Federal Drug Sentencing Reform Goes Into Effect Today

originally posted by: wantsome

originally posted by: tavi45
a reply to: wantsome

So your idea of freedom is limiting freedom?

I don't make the rules I just play by them.

You need to wake up man, seriously. Even gov doesn't play by the rules.

The freaks who make up the rules are the worst abusers of legal and illegal substances you could imagine, and get this, it is because of gov's covert involvement in drug running that there is so much of it traded on street corners. The laws are made up to prevent anyone else muscling in on gov drug business and anyone it catches goes to jail. And it will also loot for itself, any money and assets it assumes those persons might have made through drug dealing.

Gov is a criminal mob.

originally posted by: wantsome
I'm moving on now I've got better things to do with my time then argue about the legalities of substance abuse. Smoke it snort it inject it or anally insert it see ya. Just remember your free to make the choice but you have no one but yourself to blame for the consequences.

And yet you have a breaking bad avatar? Ok back on topic. This is great news and I hope many do get free from victimless crimes.

a reply to: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

I think he's saying you're free to be told how to live your life, if you don't agree, you get punished.

That's about the size of your view of 'freedom' mate isn't it?

a reply to: wantsome

really?? how ironic your avatar is eh??

dont judge people so easily... drug prohibition only benefits the people who should not be benfiting from it.

I remember a CT I heard years and years ago that the U.S. government had considered laws to put nutritional supplements in cheap fortified wines so that winos, who would rather drink than eat, would get the recommended vitamins and minerals in their diet. But, so the story goes, the government decided it was better to have unhealthy and nutrition poor winos. I forget the reasoning behind that, maybe a weak and unhealthy wino is cheaper and easier to manage.

Back on topic, most drug laws suck and prison reform has been needed for a long time, but this seems like a tiny step and fairly insignificant considering the enormity of the problems in the system.

originally posted by: wantsome
There is a line in the sand in this country cross it and you loose your freedom. I have no sympathy for drug users. If doing drugs means more to you then your freedom so be it. You make the choices you except the consequences. I can't stand drug addicts or alcoholics.

I dont see your logic


"Drugs can harm you so you we will imprison you for your protection"

What sort of logic is that?

Prison should be for people a danger to the public.


Prison does not work for drug users, never has , never will! All it does it get them mixed with worse people, labels them with a criminal record and puts them on a downward spiral that just leads them to more drugs as they cant get a decent job and stuck with a crap life with no hope or support.

Every country that treats drug use with rehabilitation instead has had massive reduction in drug use and death.

a reply to: Daedal

The leading cause of minority, male incarceration is "less than an ounce". Sure it's a choice, but one most white people don't have to make because we get slapped on the wrist and told to behave, where others get labeled thugs and receive the maximum sentence for first offense.

People will put whatever they want into their bodies whether legal or illegal... our bodies, it should be our choice. All we've managed to do by stepping all over the liberty of every adult in this country is create an exploitative black market and an exploitative corporate justice system.

a reply to: Trueman

Make it all legal and let it all enter the market. No more dealers... better yet, let the dealers become productive, contributing citizens.

a reply to: wantsome

do you drink beer or any alcoholic beverage , do you smoke.
if so you are a drug user.

both are drugs.

So is a law against driving a motor vehicle over a certain intoxication level unfair and against a person's freedom? Does my right to remain uninjured loose to someone's right to run over me while drunk?

a reply to: roadgravel

no one has said that DUI laws are being changed, just the possession of drug laws.

alcohol is legal, driving while under it's influence is not, same as with illegal drugs, driving under their influence is illegal whether you have them in your possession or not.

originally posted by: Kali74
Sure it's a choice, but one most white people don't have to make because we get slapped on the wrist and told to behave, where others get labeled thugs and receive the maximum sentence for first offense.

Well by your logic this pasty white boy should be questioning why I was put through the wringer for my first offense. Sorry to the mods if this goes against T&C, but with the topic at hand I think it fits quite nicely...

Two years of my life and many thousands of dollars that I didn't have for being an occupant of a car in which a joint was being smoked. Not for having a bag in my pocket, not for being caught in a drug deal, but for smoking a joint before my band went on stage. This was with my full cooperation with the police that night. Being my first offense I didn't read the paperwork thoroughly enough and ended up signing something that directly contradicted what the officers told me. My experience was an "arrest and release" type, where you've technically been arrested but they just give you a court date and all that on the spot and your on your way. The next morning I read the papers, realized that the police essentially duped me, and decided to fight it. I was met with "well you signed it, there's nothing that can be done.", which was true. It was my fault for not reading the paperwork more thoroughly.

