Are we responsible for our own actions?

We're responsible for our actions because we CHOSE to take those
actions.
The thought comes before the action.
The thought proceeds from our mind. It is then that the choice is
made about what action to take. Maybe that's when the "global
consciousness" is consulted.
The choices are not limited. It may seem to someone that
they are but they're not.
Therefore, we are responsible for our own actions.

Simulacra

are you saying that you think spiritual truths dont exist?, do you believe everything is moral relativism and that we are not held accountable for our actions?.

[edit on 21-12-2004 by MysticOfRadiance]

[edit on 21-12-2004 by MysticOfRadiance]

[edit on 21-12-2004 by MysticOfRadiance]

Originally posted by Simulacra
In a nutshell, the concept of 'self' and 'ego' is just the result of being trapped in physical form, not to mention societal/economic/political/religious...etc factors that influence the way we view our world.

I still disagree here Sim

I understand what you're saying, but I think the fact that we are "trapped in physical form" is the important part.

We ARE trapped in physical form, and that creates individuals out of us - whether we all share a common Life Spark, or whether we all return to the Same Place when we die is irrelevant.

We are here now - and we are individual. (even as we're one)

Originally posted by MysticOfRadiance
are you saying that you think spiritual truths dont exist?

Spiritual truths do not exist. In what model can we compare and validate a spiritual truth?

Originally posted by MysticOfRadiance
do you believe everything is moral relativism

I believe morals are a humanly created concept. Morals can not be held and redeemed universally. Just within other members of our society. Therefore morals are humanly made and thus flawed due to our physical and mental constraints (brain, neural senses, comprehension of the universe

Originally posted by MysticOfRadiance
and that we are not held accountable for our actions?.

I don't believe that we are held accountable for our actions.

Originally posted by quango
We are here now - and we are individual. (even as we're one)

Ok. I'll agree with you on this one. The physical forces us to perceive ourselves as 'individuals'. It�s a cosmic act of deception.

Originally posted by Simulacra
The physical forces us to perceive ourselves as 'individuals'. It�s a cosmic act of deception.

To what end? Why does the 'cosmos' care and want to deceive us?

Originally posted by saint4God

Originally posted by Simulacra
The physical forces us to perceive ourselves as 'individuals'. It�s a cosmic act of deception.

To what end? Why does the 'cosmos' care and want to deceive us?

Using my answers against me .The cosmos could care less about us. But our perception would make it seem as if we are being deceived.

Originally posted by elaine
We're responsible for our actions because we CHOSE to take those
actions.

And I would say those 'choices' are merely influences (socio/political/economic..etc) being equated in our mind and action is the 'outcome'.

Originally posted by elaine
The thought comes before the action.

Influences are absorb within the brain, then the remainder is the 'action'.

Originally posted by elaine
Maybe that's when the "global consciousness" is consulted.

That global consciousness is never consulted. The Cosmic Consciousness absorbs us. We are it. Consulting with the cosmic consciousness is the same as consulting yourself.

i would say individuals are responsible for there actions as the actions we take determine our individual frequency.

besides other things that are out of our control which are accounted for anyway, the way our frequency or soul is acting or leading determines how responsible we have been for ourself through our actions.

we have free will but due to spiritual truths we have a responsibility as to how we act with this free will, these spiritual safeguards are there for good reason

act negative to the truth of your existence and you start to turn away from what allows your existence in the first place, and thus turn towards less vibration and lower dimensions away from the rarefied light of the god force.

we were created by a creator who utilized the rarefied light of god, thus we are fractal's of light of the original creator, this truth means to exist there is a system/structure involved.

most everyone knows nowadays that everything has its opposites, this also applies to existence, which has a exstreme opposite of non-existence.

this is why the rules of existence are there to help safeguard your own god spark.

as you were created you can also un-create yourself through your choices and actions, this is why we are responsible for our actions, and for good reason.

Originally posted by MysticOfRadiance
i would say individuals are responsible for there actions as the actions we take determine our individual frequency.

What do you mean by frequency? The number of times a specified periodic phenomenon occurs within a specified interval?

Originally posted by MysticOfRadiance
besides other things that are out of our control which are accounted for anyway

Like what? All of our actions would be accounted for if we share a collective consciousness. And everyone will be accountable for them.

