations,factories etc. will be able to get rid of their workers and employ the unemployed youth for less than £2ph rather than employ someone on minimum wage.
Employers would absolutely love this.....The reason we have a minimum wage in the first place is to stop Employers paying a wage that people can't afford to live on.
The reason we have benefits is supposed to be so that if people can't find work or are sacked/made redundant/fall ill etc. then they can still afford the basics in life.
If some people choose a life on benefits then that is up to them...they are in a minority because I sure wouldn't want to be on benefits,would you?

originally posted by: Soloprotocol
then proceed to call the Judge a "Old Peadophile Bastard"...in the HIGH COURT.
what a idiot.

I dunno way I see things going your mate likely called it right

they have been trying this for the last 40 years.
stiil No good.

and who is not going to get a real job?
becuse some kids doing it for FREE!

originally posted by: eletheia

I admire your ethics

LOL Someone's defrauding, scrounging

cheating, is defined totally by the amount in ££££££££££££££'s involved.

A bit like being a *little* bit pregnant would you say

I don't understand your "*little* bit pregnant" reference, apologies..

I'm not sure where you gathered a view of my "ethics" from either..

I AGREE that defrauding/cheating/stealing is a negative,regardless of amount of £££ involved; However, my point was merely to help you see that there are Bigger contributing factors than the smaller ones you refer too and get so angry about. If you already know this, then I hope the energy you use to complain is proportionally displayed

State sponsored slavery? Hmmmm how about no free handouts? The WPA, the CCC.... early social programs that kept people working for their self respect (is that even a consideration these days?) by doing something FOR our country in order to get something FROM our country. Many of the National Parks were constructed then, many of the bridges, roads, and other crucial infrastructure that has since begun crumbling and falling down with little done about it. I don't believe in Welfare but I do believe in Workfare. There are too many people defrauding welfare. You say you tried to get a job, and you get a check. There are multi-generational families that haven't worked a day but keep on birthing children and getting more and more money. Families with multiple children from multiple fathers, no structure, little education, and little contribution to society, just parasites. I say, if you want a check, earn it.

a reply to: jude11

This has the same underlying problem as prison labor. The state isn't going to pay competitive wages because if they do, they're going to ursurp private business. Therefore whoever is working for the state is going to be paid below the market wage. These people are going to be hired doing jobs that were previously going to people being payed market wages. Ultimately this means that that UK program will only serve to lower wages for those already working.

Even if you disagree with this premise, you must agree that with the state suddenly becoming a supplier of labor they are going to artificially raise the supply of labor. This will reduce the wages those working can expect.

In the end this program only helps big business by reducing their labor costs, it doesn't actually fix the unemployment issue.

originally posted by: eletheia

originally posted by: blupblup



Sickness benefit and jobseekers are also paid for by the people claiming them, that's what national insurance is for.

Don't fall into their trap.

You might note I said 40 yrs. non stop. No claims for sickness or

unemployment.

Many of the unemployed are too young to have paid into the system

yet and it may not be some of their faults that they haven't as yet got

employment.

However last night I watched a TV reality programme, where this

youth who had never worked (Showed little inclination or desire to work)

put his benefits card into the ATM took out some notes, kissed them and

laughed, saying to the effect " best way to get cash"

And how much cash do you think the TV show gave that guy to act that way? "Reality" TV is very scripted.

a reply to: jaxnmarko

You do not believe in welfare?

Great, well that's all very well, but I am personally glad that my grandparents generation, and indeed my own grandfather campaigned for workers rights, and for the provision of basic services to those in need, when the vast majority of need was caused by the indifference of businesses and market leaders, and the inadequacy of government, rather than by the laziness of a very small minority of individuals.

originally posted by: Soloprotocol

originally posted by: Aspie

originally posted by: Soloprotocol

originally posted by: Aspie


A pub near us opens at 9:30am to cater for the workshy drunks. Same people everyday. These would be my first target. Picking litter would be too good for them. Plus I would pay them in food vouchers so they can't waste them in the pub.

Where is this pub that with £70 you can sit in all day everyday... must be the cheapest pint in the Galaxy. or did you just make that up.?

What i dont get is how people can be so incensed by a person living on £72 a week or less.

Are you completely moronic, these people are all claiming sickand other benefits when there is nothing wrong with them. There is another town 3 miles away that opens at 6am to cater for these drunken scroungers? You seem to like defending these workshy scroungers, are you one of them?

I believe it's all in your head. Tell me how much a week "these people" get on the sick. How much it effects your weekly pay packet and other than gossip how you know all this.

