The Myth of the Good Guy With a Gun

originally posted by: amicktd
All of this from the person who created this thread...I Shot Someone

And your point is?

You think I just woke up one morning and decided the world would be a better place without guns?

a reply to: budski

I did take it all away and referenced early humans which had none of these programmed issues you speak of. Guess where we are now....same place.

What you fail to see is your argument makes no sense. You blame society at large today and state it is programming. We started at the beginning of human existence in the exact place you are saying we should be...with none of these things around... yet here we are with these things in our lives.

If it is not human nature, then please explain how we got here when everything started exactly as you say a perfect society should be.

Oh...and guess what early humans started with...a resource based economy. So...in all your wisdom on programming and human nature....why did that change? There was no programming or any of that, yet we evolved to where we are now.

originally posted by: Vasa Croe
a reply to: budski

I did take it all away and referenced early humans which had none of these programmed issues you speak of. Guess where we are now....same place.

What you fail to see is your argument makes no sense. You blame society at large today and state it is programming. We started at the beginning of human existence in the exact place you are saying we should be...with none of these things around... yet here we are with these things in our lives.

If it is not human nature, then please explain how we got here when everything started exactly as you say a perfect society should be.

I don't blame society, I blame controlling forces which currently take the form of allegedly democratic government, where you have 2 choices, those choices being 2 sides of the same coin.

Religion and money are both control mechanisms, and we are bound by them.

What I'm saying and you're repeatedly ignoring is that we are approaching a point where we will be technologically advanced enough that money should cease to matter, and cease to be a control mechanism.

You insist it can only be one way because it's only ever been that way, as if the sum total of human knowledge doesn't matter.

You don't appear to be able to see past the current economic system, and repeatedly refuse to even contemplate any other system.

Well, I'll reiterate that we need to move to another system or die out, and the best system I have seen is a resource based system as opposed to this fake monetary system.

originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: Vasa Croe
a reply to: budski

I did take it all away and referenced early humans which had none of these programmed issues you speak of. Guess where we are now....same place.

What you fail to see is your argument makes no sense. You blame society at large today and state it is programming. We started at the beginning of human existence in the exact place you are saying we should be...with none of these things around... yet here we are with these things in our lives.

If it is not human nature, then please explain how we got here when everything started exactly as you say a perfect society should be.

I don't blame society, I blame controlling forces which currently take the form of allegedly democratic government, where you have 2 choices, those choices being 2 sides of the same coin.

Religion and money are both control mechanisms, and we are bound by them.

What I'm saying and you're repeatedly ignoring is that we are approaching a point where we will be technologically advanced enough that money should cease to matter, and cease to be a control mechanism.

You insist it can only be one way because it's only ever been that way, as if the sum total of human knowledge doesn't matter.

You don't appear to be able to see past the current economic system, and repeatedly refuse to even contemplate any other system.

Well, I'll reiterate that we need to move to another system or die out, and the best system I have seen is a resource based system as opposed to this fake monetary system.

Unless disease or natural disaster wipe us off the earth, we will not die out...economy has changed many times over the years.

originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: ColeYounger
I don't claim to have the answers regarding gun control. Both sides of the debate use statistics, anecdotes and
their own rationale for making their case.
I do know this:
If two violent thugs break into your home in the middle of the night, a gun can easily make the difference between life and death. That is a fact. It simply cannot be refuted. Case closed.

Is the minute chance of a home invasion worth over 30,000 lives per year?

And it really is a very, very small chance.

Commercials say every day a home invasion in the us occurs in the us every 8 seconds or so. How many of the 30k (fake figure as has been demonstrated) were police officer shooting, justified self defense shootings, and career criminals.


Sorry, you are clearly one of those people that thinks lights turn on because you flip the switch. Anyone can make a gun very very easily. In the US we are allowed to make them for our own use. See the 3d printer guy. You can make one for 20 bucks max at the hardware store.

The only way to ban guns effictively would be to put all the means of production in government hands. You would have to outlaw the private ownership of basic metalworking tools.

See thailand, IIRC. They regulated machine shops to stop guns. They were still flooded with homemade guns of all types from fully auto Tommy gun copies, aks, m4s, you name it. They were almost indistinguishable from legit arms, despite being made in huts , often with no electricity or modern tools. T he can stamp out ak receivers in Africa by hand.

Are we seeing yet, the totalitarian socialism this is directly tied to. Does no one remeber Stalin. Does no one remember mao. Does no one remember hitler. These people took weapons from their people so that they could kill millions.

It could be argued, statistically, that it would be better to let gun nuts kill 500k a year, than to disarm a populace which has often led to millions exterminated. Easily over 100 million in the last 100 years.

originally posted by: network dude
a reply to: budski

Don't forget to address Blane's post.

