Are we responsible for our own actions?

We all learn everday, and know one is wrong or right or right on a topic like this. Mabybe with more studying-who knows!

if we denied illusion we would all be lost...we would be the aliens

Oh please.

There is nothing wrong with denying illusion. My views not yours, sorry if I offended!

no offense taken

i deny reality,for what i see and what i know are two different things.

Originally posted by Simulacra
If we are all connected then are we responsible for our own actions? Essentially, if we are comprised of the same ?God head? then is ?self? an illusion?

The Noosphere states that humans share the same cosmic conscious. Imagine an endless body of water in which knowledge freely flows within those infinitesimal boundaries. This ocean of knowledge seems overwhelming until we realize that we are the ocean of knowledge. Each person on this planet comprises of the global conscious. We can freely take from this ocean whatever desired knowledge is needed. There is no personal distinction. We are truly a cosmic consciousness.

Sounds to me like they are talking about the Borg. The individuals on the earth are created by God.

I'm a devout Christian, but have also near-completed pre-med. So I have studied both (Western Thought)sides of creation.

Because both methods of thought claim that we have evolved from a single being doesn't imply that we are all the same. Researchers work around the clock to analyze DNA coding . . . how can something so small be so complex?

Because we are complex creatures. We examine our own existence, yet fear our inevitable demise.

We are far from perfect. We question everything, but only a chosen few actively seek answers.

I could write all of my actions off as being caused by God or by Evil, or I could write it off due to circumstances beyond my control, but in truth, I am responsible for my own actions.

Not you. Not God. Not Science. Popeye coined it best..."I am what I am."
Dot.

Originally posted by SteveG
So if it's not Tony Blairs fault for a rise in tax's it's all yours

I guess keyboards are to blame for typo's and not the users, etc..

Humans have been conditioned on a single Cause/Effect relationship of the universe. One effect ultimately has only one cause. But this is far from true.

Let's take your example of placing the blame on typos on the user. Sure you could blame the author for typos, or you could blame the keyboard for placing the letters in such a way that could cause a typo.
You could blame ATS for not having a spell check
You could blame your computer teacher for not teaching how to type properly
You could blame your 2nd grade Englsih teacher
You could blame your parents for giving birth to you....

The list goes on...different causes of equal importance but ultimately relates to one effect. The Typo.

Originally posted by MysticOfRadiance
as with light probably infinite continuums, regarding a set path that is down to the actions of individuals as nothing is fully set due to the constant of change etc.

So each person could have their own set path? Or is this set path a globaly agreed on path that our consciousness participates in? In other words, is a continum solely based on the ideas of one person or a global consciousness?

Originally posted by MysticOfRadiance
so it would seem it is or has set pre-ordained laws, or there is a system to existence.

Where would this order come from if not from a creator? The chance that order would form and then operate from Chaos seems astronomical to say the least.

That's like someone throwing a 1,000 piece Jigsaw puzzle off the Grand Canyon and every piece landing perfectly to assemble the puzzle.

Originally posted by MysticOfRadiance
that negative evil would shrink his conscious and light, where as good etc would raise grow his light and allow him to evolve spiritually and grow.

How does the creator know what is evil? What reference does this creator have if the only two things in the universe were 1.) The creator 2.) The godforce?

Originally posted by MysticOfRadiance
the light of the god force isnt evil it is a creative and spiritual force, evil seems to come about with actions that happen within time and or degradation.

Degradation of light? Wouldn't that just be the dissolution of light in space? That's just physics. Are you saying that wherever this 'god force' didn't exist was the evil? Seems pretty bias on the 'god force' part.

Originally posted by greenmansmind
with in the herd,everyone blames the other..everyone in a powerstruggle because they can keep up their own so they need others to feed it..

I like what you have to say. Sounds very Icke'ish (is that even a word?)

Originally posted by greenmansmind
if you flip me off it is up to me how i react....if i do not take it personelly ,then i did not give up my seat of power

Im going to have to go with wrong here. Your reaction to a person flipping you off can all be calculated by various factors in our universe.
Depending on where you grew up
How many times you have been flipped off in your life.
Who raised you.
How stressed you were that day.
If you had a good child hood
What your mothers emotions were when she gave birth to you
How you were conceived....etc

All the way down to the alignment of the few particles that were associated with the Big Bang.

It seems like free will, but when you look deeper down into the puzzle, you are just composed of the same matter that existed in the conception of the universe. This matter operates by certain physical laws...

What makes your matter so special?

Originally posted by greenmansmind
we all can manifest our reality and we do all the time...whether it be individual or collective.....

After reading the book, The Holographic Universe I completely agree with you.

