Are UK citizens more 'free' than people in the US?

I think the question should have been '' Who is less oppressed? '' .

GB has a history of oppression, indeed why the pilgrims left many years ago to form the new land of freedom and liberty, which once stood for something in the USA.

Scotland has the opportunity to achieve some independence from England's grasp, yet it seems strange how Obama has declared his opposition against such a outcome, given the history of the founding fathers.

The OZ premier and the pope have also stated their opposition, although I struggle to see what it has to do with anyone else besides the Scots.

It seems as if the Scots have little freedom to even decide for themselves.

Power to the people!

I don't mind CCTV cameras as I'm not a criminal and if they can save lives and catch criminals committing crimes then there a good thing-there also used for traffic monitoring ect ect

People get so touchy about cameras as an invasion of privacy but I bet if their car was stolen they would be overjoyed if it was on film

I see a chap from over the pond has said they are also the land of the brave!


Perhaps the op should do a thread on that as I'm sure we would win that hands down

As for freedom,Nhs biggest bonus this country has

I can't understand why America doesn't use the some system as a healthy workforce is a productive workforce

originally posted by: Beyond Creation
I think the question should have been '' Who is less oppressed? '' .

GB has a history of oppression, indeed why the pilgrims left many years ago to form the new land of freedom and liberty, which once stood for something in the USA.

Scotland has the opportunity to achieve some independence from England's grasp, yet it seems strange how Obama has declared his opposition against such a outcome, given the history of the founding fathers.

The OZ premier and the pope have also stated their opposition, although I struggle to see what it has to do with anyone else besides the Scots.

It seems as if the Scots have little freedom to even decide for themselves.

Power to the people!

The Pilgrims didn't leave to form The U.S.

The Pilgrims left England in 1620. The first American colony was established 1n 1607.

This history lesson comes F.O.C.

a reply to: MystikMushroom

Our government has around 30k cameras the rest are privately owned.
Plus they work my town used to have the nickname dodge city now after all the businesses got cctv crime is down 40%.

The UK is very happy all those pilgrims left

Your welcome to them

Americans might well be able to come up with a comparable list of things they can do which British people can't.
That would be the best answer to the thread.
E.g there may be some "nanny-state" provisions which America hasn't adopted.
Any suggestions there?

a reply to: grainofsand

Well if the Scottish referendum does indeed return a vote of YES, which could quite possibly happen, some of us will have attained a freedom sought after for centuries!

originally posted by: Biigs

EDIT: i should also mention that the CCTV doesnt really make any impact.

Thats because a lot of them are not even wired up, just their presence does the trick.

We are losing are freedoms, but its happening so slow people dont notice, and its happening mostly to the poor.

An example.
Many of the homes where I live are owned by housing associations and generally its those that cant afford to buy a home who live in them.
1. Tenants must not place signs notices or posters in their windows!
That right there is a lost freedom. Surely they should be allowed to show there support of something by displaying something in their window!
2. Tenants must keep their grass green. op listed this as not an issue in the uk, it is if your poor!

originally posted by: andy06shake
a reply to: grainofsand

Well if the Scottish referendum does indeed return a vote of YES, which could quite possibly happen, some of us will have attained a freedom sought after for centuries!

And some of us (like myself) will be moving down to England/ the rest of the UK.

Freedom is relative, a Independent Scotland will not make me feel any more free because i do not want a "independent" Scotland, if anything it will make me feel less free.

Financial Freedom? You need to earn at least £20K/year to feed yourself, never mind a family. You've got competition from across Europe for employment. But you are free to set up your own company. Watch out about trying to be self employ and work as a contractor with all that IR35 legislation.

Food is around £50/person. There's probably half of the UK that you couldn't afford to live because the housing is too expensive (London), or there aren't any employers (countryside). The other half you wouldn't want to live there because of the neighbors (sink estates, drunk behavior, crime). Than really ties you down to a few suburbs of each city. For job security, most people end up working in the public sector.

