More police getting shot at from Florida to Los Angeles

a reply to: Maverick7

They out number, out gun and out flank (communications and legal support) any single or small group of citizens and when challenged, they will go in and burn you out, and even allow innocent collateral damage in the process

You sound like a cop, you have obviously never been to my city.

The only collateral damage will be their K9 units if it ever came to it

Don't push your luck.

originally posted by: Witness2008


I agree. The simple fact that police unions exist, and have such a loud voice when defending the indefensible actions of LE tells me that there are hidden powers with not so benevolent intentions towards us.

If you take the time to read the link on Kelly Thomas you will see that the Fullerton community took it into their own hands in order to make some positive change within law enforcement. They too recognized where the real change would come from.... counsel members, mayors, along with police chiefs. For me they are an example of how we should all move forward.

Individual LE however have it within their power to not over react, nor take their bad day out on us. If each officer that took their job seriously and reported abuse that they would see, then we would start seeing some change. Instead we see the NYPD turning on the mayor and the cities diversified population, a perfect example of why so many people are banding together against them. LE set the tone a long time ago.

Man, did you hit the proverbial nail on the head. Police unions (or any unions for that matter) have no regard for anyone but those they represent. And the politicians they support. Too much power is given to the unions, and they wield that power with utter disregard for anyone in the communities. The officer is always right in their eyes. Not a bad thing to support the officers, but sometimes I believe they would earn more respect if they let a few go it on their own, and face the consequences of their actions.

On the other hand, putting a review board together to review police actions is mostly a waste of time. Unless they are empowered to actually do something. Most can only make recommendations with no teeth, but there have been some that have been able to make a difference. I know, the general public does not know what is involved in police work, but any idiot can see some of the incidents that have been recorded, are obviously wrong. Not all, just some.

ANYTIME an officer has video or audio equipment that is not used, suspicions should be raised. If a citizen forgets to turn on their headlights at night, they are subject to being pulled over and ticketed. However, if a cop forgets to turn on his body or dash camera, it was just a mistake, my bad. If you are doing something you don't want videotaped or recorded, stay in your house, never leave, and definitely don't try to get a job as a police officer.

I don't think LEO's as a whole set the tone for our current situation, but the bad ones who are protected by the unions, police administration, other officers who are scared to report the bad ones, district attorneys who rely on officers to convict, and a lack of oversight with real life consequences all enable the current tone of discord between the public and LEO's.

There is a solution to the current problems we face, but shooting innocent cops is not going to bring change. Abusing innocent citizens is not a solution. Working together is the only way forward, and it has got to start soon. The divide will only get greater if we don't stop this madness.

For all of you who hate the police and would like to see the police force shut down entirely -
don't give me a nasty reply - you have been crude and nasty enough on ATS already


For those of you who believe
the majority of police do their best to be fair and just
under very difficult circumstances
Please write a thank you note or
note of support and give it to a police officer
or take it to the police station.


People who hate on the police on this site have
a total breakdown hissy
when I suggest the police have the "Blue Flu"
on MLK day or week
to show people they have sympathy
for the protesters

Yet they continue to hold a love/hate relationship
they want the police
and like a psychopath
hate them at the same time

What kind of message are the police getting from the haters?
We hate you - we want to see you dead
but you have an obligation to keep us safe
no matter how much we want to kill you and see
you brought to your knees
Psycho to the max!

We are lucky the whole force
in all the US doesn't up and quit
at the same time on us,
the way our society is treating them right now.

We actually would deserve it if they did.

Man up people - if you want them to keep you and your property safe
don't threaten to do them harm or
mentally torture them
or demean them

If you really believe the police have it coming
and you want to see them dead or harmed -
then to be intellectually honest and to act in a sane manner
rather than a psycho manner
support MLK day/week of the "Blue Flu"
to be honest and to show
that you think people are basically good and don't need the police.

a reply to: grandmakdw

Wanting to see change within LE is hardly hating on cops. It's all or nothing with folks like you. Seems to be with many LE agencies these days also.

I have seen all types in my many years, good cops, not so good cops, bad cops and dangerous cops. Let's start at the end of that list and start weeding out those that use steroids, and have more than one substantiated complaint for abuse of power on their record. Most officers know who those people would be.

Police are a line of defense that we should all count on, especially the defense of our constitutional rights.

originally posted by: Witness2008
a reply to: grandmakdw

Wanting to see change within LE is hardly hating on cops. It's all or nothing with folks like you. Seems to be with many LE agencies these days also.