I think it's even on topic. You know, the thread you created.

Are you going to address this? It's really, REALLY rude to make a thread, and then ignore all the posts that you cannot comprehend.

originally posted by: Vasa Croe

originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: Vasa Croe
a reply to: budski

I did take it all away and referenced early humans which had none of these programmed issues you speak of. Guess where we are now....same place.

What you fail to see is your argument makes no sense. You blame society at large today and state it is programming. We started at the beginning of human existence in the exact place you are saying we should be...with none of these things around... yet here we are with these things in our lives.

If it is not human nature, then please explain how we got here when everything started exactly as you say a perfect society should be.

I don't blame society, I blame controlling forces which currently take the form of allegedly democratic government, where you have 2 choices, those choices being 2 sides of the same coin.

Religion and money are both control mechanisms, and we are bound by them.

What I'm saying and you're repeatedly ignoring is that we are approaching a point where we will be technologically advanced enough that money should cease to matter, and cease to be a control mechanism.

You insist it can only be one way because it's only ever been that way, as if the sum total of human knowledge doesn't matter.

You don't appear to be able to see past the current economic system, and repeatedly refuse to even contemplate any other system.

Well, I'll reiterate that we need to move to another system or die out, and the best system I have seen is a resource based system as opposed to this fake monetary system.

Unless disease or natural disaster wipe us off the earth, we will not die out...economy has changed many times over the years.

Economies have always been based around money in one form or another, because they place "worth" or "value" on things, and the more that a person has, the greater is considered their contribution.

Who made the greater contribution to society, Rockefeller or Newton?
If you think it is Newton, then this is the basis for a society that is resource based, and where education, learning and growth of the personal variety are considered a greater contribution.

originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: Vasa Croe
a reply to: budski

I did take it all away and referenced early humans which had none of these programmed issues you speak of. Guess where we are now....same place.

What you fail to see is your argument makes no sense. You blame society at large today and state it is programming. We started at the beginning of human existence in the exact place you are saying we should be...with none of these things around... yet here we are with these things in our lives.

If it is not human nature, then please explain how we got here when everything started exactly as you say a perfect society should be.

I don't blame society, I blame controlling forces which currently take the form of allegedly democratic government, where you have 2 choices, those choices being 2 sides of the same coin.

Religion and money are both control mechanisms, and we are bound by them.

What I'm saying and you're repeatedly ignoring is that we are approaching a point where we will be technologically advanced enough that money should cease to matter, and cease to be a control mechanism.

You insist it can only be one way because it's only ever been that way, as if the sum total of human knowledge doesn't matter.

You don't appear to be able to see past the current economic system, and repeatedly refuse to even contemplate any other system.

Well, I'll reiterate that we need to move to another system or die out, and the best system I have seen is a resource based system as opposed to this fake monetary system.

And again you fail to see where your logic is flawed. We started with none of these things you are talking about that you say are the downfall of society and that without the programming of today's powers that be, we would all be dandy.

I am saying that based on the entirety of human existence beginning exactly as you have stated, that you are wrong. We did not have government, democratic parties, economy, etc....when we began life.

So how do you explain how we got here? None of the programming you speak of was around at that time....none of the outside forces or economy or democratic parties or whatever.

You say there is no such thing as human nature, that it is programmed. Then how did we get here, to the point we are now? If we were exactly as you say, with none of those things, then by your standard, we should have stayed exactly that way because there is no human nature.

I am having a really hard time understanding how you are not getting this at all.

a reply to: budski

Oh someone call this guy a WAaambulance...
Come off it dude you are the one dissing Americans and their culture...

originally posted by: boymonkey74
a reply to: budski

Oh someone call this guy a WAaambulance...
Come off it dude you are the one dissing Americans and their culture...

Be gone apologist....LOL

originally posted by: Vasa Croe

originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: Vasa Croe
a reply to: budski

I did take it all away and referenced early humans which had none of these programmed issues you speak of. Guess where we are now....same place.

What you fail to see is your argument makes no sense. You blame society at large today and state it is programming. We started at the beginning of human existence in the exact place you are saying we should be...with none of these things around... yet here we are with these things in our lives.

If it is not human nature, then please explain how we got here when everything started exactly as you say a perfect society should be.

I don't blame society, I blame controlling forces which currently take the form of allegedly democratic government, where you have 2 choices, those choices being 2 sides of the same coin.

Religion and money are both control mechanisms, and we are bound by them.

What I'm saying and you're repeatedly ignoring is that we are approaching a point where we will be technologically advanced enough that money should cease to matter, and cease to be a control mechanism.

You insist it can only be one way because it's only ever been that way, as if the sum total of human knowledge doesn't matter.

