Blocking streets at random is not nonviolence

a reply to: onequestion

So, as long as no violence occurs, your ok with one group of protesters blocking roads in order to prevent their rival group from reaching a destination?

a reply to: XTexan

Im pro protesting.

a reply to: onequestion

Thats kind of the point of my line of questioning? I'm pro-protesting as well, however not when it involves violating others rights. Its just that what you are proposing would essentially allow one group of protesters to rob the right to protest from another by blocking the route.

For example, last year(?) in Texas there was a protest of types in the capital by the Pro-Choice crowd. Now I don't necessarily agree with them, but I do respect their right to voice opinions and protest. What if the Pro-Life crowd blocked them from getting to the capital and therefore blocked their right to protest (and freely travel). I wouldn't support that and I don't see how one could? It just seems wrong?

originally posted by: Echtelion
You doing that on purpose, OP? Spouting the most inane, sociopathic, hateful, resentful threads just for the sake of... getting attention?

Hopefully we got off on the wrong foot (or at the wrong stop). As far as I know my threads haven't been any of those things, so your view of them may be a mirror effect. This particular thread came about because I have a little knowledge about nonviolent movements, and wanted to let folks here know that blocking a street without notice is not a tactic used by the former masters of the art of nonviolence. And, again, I'm not condemning it as a protest tactic, it is just not nonviolent and shouldn't be labeled as such by organizers, the media, or by people participating in these dramatic actions (such a nonviolent action would have killed my pa!).

a reply to: Aleister

When one group infringes on another that is well bullying. Martin Luther King would never have infringed on the rights of others he appealed to there humanity. But many people today think forcing people to believe what you do is ok. There really isn't any tolerance for alternative views. And your right blocking streets is a form of violence and is treated as such by authorities.

originally posted by: onequestion
WE NEED TO LISTEN, LISTEN, TO PEOPLE NOT REACT thats the real solution.

Funny how the protestors were not at all interested in listening to people that wanted to use the road, but they demand that they be listened to!

So...if they riot, they're thugs. If they block intersections it's too disruptive....possibly not "non-violent"...?

Should they write an essay? A letter to the editor? Certainly that won't scare or inconvenience anyone. Plus, we could just file all of their fears and concerns about equal justice in the circular file and not have to actually deal with the uncomfortable social questions.

Waaaay more convenient.

You know when you mentioned that people have "things to do" and "places to be"? That applied to Eric Garner, Tamir Rice, Trayvon Martin and Mike Brown too.

originally posted by: kosmicjack
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Should they write an essay? A letter to the editor?

sure. why not?
or, they could get their permit and hold a lawful protest like loads of other people...

as i said, if they would have protested in public square thousands of people an hour would have heard theyre words and maybe been receptive to it.
forcing people to stop on the shoreway does not get people behind your cause.

kind of does the opposite.

i dont want to hear anything anyone has to say that is forcing me to stop on the highway.
walking though the square though, i might just hear something that gets my attention

originally posted by: kosmicjack
So...if they riot, they're thugs. If they block intersections it's too disruptive....possibly not "non-violent"...?

Should they write an essay? A letter to the editor? Certainly that won't scare or inconvenience anyone. Plus, we could just file all of their fears and concerns about equal justice in the circular file and not have to actually deal with the uncomfortable social questions.

Waaaay more convenient.

You know when you mentioned that people have "things to do" and "places to be"? That applied to Eric Garner, Tamir Rice, Trayvon Martin and Mike Brown too.

So let me see if I understand this you think burning looting and disrupting society is ok as long as you believe in the cause. Odd though others van feel just as strongly in the other direction ad well. If you want to win support the hearts and minds as they say. Do you really think disrupting lives and damaging property is the best way to accomplish that?? My experience to get people to support you you want to appeal to them not poss them off.

originally posted by: Grovit

originally posted by: onequestion

I dont care about the law.

had to quote this for truth.

you mentioned in another thread that you have a criminal record

maybe you should start to care about the law. especially if you want people to get behind your issues.

just a thought man

That is rude and uncalled for---proving you've lost your argument---when you begin attacking the OP.

Civil disobedience is a common and quite effective form of protest. It is nonviolent on the part of the protesters. It's the cops who start the violence.
Yes, there are bad laws and they should be disobeyed. That's how this country began. And you know what, I'll just bet there were a lot of ticked-off people when all that tea got tossed into the bay. I'll bet they harrumphed and groused just as loudly as you are whining about a traffic tie-up. You really expect us to believe it is a serious problem in today's world of gadgets telling you every turn to make on the road? Seriously?!!!
How about we address the problem---police brutality---and make these protests unnecessary?

originally posted by: Grovit

originally posted by: onequestion

No I think there are times when it's right to shut down everyone's life to pay attention to an issue that needs immediate resolution like a civil rights issue.


Like the nazis for example. Really inconvenient for Americans to have to go save the day but we really needed to step in and stop them.

No I'm absolutely grounded in my logic and stand firm.

i dont get your thought process at all.
just because there is a issue that warrants disrupting peoples lives does not make it the case...
thats what you dont seem to understand...something that is important to you may not mean # to me

and youre nazi example...well, that example just sucks...
lets compare stopping people in traffic and a protest to sending people to die in a war...

