Ryan lashes out at IRS commissioner: 'Nobody believes you'

originally posted by: whyamIhere

originally posted by: kruphix
a reply to: jrod

Have you not been reading this thread? Plenty of evidence right here in this thread of the foul play at the IRS.

This is a common tactic when there really is no evidence. People will claim that there is evidence everywhere...but they won't actually give the evidence.

If it is so prevalent, then it should be easy to show me some of this hard evidence that makes this such an easy case.

She took the 5th.

Innocent Public Servants don't refuse to talk to Congress.

It's kind of hard to have proof when they destroyed the evidence.

I would plead the 5th during a witch hunt as well.

No need to play their games, just let them talk to a wall and look stupid.

The IRS Had a Contract With an Email Backup Company

The Internal Revenue Service (IRS) said it can't provide emails sent between 2009 and 2011 that were requested by congressional investigators because of hard drive crashes.

The agency said that emails stored on dead drives were lost forever because its email backup tapes were recycled every six months, and employees were responsible for keeping their own long-term archives.

The IRS had a contract with email backup service vendor Sonasoft starting in 2005, according to FedSpending.org, which lists the contract as being for "automatic data processing services." Sonasoft's motto is "email archiving done right," and the company lists the IRS as a customer.

In 2009, Sonasoft even sent out a Tweet advertising its work for the IRS.

The IRS Had a Contract With an Email Backup Company

originally posted by: kruphix

Ok...and what does that prove about the IRS email system and storage limits???

I don't understand why people don't get this...YOUR email and email systems at where YOU work say absolutely nothing about the IRS email system.

This is called anecdotal evidence...and all it does it give evidence about YOUR experience...but not about anyone elses.

No, it isn't anecdotal, it is an example of the way government agencies (in this case the entire Armed Forces and the DOD) work.

I and MILLIONS of other service members are capable of logging in to our email accounts anywhere in the world, on any computer. You mean to tell me that the same email service (Outlook) is somehow magically different for the IRS?

Sometimes I wish ATS had a block option, mainly because of blatantly ignorant posters that are more worried about their particular politician possibly getting # on, rather than about their fellow citizens.

But whatever guy, IDGAF. Keep saying things like 'anecdotal evidence', but you have yet to offer ANY legitimate counterargument to ANY scandal this administration has been involved in.

Don't go quitting your day job Jay Carney.

a reply to: kruphix

I would plead the 5th during a witch hunt as well.

No need to play their games, just let them talk to a wall and look stupid.

"A" for effort on your part.

But "F" for accuracy and content.

The IRS admitted the targeting.

Lois Lerner pled the 5th (more than one time btw) which means she can legally not disclose criminal activity pertaining to the questions of the investigation.

Lois Lerner is also in Contempt of Congress.

Sad...

a reply to: kruphix

I'm not American so this is not an issue that concerns me but I totally disagree with everything you posted regarding this agencies handling of IT data. It is beyond comprehension that they do not have an offsite backup of weekly, monthly or yearly backup tapes.
It has been common IT policy worldwide since the 80's that this is how you manage backup tapes and the excuse that we just use 6 tapes on a monthly rotation is either a total lie or the worst practice of any company I have ever heard of.
It was either setup so that they can have plausible deniability in the event that something like the current scandal occurs or they have the most inept IT planners in the history of mankind & if that's the case then people's heads need to roll.

I am a 20 year IT professional and have worked for most of the major oil companies, local governments in my area, small businesses of as little as 5 staff and they all have better backup policies than the american IRS. It's just common policy worldwide and has been since the frigging 80's.

So they were using exchange servers and they were allowing the archiving of emails into PST files on the local hard drives which is still common practice for a lot of companies around the world and is an issue but most companies have good backup practice so It shouldn't matter.
You should still have an offsite backup of weekly, monthly and yearly tapes to restore the exchange database in the event that a local hard drive crash occurs on the exchange server itself. Yes you may not get all emails restored but you should have a pretty decent snapshot of data within a week of the data loss.

So what is it? They are either the most inept agency with regards to IT data retention EVER or they are complicit in covering up their tracks and I refuse to believe that a country that leads the world in IT could have an agency that has the worst policy regarding data retention, especially an agency that deals with Tax.

I feel like I have gone back in time 15 years, this just doesn't happen in today's world.

You have lost all credibility with me.

originally posted by: kruphix

originally posted by: Metallicus
a reply to: kruphix

Wait...do you actually BELIEVE the emails were accidently lost? If anything them losing the emails proves to a rational person that they do have something to hide. Therefore, it is NOT a witch hunt unless you are one of those naive people that thinks that Government can be trusted. If so, I have some swampland in Florida to sell you.

Until you can provide contrary evidence, then yes I believe they were accidentally lost.

And no, a rational person doesn't make logic leaps and make assumptions to jump to a conclusion...especially if that person has already made up their mind about the topic.

This is a witch hunt...the GOP has zero evidence and they are HUNTING for it. They don't care if anything ever comes of it, just as long as their supporters get angry over it.

You are being played.

a reply to: xuenchen

The IRS admitted the targeting.

Not a 'smidgen' of corruption.

Well I guess he was right.

It is corrupt as it gets.

Intentional targeting of us.

Destroying the evidence.

Then playing the victim.