You don't appear to be able to see past the current economic system, and repeatedly refuse to even contemplate any other system.

Well, I'll reiterate that we need to move to another system or die out, and the best system I have seen is a resource based system as opposed to this fake monetary system.

And again you fail to see where your logic is flawed. We started with none of these things you are talking about that you say are the downfall of society and that without the programming of today's powers that be, we would all be dandy.

I am saying that based on the entirety of human existence beginning exactly as you have stated, that you are wrong. We did not have government, democratic parties, economy, etc....when we began life.

So how do you explain how we got here? None of the programming you speak of was around at that time....none of the outside forces or economy or democratic parties or whatever.

You say there is no such thing as human nature, that it is programmed. Then how did we get here, to the point we are now? If we were exactly as you say, with none of those things, then by your standard, we should have stayed exactly that way because there is no human nature.

I am having a really hard time understanding how you are not getting this at all.

As soon as someone seeks to put themselves above others, there is immediately some sort of control mechanism introduced by them to ensure they stay there.

You are trying to say that we cannot evolve any further as a society.

I'm saying that we are all humans, that borders are bullcrap, that countries are another control mechanism, and that there are other ways.

The fact that you refuse to even consider an example such as a resource based economy only tells me that your mind is closed to any possibility other than the status quo.

And on that note, I'm done.
I have things to do.

originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: Vasa Croe

originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: Vasa Croe
a reply to: budski

I did take it all away and referenced early humans which had none of these programmed issues you speak of. Guess where we are now....same place.

What you fail to see is your argument makes no sense. You blame society at large today and state it is programming. We started at the beginning of human existence in the exact place you are saying we should be...with none of these things around... yet here we are with these things in our lives.

If it is not human nature, then please explain how we got here when everything started exactly as you say a perfect society should be.

I don't blame society, I blame controlling forces which currently take the form of allegedly democratic government, where you have 2 choices, those choices being 2 sides of the same coin.

Religion and money are both control mechanisms, and we are bound by them.

What I'm saying and you're repeatedly ignoring is that we are approaching a point where we will be technologically advanced enough that money should cease to matter, and cease to be a control mechanism.

You insist it can only be one way because it's only ever been that way, as if the sum total of human knowledge doesn't matter.

You don't appear to be able to see past the current economic system, and repeatedly refuse to even contemplate any other system.

Well, I'll reiterate that we need to move to another system or die out, and the best system I have seen is a resource based system as opposed to this fake monetary system.

And again you fail to see where your logic is flawed. We started with none of these things you are talking about that you say are the downfall of society and that without the programming of today's powers that be, we would all be dandy.

I am saying that based on the entirety of human existence beginning exactly as you have stated, that you are wrong. We did not have government, democratic parties, economy, etc....when we began life.

So how do you explain how we got here? None of the programming you speak of was around at that time....none of the outside forces or economy or democratic parties or whatever.

You say there is no such thing as human nature, that it is programmed. Then how did we get here, to the point we are now? If we were exactly as you say, with none of those things, then by your standard, we should have stayed exactly that way because there is no human nature.

I am having a really hard time understanding how you are not getting this at all.

As soon as someone seeks to put themselves above others, there is immediately some sort of control mechanism introduced by them to ensure they stay there.

You are trying to say that we cannot evolve any further as a society.

I'm saying that we are all humans, that borders are bullcrap, that countries are another control mechanism, and that there are other ways.

The fact that you refuse to even consider an example such as a resource based economy only tells me that your mind is closed to any possibility other than the status quo.

But you said that can't happen in a society where there is no programming...you said that there is no human nature that would allow for this to happen. There were no borders back then. You claim it is all because of programming, yet none of that existed back then.

So how is it we are where we are then, that is, if as you propose there is no such thing as human nature to intervene and we would all get along?

It is human nature to want more and to take control, or else it would never have happened in the first place.

Consider this little bit of information. England banned hand guns so the number of hand gun deaths are down while death by butcher knifes is up which is still legal in England. No matter what you make illegal humans will kill each other with what ever is handy. So I guess we should what ban humans?
a reply to: budski

a reply to: budski

It's called a REPUBLIC by the way.
What is YOURS called?
SOCIALISM ,no way.
that won't do we JUST got through, ALONG WITH ALL OF CANADA ,stomping communists claiming to be socialists all over the globe.
MAYBE back in France for YOU?
I wouldn't claim elightenment mostly fools and psudo intellectualls play at that....THEN we go die cleaning up the MESS do you know why?

Gimme a "G" Gimmie a "U" Gimmie an "N",

Wow, I read this entire post and the only thing I got out of it is that Budski hates Americans the most closely followed by all the other Humans on the planet.