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Mainstream news media censoring online debates and forums to control foreign policy narrative?

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posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 09:02 AM
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Hello everyone,

Many of us have discussed for years the idea that the mainstream media is largely owned and controlled by the powers that be, whether you want to call that the military-industrial complex, the bankers, or the illuminati. Once one studies a lot of history, travels, and hears the side of lets say non-Western countries and even victims of Western aggression, it becomes quite clear that our media is often manipulating the public, lying by omission, and misrepresenting international issues to "manufacture the consent" (Chomsky et. al) of the western public for more foreign interventions. This was true in Vietnam, the War in Iraq, and Afghanistan. Recently, such media narratives have been used as a cover for the CIA and our allies to help overthrow the Libyan regime. The next target is Assad and Syria. Global hegemony is the goal.

Anyways, having said that, until recently I was posting on article forums such as CNN user comments a lot. However, I would often deconstruct various Western claims, question Israel about Palestine, describe the real motives for our interventions, such as global control and hegemony (not freedom and democracy), etc. I would use facts and history as well.

Well, at first on these forums many comments of mine and others that were not inappropriate but just not with the government view would be deleted. This happened many times.

Now, even worse, I can't even post on some of these forums. No warning. No violation of anything to my knowledge. No racist or sexist or bigoted statements (in fact I took to task many of the people that did say such statements).

CNN for example either shows no comment area to me or it's always "closed for further comments."

I think that given the erasing of comments that were counter to the official line and now this, I really am even more convinced that these outlets are focused on propaganda, not real journalism or unbiased information for the public. Has anybody else experienced any of this with media outlet comments or forums?

As many of you realize, a functioning democracy only can occur if the general populace is given relatively unbiased information about global events, i.e. "real journalism." This is a fundamental principle and goal of journalism. Unfortunately, the only people who seem to get that information are either people who work in international affairs and thus have to study all of these issues thoroughly or scholars, formal or not,, of these issues.

Final question. I really believe, having been at protests against the Iraq War many years ago, and at Occupy Wall Street, that it will be impossible for us to really change the government if we cannot counter the power of the media. Whoever controls the mass media controls the people. If they control it, they will be able to sway a majority of the populace for or against just about anything, including against change makers.

How do we truly and effectively counter the power and reach of mass media if it has become propaganda? This is a critical question for any kind of activist.

"In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act."

-George Orwell


edit on 14-9-2014 by Quetzalcoatl14 because: (no reason given)

edit on 14-9-2014 by Quetzalcoatl14 because: (no reason given)




edit on 14-9-2014 by Quetzalcoatl14 because: (no reason given)




posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 09:19 AM
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originally posted by: Quetzalcoatl14
How do we truly and effectively counter the power and reach of mass media if it has become propaganda? This is a critical question for any kind of activist.


First of all, don't try to do it on their turf. Quit thinking that posting on their sites will make a difference. Their house, their rules and they can delete anyone they want.

Secondly, it's going to take time. It took time for things to get this point, so it's going to take time to turn this ship around.

Sorry, but that's all I got. Just build up a counter method to their method somehow to where your method seems more legitimate to the public.



posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 09:28 AM
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Thanks for the response.

I get what you are saying. The problem is, the "their turf argument" doesn't work with journalism. There are actual journalistic principles and a different standard. Most of the press has always been privately owned, and explicitly is supposed to provide unbiased information and be a check on the government, a foundational principle of the reason for the freedom of the press. Ostensible news outlets cannot claim to be providing news and being journalists and then actually be pushing a big agenda, especially an ethically questionable one.

As to my final question, I am speaking to the total impact of media versus people and activists at a collective level trying to put the government in check and/or raise awareness in the public, not my own personal impact. If we can't counter the mainstream media power, virtually all of our efforts are going to be insufficient I think.



originally posted by: DeepImpactX

originally posted by: Quetzalcoatl14
How do we truly and effectively counter the power and reach of mass media if it has become propaganda? This is a critical question for any kind of activist.


First of all, don't try to do it on their turf. Quit thinking that posting on their sites will make a difference. Their house, their rules and they can delete anyone they want.

Secondly, it's going to take time. It took time for things to get this point, so it's going to take time to turn this ship around.

