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The Myth of the Good Guy With a Gun

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posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:00 PM
link   
a reply to: boymonkey74
You've got that.
Whenever I see Ben Kingsley, all I think of is Ghandi though.




posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:01 PM
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originally posted by: butcherguy
a reply to: ScientificRailgun

Those are the cookies, when included in an assortment at my house, always get eaten last.... if they are eaten at all. The jam is like half-dried glue, as far as the chewing goes.
One thing I can say about Japan is we take our baked goods freakin' serious around here. Everything is fresh, flaky, warm, buttery, etc. Never been in a cake store with old product out. Even the stuff you get from Conbini's taste amazing.

@budski

You know I've be more inclined to listen to your opinion more seriously if every single one of your posts wasn't laced with poisonous barbs and undue snark.
edit on 12-2-2015 by ScientificRailgun because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:01 PM
link   

originally posted by: Vasa Croe

originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: network dude
a reply to: budski

With all your hopes and dreams of this place where free love and no wars exists, and there is no need for leaders or structure in any way, you fail to factor in the one part of the equation that will screw your plans every time. The human factor. Unless you have a way to make people stop begin people, and you can remove greed from man's thought process, you have a pipe dream. (actually, you really do just have a pipe dream, there is not basis in reality at all for your thought process)

But if Boymonkey74 comes to my neck of the woods, I'll take him shooting and show him how to defend himself against the beer can army I am certain will attack at any given moment.


Hopes and dreams?
No, it's inevitable.
In a place where everyone has the same things, and there is no hunger or want, why would there be crime?

You are talking about people as you see them, not as people given room to grow and evolve.

Let me put it another way.
In 50 years time, everything that a human can do a robot or other technology will be able to do better.
What price your job, your house and your mortgage then?


So, what happens when someone in the "consensus" doesn't agree with the "consensus" in your Utopia? They just understand and move on like a good programmed society member? LOL.....sounds a lot like what we have now.

Good luck with that! What you propose is exactly what is going on now....everyone MUST think the same thing, but if you don't it doesn't matter because the majority rules anyways.


See, you're still thinking in terms of todays society where people are pitched against each other in competition all the time.
It appears that you simply cannot conceive of anything different, but you'#d be wrong yet again.

A resource based society would remove many of the growth limiters currently placed on humans.
I never said it would happen overnight, and I never said it would be easy, but it will happen at some point or humans will simply cease to be.



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:01 PM
link   

originally posted by: boymonkey74
a reply to: butcherguy

Go great when dipped in tea
.

Tea?
Is that like coffee?



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:02 PM
link   

originally posted by: ScientificRailgun

originally posted by: butcherguy
a reply to: ScientificRailgun

Those are the cookies, when included in an assortment at my house, always get eaten last.... if they are eaten at all. The jam is like half-dried glue, as far as the chewing goes.
One thing I can say about Japan is we take our baked goods freakin' serious around here. Everything is fresh, flaky, warm, buttery, etc. Never been in a cake store with old product out. Even the stuff you get from Conbini's taste amazing.

@budski

You know I've be more inclined to listen to your opinion more seriously if every single one of your posts wasn't laced with poisonous barbs and undue snark.


If people hadn't been that way with me from the beginning it wouldn't happen.

I just mirror what's thrown at me.



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:05 PM
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a reply to: budski

Please explain how you are going to change human nature?.
Sorry dude If put in a situation you would use a gun to defend yourself.
It's great being a know it all and such and apparently have all the answers but this is the real world.
One day maybe in a couple of thousand years we will evolve enough to do what you suggest but dude grow up.



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:06 PM
link   
a reply to: butcherguy

It's like posh coffee.




posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:06 PM
link   

originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: ScientificRailgun

originally posted by: butcherguy
a reply to: ScientificRailgun

Those are the cookies, when included in an assortment at my house, always get eaten last.... if they are eaten at all. The jam is like half-dried glue, as far as the chewing goes.
One thing I can say about Japan is we take our baked goods freakin' serious around here. Everything is fresh, flaky, warm, buttery, etc. Never been in a cake store with old product out. Even the stuff you get from Conbini's taste amazing.