A long process turned into jail time, attending rehab (where I was in 'class' with people who would rob their mother for crack money), paying insane amounts of money to multiple organizations, and even my own personal "Law and Order" moment when I challenged the judge and left the state prosecutor speechless (they gave me a urinalysis only a few days after I was arrested and claimed I had to be still smoking. I simply cited their own materials they gave me about addiction, stating that a chronic smoker may take up to 90 days to be able to pass a urinalysis.). In the end, I learned of a term called "Early Termination". For anyone who isn't familiar with its use in a legal/probationary context, this meant that if I were to find the sums of money that would eventually be paid over the two year period, to all the organizations, and paid in full up front....well, then I didn't need the rehabilitation or the random drug screenings or the weekly updates with the P.O. So I busted my ass, came up with the money and paid them off. I even mentioned to my P.O. that it was a ridiculous loophole and that it sort of proved that the whole thing was bull#. She just kinda chuckled and said something to the effect of "Well that's the world we live in. Cash or check?"

I'll stop rambling now, but all in all my experience showed me that the "War on Drugs" includes (but is not limited to) another easy route for 'the man' to put his hands in our pockets.

a reply to: ChaosComplex

Bad luck mate.

The moral of the story here to others reading is this;

DO NOT sign anything at the Police station, after a traffic stop, or if Police want to search you, your vehicle or your home.

NEVER sign anything, even if it's to confirm your name and address or log your property into the police station etc.

There is NO law, on this planet, that can legally compel anyone to 'make their mark', none at all.

If the CC had known this at the time, he wouldn't have been stitched up.

a reply to: MysterX

Actually I think the real leason is:

Dont do anything or say anything until you get a lawyer in!

a reply to: crazyewok

Yeah, that too.

a reply to: wantsome

It seems like every thread like this there is someone like you to make sure the pro-mando sentencing(in this thread) argument gets posted on the first page. It is sad that there are still many like you in my country and it really irks me that someone on your side of the fence or blue line can claim we live in a free country when there are many who are locked away for a long time over simple possession. That is a sign of a police state, NOT a free country.

The legal system in the US is a racketeering scheme, those who can't pay their way out will suffer the most. Probation is set up to make one fail, and there are many probation officers who will try to trick their subjects into violating to keep them paying in, those with no money can not afford the cost of probation and will be violated because of this. Also it is not uncommon for someone who violates probation, even for a minor violation, to get a mandatory year in jail with no trial.(In Florida this works because a 1 year sentence is long enough to get sent to a slave farm).

This bill does not go nearly far enough and should be effected immediately, not one year from now maybe longer if it gets challenged by the oligarchy.

This is a step in the right direction, but right now it is nothing but a proposed step that will not happen for another year.

a reply to: hounddoghowlie

So there will be laws created to cover the abuse of drugs in public. What level of meth in a person in public is too much. Is it solely based on actions by the person.

I agree the drug laws are screwed up but people are in general poor at respecting others rights. Alcohol demonstrates it.

a reply to: ChaosComplex

I didn't say it didn't happen to white boys, especially white boys that don't fit the clean-cut, all-American boys. It does overwhelmingly happen to black boys though while overwhelmingly white boys get a slap on the wrist.

a reply to: roadgravel

Why shouldn't it all be covered under DUI?

originally posted by: roadgravel
a reply to: hounddoghowlie

So there will be laws created to cover the abuse of drugs in public. What level of meth in a person in public is too much. Is it solely based on actions by the person.

I agree the drug laws are screwed up but people are in general poor at respecting others rights. Alcohol demonstrates it.

i can't say much to the levels, amounts, or public intoxication that they will come up with, as far what constitutes jail time or not. kinda thinking like in some states it's just a ticket, with rehab or other things, and as you say based on what occurred, causing the police to be involved.

your right about the laws and alcohol.
two things come to mind about why they are changing the laws.
first is big money to be made. not just by government, also big companies wanting to cash in on it.
second just like prohibition, one of the main reasons to outlaw drugs was the believe or the claim that it was to, prevent alcoholism , crime, and mental illness. this seemed to have had exactly the opposite effect.

this resulted in many more people being arrested and put in prision. and other crime rated increased. soon they had the same problem that is going on now. below is a link for crime,and prison overcrowding during that period. there are better sources out there, this one is the first one i remembered/
The End of Prohibition: What Happened and What Have We Learned?
notice the first chart, the rate of consumption went down but as time went on it steadily went up. then look at the prision chart and crime chart.

man is a party animal, he will always find a way to alter his consciousness, regardless of what laws are against it.