Originally posted by Simulacra
So each person could have their own set path? Or is this set path a globaly agreed on path that our consciousness participates in? In other words, is a continum solely based on the ideas of one person or a global consciousness?

as a whole by everyone who is in the particular continuum, though the individual sets his individual path, but i arnt sure for 1 example how much the satanic global elite for example set things out of whack with there massive ritual sacrafices, like the tsunami etc.

Where would this order come from if not from a creator? The chance that order would form and then operate from Chaos seems astronomical to say the least.

That's like someone throwing a 1,000 piece Jigsaw puzzle off the Grand Canyon and every piece landing perfectly to assemble the puzzle.

the creator set his plan in motion knowing everything would eventually evolve into a system.

How does the creator know what is evil? What reference does this creator have if the only two things in the universe were 1.) The creator 2.) The godforce?.

because positive actions were you are self controlled and helping, like making things grow and not destroying things i.e. good, is along the same principles of the creative force or god force.

evil isnt part of the god force as it is a negative actions it is what appears when the god force is breaking down also where vampire types appear as they have screwed up there individual god force so try to take it off others etc. the creator learnt to be more good and thus get enough power or energy in the god force to create with, if he was negative his energy would start to lessen and not grow.

Degradation of light? Wouldn't that just be the dissolution of light in space? That's just physics. Are you saying that wherever this 'god force' didn't exist was the evil? Seems pretty bias on the 'god force' part.

some ways yes the universe is set to ultimatly wind down, where the god force didnt exist i arnt sure what is there probably nothing, or just voids of nonexistence, the god force is the energy spectrum that allows existence or time to manifest through conciousness appearing in it i.e. like the original creator, it isnt biased as such it just is and always will be whether we last the tests of time or not, as we find without renewed god force energy to differing degrees a individuals god spark will wind down.

[edit on 24-2-2005 by MysticOfRadiance]

Originally posted by greenmansmind
It is good to see that some peoples eyes are wide open and not slammed wide shut

So am I one that keeps their eyes shut and roams around the pasture like a sheep?

Originally posted by greenmansmind
we are not the creator,but we can manifest just the same..

If we, humans, can manifest and have the same 'divine' properties as the creator, then what seperates us from the creator? We have always been the creator. We just don't know it yet.

Originally posted by MysticOfRadiance
no one is above right or wrong and karma is unavoidable, something for everyone to think about

Do you really think the universe set the rules of 'Good' and 'Evil' for us humans to live by?

Think about it...Good and Evil are purely human created concepts. Do you really think that a dying star cares if it supernovas and destorys a distanct planet? Do you think Black Holes care which celestial entites it engulfs on it's Event Horizon?

Do animals abide by the rules of Karma or are they excluded? What about cancerous cells that attack the body of a 'Good' person. Is cancer evil?

The universe doesn't operate the way we tell it to. We segment are reality (good/evil, republican/democrat, black/white...etc) in order to understand or world in terms that we can comprehend.

Originally posted by greenmansmind
if we denied illusion we would all be lost...we would be the aliens

Accepting illusion is what enables us to be held down by petty laws such as physics, morales (good/evil), and the most consistent thing in ones life, Death. The Holographic Universe, I suggest everyone to read that book. It will change your view on reality.

I hate jumping in on a discussion at the very end but I have actually been thinking about this topic a lot. I have some similar beliefs as Sepulchra.

What is a choice? What happens in the brain when a choice is made? Arnt the options weighed and whichever seems better is the decision made? So wouldnt that make decisions simply a product of our past and the current environment surrounding the decision.

Do we all actually have free will and the ability to make our own choice, or is choice just simply an illusion?

First think about it from an overhead perspective. Example, person grows up in the ghetto, no family unit, no father figure, joins gang for acceptance. SInce acceptance is a human need, person does things for acceptance from the gang in order to fulfill human need even though they may go against societal norms or be evil. Sure he has a choice, but what is his choice based on?

Sure you could say he made the decision to be bad. But isnt that decision also based on what morality was instailled in him while growing up. If he had more morallity instilled would his decision be altered?

Are you with me so far? Heeres another example. Parents say they will stop paying for college if you dont get grades up. You have a test tommorow. Friends sant you to go out. You need to get a good grade or your cut off. You have a decision to make. The factors of the decision are how much you value your future and how much you value having fun. Keep in mind this is a simplified version as there could be other factors like does he have money, is he tired, etc.

In essence if you had all the variablles in a sitiation understood, you could predict the outcome of whatever decision is to be made.

Its like we are a product of a seemingly random series of events out of our control. Sure that doesnt excuse anones actions. but, damn. All my decisions i make are based on something. If something else happeed with that something then the outcome of my decision would be different.