@budski

You know I've be more inclined to listen to your opinion more seriously if every single one of your posts wasn't laced with poisonous barbs and undue snark.


If people hadn't been that way with me from the beginning it wouldn't happen.

I just mirror what's thrown at me.
I've actually seen more than a handful of thoughtful, respectful posts that you entirely ignore in favor of throwing more jabs at someone. Also, sorry if my English isn't quite what it should it be. Posting on ATS is about the only practice I have with English anymore. My dad even says I'm starting to get a Japanese accent. ;_;



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:07 PM
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originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: Vasa Croe

originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: network dude
a reply to: budski

With all your hopes and dreams of this place where free love and no wars exists, and there is no need for leaders or structure in any way, you fail to factor in the one part of the equation that will screw your plans every time. The human factor. Unless you have a way to make people stop begin people, and you can remove greed from man's thought process, you have a pipe dream. (actually, you really do just have a pipe dream, there is not basis in reality at all for your thought process)

But if Boymonkey74 comes to my neck of the woods, I'll take him shooting and show him how to defend himself against the beer can army I am certain will attack at any given moment.


Hopes and dreams?
No, it's inevitable.
In a place where everyone has the same things, and there is no hunger or want, why would there be crime?

You are talking about people as you see them, not as people given room to grow and evolve.

Let me put it another way.
In 50 years time, everything that a human can do a robot or other technology will be able to do better.
What price your job, your house and your mortgage then?


So, what happens when someone in the "consensus" doesn't agree with the "consensus" in your Utopia? They just understand and move on like a good programmed society member? LOL.....sounds a lot like what we have now.

Good luck with that! What you propose is exactly what is going on now....everyone MUST think the same thing, but if you don't it doesn't matter because the majority rules anyways.


See, you're still thinking in terms of todays society where people are pitched against each other in competition all the time.
It appears that you simply cannot conceive of anything different, but you'#d be wrong yet again.

A resource based society would remove many of the growth limiters currently placed on humans.
I never said it would happen overnight, and I never said it would be easy, but it will happen at some point or humans will simply cease to be.


Umm...you said that the society would have to reach a consensus. Why would there even be a discussion if everyone was the same? A consensus suggests people have their own thoughts and they may not align. What happens when you are the one who has the thought that does not align? You then become a follower, which means there is a leader(s) and you are not one of them.

The ONLY way in which your scenario works is if every individual is given a small piece of land and completely isolates themselves only making decision for themselves and never having contact with anyone else...ever. That is the ONLY way this can happen, and we all know what would happen then.....we would die off very quickly unless we evolved into having both female and male genitalia, but then once you have a baby, what do you do with that baby, because certainly they will want to go out on their own and you will get into arguments and because you are the parent you want them to learn stuff, but they are only limited to the stuff YOU know so there will come a time when they QUESTION you and wonder what else is out there....then you don't have a consensus anymore and your Utopia is yet again shattered.



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:07 PM
link   

originally posted by: boymonkey74
a reply to: budski

Please explain how you are going to change human nature?.
Sorry dude If put in a situation you would use a gun to defend yourself.
It's great being a know it all and such and apparently have all the answers but this is the real world.
One day maybe in a couple of thousand years we will evolve enough to do what you suggest but dude grow up.


I've been in a situation where I had to use a gun to defend myself, and I can tell you it wasn't pretty.

Human nature is not "human nature" at all, it is a product of programming and societal values, and this thread is actually a very good example of that.



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:09 PM
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originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: amicktd

originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: amicktd

originally posted by: network dude
a reply to: budski

Don't forget to address Blane's post.

I think it's even on topic. You know, the thread you created.


He lost that argument on like page 2...lol


Of course I did precious.

Selectively using stats and ignoring others is soo IN right now isn't it.


Hey I posted a couple articles for you to read without a response. You should research a topic before blasting it on a public forum. Oh and if you want to honestly research to find facts, you have to put your own biased views to the side while you do it.


Sorry I didn't realise you are the thread police.

Apologies officer.
I'll be sure to run it by you next time I want to post something.


Ok, so you're like 12 years old it seems. I won't waste anymore time in this thread...signing off!