Sorry, but that's all I got. Just build up a counter method to their method somehow to where your method seems more legitimate to the public.



posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 09:28 AM
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a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14


Has anybody else experienced any of this with media outlet comments or forums?

You'd be wasting your time preaching to that choir. They are the ones spouting the crap. If they had their way they'd do away with the internet and go back to one way media dissemination of information.

"Its our ball and you can't play." Control freaks.

By the way, your opening paragraph was spot on. They would never let that stand in their forums.

Here it is for all to see as the antithesis to all that.


As time goes on more and more people will be tuning out of their diatribe and tuning in to alternative media like ATS. I hear they are joining in higher numbers lately.

Just keep telling it like it is. Let that other main stream propaganda machine spin itself out and dry up.



posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 09:31 AM
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a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14

I have noticed it for years and there is not one single website, other then the smallest innocuous, that do not adhere to this system. Some go to great lengths to even hide this fact using cunning tactics that seem to most harmless, but unfortunately they are just another way to introduce an editorial standard to something that seems different.
The entire media system is corrupt and should not be bought into. Western commercialism vs. Eastern propaganda it makes no difference. Independant media even is subjective at times due to hierarchy of their business model.
All we can do is take everything presented and compare stories to generate a smaller picture in this case. Happy hunting!

Using the web is insufficiant but word of mouth isn't, spread the word!
edit on 9/14/2014 by AnteBellum because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 09:37 AM
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Your observations are pretty much spot on . What to do ..Well ,clicking on known propaganda websites and being frustrated by the inability to get your message across is not the way to go .Find alternative places like ATS and other places where they don't censor your comments .Although we can not change everyones mind and convince them all that it's pure controlled propaganda we may be able to show it with numbers turning away from msm and other web sites that practice such things .

I don't believe that it is possible to stop them from practicing such things but I do believe that we can limit just how effective they can be .Create a blog and reblog the news you want to .When I got into alternative news sources on of my Fav's was the Corbett Report and at first there were about 300 to 500 loyal followers .Now it's in the thousands .Just ignore the msm ..they are pretty much a joke and you have to turn what they say around 180% just to be close to the truth .Not worth it in my books .peace a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14
ETA ...here op watch this vid .Its mainley about journalism and the msm and what we can do




edit on 14-9-2014 by the2ofusr1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 09:51 AM
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Right, I guess the point of posting on some of those forums is that there would be 1000's of people posting on the major articles, and by some of us providing anti-theses to the narrative other people that don't go to sites like ATS would get to see a paragraph or larger questioning the narrative. Quite a few people would post ATS-esque comments. It's the equivalent to having someone give a dishonest speech and having people in the crowd calling them out.

Having said that, I agree that we won't change the actual outlets with the current system.

That is why my current real question is how we as activists counter the power of the media through other means. Because unless we can reach a critical mass as they do, it will be very difficult to really change much. This is where I am at a loss.

I think that all of our individual efforts, from alternative news sites to our own personal convos with loved ones, do make some kind of impact. But again, we need a critical mass to counter the power of the gov and media.


originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14


Has anybody else experienced any of this with media outlet comments or forums?

You'd be wasting your time preaching to that choir. They are the ones spouting the crap. If they had their way they'd do away with the internet and go back to one way media dissemination of information.

"Its our ball and you can't play." Control freaks.

By the way, your opening paragraph was spot on. They would never let that stand in their forums.

Here it is for all to see as the antithesis to all that.


As time goes on more and more people will be tuning out of their diatribe and tuning in to alternative media like ATS. I hear they are joining in higher numbers lately.

Just keep telling it like it is. Let that other main stream propaganda machine spin itself out and dry up.



posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 09:56 AM
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Hello,
Thanks for chatting.

I agree that generally speaking, all sides on various issues are biased. Some are willfully so, which changes it from bias to propaganda. Therein is a main difference.

The problem is, your average person doesn't have the time or ability to go research all sides of an issue. It takes years and lots of effort to get a grasp on global affairs, history, etc. That's what only increases the guilt of the mainstream media. They are abusing the heck out of their mandate, to provide information on both sides of issues to said public.

As to spreading the word, I agree that this is one of our own personal responsibilities, even if it is hard and takes courage. Speaking the truth matters in a world of lies.

"In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act."