Am i one of them??? Hell yeah, nothing i like better than to get up at the crack of dawn and watch all you muppets head off for another day on the hamster wheel.
i sometimes even befriend one of you at the bus stop in the pretense i am starting at the same factory then when they clock in i say..Na NA NA NA NA, i'm off home to my bed to watch jeremy Kyle on my big 52" plasma TV, but i dont go home, instead i head to the pub for a full day of alcoholic beverage guzzling and Cocaine snorting only broken by nipping into the bookies to gamble away YOUR tax money...

I cant for the life of me see why you have a problem with that. must be jealousy.

All in my head huh? It's happening all over the country. It's you Labour leftwing pc brigade numpties who are delusional. I know it happens because I have to walk past these drunks outside the pub having a cig at 9:50(I start work at 10). I don't want my hard earned taxes paying for these wasters benefits. Labour want to increase the benefit cap from £26,000. That is a disgraceful amount of money for someone how has no intention of even looking for a job.

I think you need to come into the real world.

originally posted by: jaxnmarko
State sponsored slavery? Hmmmm how about no free handouts? The WPA, the CCC.... early social programs that kept people working for their self respect (is that even a consideration these days?) by doing something FOR our country in order to get something FROM our country. Many of the National Parks were constructed then, many of the bridges, roads, and other crucial infrastructure that has since begun crumbling and falling down with little done about it. I don't believe in Welfare but I do believe in Workfare. There are too many people defrauding welfare. You say you tried to get a job, and you get a check. There are multi-generational families that haven't worked a day but keep on birthing children and getting more and more money. Families with multiple children from multiple fathers, no structure, little education, and little contribution to society, just parasites. I say, if you want a check, earn it.

Totally agree with you sir.

originally posted by: nullafides

originally posted by: andy06shake
a reply to: jude11

In a country with a supposed minimum wage this is simply illegal.

They should be getting £5.13 or £6.50 per hour depending on there age and even then its quite frankly nowhere near enough to live.

You've got a very good point there! Someone should be fairly compensated for their work....

Well if they get government subsistence like housing, food, transport. is that not compensation?

a reply to: Aspie

And why is that bill so high? because of the sky high rents charged by private individuals.
The majority of that £26000 goes to property owners.

originally posted by: NeoSpace
This has already been in place for a few years now, it's called the Mandatory Work Programme im 30 and 6 months after my work place closed down I was working 9 to 5, 5 days a week for 3 months in charity shops for £72.30 a week or my money would be stopped. from 1 month upto 3 years.

It's total B.S. in my opinion, there where others with me on the program doing community service for petty crimes, they only had to work 3 hours a day 2 days a week, and 1 guy who just came out of prison on the programme also working 3 hours a day 2 days a week, then theres me, never commited a crime in my life doing 9 to 5 every day.

Just a question.

Did all of them receive the same benefits and pay as you?

Also where you given time off for interviews and such related to getting at new job?

just want all the facts.

Thanks

a reply to: GeauxHomeYoureDrunk

I Agree.

This is to way to provide support to those in need, but to try and make sure it does not become a "job".

You want to remain on the dole? fine we have same work that needs to be done.
Don't like working for no wages and just room and board? Great move on to a real job.

Now I do understand there may be SOME cases that will fall though the cracks on this and they should be looked at in a case by case method.

I would love to see this done in the US.

originally posted by: UKWO1Phot
1. Where are they going to find 50,000 jobs? The kids are unemployed as it is.
2. They get told to do free labour. Who's legitimate job will they be taking? Will that next person be unemployed then shoved onto the scheme?
3. How many of these companies (gov cronies) are going to be chomping at the bit to fire their already underpaid staff and get some government paid free labour?

Just a few points that come to mind...

Don't know about the UK, but in the states there is plenty of work that could be given to these people. In fact it could even lead to SOME new full time positions as supervisors and such.

Many town would benefit from cleanup crews to pick up the trash on the roads.
State and Federal park could use crews to tidy them up.
Veterans and county hospitals could use more people to help there.
Public museums could use tour guides and such.

And many of these could lead to full time positions. IF you do a good job in the unpaid areas you may learn skills and the peole in charge my be wiling to move you up in a paid train position. Appritiship use to be a great way to move into a paid position.

True most of these jobs are untrained grunt work, but many of these things need to be done and aren't being done because of the lack of funds to pay for this unskilled labor in the public domain.

But to be honest I'm a big fan of the 12-24 month required civil service idea for all people after high school. Don't think is should be limited to just military service, any service to the public would count in my mind.