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:10 PM
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a reply to: budski

So you are a hypocrite....
You don't practise what you preach.
I'm out.



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:11 PM
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a reply to: budski

Humans are violent creatures by nature. Even if we had everything we could want, some of us would still want more (and usually more from someone else). There will always be those who are stronger or weaker of body and/or mind. Those few aggressive enough will always try to have their ways. In all of our existence on this planet we have fought one another, it is in our programming. Perhaps when we evolve or merge with our machine overlords
that may change.



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:12 PM
link   

originally posted by: Vasa Croe

originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: Vasa Croe

originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: network dude
a reply to: budski

With all your hopes and dreams of this place where free love and no wars exists, and there is no need for leaders or structure in any way, you fail to factor in the one part of the equation that will screw your plans every time. The human factor. Unless you have a way to make people stop begin people, and you can remove greed from man's thought process, you have a pipe dream. (actually, you really do just have a pipe dream, there is not basis in reality at all for your thought process)

But if Boymonkey74 comes to my neck of the woods, I'll take him shooting and show him how to defend himself against the beer can army I am certain will attack at any given moment.


Hopes and dreams?
No, it's inevitable.
In a place where everyone has the same things, and there is no hunger or want, why would there be crime?

You are talking about people as you see them, not as people given room to grow and evolve.

Let me put it another way.
In 50 years time, everything that a human can do a robot or other technology will be able to do better.
What price your job, your house and your mortgage then?


So, what happens when someone in the "consensus" doesn't agree with the "consensus" in your Utopia? They just understand and move on like a good programmed society member? LOL.....sounds a lot like what we have now.

Good luck with that! What you propose is exactly what is going on now....everyone MUST think the same thing, but if you don't it doesn't matter because the majority rules anyways.


See, you're still thinking in terms of todays society where people are pitched against each other in competition all the time.
It appears that you simply cannot conceive of anything different, but you'#d be wrong yet again.

A resource based society would remove many of the growth limiters currently placed on humans.
I never said it would happen overnight, and I never said it would be easy, but it will happen at some point or humans will simply cease to be.


Umm...you said that the society would have to reach a consensus. Why would there even be a discussion if everyone was the same? A consensus suggests people have their own thoughts and they may not align. What happens when you are the one who has the thought that does not align? You then become a follower, which means there is a leader(s) and you are not one of them.

The ONLY way in which your scenario works is if every individual is given a small piece of land and completely isolates themselves only making decision for themselves and never having contact with anyone else...ever. That is the ONLY way this can happen, and we all know what would happen then.....we would die off very quickly unless we evolved into having both female and male genitalia, but then once you have a baby, what do you do with that baby, because certainly they will want to go out on their own and you will get into arguments and because you are the parent you want them to learn stuff, but they are only limited to the stuff YOU know so there will come a time when they QUESTION you and wonder what else is out there....then you don't have a consensus anymore and your Utopia is yet again shattered.



Again, you are completely ignoring mans capacity to change.
You are completely focused on the world as it is now, and refuse to even contemplate that there could be change.

Take away competition between humans, and immediately the whole world would change.
Competition exists right now because it means those at the top make more money.
Everything you do in your life is focused towards this.

Just try thinking about a resource based economy.
You could even look it up.
Take away the power and control mechanisms.
Take away fake religious bullcrap.
Put in its place education and personal growth in a technologically advanced society.

All you are doing at the moment is reinforcing your own programming.



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:14 PM
link   

originally posted by: amicktd

originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: amicktd

originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: amicktd

originally posted by: network dude
a reply to: budski

Don't forget to address Blane's post.

I think it's even on topic. You know, the thread you created.


He lost that argument on like page 2...lol


Of course I did precious.

Selectively using stats and ignoring others is soo IN right now isn't it.


Hey I posted a couple articles for you to read without a response. You should research a topic before blasting it on a public forum. Oh and if you want to honestly research to find facts, you have to put your own biased views to the side while you do it.


Sorry I didn't realise you are the thread police.

Apologies officer.
I'll be sure to run it by you next time I want to post something.