I have seen all types in my many years, good cops, not so good cops, bad cops and dangerous cops. Let's start at the end of that list and start weeding out those that use steroids, and have more than one substantiated complaint for abuse of power on their record. Most officers know who those people would be.

Police are a line of defense that we should all count on, especially the defense of our constitutional rights.

What we are seeing in the streets
and in the riots
and in the brutal slaying of the 2 officers
and in the protests
is raw, unadulterated hatred
and a call to kill the police is routine.

Hardly rational,

hardly just asking for change

it is raw,

it is nasty,

it is so bad that I really wouldn't blame

the entire US police force if they quit en mass

That is what the media is showing us on a daily basis,
do you see any peaceful, rational conversations taking place
I sure don't.
Do you see the leaders of these protests encouraging
peaceful, rational dialog?
I don't.
I see racial hatred and racial division being
spewed like the evil
it is.
Directed at those who we depend on to keep us safe.

That is what I am getting from all of these protests,
killings, and attacks on police.

originally posted by: real_one
The culture of police worship on ATS has gotten out of hand.

That's not even close to being true. You've got it backwards. Most of the posts here are hateful anti-cop rhetoric. The few posts that make note of that are 'police worship' ??? No. Making note of the mindless wide-brush cop hate is not 'police worship'.

a reply to: grandmakdw
Go back to your knitting grandma....these brutal savages need to be restrained....period.
If there is no restraint coming from the corridors of government.....(who do not respect the people either) then the people will take matters into their own hands....
Firstly the nut cases will react as they have been doing....but then the people will be moved to strike back also......
It is a matter of history....and those who ignore it get to relive it.....

originally posted by: grandmakdw
it is so bad that I really wouldn't blame
the entire US police force if they quit en mass

I wouldn't blame them either. It's a thankless job. Blue flu or see them leave en mass ... leave the cop haters to have to deal with life without police officers. Now that would be interesting.

originally posted by: stirling
a reply to: grandmakdw
Go back to your knitting grandma....these brutal savages need to be restrained....period.
If there is no restraint coming from the corridors of government.....(who do not respect the people either) then the people will take matters into their own hands....
Firstly the nut cases will react as they have been doing....but then the people will be moved to strike back also......
It is a matter of history....and those who ignore it get to relive it.....

Ok, so you support the police force quitting or being let go in it's entirety?

If you think they are savages then that should be the honest response.
Ask for the resignation or firing of every police officer in the US
immediately.
That is how you deal with savages in your midst.

So instead of name calling and
spewing hatred
do something positive
and demand the resignation
or firing of every police office in the
US effective
immediately.
That would be an honest response.

Are you doing that?
Are you being honest?

Or do you want to call them savages
and then demand they keep you and your property safe?
That is psycho to the max.

Call me a savage
and I would never respond to help you stay safe
or keep your property safe
or help your family in any way
Good thing I'm not a police officer, huh?

Be intellectually honest if you believe the police are brutal savages
Demand that they all be fired
all over the US
immediately.
That is an honest response
and the only way
to deal with
what you call brutal savages

a reply to: grandmakdw

Only being able to see one side of this is why it has gotten as bad as it has, and now police are being targeted while eating their lunch. There is plenty of guilt to go around, and I suggest holding both sides accountable at all times.

Take the NYPD, who have banded together to oppose their boss, who by the way sent zero aspersions in the direction of police. All that I can see that could have possibly angered the police force and their union (who actually control the departments) was to get rid of an unconstitutional practice of stopping and frisking, really just blatant profiling, and then to express his opinion concerning the race relations between the police and the populace.

The stop and frisk policy spoke volumes as to the racial profiling that has been employed by the NYPD. There are plenty of other cities that have experienced racial divide because of such practices. Ferguson Missouri being another.

I live in St. Louis and have heard calm coming from the vast, vast majority of residents. Just as you don't want to see all police blamed for the bad actions of a few, minority populations would rather not be blamed as a whole for shooting or threatening police.

Police are authority figures, they really should be setting the example.

a reply to: grandmakdw

Eliminating municipal police departments really should be considered, as their heads are really not accountable to the population. I see no reason to not have the sheriff departments in each county to police all streets.

originally posted by: Witness2008
a reply to: grandmakdw

Eliminating municipal police departments really should be considered, as their heads are really not accountable to the population. I see no reason to not have the sheriff departments in each county to police all streets.