Political Freedoms? Be careful what you say on the race/religion issue. There are a couple of religions and countries that you must never criticize. Don't mention anything about the country being overcrowded or that there isn't any space left.

20k a year to feed yourself, you eating in a 5 star hotel every night?

Property prices are insane and have been for some time now, I was lucky to get on market about 12 years back
But it's a struggle here as other places in the world

What can we do? It's not like we can roll back prices to what they should be

I think mortgages may have to get even longer and retirement age raised,will then be a work to the grave system that also taxes you after the grave :-/

a reply to: Whereismypassword

Iam gonna do a jewel hiest when iam 65 if I get away with it if I get caught they have to house and feed me.
But by that time it will be all soylent green.

UK has no constitution.

That means things like abortion can theoretically be made illegal in the blink of an eye in the UK. There is no legal mandate blocking it's criminalization if they wanted to.

UK is more restrictive with porn, no "freedom of speech" enshrined on a piece of paper from back in the day like the USA. So they have full control of it. Lots of things like that they have full range of options to criminalize if they wanted to.

Marijuana is still illegal, not regarded as a hard drug but it's still illegal, unlike some states like Oklahoma (?) where you can legally grow your own and buy it in the shops.

On a technical level I think USA has more "free-er" laws. The problem is USA is a big place. So there's always one state that's ultra conservative than the UK.

originally posted by: mysterioustranger
a reply to: grainofsand

Any country that has thousands and thousands of cameras... everywhere...EVERYWHERE...every street, building, station, roadway, corner, church, club, sports arena, parking lot, your own home-street...by the HUNDREDS of thousands trained on all people everywhere all the time....How "FREE" is that?

Well, I don't know of anybody who has been harassed by the state on the basis of what a camera has captured. Unless you count speeding cameras, which are a fact of life everywhere. On the other hand I do know of plenty of crimes that have been solved by the use of cameras.

I don't think it is as easy as saying "the UK or the US is freer". The countries are very different. Some things that Americans do (wander round with concealed weapons, say) would be unthinkable in Britain. But equally I think we have less government interference as a whole over here. Pushy HOAs are also almost unheard of.

And of course we get a lot more holidays : I get 8 weeks a year paid time off work. And then there is the NHS which, although it may be far from perfect, is a minor miracle in my view.

originally posted by: grainofsand
Many US cities and 'population zones' prevent all manner of things such as kids selling lemonade from the yard, grass turning brown, lighting fires in the garden, growing vegetables in the front yard, keeping chickens/goats/whatever.

You must be confusing the USA for California.

Didn't the UK throw its entire populus into slavery with their employment initiatives once you're on their dole? There have been a lot of stories about people being forced to work at their version of walmart (i think its called tepsco) regardless if they get a gig in their job.

Also, didn't the uk officially legalize slavery in 2013?

I wouldn't call that free.

originally posted by: ArchPlayer
Didn't the UK throw its entire populus into slavery with their employment initiatives once you're on their dole? There have been a lot of stories about people being forced to work at their version of walmart (i think its called tepsco) regardless if they get a gig in their job.

Also, didn't the uk officially legalize slavery in 2013?

I wouldn't call that free.

where did you hear that?

Now i could have missed somthing, it happens but im pretty sure that didnt happen

a reply to: ArchPlayer
Sounds like you've been reading the internet!

I think we'd have heard if they'd legalised slavery last year. Even the stoic Brits might have done a bit more than tut and moan over their tea.

I don't know what house prices are like in the US but I assume they are cheaper. Here in the UK I feel I will never be able to own a decent sized house. so in that sense I am not free as I am tied to working and paying rent and never getting anywhere.

Another thing to say is that my mother is danish and my parents didn't get married so because of a stupid law I cannot claim citizenship through my British father. I have been refused a uk passport several times even though I have a british birth certificate, born and raised in england.

I am basically being held hostage.