-George Orwell


originally posted by: AnteBellum
a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14

I have noticed it for years and there is not one single website, other then the smallest innocuous, that do not adhere to this system. Some go to great lengths to even hide this fact using cunning tactics that seem to most harmless, but unfortunately they are just another way to introduce an editorial standard to something that seems different.
The entire media system is corrupt and should not be bought into. Western commercialism vs. Eastern propaganda it makes no difference. Independant media even is subjective at times due to hierarchy of their business model.
All we can do is take everything presented and compare stories to generate a smaller picture in this case. Happy hunting!

Using the web is insufficiant but word of mouth isn't, spread the word!



posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 10:01 AM
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a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14

I've been banned from sites like Hannity etc, yet I still have my membership to sites like "The Daily Ko's".

And I consider myself a conservative!

So yes, OP, there does appear to be some effort to control the message.



posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 10:02 AM
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a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14


Don't let it dishearten you and keep trying. Create new accounts on the websites that restrict you... hell just do what you have to. One person can make a difference to sooooo many people. You could change one person or many but if you only change one person, that one person could change one or many. Just keep it up. We didn't get to this point by sitting back and letting others come to us.


I forgot to mention, yea there is a STRONG effort by MSM to block your voice out.
edit on 14-9-2014 by Antipathy17 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 10:04 AM
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originally posted by: the2ofusr1
Your observations are pretty much spot on . What to do ..Well ,clicking on known propaganda websites and being frustrated by the inability to get your message across is not the way to go .Find alternative places like ATS and other places where they don't censor your comments .Although we can not change everyones mind and convince them all that it's pure controlled propaganda we may be able to show it with numbers turning away from msm and other web sites that practice such things .

I don't believe that it is possible to stop them from practicing such things but I do believe that we can limit just how effective they can be .Create a blog and reblog the news you want to .When I got into alternative news sources on of my Fav's was the Corbett Report and at first there were about 300 to 500 loyal followers .Now it's in the thousands .Just ignore the msm ..they are pretty much a joke and you have to turn what they say around 180% just to be close to the truth .Not worth it in my books .peace a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14
ETA ...here op watch this vid .Its mainley about journalism and the msm and what we can do





Thanks man.

Yeah, we aren't going to stop the big outlets from doing what they do. A big key though is waking up more people to the fact that it is propaganda. Many don't get that yet.

Alternative sources matter, but we also have to be careful that we aren't just preaching to the choir and hanging out with others of our ilk.

You are right though that the proportion of people who are questioning things has grown, which in itself is big progress. This may be due to the advent of the internet, where it has become easier to find a variety of information on any given topic. The internet really loosened the power of the "gate-keepers" of information.

Thanks for the video. I just started watching it.



posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 10:08 AM
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originally posted by: beezzer
a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14

I've been banned from sites like Hannity etc, yet I still have my membership to sites like "The Daily Ko's".

And I consider myself a conservative!

So yes, OP, there does appear to be some effort to control the message.


Right, I don't think that it is limited to either conservative or liberal outlets.



posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 10:15 AM
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originally posted by: the2ofusr1
Create a blog and reblog the news you want to..........


........And link up as many relevant blogs to yours as you can. Create a "web of truth" if you will. Presentation goes a long way as well. Make your site look as "Facebook Esque" as you can. Or just make the graphics look as much like the mainstream news sources as you can. People do judge sites on first impressions so copy the layouts of mainstream sources as much as you legally can. Keep the front page of the site, the part a viewer will see first, filled with current stories presented in a tepid yet truthful way. Let the reader decide what they want to get enthused about. Don't give them in "in your face" wording and graphics. Just stay factual and practical.

Another poster mentioned word of mouth. That is perhaps the best way to start. Be patient, the tide will turn. People have had enough.



posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 10:16 AM
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Thanks. You are right. We learn very quickly that there is a purposeful effort by the powerful to control our views and get us to do things that probably aren't ethical on the global stage (wars, coups, etc). But we also learn that there is an oft unconscious mob mentality with the normal public, who asleep, will react negatively to those who question.

The most disillusioning thing is that I recently went back to grad school in international affairs. I went there in part to get proximity to power and increase my ability to affect policy and what have you. Some of my professors work on the UN Security Council, or develop global policy (Jeffrey Sachs the economist was my economics professor).

