Question for ATSers- Do you love unconditionally? Should you?

a reply to: Advantage

Nah, thats not unconditional love. Thats stupid.. suicide by home invasion if you decide to live in such an absurd way.

Unconditional love is exactly the same thing. You are willing to love everything all the time for any reason at all. That is a dangerous and reckless mentality to adopt.

I mean its not a bad thing to work toward it, but to claim you love unconditionally.. well I really feel its dishonest.

That's why when people tell me they love me, I tell them not to say it unless they mean it. Love is not something you throw around lightly. What's that line from the Snow Patrol song? "Those three words/Are said too much/And not enough". People who love each other get divorced. People who love each other beat each other. People who love each other cheat and lie and scheme behind each other's backs. That's what "love" signifies these days.

I think, rather than unconditional love, we need to be concerned about earthly, human love. We haven't even nailed loving conditionally, let alone unconditionally.

originally posted by: Dark Ghost
Even people that claim to love unconditionally, actually love conditionally.

"I love my children unconditionally!" - No, you love them because they are your children.

well yes because earthly love is a survival instinct.


Scientists prove it really is a thin line between love and hate
The same brain circuitry is involved in both extreme emotions – but hate retains a semblance of rationality

www.independent.co.uk...

en.wikipedia.org...

originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
Yes, I love unconditionally no matter who you are. I may not like some people but that doesn't mean I don't love them.

Love is the key to solving all of our problems, if we loved one another there would be no murder or war, there would be no lies because people would treat others as they would want to be treated. This is why Jesus put so much emphasis on love, because he knew it was and still is the thing that could correct everything wrong with this world.

Emulate Jesus, don't worship him. Be love and everything else will fall into place.

I love that you are capable of that. . I am at the point where I wish everyone should reach a level of happiness and feeling of being complete but at the same time get the sense of responsibility to fix all that they have done and not allow themselves to cause suffering.

I cannot love the predatory/bullying insanity to submission that I see some people are doing. Souls with those behavioral problems should be either locked up in insane asylums/monastery where they can get help or be in a lower level animal body so that they do not cause suffering when their ego acts out.

I can at least love the potential of all souls. In the end they will be marvelous.

Namaste

a reply to: Krazysh0t

I think we have a different definition of unconditional love. To me, it means feeling a loving feeling for someone, no matter what the circumstances. That doesn't mean that you never get frustrated or angry at their actions. It means you don't just walk away from them and "write them off" forever.

To me, it also doesn't mean you spoil your children. Because I love my child, I want her to grow up self-sufficient, healthy, happy and productive. That means I have to teach her how to be self-sufficient, so she will be healthy, happy and lead a productive life. After all, I won't always be around to do everything for her. If I did spoil her and provide everything for her, when I died, she would be lost and miserable. How would that prove I love her? I want her to be able to live just fine without me, because as statistics show, she will probably outlive me.

The examples with dogs just doesn't do it for me. Dogs don't have the reasoning capability that we have - they're not too good at logic ("you don't feed me, therefore you are not worth loving" or "you killed my baby, therefore I will now hate you forever"). A little baby would be the same way. It will still reach out for it's mother, even if the mother withheld food for a few days. That's not necessarily unconditional love - that's just inability to think it through to a logical conclusion.

a reply to: FlyersFan

Love, as it is proclaimed by those who try to sell it, is an empty virtue. Unconditional love, even emptier, and meaningless within a framework of seemingly infinite circumstances and possibilities. Love, as it actually manifests apart from the typical rhetorical doctrines of love, is entirely dependent upon, and manifest in, those entirely unique circumstances, and the ones who experience them. In other words, no two loves are alike.

originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: Krazysh0t

I think we have a different definition of unconditional love. To me, it means feeling a loving feeling for someone, no matter what the circumstances. That doesn't mean that you never get frustrated or angry at their actions. It means you don't just walk away from them and "write them off" forever.