I almost stood up in my living room and applauded when he said that the IRS can ask for 7 years worth of tax records yet they can't keep 6 months worth of employee emails.

They are liars. That's the truth. They will continue to lie because they continue to get away with it. Nothing will happen to the IRS because something will happen to take the attention and heat away from this like it always does. People will forget about it and move on.

It's disgusting and it pisses me off.

Everyone should refuse to file this coming year. What are they going to do if EVERYONE refuses to file? There's not a lot they can do to that many people. But nobody is willing to stand up and say they are tired of this bullshiite and they aren't going to take it anymore. They just keep bending over and taking it like its Christmas morning in freaking Hawaii.

originally posted by: Lipton

originally posted by: kruphix

Ok...and what does that prove about the IRS email system and storage limits???

I don't understand why people don't get this...YOUR email and email systems at where YOU work say absolutely nothing about the IRS email system.

This is called anecdotal evidence...and all it does it give evidence about YOUR experience...but not about anyone elses.

Sometimes I wish ATS had a block option, mainly because of blatantly ignorant posters that are more worried about their particular politician possibly getting # on, rather than about their fellow citizens.

These folks are psychopathic. Really. To some degree.

At any rate the lost email defense is a dumfounding example of how stupid they think we are, how scank their press azz covers are, ect just a big middle finger from a criminal organized crime syndicate.

Who is this Kruphix stooge, and why are you a member of ATS if you're just gonna gobble up the spoon fed stories from your puppet master?

Wow, I own a small business, 2 employees and we store emails longer than the IRS, I'm feeling pretty good about my fly by the seat of my pants IT approach.

Good to hear Mr. Ryan say out loud what I know A LOT OF AMERICANS HAVE BEEN THINKING.

More manufactured outrage at a manufactured scandal.

Good for Paul Ryan, he can use the video when he asks for donations next week.

Remember the GOP mantra this election cycle: Benghazi, IRS, Obamacare, repeat.

originally posted by: Logarock

originally posted by: Lipton

originally posted by: kruphix

Ok...and what does that prove about the IRS email system and storage limits???

I don't understand why people don't get this...YOUR email and email systems at where YOU work say absolutely nothing about the IRS email system.

This is called anecdotal evidence...and all it does it give evidence about YOUR experience...but not about anyone elses.

Sometimes I wish ATS had a block option, mainly because of blatantly ignorant posters that are more worried about their particular politician possibly getting # on, rather than about their fellow citizens.

These folks are psychopathic. Really. To some degree.

At any rate the lost email defense is a dumfounding example of how stupid they think we are, how scank their press azz covers are, ect just a big middle finger from a criminal organized crime syndicate.

When it gets this far along and gone to seed.. the madmen in
the bunker begin to believe everyone topside in the artillery
barrage aren't even there anymore.
Worst of all, they think everyone else believes their BS too.

I swear this is going to be my favorite one size fits all poster
for the NWO-MO.. and they're not going to get away with it
MUCH LONGER.



I'm sorry when (not if) this image gets tiresome, but you know:
pounding the truth out there is sometimes just as important.

a reply to: kruphix

They store meta data...not the actual data itself.

So the 'official' story goes.

But people need to get real they collect, and STORE much more than that.

Otherwise what the hell use is it ?

metadata is an a+b conversation which doesn't mean anything.

Intelligence gathering is a+b with c reading what they are talking about.

That is the WHOLE POINT of intelligence gathering.

This whole thing can easily be cleared up with someone using his pen, and his phone.

But fat chance of that happening.

They would rather obfuscate, and tamper with, and destroy evidence.

a reply to: Logarock

These folks are psychopathic. Really. To some degree.

Not to *SOME* degree....

To the *Nth* degree !!

a reply to: skunkape23

Also, did you hear what he said? He didn't say, "I haven't lied!!"

He said, "No one has ever 'accused' me of being a liar."

Big damned difference.

a reply to: Snarl

I noticed two 'tells' in the IRS commissioner's testimony. I have to say he has a really good poker face.

Paul Ryan has some new fans now. Other than this and him partnering with Mitt, I really do not know much about him.

This is typical. Props to Ryan for calling him out but what Ryan wont say or admit is Emails are never stored on the Personal PC's.

That is like me telling someone I lost my Yahoo Emails forever and even the police can not get Yahoo to fork them over.

This circus is for the not so smart people who will not know better and think the Republicans are not just as guilty of the same crap. Obama just sucks a lot worse than any other President.

D.C. needs an Enema, pure and simple or nothing will ever change before total collapse.

a reply to: Patriotsrevenge

This is typical. Props to Ryan for calling him out but what Ryan wont say or admit is Emails are never stored on the Personal PC's.

The nuance of truth can be found when they nance around the subject of intentional destruction of the data. Neither side wants to destroy the IRS, because they both use it as a weapon when they're the ones holding office.

The IRS simply needs ... to go.

a reply to: Metallicus

That was absolutely awesome!

He took the words out of my mouth.

Perfect delivery.

Kruphix, thanks for playing the role of the naive, contentious, painfully misinformed Obama supporter during this debate. Someone has to play devil's advocate in these threads or else things might get boring.

Paul Ryan said just what I wanted to say to this arrogant, moronic buereaucrat.