Most of the professors and students, even though they were brilliant and accomplished, were either also not very aware or wouldn't admit to it. You would hope that at that level more would be aware or willing to be honest. But in fact, many of them even if they are aware are too career-minded and naturally political to make such dangerous statements.

I remember studying the Syrian conflict with a woman who has worked with the Security Council for 30 years, and me saying that it was all an unethical proxy war with our intelligence services funding and arming the rebels, and that the goal was for regime change (not freedom, democracy, or stopping chemical weapons), such that proxies of the Russians, such as Syria and Iran, would be knocked out.

My professor just looked at me knowingly, smiled, and deflected to another topic. Some know, some don't. But at that level many can't even admit it because they might lose their jobs at the UN or with their national governments.

It's all quite disillusioning.

To Jeffrey Sachs' credit, he just came out with an article blasting the proxy wars in the ME and the US possibly creating the situation with ISIS.

www.huffingtonpost.com...

There ARE some public intellectuals and leaders that once in a while call out the truth at some level.


originally posted by: Antipathy17
a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14


Don't let it dishearten you and keep trying. Create new accounts on the websites that restrict you... hell just do what you have to. One person can make a difference to sooooo many people. You could change one person or many but if you only change one person, that one person could change one or many. Just keep it up. We didn't get to this point by sitting back and letting others come to us.


I forgot to mention, yea there is a STRONG effort by MSM to block your voice out.

edit on 14-9-2014 by Quetzalcoatl14 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 10:18 AM
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I'm a proud member of the 'Banned From CNN' club. They cannot handle different opinions and will delete comments like crazy. They have a dedicated sheep army of mods, I will give them that. I was also let go from Hannity for asking him if he felt good about being a Zionist troll. They have to be worried that so many are disagreeing with them. But don't worry, they're on their way out. Too many people are calling them on their propaganda BS.

Another site that I've found to have gotten really bad is a gaming website: IGN. They delete comments like crazy. The mods are very left-leaning fascists. They claim they want people to discuss a topic, but then, delete all their comments because they cannot handle differing opinions. lol It's pathetic, really.

But don't sweat it. I believe this format will be replaced by people who're sick of it. I think there will be big changes in TV, radio and movies too. Sort of a entertainment revolution



posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 10:22 AM
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Almen, we are in the same club with CNN haha. SHEEP ARMY!! lol.

I agree with you that there are efforts on both sides, meaning that it seems as if big outlets of all kinds are censoring things too much. The point is that we need to be having a real and thorough dialogue on all of these issues on the national stage, and people of all stripes, conservative, liberal, neutral, atheist, Christian, you name it, should be able to give input and say their views. We need that.


originally posted by: Fylgje
I'm a proud member of the 'Banned From CNN' club. They cannot handle different opinions and will delete comments like crazy. They have a dedicated sheep army of mods, I will give them that. I was also let go from Hannity for asking him if he felt good about being a Zionist troll. They have to be worried that so many are disagreeing with them. But don't worry, they're on their way out. Too many people are calling them on their propaganda BS.

Another site that I've found to have gotten really bad is a gaming website: IGN. They delete comments like crazy. The mods are very left-leaning fascists. They claim they want people to discuss a topic, but then, delete all their comments because they cannot handle differing opinions. lol It's pathetic, really.

But don't sweat it. I believe this format will be replaced by people who're sick of it. I think there will be big changes in TV, radio and movies too. Sort of a entertainment revolution



posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 11:28 AM
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Of course they are. Comments aren't moderated for language or content, they're moderated to prevent facts from being posted.

As much as I love ATS I have to say it's a tool of TPTB. Sites like this exist to gauge the opinions of those willing to speak of such things.



posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 01:09 PM
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a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14


Having said that, I agree that we won't change the actual outlets with the current system.

I think we are. On websites like this. I did.

Did you have such awareness before coming to the internet? I didn't.

The televised news, newspapers and other media like TV and movies can no longer hide the fact that the humanitarian interventions and bomb-ocracy just isn't what its cracked up to be. Just the other day the US preeminent announced invading another Middle Eastern country and sanctions against Russia.

The old cold war rhetoric about commies, enemies at the gates and defending America thousands of miles away ultimately failed back then and it will again. People aren't that gullible.

Plus today there is two way communication going on between ordinary people on the internet.