Ok then if that is what you believe,
make it public
fight for it
and ask for the resignation/firing
of all police immediately, since you seem to believe they are all bad
then work to rebuild as you want it


That is not the way I see it
I see the vast majority of police as doing their best to be fair and just

I see what is in every organization,

and what no organization will ever be rid of

- a few bad apples

The police force right now, in my opinion,

should make extremely public examples of the few bad apples

They should also make extremely public all of the good things the police do to help people and to protect property.

Also those who want police to stay engaged,
to protect them and their property
should show support for the vast majority of fair and just police officers.
That is my opinion and how I feel.

On the flip side,
if one thinks most police are bad
then one should demand the total end
to the police forces
immediately.

Add this one...

NC Officer Thwarts NYPD-Style Assassination Attempt ...

There is a serious issue about to break out into the mainstream in this country.

a reply to: grandmakdw

The REAL numbers of brutal to non-brutal interactions don't even come close to one percent...something like .003 percent if I remember correctly.

You know what I think would happen if law enforcement went away, grandmakdw? Aside from it not being very pleasant around here for a while? People would be screaming for it and forming vigilante squads and shooting each other left and right.

I wouldn't want that mostly thankless job, which is hard enough without most of the same idiots who cause the mess now painting targets on their backs.

a reply to: onequestion

Probably so. Unless the majority of the people speak out and some of the hate mongers chill out and look at all this in perspective.

a reply to: ~Lucidity

Good and evil play, red pill vs blue pill, red lights and blue lights, that's what all of this about, problem, action resolution, without evil there can be no good, and vis versa, I choose not to involve myself in discussions about today's modern paramilitary forces and the way they are evolving into small armies in our midst, that we pay taxes to protect all of us and serve all of us equally.

I like to think back to the whole reason we have police, that is a throwback to Rome, keeping city states under control, assisting in collecting taxes, there is some good information for anyone who wants to see where the idea of having police came from.
Wikipedia - Vigiles

The problem that presents itself nowadays, stereotypes drive all behavior, and once you have mass mindset on either side of the pole, bad things happen because individuals become standard bearers for certain stereotypes and they unduly become the focus of police stops and greater scrutiny.

This is the reason why all profiling is wrong, just as the police profile criminals or those that look like they might be, people have always had two different stereotypes of police, people that live in crime free areas have a positive stereotype of the police and usually good ones that promote less volatile interactions, on the other hand kids growing up in very bad or violent urban situations growing up witness on a daily basis what they see on every corner and have to deal with not so positive outcomes in the dealings with police, to them them the police are a counter opposing force only there to oppress, bully and victimize them, again that is the perception, so there is of course a volatile atmosphere that already exists, bad vibes, bad blood period...

So what you have is yet another duality, first of the good and evil, and secondly of two entirely different unfortunately prejudiced feelings that one segment of the population has verses the other, and a monolithic view police have about the communities that they serve which translates into the way certain individuals are treated as opposed to those who might not fit the visual stereotypes they have been brainwashed with.

Policing is an art, but too many do not have a handle on it, and it causes everyone else that are in that occupation to bear the brunt of criticism, I really can't say I don't like the police, but it is easy to see the problem if you just start to think through a few of the things I just wrote.

This is all just a play to aid in banning firearms- and increasing the policing of the citizens of this no longer free country.

The police are just pawns in this game like the rest of us- their losses will be total, as will ours.

But this is just the result of people that are desperate

Maybe if they would spend their money on educating themselves to get a job instead of buying guns and $200 Nikes they wouldn't be desperate?

Any groups that gather together, are well armed, and claim to be anti police will be crushed. If you think about this in military terms they outnumber you, out gun you, out supply you, and have the law on their side. They also have the standard political defense of being tough on crime protecting them. No serious rebellion can win in a straight up fight, but if people act independently and find/attack their own targets (as these stories of isolated shootings suggest), things will happen.

I don't want a guerrilla war against the police, but every day now it looks more and more like that's what's going to happen. People aren't stupid, they'll figure out the tactics that work. How many times would it take a group of 4 people working together to fake a domestic call, get a police response, and then take the cop out? Or trip security alarms just for the purpose of luring them to an area? If things don't start changing, and fast... we could see this happening next year.

Personally, I think this all hinges on NYC. They have some of the worst abuses and a public fight going on over it right now. If the cops win people will lose hope, if the mayor wins they'll gain some.