Ok, so you're like 12 years old it seems. I won't waste anymore time in this thread...signing off!


Typical.
You want to tell me what to post but have a hissy fit when I decline.

see you.
have a nice day.



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:17 PM
link   

originally posted by: joemoe
a reply to: budski

Humans are violent creatures by nature. Even if we had everything we could want, some of us would still want more (and usually more from someone else). There will always be those who are stronger or weaker of body and/or mind. Those few aggressive enough will always try to have their ways. In all of our existence on this planet we have fought one another, it is in our programming. Perhaps when we evolve or merge with our machine overlords
that may change.


This was certainly true in the past, but it doesn't have to be that way anymore.

Every single person here, me included, is a product of programming.
In school, you are taught by rote how to pass exams that the government wants you to pass.
You are told how to behave, what to drink, what to eat, when to sleep, and that for the good of all you must work in a job that has little or no meaning.
This is not an accident.
Governments don't want citizens, they want drones.

The challenge is to see other ways to live as a society, as a species that occupies a single planet of finite resources, and then to try and move off that planet.



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:19 PM
link   

originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: Vasa Croe

originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: Vasa Croe

originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: network dude
a reply to: budski

With all your hopes and dreams of this place where free love and no wars exists, and there is no need for leaders or structure in any way, you fail to factor in the one part of the equation that will screw your plans every time. The human factor. Unless you have a way to make people stop begin people, and you can remove greed from man's thought process, you have a pipe dream. (actually, you really do just have a pipe dream, there is not basis in reality at all for your thought process)

But if Boymonkey74 comes to my neck of the woods, I'll take him shooting and show him how to defend himself against the beer can army I am certain will attack at any given moment.


Hopes and dreams?
No, it's inevitable.
In a place where everyone has the same things, and there is no hunger or want, why would there be crime?

You are talking about people as you see them, not as people given room to grow and evolve.

Let me put it another way.
In 50 years time, everything that a human can do a robot or other technology will be able to do better.
What price your job, your house and your mortgage then?


So, what happens when someone in the "consensus" doesn't agree with the "consensus" in your Utopia? They just understand and move on like a good programmed society member? LOL.....sounds a lot like what we have now.

Good luck with that! What you propose is exactly what is going on now....everyone MUST think the same thing, but if you don't it doesn't matter because the majority rules anyways.


See, you're still thinking in terms of todays society where people are pitched against each other in competition all the time.
It appears that you simply cannot conceive of anything different, but you'#d be wrong yet again.

A resource based society would remove many of the growth limiters currently placed on humans.
I never said it would happen overnight, and I never said it would be easy, but it will happen at some point or humans will simply cease to be.


Umm...you said that the society would have to reach a consensus. Why would there even be a discussion if everyone was the same? A consensus suggests people have their own thoughts and they may not align. What happens when you are the one who has the thought that does not align? You then become a follower, which means there is a leader(s) and you are not one of them.

The ONLY way in which your scenario works is if every individual is given a small piece of land and completely isolates themselves only making decision for themselves and never having contact with anyone else...ever. That is the ONLY way this can happen, and we all know what would happen then.....we would die off very quickly unless we evolved into having both female and male genitalia, but then once you have a baby, what do you do with that baby, because certainly they will want to go out on their own and you will get into arguments and because you are the parent you want them to learn stuff, but they are only limited to the stuff YOU know so there will come a time when they QUESTION you and wonder what else is out there....then you don't have a consensus anymore and your Utopia is yet again shattered.



Again, you are completely ignoring mans capacity to change.
You are completely focused on the world as it is now, and refuse to even contemplate that there could be change.

Take away competition between humans, and immediately the whole world would change.
Competition exists right now because it means those at the top make more money.
Everything you do in your life is focused towards this.

Just try thinking about a resource based economy.
You could even look it up.
Take away the power and control mechanisms.
Take away fake religious bullcrap.
Put in its place education and personal growth in a technologically advanced society.

All you are doing at the moment is reinforcing your own programming.
You know how smug you're making yourself sound right now, right?

"I know the right way to do things, everyone else is wrong and stupid and programmed".