I hope this gets some replies.... I didnt read the whole thread but did read most of it.


[edit on 24-2-2005 by alienpyro1]

[edit on 24-2-2005 by alienpyro1]

Originally posted by Simulacra

Originally posted by MysticOfRadiance
no one is above right or wrong and karma is unavoidable, something for everyone to think about

Do you really think the universe set the rules of 'Good' and 'Evil' for us humans to live by?

Think about it...Good and Evil are purely human created concepts. Do you really think that a dying star cares if it supernovas and destorys a distanct planet? Do you think Black Holes care which celestial entites it engulfs on it's Event Horizon?

Do animals abide by the rules of Karma or are they excluded? What about cancerous cells that attack the body of a 'Good' person. Is cancer evil?

The universe doesn't operate the way we tell it to. We segment are reality (good/evil, republican/democrat, black/white...etc) in order to understand or world in terms that we can comprehend.

hi simulacra, your level of understanding of anything improves with your level of consciousness or the level of evolution or development etc you have attained.

souls have consciousness whereas planets etc dont.

yes of course we do segment our reality and give meanings to things, the more evolved a individuals consciousness the more he can do with it.

animals have to abide to rules just as everyone else, that has consciousness does.

the 'rules' are a throwback to the price of existence and how the energy patterns work.

when we relize that we are all dreaming..as we all do..thou not only when we sleep also when awake..
then we can learn to control our dream...
one of the most important things i have ever learned was when i was in pre school..nursury rhyme...row row row your boat...

thou it seems to be one of the most difficult things for people to do..
i chose to at a very young age..i have been persistent at living my dream,no matter what lies before me..again it is not easy for the way we live our lifes today is more like living others dreams,including the dreams of our fathers..

everyone can say what they will about not being truly responsible for their actions..
i know that we are..
i see a very weak world around
everyone saying you make me happy you make me sick you this you that..
to me that is like saying your mind is not your own
someone mentioned universal law..my mind is the universe..i am not sure about law..did the universe write it or man

as far as i understand everything has consciousness everything is alive..
i think that man thinks he is so intelligent somehow some silent innate knowledge is taken away..its as if wool was pulled over his eyes..
colors blind the eyes sound deafens the ears

as far as reading the holographic universe..that may be to scientific for some..
perhaps magik of the mind...

or sitting in silence for a long time would be best..most of all awareness much awareness and sensitivity//yada

Originally posted by alienpyro1
I hate jumping in on a discussion at the very end but I have actually been thinking about this topic a lot. I have some similar beliefs as Sepulchra.

What is a choice? What happens in the brain when a choice is made? Arnt the options weighed and whichever seems better is the decision made? So wouldnt that make decisions simply a product of our past and the current environment surrounding the decision.

Do we all actually have free will and the ability to make our own choice, or is choice just simply an illusion?

First think about it from an overhead perspective. Example, person grows up in the ghetto, no family unit, no father figure, joins gang for acceptance. SInce acceptance is a human need, person does things for acceptance from the gang in order to fulfill human need even though they may go against societal norms or be evil. Sure he has a choice, but what is his choice based on?

Sure you could say he made the decision to be bad. But isnt that decision also based on what morality was instailled in him while growing up. If he had more morallity instilled would his decision be altered?

Are you with me so far? Heeres another example. Parents say they will stop paying for college if you dont get grades up. You have a test tommorow. Friends sant you to go out. You need to get a good grade or your cut off. You have a decision to make. The factors of the decision are how much you value your future and how much you value having fun. Keep in mind this is a simplified version as there could be other factors like does he have money, is he tired, etc.

In essence if you had all the variablles in a sitiation understood, you could predict the outcome of whatever decision is to be made.

Its like we are a product of a seemingly random series of events out of our control. Sure that doesnt excuse anones actions. but, damn. All my decisions i make are based on something. If something else happeed with that something then the outcome of my decision would be different.

I hope this gets some replies.... I didnt read the whole thread but did read most of it.


[edit on 24-2-2005 by alienpyro1]

[edit on 24-2-2005 by alienpyro1]

My thoughts exactly. It all comes down to probability. For example, a child born with higher serotonin levels than normal, is fearless and more impulsive, so when he/she gets in trouble at school...can you blame the kid? Sure, you could, but when you get down to the nitty and gritty of it..who's fault is it? His/her genes? People can usually be reformed, im not trying to take away any responsibility, but ultimately, we are products of our genes and environment. A kid born with abnormally high serotonin levels, who is abused at a young is 9 times as likely to be a criminal/violent when he grows up as opposed to a person with normal serotonin levels. Is the kid at fault for being a criminal? What choice did he have? Free-will is just an illusion. It all comes down to probability.