I'm just working off the definition of unconditional. Keep in mind conditions can be both positive and negative towards you growth. I like how Dark Ghost said on page two that loving your child is conditional since you love them BECAUSE they are you child. That is a positive condition.

To me, it also doesn't mean you spoil your children. Because I love my child, I want her to grow up self-sufficient, healthy, happy and productive. That means I have to teach her how to be self-sufficient, so she will be healthy, happy and lead a productive life. After all, I won't always be around to do everything for her. If I did spoil her and provide everything for her, when I died, she would be lost and miserable. How would that prove I love her? I want her to be able to live just fine without me, because as statistics show, she will probably outlive me.

Those are conditions and it's ok, it's part of human love. Human love is multi-faceted. Unconditional love is one dimensional. That is why it is unattainable for humans.

The examples with dogs just doesn't do it for me. Dogs don't have the reasoning capability that we have - they're not too good at logic ("you don't feed me, therefore you are not worth loving" or "you killed my baby, therefore I will now hate you forever"). A little baby would be the same way. It will still reach out for it's mother, even if the mother withheld food for a few days. That's not necessarily unconditional love - that's just inability to think it through to a logical conclusion.

Dogs not having the ability to reason is why they can attain unconditional love. They don't have the ability to doubt what the person they love is doing because they cannot reason like that.

Your baby example may actually be a pretty good example of unconditional love as well.

ETA: I think that you are getting boundless love confused with unconditional love. I think what you are describing between you and your daughter is boundless love. You love her SO much that you want her to grow and develop right and be successful. There is a big difference between boundless love and unconditional love. For one, boundless love can have conditions.

Thanks for making this thread, FF. I have a few thoughts I would like to add.

1. Love toward a child is not what I would call unconditional. It's dependent on a condition, that of being your child.

2. Unconditional love doesn't mean I won't kick your ass if you get in my face. I most certainly will kick your ass, and afterwords have a pint of beer with you, Irish style.

3. Unconditional love is only possible in people who have had a certain kind of mystical experience. The kind that takes you past dualism to non-dualism, so that you can see identity behind the surface appearance of multiplicity. People who have not had that kind of experience should just do the best they can.

4. Unconditional love has to go hand in hand with a radical humility that knows no one is better or worse than anyone else, no matter who they are or what they have done. Therefore it must also go hand in hand with unconditional forgiveness.

a reply to: FlyersFan

I would really love to love unconditionally, but I don't. Well except for my cats and if I could have children they would also be loved unconditionally, of this I'm sure.

While I love my husband, family and friends with my entire being, it's not unconditional. I've burned bridges before and would do it again if the need arose. While I may still love those that I've cut ties with, sometimes people just aren't compatible.

a reply to: Krazysh0tI have to agree with your position, with some additions.

I don't think unconditional love is even possible for humans

Again, point on. We, with some exceptions, are human beings. Not totally one, not totally the other. The human body is a set of limitations in our abilities and gifts. We, are not perfect. Some of us know of our inner self while others only speculate or know nothing of it. Most people live in the human while others try to live the being inside. The "Being" side, at times, can see beyond the physical limitations of our reality. And to add to it, if Karma and reincarnation are true, we human beings come with predefined, preloaded, emotional "Baggage".

So it would seem, at least to me, that unconditional love was never an intention when the human being was developed/ created. It can only be something we strive for on the individual level. Some people know its a integral part of them, and some don't.

In my opinion there is a unhealthy train of thought running through social media in the form of unconditional love with the phrase " I love my XXXXX (enter the person you wish) with all my heart. This term, in essence, is quite self centered and selfish in nature, my opinion. How can a human being commit its heart to just one person/ thing. Oh you say, its just a saying. So to those who sign on to this "saying", what are you saying to all the other people in your life?

Unconditional love is not of our realm, our physical existence, and only something to be reached for. In my humble opinion all humanity really needs to achieve is not unconditional love, all they really have to do, is start caring about one another. " I care"!