That's what I'm hearing. Try a little humility, man. You attract more flies with honey than vinegar, as the old saying goes.



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:24 PM
link   

originally posted by: ScientificRailgun

originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: Vasa Croe

originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: Vasa Croe

originally posted by: budski

originally posted by: network dude
a reply to: budski

With all your hopes and dreams of this place where free love and no wars exists, and there is no need for leaders or structure in any way, you fail to factor in the one part of the equation that will screw your plans every time. The human factor. Unless you have a way to make people stop begin people, and you can remove greed from man's thought process, you have a pipe dream. (actually, you really do just have a pipe dream, there is not basis in reality at all for your thought process)

But if Boymonkey74 comes to my neck of the woods, I'll take him shooting and show him how to defend himself against the beer can army I am certain will attack at any given moment.


Hopes and dreams?
No, it's inevitable.
In a place where everyone has the same things, and there is no hunger or want, why would there be crime?

You are talking about people as you see them, not as people given room to grow and evolve.

Let me put it another way.
In 50 years time, everything that a human can do a robot or other technology will be able to do better.
What price your job, your house and your mortgage then?


So, what happens when someone in the "consensus" doesn't agree with the "consensus" in your Utopia? They just understand and move on like a good programmed society member? LOL.....sounds a lot like what we have now.

Good luck with that! What you propose is exactly what is going on now....everyone MUST think the same thing, but if you don't it doesn't matter because the majority rules anyways.


See, you're still thinking in terms of todays society where people are pitched against each other in competition all the time.
It appears that you simply cannot conceive of anything different, but you'#d be wrong yet again.

A resource based society would remove many of the growth limiters currently placed on humans.
I never said it would happen overnight, and I never said it would be easy, but it will happen at some point or humans will simply cease to be.


Umm...you said that the society would have to reach a consensus. Why would there even be a discussion if everyone was the same? A consensus suggests people have their own thoughts and they may not align. What happens when you are the one who has the thought that does not align? You then become a follower, which means there is a leader(s) and you are not one of them.

The ONLY way in which your scenario works is if every individual is given a small piece of land and completely isolates themselves only making decision for themselves and never having contact with anyone else...ever. That is the ONLY way this can happen, and we all know what would happen then.....we would die off very quickly unless we evolved into having both female and male genitalia, but then once you have a baby, what do you do with that baby, because certainly they will want to go out on their own and you will get into arguments and because you are the parent you want them to learn stuff, but they are only limited to the stuff YOU know so there will come a time when they QUESTION you and wonder what else is out there....then you don't have a consensus anymore and your Utopia is yet again shattered.



Again, you are completely ignoring mans capacity to change.
You are completely focused on the world as it is now, and refuse to even contemplate that there could be change.

Take away competition between humans, and immediately the whole world would change.
Competition exists right now because it means those at the top make more money.
Everything you do in your life is focused towards this.

Just try thinking about a resource based economy.
You could even look it up.
Take away the power and control mechanisms.
Take away fake religious bullcrap.
Put in its place education and personal growth in a technologically advanced society.

All you are doing at the moment is reinforcing your own programming.
You know how smug you're making yourself sound right now, right?

"I know the right way to do things, everyone else is wrong and stupid and programmed".

That's what I'm hearing. Try a little humility, man. You attract more flies with honey than vinegar, as the old saying goes.


You seem to be under the impression that I care what you think, so let me clear that up for you.
I don't.

I also said that I am under the same programming, but hey, don't let the little details get in the way of yet another ATS forum gang attack.

The motto here for those who missed it is "Deny Ignorance".
You guys might take a few moments to reflect on what that actually means, because what it doesn't mean is "support the status quo and make sure things can never change".



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:28 PM
link   
a reply to: budski

You're not making any new friends with your outright hostility. I'm certainly not losing any sleep over what budski said to me, all I'm saying is you've been unduly hostile to people in your own thread. I won't speak on the subject anymore, as it's clear I can't change your behavioUr (I even used the "proper" spelling! Look at me go!) and this thread has already been well and truly derailed.



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:30 PM
link   
All of this from the person who created this thread...I Shot Someone
edit on 12-2-2015 by amicktd because: (no reason given)



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