That example makes as much sense as all the "what if" folks with their predictions of death from heart attacks, etc....that game never ends.
The point is to disrupt the normal social order and make people ask questions. That's the point of civil disobedience. Have you folks never studied history? Don't you think the high and mighty in India made these same arguments against Ghandi when the salt trade was impacted?

originally posted by: diggindirt


That is rude and uncalled for---proving you've lost your argument---when you begin attacking the OP.

well. i didnt attack anyone and i also didnt say anything that he did not say himself.
i stated a fact(something he said in a thread on a public forum)
then i made a suggestion
dont see how that is an attack and if you think it was, oh well

originally posted by: Grovit

originally posted by: jimmyx

the people that threw tea into boston harbor were breaking the law...so, apparently you would have been on the side of the british empire during the formation of the U.S.

some serious reaching going on in this thread...

comparing the situation of this thread to nazi germany, the boston tea party and the fight for independence
ok

There's no reaching in the comparison to the fight for our rights as human beings and to be treated as such. No reaching at all. Police brutality and corruption are serious issues that cost us millions of dollars each year in taxpayers costs. It must be addressed.
There are those of us who have spent the past 20 or so years doing all the non-public protesting, writing letters to officials, writing and speaking at every opportunity. The writing and speaking hasn't worked. The problem has consistently gotten worse. Lawsuits resulting from police brutality run millions of dollars each year. Some taxpayer is paying those costs.
So, when you're sitting there in traffic because another 'roided-out rager has taken the life of a another....think what it is going to cost you and your children to let this behavior continue. Maybe while you're sitting there in traffic you could use one of your smart gadgets to send out a few emails and ask the cops to stop it with the brutality.
Stop the brutality and corruption and bring down your taxes. If you can't have compassion for your fellow citizens, think of it in economic terms and it should really get your motor going.
The president of the US causes worst traffic tie-ups every time he visit a city. Get real people!

a reply to: diggindirt

call it what you want.
comparing it to the tea party and bringing up ghandi does not give the assholes forcing people to stop on the highway more merit.
if you feel that way, thats great.
i dont feel that way.
i dont think those methods help get people behind their cause....then again, it is their cause, not mine

originally posted by: XTexan
a reply to: onequestion

So, as long as no violence occurs, your ok with one group of protesters blocking roads in order to prevent their rival group from reaching a destination?

Oh, so now this protest has moved from one highway to all routes leading in and out of the city? Wow! That was pretty neat stuff.

originally posted by: diggindirt


It must be addressed.
i agree. however it is not up to you when and how i address it. thats my call

. Lawsuits resulting from police brutality run millions of dollars each year. Some taxpayer is paying those costs.
so youre worried about my tax dollars? sure pal

Maybe while you're sitting there in traffic you could use one of your smart gadgets to send out a few emails and ask the cops to stop it with the brutality.
dont have a smart phone and if i did i wouldnt be doint that. id either be playing mahjongg or calling a roid rager to hopefully come and arrest you so i can get to my business

Stop the brutality and corruption and bring down your taxes.
again with worrying about my taxes. did i ask you to do that?

If you can't have compassion for your fellow citizens, think of it in economic terms and it should really get your motor going.
for the most part i dont have compassion for my fellow citizens. i dont like people very much.

The president of the US causes worst traffic tie-ups every time he visit a city. Get real people!

justify the behavior all you want.
spew your crap all you want.
i dont agree with the methods this thread is about and im not going to change my mind. its just not going to happen.
say what you want and so what you want, just dont bother me with it.

originally posted by: diggindirt


Oh, so now this protest has moved from one highway to all routes leading in and out of the city? Wow! That was pretty neat stuff.

he didnt say that.

originally posted by: Grovit
a reply to: diggindirt

call it what you want.
comparing it to the tea party and bringing up ghandi does not give the assholes forcing people to stop on the highway more merit.
if you feel that way, thats great.
i dont feel that way.
i dont think those methods help get people behind their cause....then again, it is their cause, not mine

If you don't think police brutality and corruption are your issue, you haven't really considered the matter logically. You've let your anger at what you perceive as a bunch of looters and grifters crowd out your rational, logical thought patterns.
I spent a couple hours today with a retired police chief who is now a county executive. He KNOWS this is a huge issue and one that must be addressed. When cities, counties and states are forced to spend millions of tax payer dollars in defending their employees and paying out settlements for the bad behavior, it is costing every single citizen who pays taxes. And that's just the legal fees and settlements. The medical bills for those brutalized people are borne by the taxpayers as well.
It is his opinion, and I agree with him, that body cameras and drug testing of officers after any violent encounter must be the beginning point to addressing the brutality.
The corruption can be rooted out. It's hard, tedious, thankless work but it can be done. It must be done.
And when the letter writing, the preaching, the pleading---all have little effect---taking to the streets peacefully is what is left to those of us who will not endorse violence.
For heaven's sake man, let go of the anger and think logically.

a reply to: diggindirt

not angry man. i just dont agree with the methods.
you clearly care about the issue very much. awesome for you
i dont. drop it

a reply to: onequestion

I disagree. You claim we should listen. Listen to what?

The testimony of the Ferguson officer and witnesses are both hearsay. No one knows what happened exactly in Ferguson.

So you have an angry mob that has "ruled" the officer guilty based on hearsay. We are supposed to "listen" to that?

No matter what has happened it does not justify the blocking of traffic or looting.

Ferguson lost at least 10 businesses due to fire and destruction. Businesses that have been running, some, for thirty years. This is far worse for the community than losing one life.

Now we get to the fact that CEOs are becoming reluctant to invest in these communities. It's fun to have an idea and think you will change things, you have to do it the correct way.