Originally posted by MysticOfRadiance
the way our frequency or soul is acting or leading determines how responsible we have been for ourself through our actions.

Still I dont know what you mean by 'human frequency'.

Originally posted by MysticOfRadiance
we have free will but due to spiritual truths we have a responsibility as to how we act with this free will, these spiritual safeguards are there for good reason

Spirtual truths? How do we know the limits of our spirits? Whatever perception we have of our spirit isnt a 'Spirtual truth'. It's a perception based on a variety of factors that influence the way we think. How can you validate a spirtual truth? What reference point is there?

Originally posted by MysticOfRadiance
act negative to the truth of your existence and you start to turn away from what allows your existence in the first place

Negative/Positive, Good/Bad is just our brains polarizing our world. Its a physical function. In reality there is no Good/Evil in the universe. The universe just...is.

Originally posted by MysticOfRadiance
lower dimensions away from the rarefied light of the god force.

'Lower Dimensions'? Rarefied Light of the God Force? I'm clueless as to what you are talking about. Maybe you could provide some links.

Originally posted by MysticOfRadiance
most everyone knows nowadays that everything has its opposites, this also applies to existence, which has a exstreme opposite of non-existence.

Once again, this is only our perception. Perceptions change from culture to culture. Did you know that some Native Americans don�t even have a word in their vocabulary for past and future? Therefore, how could everyone know these "truths"? Taoist believe that everything is in the moment, and there is no separation of existence and non-existence.

I think when people realize they arent responsible for their own actions, it then becomes easier to make better choices.

Originally posted by Alec Eiffel
I think when people realize they arent responsible for their own actions, it then becomes easier to make better choices.

I guess 'cause it means we can do whatever we want. ANARCHY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Originally posted by saint4God

Originally posted by Alec Eiffel
I think when people realize they arent responsible for their own actions, it then becomes easier to make better choices.

I guess 'cause it means we can do whatever we want. ANARCHY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Not without the legal system looming over you.

Let me just through this in the works ,I'had been working on it some time ago,I don't have much time now so I'll let you guys read it and see if it tastes any good...
Existentialists have argued, they must accept the risk and responsibility of their actions...
Most existentialists have held that rational clarity is desirable wherever possible but that life's most important questions are not accessible to reason or science.
Freedom of choice, through which each human being creates his or her own nature, is a primary theme. Because individuals are free to choose their own path, existentialists have argued, they must accept the risk and responsibility of their actions. Kierkegaard held that a feeling of general apprehension, which he called dread, is God's way of calling each individual to commit to a personally valid way of life. Relatedly, 20th-century German philosopher Martin Heidegger felt that anxiety leads to the individual's confrontation with the impossibility of finding ultimate justification for his or her choices.
"Where shall we seek Nothing? Where shall we find Nothing? In order to find something must we not know beforehand that it is there? Indeed we must! First and foremost we can only look if we have pre-supposed the presence of a thing to be looked for. But the thing we are looking for is Nothing. Is there after all a seeking without pre-supposition, a seeking complemented by a pure finding?" by M.Heidegger...
The Realm Of Existentialism..
"The existentialists along with many other groups are helping to teach us about the limits of verbal, analytic, conceptual rationality. They are part of the current call back to raw experience as prior to any concepts or abstractions. This amounts to what I believe to be a justified critique to the whole way of thinking of the western world in the 20th century, including orthodox positivistic science and philosophy, both of which badly need re-examination." by Abraham.H.Maslow....
Phenomenology Defined..
The phenomena studied are those experienced in various acts of consciousness, mainly cognitive or perceptual acts, but also in such acts as valuation and aesthetic appreciation. Husserl intended to develop a philosophical method that was devoid of all presuppositions and that would describe phenomena by focusing exclusively on them, to the exclusion of all questions of their causal origins and their status outside the act of consciousness itself. His aim was to discover the essential structures and relationships of the phenomena as well as the acts of consciousness in which the phenomena appeared, and to do this by as faithful an exploration as possible, uncluttered by scientific or cultural presuppositions.
In his original conception of phenomenology, Husserl's idea of a presuppositionless science amounted to rejecting all antecedent commitments to theories of knowledge, both those formally developed as philosophical systems and those which pervade our ordinary thinking ("the natural attitude"). He intended by this suspension, or bracketing, of extraneous commitments to go beyond the usual choices of Idealism and Realism, to "the things themselves." In his later work, however, Husserl expanded his phenomenological method to include what he called "the phenomenological reduction." In this reduction, not only extraneous opinions, but also all beliefs about the external existence of the objects of consciousness, were bracketed. This suspension of all reference to the reality of the thing experienced left the philosopher with nothing but the experiencing itself, which Husserl divided into the "noesis" (act of consciousness) and the "noema" (object of consciousness). Here the line between idealism and phenomenology became blurred, although the suspension of belief in the reality of an object of consciousness is not the same thing as denying that it exists.by Thomas E. Wren..