I can not love unconditionally everyone on the planet, but I can care about them, about all the animals, the rain forests, the rivers, the people I have never met, or the places I have never been. I care about this world and all the things that make it up. And I'm not ashamed of that.

a reply to: FlyersFan

That's not unconditional love. That's a mixed up person with dependency issues. Unconditional love doesn't mean taking abuse or crap from others.

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: FlyersFan

That's not unconditional love. That's a mixed up person with dependency issues. Unconditional love doesn't mean taking abuse or crap from others.

Actually, that's exactly what it means. Unconditional is unconditional.

a reply to: AfterInfinity

If you try to abuse me or offend me, I may or may not kick the crap out of you, depending on certain variables. Either way, I will continue to love myself and you.

'Love, and do as you will' -St Augustine

a reply to: All Seeing Eye

Well said. I agree completely. Unconditional love is something that you can strive for, but you must realize that it isn't possible to achieve. Like I said earlier, I think that the problem stems from people not fully understanding what the word unconditional means. It literally means, "no conditions". And conditions can be a wide range of things that most wouldn't think of as such.

I think that unconditional love is something akin to infinite love I guess. It requires infinite trust (even if the person happens to a kleptomaniac or a junkie). It requires you to love despite any abuse you may receive. Because of things like this, it is actually unhealthy to love unconditionally since the only way a relationship would be beneficial to someone that loves someone else unconditionally would be if the unconditional love was a two way street. We are already talking about the monumental wall that needs to be overcame to achieve just ONE person loving unconditionally, let alone two.

originally posted by: BlueMule
a reply to: AfterInfinity

If you try to abuse me or offend me, I may or may not kick the crap out of you, depending on certain variables. Either way, I will continue to love myself and you.

'Love, and do as you will' -St Augustine

That's fine, but your love still has conditions attached. When you write "if *insert action of person you love*, then *insert appropriate response*" then you have a condition. Therefore it is conditional love. If...then statements are also known as conditional statements by the way.

I think one of the biggest tragedies of recent history is the amalgamation of several different experiences into one single word; "love."

The amount of confusion about the different experiences involved seemed to be continually muddied by the idea of the base emotion.

I was curious though, if anyone reading this thread is knowledgeable about it.. Does any currently used modern language discern between the different experiences like some ancient languages did?

originally posted by: FlyersFan
I don't think I've ever seen more than three people in my entire life who have practiced unconditional love towards everyone.

I believe most of us have been conditioned and programmed to hate in instead of love.

Mother Theresa said if we spend all of our time condemning people we have no time to love them.

This post really got my attention recently and I think all of us would do well to live by it:

originally posted by: Asktheanimals
if you can't make a constructive criticism to someone's art please don't tear it down.
Maybe you know what it's like to have somebody trash your work - it's devastating.
Some people can't even try again after getting those kinds of comments.
(in fact that's why most people don't do art as adults - somebody has already destroyed their faith in themselves)

ATS is a community. We shouldn't treat each other like strangers.
We should support each other, not knock each other down.
There are plenty of very talented artists on ATS.

a reply to: AfterInfinity

No it doesn't at all. Love doesn't mean never being mad at someone etc... so why would unconditional love? Unconditional love would be loving people even though they make you mad or hurt you. It doesn't mean you lay down and let someone walk all over you, you can still love such a person but not accept when they attempt to do it to you.

originally posted by: AfterInfinity

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: FlyersFan

That's not unconditional love. That's a mixed up person with dependency issues. Unconditional love doesn't mean taking abuse or crap from others.

Actually, that's exactly what it means. Unconditional is unconditional.

The actions we take can have different variable driving factors. Taking abuse is not in the best interest of "unconditional love" for ANYONE involved in the situation.

Unconditional refers to the presence of unconditional love and is not in reference to the subjective interpretation of the actions taken. A parent wouldnt think it was "loving" to allow their child to abuse themselves and everyone around them. Quite the opposite, actually.

a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

I agree. I believe in loving unconditionally.