Let me give you another example. My mom was just a child in WWII. She remembers that it was punishable by death to listen to other than state sanctioned radio broadcasts that were being beamed into the country by the Allies. Tough controls prevented people from getting other than state controlled propaganda under the "Propaganda Minister" Joseph Goebbels.

If you were caught listening to outside news you could be sent to a death camp.

People listened anyway. Privately they poopooed Hitler and the Third Reich dogma and hungered for the truth about what was really going on. Folk used to come over to her house and gather around the set turned way down. Others that couldn't make it were told what the news news was from outside Germany.

They knew what time it was. The state continued to churn and make big noise about the Fatherland . People would agree and repeat this in public but really in their heart they were forming their own opinions. They could not have done this without some alternative source, however.

It was difficult for them to do anything about it, the state police and political minded Nazi's were everywhere. Being denounced for negative behavior or attitudes (not going along) was ever present.

We are a long way from that. Just keep telling the truth. People do hear it, even though they continue to publicly support the status quo. In this light persons on the fence are thinking about the hypocrisy presented to them from all around and developing different opinions. So are those that have so far been blinded to any other input.



posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 01:39 PM
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Good advice all.


originally posted by: DeepImpactX

originally posted by: the2ofusr1
Create a blog and reblog the news you want to..........


........And link up as many relevant blogs to yours as you can. Create a "web of truth" if you will. Presentation goes a long way as well. Make your site look as "Facebook Esque" as you can. Or just make the graphics look as much like the mainstream news sources as you can. People do judge sites on first impressions so copy the layouts of mainstream sources as much as you legally can. Keep the front page of the site, the part a viewer will see first, filled with current stories presented in a tepid yet truthful way. Let the reader decide what they want to get enthused about. Don't give them in "in your face" wording and graphics. Just stay factual and practical.

Another poster mentioned word of mouth. That is perhaps the best way to start. Be patient, the tide will turn. People have had enough.



posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 06:10 PM
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I firmly believe that the US government controls the media to a certain extent. If they do not control it, they can easily influence it. When Steven Sotloff was executed and ISIS released the video, I came across the owners of other websites claiming they were pressured by the government into taking them down. They essentially wiped the video off the internet, or pressured others into wiping it off the internet. I am not going to debate about whether people should watch such a video, but they should have that choice in my opinion, as it is an important issue that we should be informed about. Realizing their brutality and their views is important in my opinion. Anyway, I don't know if others had realized that such a thing was going on, but I trust those who said this is what was occurring. If it could be proven that such a thing was censored by pressure from the US government, then doesn't that prove that the government can not only influence the MSM, but also what we see online?

ETA: Many people are not aware of Operation Mockingbird, which the Church Committee exposed in 1975. Essentially they recruited owners of MSM outlets, as you don't have to control the lower-level employees, considering those at the top levels are who make the final decisions about what is published and what reaches the masses. If you control the top then you control the entire thing in essence. It was shown that they recruited the owner of the Washington Post, who then recruited more high-profile and influential media executives, just like the CIA does when recruiting assets, or spies. Considering it was a CIA run project, that makes sense. So they knew such a thing was going on all the way back in the 50's, and I find it hard to believe that the CIA would give up such lucrative control measures. It is not like we have any clue about what they are doing. If they tell us they are doing something, you can assume it goes much deeper. We probably cannot even guess at some of the things that they have done, or that similar agencies within the government have done. Truth is stranger than fiction sometimes. And exposing that such a thing was going on BACK THEN, before such things were even legal, says a lot. Nowadays, when we know the government has no qualms about our privacy and freedom, I wouldn't expect them to draw the line at influencing the MSM. No way.

So how does this relate to online discussions and online news and things like that? Well it seems to me that if an agency was powerful enough to control influential people in the MSM, then they are powerful enough to use technology in modern times to influence the masses. There is much more anonymity, and it is much easier to accomplish certain tasks in our high-tech world. It would be a surprise to me if they weren't involved in such things. A few years ago I used to believe it was impractical for an agency to infiltrate online discussions for a variety of reasons, but as time has gone on, and I've been a part of various online communities that would interest the government, including ATS, I have changed my mind. Now my only question is to what extent such things occur.
edit on 9/14/14 by JiggyPotamus because: (no reason given)




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