Originally posted by Alec Eiffel
Not without the legal system looming over you.

And this legal system is a heavy influencer on the seemingly 'free will' actions that we take.

"Are we responsible for our own actions?"

Of course!

Unless,

you were possessed or in some way being puppeted, controlled by someone else,

in which case - that was their action, to puppet you,

unless - they were being controlled.

So it works just perfectly well, as long as no-one is allowed to disguise who is controlling who for what reasons.

If that happens, and people are doing things because they are being made to do them and not because they chose to do those things, it will stall things into a sort of repeat-loop of reality, until whatever the problem is is dealt with and removed. As in for the whole world, regardless of where who you are, if you are here then you are part of that same world where those things are happening in it. So even if it did not affect you directly it would affect the world which you must deal with on some level to exist here at all, so - it affects everyone.

hi simulacra, would you agree there is a system to the universe for it to be able to exist and function?.

Originally posted by MysticOfRadiance
hi simulacra, would you agree there is a system to the universe for it to be able to exist and function?.

I agree that the only true system that enables the universe the operate is based on it's perceived 'randomness'. If this chaos didnt exist, then the pattern of the universe would have long been discovered eons ago and manipulated in some 'divine' way.

Originally posted by Simulacra

Originally posted by MysticOfRadiance
hi simulacra, would you agree there is a system to the universe for it to be able to exist and function?.

I agree that the only true system that enables the universe the operate is based on it's perceived 'randomness'. If this chaos didnt exist, then the pattern of the universe would have long been discovered eons ago and manipulated in some 'divine' way.

so what if we say the plan for the universe was thought out by the creator who through trial and error had evolved himself to a high degree, and learnt to use the creative (god) force that he had become conscious in and thus exist i.e. time.

the creator then put his plan into action by innitiating the big bang billions of years ago, thus creating chaotic beginnings though with the right components to evolve into the universe and souls we see today.

the chaos still exists and so does the divine design.

oh, it looks like your post above simulacra was talking about the creator.

[edit on 9-2-2005 by MysticOfRadiance]

[edit on 9-2-2005 by MysticOfRadiance]

[edit on 9-2-2005 by MysticOfRadiance]

[edit on 9-2-2005 by MysticOfRadiance]

Originally posted by MysticOfRadiance
so what if we say the plan for the universe was thought out by the creator who through trial and error had evolved himself to a high degree, and learnt to use the creative (god) force that he had become conscious in and thus exist i.e. time.

Omnipotent power would not create the universe out of Trial and Error. Remember, God is supposed to be omnipotent, free of flaws and errors...all knowing? So that would negate your statement.

Originally posted by MysticOfRadiance
the creator then put his plan into action by innitiating the big bang billions of years ago, thus creating chaotic beginnings though with the right components to evolve into the universe and souls we see today.

Mathematically, if we knew every factor that ignited the 'Big Bang' (the exact coordinates of molecules, astronomical conditions, solar wind factor...etc.) Then we could replicate the exact same 'Big bang' and thus:
Replicate the exact conditions in which the universe was created.
Replicate the exact time period in which magma cooled down
Replicate the first cellular life emergence
Replicate the exact time water/land evolution occurred...
Replicate every singe earthquake/volcanic eruption/natural disaster at the exact moment.
Replicate the exact second of the emergence of the first homo-sapien
....skip a few million years

Replicate the same exact cloud configuration in which JFK was assassinated
Replicate the exact amount of people who watched the Moon landing
Replicate every single lottery number
...and eventually

Replicate this exact same post and conversation.
We perceive that our actions are governed by our own free will. But in essence, if we had a sophisticated enough mathematical equation, we could predict every action that has arisen in our world and every action that will arise.