No one is perfect. Including me. Everyone makes mistakes. Even those who do harm to others - are they acting out of psychological issues and don't know better? Are they harming out of anger? Are they so broken they don't know how to love? Were they trained wrong? A human is a human is a human. Jesus loved all. He is willing to forgive all. I do emulate my life after Him. Of course I make mistakes, have anger, have arguments but in the end I can forgive, still love that person for the soul inside including those that seem so lost to humanity. I can try to help others but if they aren't willing to change or try then I let them be and can love them from a distance.

Every human is deserving of love. And sometimes that is all we can offer to another person: a piece of ourselves, that inner love that says, "It's okay. I love you, you are worthy." I don't love the evil but I can love the person.

Sometimes it's hard as one's own emotions can try to overpower you. But do I have a right to let those emotions colour my feelings about someone? No. And yes you do come to a place where you can find yourself loving unconditionally. I may not like the personality or beliefs but that's none of my business. It sets you free from labelling another person in any way and it allows you to focus on the only thing that matters in this world: love one another. Love is energy.

I sound holier than thou but after lots of self delving into my own thoughts I clear my mind and look at the person, really look at the soul within that person - forget the outer shell, the actions, the limited mind and what is left? A soul whirling within that has so much growth waiting ahead of them. Yes you can love unconditionally. Heck if Jesus can love me I can turn around and love all others.

originally posted by: Serdgiam
I think one of the biggest tragedies of recent history is the amalgamation of several different experiences into one single word; "love."

The amount of confusion about the different experiences involved seemed to be continually muddied by the idea of the base emotion.

I was curious though, if anyone reading this thread is knowledgeable about it.. Does any currently used modern language discern between the different experiences like some ancient languages did?

Here's an article on 15 different types of love, written by a psychologist.

15 Different Types of Love

15 Different Kinds of Love:

Infatuation- loving feelings towards a love object that are largely based upon fantasy and idealization (instead of experience). Often when partners get to know each other, infatuation diminishes.

Romantic Love- An abiding love for a partner with whom you feel passion, attraction, caring and respect.

Eros- a passionate love usually involving sexual feelings for a love interest.

Companionate Love- feelings of warmth towards a friend with whom you love to spend time

Unconditional Love- A type of affection and caring that is so strong that you feel it consistently, regardless of what that other person does

Conditional Love- A love that requires specific action or conditions in order to be maintained. For example, at its extreme, a parent who gives very conditional love would only love his child when he gets straight A’s, becomes a surgeon and has two children. The love is based on outside conditions and when they do not occur, the love is withdrawn.

Puppy Love- A childish, innocent temporary crush on someone that you don’t know well.

Maternal Love- This term usually connotes love that is nurturing, accepting and protective. In actuality this love can also be given by a father etc.

Paternal Love- This term connotes love that involves guidance and some authority. Paternal love usually prepares a child to be ready for the outside world. Again, in reality this type of love is not gender specific.

Soulmate Love- This type of love is described as a love that has survived multiple life times. Not everyone believes in this concept.

Spiritual/Divine Love- This type of love recognizes the Divine light in everyone and everything. Love is given to everyone as an act of loving God.

Love of your country or patriotism- This is love for the place you live or the place that were born. It is a type of loyalty and a special feeling of belonging that you attribute to that specific geographic location.

Self-Love- This is a positive feeling that you have about who you are and what you deserve. It often is expressed by treating yourself well, respecting yourself, wanting yourself to be happy and expecting others to respect you too.

Brotherly Love- This term connotes having a feeling of love for your neighbor, because all humanity is considered to be part of a larger family of human beings.

Tough Love- This term is used to describe a love that is expressed by setting boundaries for the good of the other person. So for example, a parent may send their teenager to rehab if he is drug addicted, even if he does not want to go. They feel that this is an act of love because it stems from a desire for their son’s ultimate good and happiness.

I bolded the part about unconditional love. By the way, many people in this thread are trying to position some of these other forms of love as unconditional love. They are not. For instance, maternal and paternal love were positioned to me earlier in this thread as unconditional love.